What would my grandad have known as a 3rd degree mason?

Originally posted by GreatOwl

Originally posted by network dude

Bad people will be bad regardless of who they are around. Place the blame where it belongs. On the individual.

I don't disagree with you. The point I'm making is that when bad people join good people in brotherhood, and the rules of that brotherhood declare the good must support the bad regardless of how bad they are, that's when the brotherhood itself becomes evil.

Maybe you can show us an example of how this might happen. I know there are very strict rules about what is considered a masonic offence. I as a mason can bring charges against another mason if I feel he has done something that violates our rules. If found guilty by a jury of his peers, the offending mason can be expelled from the fraternity.

Originally posted by network dude
I as a mason can bring charges against another mason if I feel he has done something that violates our rules. If found guilty by a jury of his peers, the offending mason can be expelled from the fraternity.

In my jurisdiction if the offence is egregious enough the Grand Master can expell the person without a trial. A recent example would be someone who was caught embezzelling at work. He was automatically expelled from Masonry without a trial.

reply to post by nancyliedersdeaddog

QFT!

reply to post by GreatOwl

Actually we don't have to support the bad apples.

Originally posted by KSigMason

Actually we don't have to support the bad apples.

Well, that's the problem. In Freemasonry a "bad apple" is someone who breaks the masonic rule, not someone who breaks the rules of outer society.

For example, during lodge meeting a mason discovers that a brother he sits with broke and entered into some political opponent's offices and stole some sensitive documents. But, since he found this out as a mason, he is required to keep it secret. He can't report it to the police. What he might try to do, since he knows who did it, is attempt to construct some sequence of events in the outer society to trap the brother into revealing himself etc..so that he gets caught.. But, that requires a rather round about indirect method of "making a good man better".

reply to post by GreatOwl

Too bad you are really wrong on this matter.

Originally posted by GreatOwl

Originally posted by KSigMason

Actually we don't have to support the bad apples.

Well, that's the problem. In Freemasonry a "bad apple" is someone who breaks the masonic rule, not someone who breaks the rules of outer society.

For example, during lodge meeting a mason discovers that a brother he sits with broke and entered into some political opponent's offices and stole some sensitive documents. But, since he found this out as a mason, he is required to keep it secret. He can't report it to the police. What he might try to do, since he knows who did it, is attempt to construct some sequence of events in the outer society to trap the brother into revealing himself etc..so that he gets caught.. But, that requires a rather round about indirect method of "making a good man better".

Do you spend all your time in fantasy land, or just some of it?
No, if you break masonic law, you get in trouble. If you break mans law, you get in trouble. Acting unmasonicly would include breaking mans law. Soon you will start telling us we grow horns once we get in or something. You should get a better hobby, you suck at this one.

I seriously think some people on this site think being a mason is all about gay orgys and plotting to take over the world. I would love to see some of these people actually see what goes on because they would shocked by how normal it really is. Every Mason I know including my Grandfather are pillars of the community and have been amazing role models for me.

Originally posted by nancyliedersdeaddog
I seriously think some people on this site think being a mason is all about gay orgys and plotting to take over the world. I would love to see some of these people actually see what goes on because they would shocked by how normal it really is. Every Mason I know including my Grandfather are pillars of the community and have been amazing role models for me.

Hell, even some of the Masons I know who participate in gay orgies can be pillars of the community and amazing role models. What goes on in the bedroom between two consenting adults generally has no bearing on their morality or their role in the world at large.

Originally posted by GreatOwl

Originally posted by KSigMason
In reality, you don't have the right to know what we do in private by the very definition of the word 'private' (which is synonymous with secrecy).

A private person has right to privacy, but a public figure has obligation to allow us to peek into his private activities whenever we feel there might be good reason. Whoever doesn't like that, can simply retire from public life, and return to become a private citizen once again, to enjoy all the rights of private citizens. Nobody forces anyone to take up public office of any kind. To take up public office is to give up some private rights.

Can you please tell me what was said at the last Bilderberg meetings? Surely since many people in attendance are currently active in the public sector we MUST be allowed to know what they discussed?