We Now Have Our Smallest Government in 45 Years, page 2


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ATS Members have flagged this thread 7 times


reply posted on 7-8-2012 @ 06:15 PM by miniatus
Originally posted by EvilSadamClone
reply to
post by miniatus



It's not the numbers, it's the POWER of the government that matters. The numbers are just a symptom.




Well I agree, I eluded to that as well by saying that a room of super computers are capable of doing far more than thousands of employees.. when you take that and add to the fact that the total number of employees is probably much larger than it was 45 years ago, the fact there are more agencies than there were 45 years ago and the fact that those agencies have more power than they had 45 years ago.. you can safely state that our government now is WAY larger and far more powerful/looming than ever before.. our population numbers mean absolutely nothing when you look at those things.. so the chart is useless..
edit on 8/7/2012 by miniatus because: (no reason given)



reply posted on 7-8-2012 @ 08:22 PM by Komodo
reply to post by LDragonFire



I call ...

BS~! what about the new TSA, was that included....

what's your stance ?



reply posted on 7-8-2012 @ 09:25 PM by freethinker123
Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
Originally posted by freethinker123
Can somebody explain to me the obsession with smaller government in the US, rather than a better functioning government? In other words, why aren't people as concerend with state employees doing their jobs better as much as they are wanting for them to lose their jobs?

I ask because almost all from the US talk about this small government thing, but I get the feeling its a 'belief' almost held like a religion and that hardly anybody even bothers thinking about the issue, its a given for some reason...



Because they cant do it better.

Speaking as a decades long government employee efficiency is frowned upon.

In one of my higher-up positions I was able to cut tens of thousands off the annual budget of my municipality not by laying people off, reducing services or making any cuts of any kind. I simply cancelled all the crony contracts that had been established and opened all acquisitions and services up to bidding and "shopping around."

The taxpayers on the street loved it.

The bureaucrats did not.

I experienced this same occurrence in several positions across several cities and states.

Efficiency is punished. Nepotism and waste is not only liked but it is encouraged and rewarded.

I'll never forget the time I was called out for picking up a $2 roll of tape on my way in rather than ordering that same roll of tape for $10 from the city approved vendor.

An efficient government is an impossibility. By it's vary nature any governing entity or bureaucracy will be corrupt sooner or later.


Thanks for the reply, at least you have an informed reason for your belief. But would you agree with me that most in the US think small government is good, but they haven't thought about if this is true, or had any experience of it. For me its worrying that people buy into a general belief with bothering to consider the issue.

For the record I've also worked at a government institution and I'd agree with you about bureaucracy. On the other hand I've worked in the private sector, where the boss / owner used to yell and belittle us, including department heads such as myself. He wasn't cometent....

Is an efficient government impossible? With correct oversight / incentives surely its possible to make government more efficient? But efficiency is only part of the story. Being effective and doing the job correctly is just as important isn't it?


reply posted on 8-8-2012 @ 02:30 AM by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by LDragonFire



Since when has Big Government been measured by the number of employees. Oversight, restrictions, detention of US citizens without cause cited, that is Big Government.


reply posted on 8-8-2012 @ 05:38 PM by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by LDragonFire



In 1968, the U.S. Federal Budget, in terms of spending was $368.7 billion. Contrast that with the 2012 United States Federal Budget which has approved $3.796 trillion in expenditures. That's some nifty adjusting for inflation if we are going to take the title of this thread and the study cited at their implication.


reply posted on 8-8-2012 @ 05:39 PM by LDragonFire
reply to post by Komodo



I don't know anything more than whats in the article.

Per population I can believe it considering all the cops and firefighters and teachers laid off in the last few years.

Honestly Bush at his time had the largest government, dept, and everything else they bash Obama about.



reply posted on 8-8-2012 @ 05:52 PM by Diisenchanted
Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to
post by LDragonFire



That's ALL government. Not Federal Government. This only highlights the extreme issues with our municipalities.. when most people complain about the size of government they mean the Feds.



No they don't. That is just a moronic statement.
When I complain about big government it is about all government. Right down to local. We were not born yesturday and we are not stupid.
Big government is all government. In fact we are more affected by local government than we are the idiots in Washington.....


reply posted on 8-8-2012 @ 06:46 PM by charles1952
reply to post by Diisenchanted


I'm not entirely sure that the statement was all that moronic. Local government employees actually do something for us. Police & Fire, teachers, etc. They're easier to influence, have a smaller scope, usually have to explain themselves in town meetings, more closely represent the people they deal with, and know the community far better.

I don't mind local government as much as you do, and I don't think my position is moronic. We can argue if it's right, but it's not moronic.


reply posted on 8-8-2012 @ 11:11 PM by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by charles1952



I agree with you. Normally I think Federal when I think Big Government. That doesn't mean state and local cant overstep their bounds, but none can impact us like the Feds.
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