Why should I go to hell?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by benrl

 

So that's the only answer you can give? So me emulating exactly what Jesus taught earns me the prize of eternal suffering and pain?

Is Jesus in hell right now?

Murgatroid covered this, read his post, it states what needs to be done According to the Bible.

Deserving has nothing to it, you don't earn salvation according to Christianity.

Originally posted by Trueman

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by SisyphusRide

 

What is purgatory? How is that any better than hell? What is experienced in purgatory?

The most popular version I've ever heard is : Purgatory is the waiting room for bad people while they wait for final judgement. Then you cease to exist and your records will be destroyed. You will never go to hell because that's exclusive for demons and/or fallen angels, and you got no wings.

I'm christian but I don't believe that.

Bzzz...

Purgatory is the condition of purification or temporary punishment[1] by which those who die in a state of grace are believed to be made ready for Heaven.

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by benrl


I have read his post, it boils down to 'you must believe in Jesus', I am paraphrasing here.

It sounds to me like your god is a tyrant, a fascist dictator who punishes those who talk bad about him. If that's what god is, I want nothing to do with him.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

I have read his post, it boils down to 'you must believe in Jesus', I am paraphrasing here. It sounds to me like your god is a tyrant, a fascist dictator who punishes those who talk bad about him. If that's what god is, I want nothing to do with him.

you answered your own question.

John 3:18

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Acts 4:12

Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

John 8:24

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

From a biblical perspective, it is not about how good you are, it is about your acceptance of Christ's death and resurrection.

Matthew 7:22-23

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Romans 10:9-10

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Originally posted by SisyphusRide

Originally posted by Trueman

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by SisyphusRide

 

What is purgatory? How is that any better than hell? What is experienced in purgatory?

The most popular version I've ever heard is : Purgatory is the waiting room for bad people while they wait for final judgement. Then you cease to exist and your records will be destroyed. You will never go to hell because that's exclusive for demons and/or fallen angels, and you got no wings.

I'm christian but I don't believe that.

Bzzz...

Purgatory is the condition of purification or temporary punishment[1] by which those who die in a state of grace are believed to be made ready for Heaven.

en.wikipedia.org...

Your version is boring

reply to post by SisyphusRide


The bible says nothing about purgatory. Where did this concept come from? Man, not 'god'.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
You don't need to believe in god to be a good person. Isn't that what god wants?

I do not believe Jesus died on the cross or was resurrected three days later.

He wants you to know the truth and BELIEVE it...

"What must we do to do the works God requires?" Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent." John 6:28

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears my word and believes Him who sent me, has eternal life; he does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life." John 5:24

reply to post by benrl


Since I don't believe in Jesus anymore, do you believe I deserve to go to hell? Even if I emulate what Jesus taught?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by SisyphusRide

 

You don't need to believe in god to be a good person.

my friend you are a pro at putting words into people mouths...

heck I'll go one step further and just say you're a natural and don't even know it. It is possibility ats has affected your thought processes though

what was it Jesus told that one guy when he was walking gathering his followers?

You're ok!
Heaven and Hell

The Kingdom of heaven is already in the midst of those who live the spiritual life. What the spiritual person knows in the Holy Spirit, in Christ and the Church, will come with power and glory for all men to behold at the end of the ages.

The final coming of Christ will be the judgment of all men. His very presence will be the judgment. Now men can live without the love of Christ in their lives. They can exist as if there were no God, no Christ, no Spirit, no Church, no spiritual life. At the end of the ages this will no longer be possible. All men will have to behold the Face of Him who “for us men and our salvation came down from heaven and was incarnate… who was crucified under Pontius Pilate, and suffered and was buried . . . ” (Nicene Creed) All will have to took at Him whom they have crucified by their sins: Him “who was dead and is alive again.” (Revelation 1-.17-18)

For those who love the Lord, His Presence will be infinite joy, paradise and eternal life. For those who hate the Lord, the same Presence will be infinite torture, hell and eternal death. The reality for both the saved and the damned will be exactly the same when Christ “comes in glory, and all angels with Him,” so that “God may be all in all.” (I Corinthians 15-28) Those who have God as their “all” within this life will finally have divine fulfillment and life. For those whose “all” is themselves and this world, the “all” of God will be their torture, their punishment and their death. And theirs will be “weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (Matthew 8:21, et al.)

The Son of Man will send His angels and they will gather out of His kingdom all causes of sin and all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire; there men will weep and gnash their teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the Kingdom of their Father. (Matthew 13:41-43)

According to the saints, the “fire” that will consume sinners at the coming of the Kingdom of God is the same “fire” that will shine with splendor in the saints. It is the “fire” of God’s love; the “fire” of God Himself who is Love. “For our God is a consuming fire” (Hebrews 12:29) who “dwells in unapproachable light.” (I Timothy 6:16) For those who love God and who love all creation in Him, the “consuming fire” of God will be radiant bliss and unspeakable delight. For those who do not love God, and who do not love at all, this same 66consuming fire” will be the cause of their “weeping” and their “gnashing of teeth.”

Thus it is the Church’s spiritual teaching that God does not punish man by some material fire or physical torment. God simply reveals Himself in the risen Lord Jesus in such a glorious way that no man can fail to behold His glory. It is the presence of God’s splendid glory and love that is the scourge of those who reject its radiant power and light.

... those who find themselves in hell will be chastised by the scourge of love. How cruel and bitter this torment of love will be! For those who understand that they have sinned against love, undergo no greater suffering than those produced by the most fearful tortures. The sorrow which takes hold of the heart, which has sinned against love, is more piercing than any other pain. It is not right to say that the sinners in hell are deprived of the love of God… But love acts in two ways, as suffering of the reproved, and as joy in the blessed! (St. Isaac of Syria, Mystic Treatises)

This teaching is found in many spiritual writers and saints: St. Maximus the Confessor, the novelist Fyodor Dostoevsky. At the end of the ages God’s glorious love is revealed for all to behold in the Face of Christ. Man’s eternal destiny - heaven or hell, salvation or damnation - depends solely on his response to this love.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Since I don't believe in Jesus anymore, do you believe I deserve to go to hell? Even if I emulate what Jesus taught?

It has nothing to do with Merit or Deserving anything.

Originally posted by TruthSeekerMike
According to the saints, the “fire” that will consume sinners at the coming of the Kingdom of God is the same “fire” that will shine with splendor in the saints. It is the “fire” of God’s love; the “fire” of God Himself who is Love. “For our God is a consuming fire” (Hebrews 12:29) who “dwells in unapproachable light.” (I Timothy 6:16) For those who love God and who love all creation in Him, the “consuming fire” of God will be radiant bliss and unspeakable delight. For those who do not love God, and who do not love at all, this same "consuming fire” will be the cause of their “weeping” and their “gnashing of teeth.”

wow that sounds like the here and now... real-time

good post btw, thanks for your input

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
Since I don't believe in Jesus anymore, do you believe I deserve to go to hell? Even if I emulate what Jesus taught?

You are IGNORING what Jesus taught:

"What must we do to do the works God requires?" Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent." John 6:28

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears my word and believes Him who sent me, has eternal life; he does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life." John 5:24

reply to post by benrl


What does it have to do with then? Belief?

If you believe in Jesus, you get into heaven correct? That implies that those who believe deserve getting into heaven.

Your kidding right? You read the Bible, say you know the Bible and you still cannot answer that question?

Seriously, I'm not being factitious, I'm being serious. You have a Bible and it says why, and you still don't know?

It's not about belief here, because even an atheist could read the Bible and tell you the answer to your question based on what the Bible says. It's about your question 'why'?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
The only difference between me now and me while I was Christian is that I do not believe Jesus died on the cross or was resurrected three days later. I do not believe he walked on water or turned water into wine with a wave of a hand.

I also have a question for you. If any of the disciples of Jesus died except for Judas before Jesus was crucified and performed all of those miracles, do you think they would have gone to hell??

To Jesus, miracles are not the most important thing in the Gospel. It's probably not even important. Performing miracles even in the name of Jesus will not guarantee you entry to the Kingdom of Heaven.

To truly love God and what He loves, and to hate the things He hate. Is the most important things to Jesus.

Belief comes with action. You don't believe and praise and grovel to someone and refuse to do what he/she loves to do, that's an insult!

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
I've been a good person my entire life, I follow what Jesus taught to a tee. I love everyone as I love myself and I treat others as I would want to be treated. I have never been in a fight and have never intentionally hurt anyone or swindled anyone for my own benefit. I'm as truthful a person as you will ever find, I never lie unless I believe it is a necessary one in order to avoid hurting someone else. I have never killed any creature intentionally or for sport. I've never even stepped on an ant purposely. I believe I have perfect morality in the fact that I follow what Jesus taught, I grew up learning of the lessons he taught and believed the story around Jesus, the death and resurrection. I know these lessons and modeled my life around what he taught.

The only difference between me now and me while I was Christian is that I do not believe Jesus died on the cross or was resurrected three days later. I do not believe he walked on water or turned water into wine with a wave of a hand.

So tell me, why should I deserve to burn for eternity when I strive to emulate what Jesus was, a kind and loving person who holds no grudges and doesn't judge others based on their personal beliefs/opinions?

I'd like a better reason than 'because you don't believe in Jesus' please.

Thanks.

edit on 15-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

edit on 15-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

Could it have been that it was not the real Jesus that was crucified? Could it be that the real Jesus did rise three days later? Could it be Jesus turned water into wine by use of chemistry with a wave of his hand (? dye flying through the air ?). Could it be?

reply to post by pacifier2012


I knew the answer most would give, I was hoping for something a little more in-depth than the superficial 'you don't believe in Jesus' tripe.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

What does it have to do with then? Belief? If you believe in Jesus, you get into heaven correct? That implies that those who believe deserve getting into heaven.

You know what the difference between you an I? I know I don't deserve salvation.

Yet according to Christian theology and Jesus Teachings, I have it, and you do not.

Just because you do not like the answer to your question (why you are not saved based on Christian beliefs) does not mean it is going to change the more ways you phrase the question.