Religion as reality is terrifying to humanity

Originally posted by Jordan River
i cant fix it, guess i'm stupid

edit on 15-8-2012 by Jordan River because: (no reason given)

Nah, no harm.. it's not a simple matter.. it's a matter of looking up the quote and /quote blocks.. it can be tedious ..

reply to post by miniatus


I really enjoyed our conversation completely. You believe religion is #1 killer of mankind, while i believe that Political power figures who hijacked religion to kill people is number 1 killer of mankind

reply to post by miniatus

I'm not for the NWO as ATS often describes it .. this big bad horrible thing looking to ruin us all ..

I think though that if we're ever to get beyond "America" "Europe" "Asia" ... "Middle East" .. we need to grow the $&#^$ up and realize we're one community on a big marble in the sky .. and if there is other life out there we're only going to look like a fragmented mess ... so ultimately I think one world government is a natural progression as we evolve .. physically, mentally and emotionally .. right now we're all too arrogant and segregated... and what segregates us the most? ... anyone? ... religion .. that thing that they all think they are 100% right on =) ... and can't possibly be .. but nobody is willing to say "ok .. maybe I was wrong"

The waking up of the human race, I think, will be realizing.. wait.. we were all wrong.. religion isn't it .. we're all children of the cosmos... we are a member of the universe so if we work together, pool resources.. we can step far beyond our current boundries.

You, sir, are now counted amongst my heroes.
Thank you for posting this (above)......

Originally posted by Jordan River
reply to post by miniatus

 

I really enjoyed our conversation completely. You believe religion is #1 killer of mankind, while i believe that Political power figures who hijacked religion to kill people is number 1 killer of mankind

I think political is right up there.. I just know religion has been a factor before politics and that in many cases religion DRIVES politics... so that's why I say what I said... in the US right now.. if you don't show some religious leaning, you won't win the ticket... you have to .. but the tides are changing... polls are showing a rise in atheism and a decline religiosity ... I think there's a lot of closet atheists out there... but still today, you have to be religious to win the seat.. I could never run .. if I said I was atheist, the eldest members of our country would shoot me down regardless of my stance on issues...

reply to post by wildtimes


Thank you =) very much...

Probably the only person on this board who would agree with that sentiment, the rest will think.. OMG .. NWO .. he's Illuminati / mason / insert something else conspiratorial

reply to post by miniatus


I think there is a fine line between religion, politics, fear and BS. I'm sure we can agree on that.

I believe we need a more community, civilian based leadership in the world, rather than some rich person in office.

Religious conformity is weak compared to those who have more of a universal approach . I think this also separates the religious and spiritualist, but thats another discussion

reply to post by miniatus

Thank you =) very much...

Probably the only person on this board who would agree with that sentiment, the rest will think.. OMG .. NWO .. he's Illuminati / mason / insert something else conspiratorial

You're very welcome!

There are others who agree.....
I welcome the NWO, where everyone has a roof, clothing, clean water, and enough to eat!!
There is no reason for people to be starving. It's shameful how the world is right now....
anyway,....
high five
~wild

Originally posted by Jordan River
reply to post by miniatus

 

I think there is a fine line between religion, politics, fear and BS. I'm sure we can agree on that.

I believe we need a more community, civilian based leadership in the world, rather than some rich person in office.

Religious conformity is weak compared to those who have more of a universal approach . I think this also separates the religious and spiritualist, but thats another discussion

edit on 15-8-2012 by Jordan River because: (no reason given)

I agree... I do agree... politics and religion meld into one .. more now perhaps than ever, but I don't think they've ever not been related in some fashion... but are not mutually exclusive .. you can be political without being religious .. and you can be religious though, more difficult I think.. without being political

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by miniatus

 

Thank you =) very much...

Probably the only person on this board who would agree with that sentiment, the rest will think.. OMG .. NWO .. he's Illuminati / mason / insert something else conspiratorial

You're very welcome!

There are others who agree.....
I welcome the NWO, where everyone has a roof, clothing, clean water, and enough to eat!!
There is no reason for people to be starving. It's shameful how the world is right now....
anyway,....
high five

~wild

Exactly the NWO I think is what has to happen... I think we're in the dark ages where we all think as individuals.. what's mine is mine... I earned it.. give it... that is still a caveman mentality.. ironically those same people are all for the community fixing their roads, paying for education and upkeeping the parks they get to look at during their paid for roads... it's silly .. at some point we have to realize that we share this rock, it's not yours, mine or theirs.. it's all of ours.. and we will.. I am sure.. if we LIVE LONG ENOUGH to see it.. have to realize we're not alone... then what? USA is not going to represent the planet... nobody would stand for that... what then? ..exactly why we need one standard body..

When we realize we are a collective community .. we will win..

Originally posted by miniatus


Religious conformity is weak compared to those who have more of a universal approach . I think this also separates the religious and spiritualist, but thats another discussion

edit on 15-8-2012 by Jordan River because: (no reason given)

I can sit and reflect on some quotes of the bible that probably make the Pope Urban II during the crusade make a double take before sending his soilders. Are we just more evolved? more refined? If you think about it, religion birth science, even though they wanted to keep it a secret and hide it, religion birth science in some respect.

Pope Urban II, how does a pope have the power to give remission of sin, there is political arrogance as a religious figure.

Originally posted by Jordan River

Originally posted by miniatus


Religious conformity is weak compared to those who have more of a universal approach . I think this also separates the religious and spiritualist, but thats another discussion

edit on 15-8-2012 by Jordan River because: (no reason given)

I agree... I do agree... politics and religion meld into one .. more now perhaps than ever, but I don't think they've ever not been related in some fashion...

I think that religion and politics are related in that they that seek control of those that believe ... religion IS politics as far as I'm concerned.. the council of nicea.. I won't go in to depth but anyone who TRULY reads up on that knows the impact politics has on religion .. and vice versa..

Originally posted by Jordan River

Originally posted by miniatus


Religious conformity is weak compared to those who have more of a universal approach . I think this also separates the religious and spiritualist, but thats another discussion

edit on 15-8-2012 by Jordan River because: (no reason given)

I can sit and reflect on some quotes of the bible that probably make the Pope Urban II during the crusade make a double take before sending his soilders. Are we just more evolved? more refined? If you think about it, religion birth science, even though they wanted to keep it a secret and hide it, religion birth science in some respect.

Pope Urban II, how does a pope have the power to give remission of sin, there is political arrogance as a religious figure.

edit on 15-8-2012 by Jordan River because: (no reason given)

Originally posted by miniatus

Originally posted by Jordan River

Originally posted by miniatus


Religious conformity is weak compared to those who have more of a universal approach . I think this also separates the religious and spiritualist, but thats another discussion

edit on 15-8-2012 by Jordan River because: (no reason given)

I can sit and reflect on some quotes of the bible that probably make the Pope Urban II during the crusade make a double take before sending his soilders. Are we just more evolved? more refined? If you think about it, religion birth science, even though they wanted to keep it a secret and hide it, religion birth science in some respect.

Pope Urban II, how does a pope have the power to give remission of sin, there is political arrogance as a religious figure.

edit on 15-8-2012 by Jordan River because: (no reason given)

I replied but it didn't take

Christianity is ever evolving... none of the modern christians live by the early christian rules... none of them,... it's weird.. when you quote some parts of the bible they take it literally and when you quote others, they take it as vague... they evolve with society ... and that's wrong.. they are all sinning in the eyes of their original lord ... but they don't care

I always like to mention when I'm leaving to get to sleep because if I don't I get picked apart for abandoning a heated debate.. it's 10:30pm where I am ( nearly so I MUST go ...

reply to post by Jordan River


I used to feel a similar sort of anger but thanks to Divine Grace I moved past it. People are not to blame; unconditional forgivness and undifferentiated love is the way.

Anger and fear are closely related so one must move past both eventually.

Originally posted by Jordan River

Well this thread is a discussion on the reality of Heaven as told through the Abrahamic religions. I believe is a more terrifying thought to mere mortals and a major hurdle through acceptance.

It's terrifying either way. We either die, and forever lose consciousness. Or we spend eternity in hellfire and torture for not repenting on how we enjoyed our one life.

Logically

Uh oh.

Heaven/hell/purg/ghost are all in a thin veil of another dimension. Nobody had this type of concept back 2,000 years ago.

You sure?....

With the help of science, physics we have to a rationality that there is a alternative universe, parallel world.

Which doesn't give credence to the specific Abrahamic beliefs of heaven, hell, purg etc

Also, aliens have pointed out the proof that inter dimensional beings may be aliens and/or Angels.

If it was proven there was inter dimensional aliens it would not be proof of Abrahamic angels.

Morality and the principal of doing good, charitable, giving, helping, aiding is the core principal to all these.

All good things But are you suggesting someone can't be moral in these ways without Abrahamic religion?

So then.... You got science backing up religion and many scientist being smart enough to accept both fields, theo/physics/science.

What parts of Abrahamic religion is backed by science? The examples you already gave are quite weak.

So i feel very angered at people who separate fields and do not accept anything else. Complete blindness of the bigger picture.

Do you separate and push away Native American religion or is that part of your bigger picture? I am not saying you should, or that I do, just proving the point that you're not as 'wide-eyed' as you claim. Your bigger picture includes a disbelief in many other religions and spiritual systems. You do it. We can do it.

You people cannot believe what you cannot accept or understand through 10% of brain power that you use. Nothing but mere ants such as myself .

We don't just use 10% of our brain. That's a really bad myth.

If you believe that try removing 90% of it.

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


ah, the fine comber

Originally posted by miniatus
Religion has always been terrifying, despite it NOT being reality ... that's exactly it's selling point... and precisely what has kept it popular ... and those who've disagreed in history, have died... check out the crusades..

Sorry but that's my view...people stick with it because if they don't they are told they will burn ... it's a philosophy of fear...

edit on 8/15/2012 by miniatus because: (no reason given)

edit on 8/15/2012 by miniatus because: (no reason given)

Are you under the assumption that religion began with the Christians? Were there no other religions ever on the face of the planet before Christianity?


History on hell....
This description is found in the Popol Vuh,
The Underworld of the Maya

The Egyptian Book Tuat
Egyptian Hell

The English word for Hell derives from Hel, the ancient goddess of Norse mythology.
Norse Gods and Goddesses

The Rig Veda
Hindu Hell

There are just several examples of the concept of hell in religions other than Christianity. These pre-date Christianity in some cases, and impossible to be influenced by Christianity. We can keep going on, but to limit the concept of hell solely from Christian perspective would be historic ignorance. Who created the "rule through fear"? These hells did not arise from leaders wishing to keep their subjects in line, they are part of all religions and part of the life of the people in which these concept arose.

reply to post by WarminIndy


Eastern Religion/Philosophy such as Hinduism have no permanent place of damnation like Christianity does. The Egyptian underworld "Duat" wasn't such a place either.

Hell is an agenda to get people into a certain mindset, like to be a great warrior as in Viking mythology. I don't think I need to explain what the "eternal place of hell" myth has done to us here in the west.

Originally posted by AdamsMurmur
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Eastern Religion/Philosophy such as Hinduism have no permanent place of damnation like Christianity does. The Egyptian underworld "Duat" wasn't such a place either.

Hell is an agenda to get people into a certain mindset, like to be a great warrior as in Viking mythology. I don't think I need to explain what the "eternal place of hell" myth has done to us here in the west.

I am sorry that I fail to see your point, my point was made by links. Disagree with them if you wish, I am just providing you with the information. I am not the creator of the websites and did not present them as my knowledge in creating them.

Did you at least read the links, or did you just go by what someone else said? The Rig Veda is part of Hinduism, maybe not all Hindu philosophy agrees with it, but Hinduism covers a vast range of philosophies. You should not pigeonhole one aspect of Hinduism and call it the end all of Hinduism. Actually many historical Hindu scholars agree that the earliest Hindu books have a heaven and a hell.

Indra who reigned in heaven and Yama who ruled the hell.

I did not make this up.

In The Mahabharata, Vrihaspati's account of "the frightful regions of Yama" has a good description of hell. He tells king Yudhishthira: "In those regions, O king, there are places that are fraught with every merit and that are worthy on that account of being the abodes of the very deities. There are, again, places in those regions that are worse than those which are inhabited by animals and birds…"

I am sorry, what book was that? The Mahabharata?

Let's see about Yama

Yama is the much-feared Hindu god of death who lives in his gloomy palace Kalichi situated somewhere in the nether regions or the Hindu Patala. He is the regent of the Southern quarter of the compass. Yama has a number of attendants to assist him in his many tasks. In his palace he keeps a register called the "Book of Destiny" in which each person's span of life is recorded. This is maintained by one of the god's attendants and the servant is predictably as gloomy of countenance as his master. When a person's span of life is over Yama sends some of his more robust attendants up to earth to haul the person down to his palace.

I am sorry, again, what book is this found in? The Mahabhatra? Christians didn't write the Mahabhatra, Who did? The ancient Hindus. Gasp, whodathunkit? Yama resides in Kalichi. Will you say it is allegorical? Then why were there devotees who prayed to appease him?