People who shall not enter heaven.

Originally posted by EvilSadamClone
reply to post by adrift

 

There is no such thing as logic when religion is involved.

Oh another Jean-Paul Sartre, I presume. Some of the greatest philosophers have spoken in favor of religion, no matter what the religion is. Which religion is it that you have a problem with?

reply to post by WarminIndy


Oh, all of them, especially organized religion.

reply to post by adjensen

So you're an anti-semite, whoop dee doo. You spent an awful lot of time whining about something you think doesn't exist, why not just go off and hate in private?

Have you seen the number of religious folk hating in public? Waving signs and shouting for people to repent? Whole world going to sh*t around them and they're just sitting there waiting for the Jesus Cab? Yeah, nice guilt trip.

And being against Christianity's head-in-the-sand conform-on-pain-of-eternal-damnation philosophy is not anti-semitic. I have nothing against Jews. They're pretty cool people. So, again, nice try.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity

So why then should we call him God? He is no God.

He is absolutely useless and we don't need him.

You're right, the Christian god is no god.

But there is something better out there...we just don't understand it...

Technically, the Christian God is the Jewish God. I suppose it would be better if we worshiped Pele? Maybe Loki? Maybe Shamash?

reply to post by WarminIndy


How about respect and learning instead of outright worship? Does that work for you? Personally, I don't like any activity that causes me to feel bad about being who I am, just to get a little sympathy and gratiation from some guy who holds his own creative flaws against me, AND who f***s with people just to win a bet with the guy whom he is supposedly fighting.

But that's just me.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


12:06 AM on June 6th.

some of the ideas present in the bible are great! some not so great. some undeniably ignorant. but what does one truly expect from a book written that long ago. when I go back and watch some old movies I become dumbfounded as to the how any of that would have been passed off as quality material. why would a son without a father not be allowed into heaven? I think we could just update that one to the parents of the bastard will both be damned for eternity. I just can not believe that some all knowing and great being would go through the measures of creating all this beauty only to damn it for eternity. On the flip side it is equally as difficult to believe that some star exploded and then ATS appeared.

anyway I equate this post to that of a mormon coming to my door, as I would deliver my opinion to them as well.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
And being against Christianity's head-in-the-sand conform-on-pain-of-eternal-damnation philosophy is not anti-semitic. I have nothing against Jews. They're pretty cool people. So, again, nice try.

That wasn't addressed to you, so I'm not sure what relevance your opinion of Jews would be.

OP is ranting about a Jewish text, written by Jewish people, believed by Jewish People, about the Jewish God. That seems pretty anti-Semitic, I'd say. And who gets to go into the Temple doesn't really matter to Christians, so he fails to make any point, apart from "hatin' on the Jews".

Originally posted by EvilSadamClone
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Oh, all of them, especially organized religion.

Can you name any religion that is not organized? In every religion there is always someone who is a master, someone who is a teacher and someone who leads in worship.

reply to post by WarminIndy


Not part of the topic of this thread.

The topic of which is; the people God shall not allow into heaven as stated in Deut.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

How about respect and learning instead of outright worship? Does that work for you? Personally, I don't like any activity that causes me to feel bad about being who I am, just to get a little sympathy and gratiation from some guy who holds his own creative flaws against me, AND who f***s with people just to win a bet with the guy whom he is supposedly fighting.

But that's just me.

edit on 10-8-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

How about respect and learning toward our God as well? So don't feel bad about your activity, but what you fail to understand, it is not about what you do to yourself, it is what you do to others that matters. And the Bible teaches that, there is punishment when we harm others. That is the fundamental notion of the Golden Rule and karma. You reap what you sow, so we let you reap it if that is what you wish. But I do have a right to say someone is harming another, and that is what the Bible is teaching.

Why do you suppose the Bible says "thou shalt not kill"? Does that mean God is telling you that you better not deviate from His Will or else, or could it mean that when you have killed someone that you have taken a life not yours to take and destroyed other people in the process?

The Bible is about justice and equity. Somehow people turned it into "Why should God tell what I can and cannot do?" That justice and equity means that we have to be punished for harming others, and that also means that if we have been harmed there is justice for us.

Originally posted by EvilSadamClone
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Not part of the topic of this thread.

The topic of which is; the people God shall not allow into heaven as stated in Deut.

edit on 10-8-2012 by EvilSadamClone because: (no reason given)

Again, not a verse regarding heaven. That is the first flaw in your argument, and it seems to be based in ignorance.

reply to post by WarminIndy


Why should we respect him? What has he done to earn it other than encourage a bunch of people to be intolerant of other people who doesn't believe the same way as they do?

What has he done to earn people's respect other than browbeat people into submission into worshiping him?

Might makes right is no reason to respect some one. All that does is generate fear and resentment.

reply to post by WarminIndy


I wish I had a dollar for every time a Christian claimed anybody who disagreed with them is ignorant because they and only they have the one true correct interpretation of the Bible.

You're the one who's ignorant.

Originally posted by EvilSadamClone
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Why should we respect him? What has he done to earn it other than encourage a bunch of people to be intolerant of other people who doesn't believe the same way as they do?

What has he done to earn people's respect other than browbeat people into submission into worshiping him?

Might makes right is no reason to respect some one. All that does is generate fear and resentment.

Do you think I am an intolerant hater because I am a Christian? That is a stereotype and a false one. The Bible I read teaches me to love my neighbor as myself. That does not mean that I have to accept their behaviors if it harms others.

Go ahead and do the things you want to do for yourself, I will show you grace. But I do have a right as a person to point out that if you do things that will bring harm, that you should not do it. That's like drinking and driving. Sure, maybe 10 times someone drinks and drives and does not cause a wreck that kills someone, but there is always that one time that does it. Should I have looked the other way? Friends don't let friends drive drunk. That is a simple concept that means friends do not let you partake in something that can lead to destruction. Does that mean your friend is intolerant of you? No, they care about you and others enough to say something. That is not hating.

I care about my neighbors. They might not all think the same way as I do and they partake in behaviors that are harmful. When they do something that harms someone else, my caring must go toward justice and equity for the harmed person first. That is not intolerance, it is caring enough to help. When you have the attitude of "God doesn't like me because He does not like what I do, therefore I will not like God" then what you really mean is "God better not tell me what to do because I ain't gonna' care about anybody else but myself". It really is more intolerant to purposely partake in things knowing it might cause destruction to someone else.

Originally posted by EvilSadamClone
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

I wish I had a dollar for every time a Christian claimed anybody who disagreed with them is ignorant because they and only they have the one true correct interpretation of the Bible.

You're the one who's ignorant.

I would have a million bucks too from every person who said I was ignorant even though their assumption and statement was based in falsehood. You did not realize that verse was not mere interpretation, and did not realize exactly who it was talking about. So then you made your own interpretation and then get angry when we challenge your interpretation at the same time you are accusing us of our interpretation.

How do we know your interpretation is correct? What proves your interpretation? Again, it was based in ignorance, meaning that you were not aware of the facts involved.

reply to post by WarminIndy

Go ahead and do the things you want to do for yourself, I will show you grace. But I do have a right as a person to point out that if you do things that will bring harm, that you should not do it. That's like drinking and driving. Sure, maybe 10 times someone drinks and drives and does not cause a wreck that kills someone, but there is always that one time that does it. Should I have looked the other way? Friends don't let friends drive drunk. That is a simple concept that means friends do not let you partake in something that can lead to destruction. Does that mean your friend is intolerant of you? No, they care about you and others enough to say something. That is not hating.

Yes, it is a form of hate. Because you are assuming that you and only you have the right interpretation of morality. The greatest and smallest of crimes have been done in the name of doing good and helping people. You can take any number of examples and what do you see behind it? Somebody is trying to do good by imposing their morality upon another person in order to get them to conform to the one true way, whatever that is.

I would have a million bucks too from every person who said I was ignorant even though their assumption and statement was based in falsehood. You did not realize that verse was not mere interpretation, and did not realize exactly who it was talking about. So then you made your own interpretation and then get angry when we challenge your interpretation at the same time you are accusing us of our interpretation.

No, I got angry because you people insulted me. If you wanted a real discussion you could have challenged me in a way that didn't use words like calling me ignorant or faulty. I did not insult anybody. They just took what I said personally.

And you've made claims that my interpretation is the faulty one, but you haven't done anything to back up what you said other than make a claim that it is the wrong one. Words have many meanings, and because they have many meanings that can lead to many different interpretations. And that's the beauty of the Bible, all interpretations are correct in one form or another. For every Bible verse there is an equal and opposite Bible verse.

And now you're telling me that I can't make my own interpretation of what the verses say and must use your interpretations. But I'm sure that you're not going to directly give me any real answers but do what you can to turn the discussion against me. That is what you Christians do. You can't have an honest discussion with a Christian.

Originally posted by EvilSadamClone
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Go ahead and do the things you want to do for yourself, I will show you grace. But I do have a right as a person to point out that if you do things that will bring harm, that you should not do it. That's like drinking and driving. Sure, maybe 10 times someone drinks and drives and does not cause a wreck that kills someone, but there is always that one time that does it. Should I have looked the other way? Friends don't let friends drive drunk. That is a simple concept that means friends do not let you partake in something that can lead to destruction. Does that mean your friend is intolerant of you? No, they care about you and others enough to say something. That is not hating.

Yes, it is a form of hate. Because you are assuming that you and only you have the right interpretation of morality. The greatest and smallest of crimes have been done in the name of doing good and helping people. You can take any number of examples and what do you see behind it? Somebody is trying to do good by imposing their morality upon another person in order to get them to conform to the one true way, whatever that is.

I would have a million bucks too from every person who said I was ignorant even though their assumption and statement was based in falsehood. You did not realize that verse was not mere interpretation, and did not realize exactly who it was talking about. So then you made your own interpretation and then get angry when we challenge your interpretation at the same time you are accusing us of our interpretation.

No, I got angry because you people insulted me. If you wanted a real discussion you could have challenged me in a way that didn't use words like calling me ignorant or faulty. I did not insult anybody. They just took what I said personally.

And you've made claims that my interpretation is the faulty one, but you haven't done anything to back up what you said other than make a claim that it is the wrong one. Words have many meanings, and because they have many meanings that can lead to many different interpretations. And that's the beauty of the Bible, all interpretations are correct in one form or another. For every Bible verse there is an equal and opposite Bible verse.

And now you're telling me that I can't make my own interpretation of what the verses say and must use your interpretations. But I'm sure that you're not going to directly give me any real answers but do what you can to turn the discussion against me. That is what you Christians do. You can't have an honest discussion with a Christian.

I challenge you from the chapter before and after, what the context was to prove your statement. I am not allowed to take the Bible out of context as a Christian and would not want to. That is why some of us Christians devote a lot of time learning and understanding the people of the Bible, the context of the times in which they lived and what words meant. So before you fly off the handle again thinking I am a stereotype Christian, I challenge you to prove that chapter meant heaven. It does not and never will. Context is everything, so prove your statement.

Let's do this systematically, shall we? That is what some of us Christians do for study, let's learn about context by each verse and what came before and after. Show me anywhere in that chapter that it is referring to heaven.

I'm sorry, but I have no more interest in this subject.

You can take that for a victory if you wish.

But it is not.

This is why the Bible is hate literature and should be banned

Oh, you are another one of those book burning types yes? How about this princess... You mind your own business and stop acting like you have some moral authority to dictate what anyone has a right to read. Tired of you Nazi types.