DHS places new order for 750 million rounds

Originally posted by getreadyalready
Somewhere above 220,000 employees fall under the purview of DHS. Some are going to be support and admin of course, but a billion rounds is only about 4,000 rounds per employee. (corrected math)

Say only 25% of the employee force has to qualify with weapons, that is still 60,000 people. 50 rounds of practice per year per person, and about 10 in a magazine to carry on duty, and you have a need for 600,000 hollow points, and 3 million practice rounds each year. Hopefully the ones that really are in the mix are shooting a lot more than 50 rounds of training per year, so the numbers published seem just about right.

As far as hollow points being banned by the Geneva Convention.... that was a stupid move. We use hollow points because it gives more knockdown power and less chance of pass-through to unintended targets. A practice round would actually be MORE DANGEROUS in a LEO or domestic situation, because you might hit someone behind your intended target, or ricochet and hit just about anyone. I use an "extreme frangible" in my carry guns, because it is even more dangerous to the intended target, and less dangerous to everyone else. Air Marshall's supposedly use something similar to avoid damaging an airplane if they have to fire it onboard.

edit on 13-8-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)

edit on 13-8-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)

You were correct before.

These ammunitions are never meant to be used by US military/DHS against US citizens. They are to be used by a foreign occupying force (NATO) on behalf of the US governement, due to the inability of US military personnel to fire against US citizens.

It is the preparring that DHS and FEMA are responsible for, neither orginization will be the ones in possession of these items, or executing any portion of plan once martial law is enacted and NATO troops begin the occupation of the US.

Cut of the cities (isolation), then control the food. It is not hard with a foreign occupation force that has 30,000 UAVs at their disposal, millions of cameras in city intersections for monitoring, and a US freeway system designed to aid martial law scenarios (only a couple ways to get from city to city).

God Bless,

They also procure "comercial leaded training rounds" for "training". Procurement number HSFLGL-12-B-00003

Isn't the idea of using jacketed bullets is to increase the survivability of a gun shot wound.

Of course when 5 or 10 cops open fire on one person then it really doesn't matter I suppose.

Just had a chat with a colleague Who's more into aquasition
Turns out the Freedom group has been buying up a lot of company's.
Freedom group being majoritly owned by Cerberus management, it's VERY interesting whom is involved in this organisation.

Now from what I gather, certainly with regards to the hollow points perchased earlier,
Yes hollow points are for increased damage to your target
And as many have stated these could have been for training purposes as a hollow point round 'flies' differently to a standard full copper jacket round
Therefore training would be required to know your point of aim at certain distances for the 2 different types of round

However in counter argument to this a side arm ( pistol/revolver) that these rounds were intended for) is designed for use over short ranges lets say upto 30 meters ( just to whack a number on it )
The difference in fall of shot between hollow point and standard rounds is very little, about 2-3 inches at 30 meters, not really a lot !
Not enough to warrant the expense !
Secondly ammunition for training is generally not bought as such, ammunition is perchased for operational use, then when it nears it's shelf life or the next new bath of ammo is bought, what was ops ammo now becomes training ammo

Can someone post a breakdown of this ammo order ( if one exists ) so I can cast my enquisitive mind over it

reply to post by roadgravel

Full Metal "Jacket" (FMJ), Yes......
"Jacketed" Hollow Point (JHP), No.

reply to post by Neocrusader

Cerberus (owned by the Carlyle Group) is buying up Gun Manufacturers also. It wouldnt surprise me to see a LBO using Govt $ to control these companies and then shut them down or something (and they would probabaly simultaneously make reloading illegal also).

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by CosmicCitizen

 

What if you're safely on your porch as something happens out on the street. Bullets start flying, and the FMJ rounds are bouncing off the windshield and hood of the car and peppering your house, while the hollow points are breaking up as soon as they hit something and not causing any significant danger to you.
I think it is preferable to not get shot at all, rather than to have to choose which one might hurt you more. The idea is to not have any unintended targets.

YES I AGREE WITH THAT. Someone else mentioned the Air Marshall rounds which are extremely frangible being made of super compressed metallic powder that basically disintegrate as the round transfers its energy to the target with no over-penetration possible.

reply to post by CosmicCitizen


I was referring to FMJ. Just seems a bit inhuman for the police to not use a fully jacketed bullet.

Maybe since the non police have them, it is all bets off. Maybe if is just non duty use.

It used to be thought that non FMJ rounds had a higher rate of jamming. If that were the case I would think police would shy away for reliability reasons.

These so-called "orders" for guns and ammo are nothing more or less than pure BS.........This is a military dictatorship you are living in and they damn well are highly secretive about ALL OF THEIR CRIMINAL ACTIONS. You know ONLY what they want you to know - so rest assured that all of these supposed "ORDERS" for bombs, guns and ammo (and whatever else) are part of a larger psy-op propaganda operation..........and don't dare ask me to prove what I know to be true. I worked hard for that info and I'll be damned if i am going to reveal it to skeptics and non-believers.

reply to post by Vitruvian

Vitruvian (Man) ....unless it is a Black Ops there still has to be a paper trail for the General Accounting Office (GAO) for all agency procurements. Speaking of "black ops" I cant wait for a whistleblower to post an order for nerve gas or something.

reply to post by roadgravel

Yes there should be fewer jams with FMJ but the difference is probably de minimis versus the relative effectiveness. Remember when they shoot their firearm they dont shoot to warn or wound....they shoot to kill (center mass) so they want the deadliest bullet available (and get them as the Geneva Convention does not apply here - but it might make TPTB down play the semantics of "the 'war' on terror").

The incompetance level is staggering in America, do you really think any kind of a government occupation or martial law declaration is going to last any longer than that Occupy Wallstreet BS?

Let them put the NG on the street corners and i`ll show you a quick way to aquire military grade weapons.
You guys should be more worried about street gangs and drug cartels which are actually out to hurt you.

Originally posted by CosmicCitizen


The cover for the big order is that this is for "training" but a) you dont need hollow points for training (they are designed for maximum human stopping power not cutting thru paper targets), and b) the quantity of the order which is in addition to 700 million rounds over the last year or so (over 1.4 Billion total now) suggests that they are preparing for civil war against the american people. I would imagine that there will be a final order for over 1 bilion rounds and then a defecation storm will be imminent. Comments, reactions or other thoughts???

www.infowars.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Not that I disagree with your post but I would clarify one thing.

About training with hollow point ammo, You should train with what you plan to carry and shoot because different ammo shoots differently and point of aim is different.

I practice with what I carry for defense. Everyone should.

Originally posted by StratosFear
The incompetance level is staggering in America, do you really think any kind of a government occupation or martial law declaration is going to last any longer than that Occupy Wallstreet BS?

Let them put the NG on the street corners and i`ll show you a quick way to aquire military grade weapons.

You guys should be more worried about street gangs and drug cartels which are actually out to hurt you.

The NG line is pretty funny.......... and I fully agree.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


I agree with you, but MAN, that is a lot of training

750,000,000 / 1000 (just a swag at how much may be burned up in a training session by 10 ppl) / 365 (days in the year) = 2054 training sessions a day every day of the year.

Lot of shooting

reply to post by CosmicCitizen




CHINA!!!

2ND LINE..... ONE LOVE

I look at it this way......the ammo ordered is typical police style ammo....(except for the large 223 rifle order)
They have how many people under arms?
Sooothats the number of people into the umber of bullets and what kind of allowance do you get for an idividual?
Cut that down considerable for the years theyll be usig this order....and thats not a real lot of practice is it?


They have approx 200,000 working for them.....seven hundred fifty million rounds comes to
750,000,000/200,000=three thousand seven hundred fifty rounds per person for practice and duty......
Now, are we going a LITTLE off the deep end here?

I have a close relative who works for DHS on the "front lines" as it were on the border. I aksed him directly about the ammo. He confirmed that they do indeed use hollowpoint for practice.

reply to post by ElohimJD


Never thought of it that way. I figured the smart military personal (with possible civilian efforts) would evenly split and attack the personal that would go through with orders against the population. If it came to a civil war, but with a foreign intervention i believe youre correct

Originally posted by SoymilkAlaska
seriously, why in the world would they ever buy so much ammo?


who are they going to shoot, and why?

... Zombies.