The Sun of God

page: 3
10
<< 1  2    4 >>

log in

join

posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 11:45 AM
link   
reply to post by adjensen
 


I have done my research as well. I didn't come to my conclusion based on others translations and interpretations, I used common sense, something you lack overwhelmingly.

I have shown lack of critical thinking? From the guy who finds it so hard to grasp such a simple concept? Are you kidding me?


Sorry, but I'm not fluent in either Greek nor Hebrew so I don't qualify to make translations. I have a feeling that neither do you. Obviously you are too intellectually lazy to grasp the sun/son concept so no, I will not agree to do the work for you, sorry. You're on your own there.


ETA: I'll use the logic of most Christians here, prove that it hasn't been altered yourself.
edit on 6-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 11:56 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


So you're unable to provide one single example to support your claims. That's what happens when you just make things up, based on your "feelings."

So much for "enlightenment", oh font of ignorance and irrationality.



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 12:02 PM
link   
reply to post by adjensen
 


It wouldn't matter if I did bring evidence, you have shown time and time again that you ignore logic when dealing with the bible and Jesus, why would this time be any different?

I'm not going to spend hours of time to research something only for you to shoot it down before even reading or considering it.

So much for 'common sense'.
edit on 6-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 12:19 PM
link   

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
I'm not going to spend hours of time to research something only for you to shoot it down before even reading or considering it.


So now you admit that you haven't even done any research, and you have no intention to do any, because you're content to wallow in your own narcissistic fantasy world, rather that prove yourself wrong, never mind me doing it for you.

As for "common sense", anyone reading any of the numerous interchanges between you and I can't help but notice that, while I consistently stand on fact and rational thought, you subsist on emotional appeals, easily disproven theories and vacuous claims, eventually falling into making straw men and ad hominem attacks when you realize that you have nothing to say.

I sincerely hope that, in a few years, after you have matured a bit, you come back and review your behaviour on ATS.



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 12:20 PM
link   

Originally posted by adjensen

Boy, if there's ever a challenger to God for the power of omnipotence, it's gotta be Constantine. I've seen him credited with doing almost everything


Combining sun worship with Jesus? No.

If you don't take the time to study and understand the Jewish religion, you will never understand Christianity and continue to make nonsensical statements about it, like this. Christianity has the same basis as Judaism, the only difference is that people are reconciled to God through Christ, rather than through the Law.

To that end Judaism and Christianity are explicitly opposed to any notion that God is an object. Saying that God (or, by extension, Christ,) is the sun is as absurd as saying that a vase a potter makes is the potter. Claiming that Christianity is relabeled sun worship is completely contrary to Christian theology, history and teaching, and is without any reasonable basis, apart from haters just wanting it to be true.



I see you are up to your same disgruntled name calling that happens again and again when anyone disagrees with your dream dogma. Surely, this English Nursery song is yours:

"Row, row, row your boat,
Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily,
Life is but a dream."


You are doing a lot of rowing here and you appear to dismiss the Trinity. You know that Christian thing that says Jesus is god. Then all those pictures of Jesus as god on the cross in every Christian Church is a symbol for god in every church.

Perhaps you "hate" when folks notice that, so the term may only apply to you.


The rest of us are looking at the old traditions and going where that takes one to find the points of origin for the fables and faked concepts for god.

You would deny that even Sun-Day exists, and even the XP on Constantine's Shields. Like it or not Constantine was part Sun worship and part XP worship, and it came from a dream:




www.hyperhistory.net...

Although Constantine was one of the greatest influences in promoting the Christian faith, he is also credited with infiltrating it with pagan practices, and bringing idols into the church. While Christianity was growing in popularity, sun worship or Mithraism remained strong in the empire. Sun worshipers were converted to Christianity because of their surface similarities, practices, and analogies such as “the sun of righteousness” which were later implemented into the church.

Mithra, the sun god was celebrated in the solar paganism and their day of rest and worship was on the day of the sun. Constantine issued laws conflicting with the fourth commandment, changing the day of worship from Sabbath to Sunday to coincide with the sun worship day of rest. Constantine’s motives for promoting the pagan influences on Christianity are not certain. His mutual compensation was possibly for political purposes of gaining favor or out of ignorance of the laws of the Bible. One mystery is The Arch of Constantine, built to honor his triumph in the name of God. The monument displays no symbolic relevance to God, but does have images of Mithra.



So, Christians have Easter from the pagan Sun worship of Nimrod's gang, and they go to church on SUN day to worship their god, via Trinity, that is a symbol for Jesus being god that is on every church in the US.

edit on 6-8-2012 by MagnumOpus because: Balogana that rejects the grinder



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 12:26 PM
link   
reply to post by MagnumOpus
 


That doesn't even make any sense, sorry.

You go on with your "looking at the old traditions" and finding connections that don't exist, because the only "old traditions" you look at are the ones that are consistent with your point of view. You'll dupe those who are as pre-biased as you, but will fail to win anyone else, because you can't argue against a belief you don't understand.



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 12:35 PM
link   
reply to post by toocoolnc
 


Very nice OP! Star and flag!

I like this.



Ancient man even with his limited intelligence at that time had no problem understanding that all life on Earth depended directly on life-giving energy from the Sun. Consequently, all life was lost without the sun. It followed that God's 'Sun' was nothing less than [man's savior].

Since...energy from the Sun gave life, and we sustained our very existence by taking energy in from our food (which came directly from God’s Sun), the Sun must give up its life supporting energy so that we may continue to live. 'God’s Sun [must give] his life for us to live.'"


There is no question in my mind that "sun god" worship has permeated Christianity to its core.





Above is a Roman coin from the 3rd century A.D. (Probus, A.D. 276-282) which on the reverse depicts the pagan sun god driving a chariot drawn by four horses (Sol in Quadriga). The inscription reads SOLI INVICTO - The Invincible Sun.]





A similar mosaic found in the Vatican grottoes under St. Peter's Basilica, on the vaulted ceiling of the tomb of the Julii (also known as "Mausoleum M"). It depicts Christ as the sun-god Helios / Sol riding in his chariot, and is dated to the 3rd century A.D. The two left horses were destroyed when the hole was made to enter the tomb. Other mosaics in this Christian tomb depicted Jonah and the whale, the good shepherd carrying a lamb, and fishermen. This blending of paganism with Christianity is syncretism, and apostasy.





So in St. Peter's square, the symbol of Baal is within the symbol of Ishtar, and at the center is an Egyptian obelisk, all representing pagan sun worship.







posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 12:40 PM
link   
reply to post by adjensen
 


How did you come to the conclusion that I haven't done any research? Just because I refuse to spend hours of research only for you to shoot it down does not mean I have not done any.

Ad hominem? Hypocrite? I think so.

So now you speak for everyone? How self-centered can you possibly be? Just because you believe that you stand on fact and rationality doesn't mean everyone agrees with you. Get off your high horse.


How have I based my arguments on emotion? I no longer have an emotional connection with the bible, I used to, but now I see it for what it truly is: propaganda and dogma. You are the one that refuses to see logic when it is presented to you and are the one with an emotional connection to the bible, so YOU are the one basing your arguments on emotion, you just refuse to see it.

Since you can't grasp such a simple concept, that goes to show you lack critical thinking when dealing with the bible.Oh In fact, you lack any form of thinking because you let the bible do it for you.

'Oh no, Satan will take my soul if I think any differently.' That's the bondage religion has placed you in. Sad, but absolutely true.
edit on 6-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)
edit on 6-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 12:45 PM
link   
reply to post by adjensen
 


To you it doesn't make sense, but to others without just a one-track mind, it makes perfect sense. The connections are there, you just refuse to see them because you only look at traditions that fit your point of view. See how that can go both ways?



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 12:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by adjensen
reply to post by MagnumOpus
 


That doesn't even make any sense, sorry.

You go on with your "looking at the old traditions" and finding connections that don't exist, because the only "old traditions" you look at are the ones that are consistent with your point of view. You'll dupe those who are as pre-biased as you, but will fail to win anyone else, because you can't argue against a belief you don't understand.



I am sure you think de-nile is a place in Egypt, But real denial is the boat you row:

"Row, row, row your boat,
Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily,
Life is but a dream."

Most of us do read more than one book, and we don't get stuck in the ignorance presented by only reading one book and attempting to tell everyone you know everything there is about god and those origins that well pre-date the Bible's first entry.

ATS is about the rise above ignorance and not cruising down De-Nile with a pretty dream to row down the river.

Your one book takes advantage of repetion of the same things over and over again in the churches, and it takes advange of a defect in human brain development that takes illusions and dreams into reality and inabilty to separate reality from fantasy. It is a form of mind control and pretty story stimulation for Serotonin, but avoids harsh truths.




www.popsci.com...

Found: The Particular Brain Fold That Helps People Distinguish Between Imagination and Reality




The rest of us that can see this process happening, don't subscribe to its dreams. The rest of us will read many other books, use critical thinking, and speak with rational insights that often do oppose your dreams and illusions.

edit on 6-8-2012 by MagnumOpus because: Boats based on dreams sink, and they don't row with a darn, expect in the imagination of Christian's pagan god



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 01:59 PM
link   

Originally posted by MagnumOpus
Most of us do read more than one book, and we don't get stuck in the ignorance presented by only reading one book and attempting to tell everyone you know everything there is about god and those origins that well pre-date the Bible's first entry.


Fair enough -- point me to a scholarly resource that demonstrates that Christianity is just "Sun worship" and successfully reconciles the Judaic viewpoint, and I will be happy to read it. My statements are based on the historical record and theological viewpoint of Judaism, as I know it, but if I have been misinformed, I'd appreciate your credible sources.

I presume that you understand the concept of a "scholarly resource", since you are so widely read.



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 02:12 PM
link   

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by MagnumOpus
Most of us do read more than one book, and we don't get stuck in the ignorance presented by only reading one book and attempting to tell everyone you know everything there is about god and those origins that well pre-date the Bible's first entry.


Fair enough -- point me to a scholarly resource that demonstrates that Christianity is just "Sun worship" and successfully reconciles the Judaic viewpoint, and I will be happy to read it. My statements are based on the historical record and theological viewpoint of Judaism, as I know it, but if I have been misinformed, I'd appreciate your credible sources.

I presume that you understand the concept of a "scholarly resource", since you are so widely read.



One thing I think we all know, is you don't represent scholarship on religion.


I do think that what I and it appears others are seeing is that you play too many games. One of those games is your constant attempts to paraphrase what others say that well departs from what they said originally.

Your game is all about wearing down others with having to constantly correct your mistatement due to inaccurate parapharsing.

Such games are hardly worth anyones time spent to convince you of anything different than hitting the same serotonin reward botton in the brain that your Bible beliefs put into place.

Most others looking around this thread don't have any problems seeing the Sun worship issues from Rome and Constantine. And they all know Jewish don't go to church on Sunday, and most of them call Trinity a lie and don't have much use for the Christian perversions of Jesus.

And many of us don't value your opinion, we only take a little time to keep you from misleading others.



edit on 6-8-2012 by MagnumOpus because: The games of the paraphasers



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 02:50 PM
link   
reply to post by MagnumOpus
 



Most others looking around this thread don't have any problems seeing the Sun worship issues from Rome and Constantine. And they all know Jewish don't go to church on Sunday, and most of them call Trinity a lie and don't have much use for the Christian perversions of Jesus.


Well, that's all well and good, but I've asked you on what basis do you have no problems "seeing the Sun worship issues from Rome and Constantine." I'm not "twisting your words" -- I'm asking you for a scholarly reference that you point to for your apparently crystal clear perspective on Sun worship and Constantine.

The reason that we base evidence on scholarly references are that they are required to be sourced (one can determine what the author is referencing, to verify that the statements made are valid ones) and they are almost always peer reviewed, meaning that someone with a solid background in the same field has reviewed the sources and methodology and attests to the validity of it.

There are plenty of "sources" that one can find on the Internet that are neither scholarly, nor are they peer reviewed, and through them, we can find concrete "evidence" that Christ never existed, that he existed and was the bringer of Gnosis, that Julius Caesar WAS Christ, that perpetual motion machines exist, that the Earth is the battleground of a half dozen alien species, that the Masons rule the world, or the Illuminati do, or the Bilderbergers do, or the aliens do, etc, etc, etc.

Criticize me all you like, but if you review my postings, I am fairly consistent in simply asking people to explain why they believe things that are contrary to existing evidence, and to provide reasonable evidence to support their claims, because I do not believe in presenting opinion as fact.

So, what books or journal articles can you point me to?



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 02:58 PM
link   
reply to post by adjensen
 





I am fairly consistent in simply asking people to explain why they believe things that are contrary to existing evidence,


What existing evidence? Do you have evidence that the RCC never merged Christianity with solar deity worship and it remained completely pure of such influence?


edit on 6-8-2012 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 03:10 PM
link   
,

Originally posted by adjensen

So, what books or journal articles can you point me to?




There is really no excuse for your ineptitudes. The entire world knows about the Christian Purges of Rome's rule. They also know that Constatine stepped on Judiasm and basically said Christians have the rule of law now, with a good deal of Sun worship blended into the religion theme.

Anyone in the world can read an encyclopedia but you.




www.newworldencyclopedia.org...

Coins struck for emperors often reveal details of their personal iconography. During the early part of Constantine's rule, representations first of Mars and then (from 310 C.E.) of Apollo as sun god consistently appeared on the reverse sides of the coinage.

----------

Gothicus had claimed the divine protection of Apollo-Sol Invictus. In mid-310 C.E., two years before the victory at Milvian Bridge, Constantine reportedly experienced the publicly announced vision in which Apollo-Sol Invictus appeared to him with omens of success. Thereafter the reverses of his coinage were dominated for several years by his "companion, the unconquered Sol"—the inscriptions read SOLI INVICTO COMITI. The depiction represents Apollo with a solar halo, Helios-like, and the globe in his hands. In the 320s Constantine received a halo of his own in images. There are also coins depicting Apollo driving the chariot of the Sun on a shield which Constantine is holding and in one example, from 312, shows the Christian symbol of the chi-rho on a helmet worn by Constantine.






"Constantine was almost certainly a Mithraic, and his triumphal arch, built after his 'conversion', testifies to the Sun-god, or 'unconquered sun'. Many Christians did not make a clear distinction between this sun-cult and their own. They referred to Christ 'driving his chariot across the sky'; they held their services on Sunday, knelt towards the East and had their nativity feast on 25 December, the birthday of the sun at the winter solstice. During the later pagan revival under the Emperor Julian many Christian found it easy to apostacize because of this confusion; the Bishop of Troy told Julian he had always secretely prayed to the sun. Constantine never abandoned sun-worship and kept the sun on his coins. He made Sunday into a day of rest, closing the law courts and forbidding all work except agricultural labour. In his new city of Constantinople, he set up a statue of the sun-god, bearing his own features, in the Forum; and another of the mother-Goddess Cybele, though she was presented in a posture of Christian prayer.
Constantine's motives were probably confused. He was an exceptionally superstitious man, and he no doubt shared the view, popular among professinal soldiers, that all religous cults should be respected, to appease their respective gods....Vain and superstitious, Constantine may have embraced Chrstianity because it suited his personal interests, and his growing megalomania.... His own role was not wholly removed from that of the pagan God-emperor - as witness the colossal heads and statues of himself with which he littered his empire...How could the Christian Church, apparently quite willingly, accomodate this weird megalomaniac in its theocratic system? ----- " A History of Christianity "Paul Johnson pp. 67, 68






"Although Constantine attributed his success to the divine message that he beleived he had read in the skies before the battle at the Milvian Bridge in 312, he could not officially--and privately, it seems, did not-abandon paganism at once. ---- " Encyclopedia Americana 2000






"However, until his preparations for his final campaign by 323, he did not abandon his allegiance to the Sun god, even though he regarded himself as a servant of the Christian God... Constantine's public image remained - the Sun god was the emperor's 'companion.' The liberation of Rome was attributed to the Sun on a medallion struck at the time. ---- " The Rise of Christianity, W.H.C. Frend, p.484






“Constantine’s nephew Julian speaks of Constantine’s connection with a special cult of Helios. From a familiar obverse on coins of Constantine, representing the sun-god with the inscription SOLI. INVICTI. COMITI, we deduce that the personification of the sun as Mithras is here implied. Anyone who has dealt with ancient coins knows that out of five Constantinian pieces probably four will bear this obverse, so that there is a high probability that this device was retained until the Emporer’s death…But the coins with unequivocal Christian emblems which he is said to have struck are yet to be found. ---- ” The Age of Constantine the Great, 1949, Jacob Burckhardt, p.293



You have great illitaracy on the issues of the Christian Purges. The change of Constantine to support Christians and Sun worship are obvious, and the fact that Constantine stepped down hard on Judaism. That Constantine swich against Judaism was blamed for the Holocaust due to Vatincans retention of the ideas.

Constantine was politics to end all the purge wars that were distroying too much.


edit on 6-8-2012 by MagnumOpus because: A boat load of evidence---even in encyclopedias and books of notable authors, and his Nephew



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 03:16 PM
link   

Originally posted by windword
What existing evidence? Do you have evidence that the RRC never merged Christianity with solar deity worship and it remained completely pure of such influence?


RRC? What does that stand for?

Well, first of all, I'm not the one making the claims here, so I'm not sure why it's on me to prove a negative. And secondly, yes, there is a consistent theological thread through both the Old and New Testaments, along with the writings of the church, both early and throughout history, that God is not an object, and objects are not to be worshiped or confused with him.



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 03:26 PM
link   

Originally posted by MagnumOpus

Originally posted by adjensen

So, what books or journal articles can you point me to?




There is really no excuse for your ineptitudes. The entire world knows about the Christian Purges of Rome's rule. They also know that Constatine stepped on Judiasm and basically said Christians have the rule of law now, with a good deal of Sun worship blended into the religion theme.


Apart from your personal insults, where is your evidence of "a good deal of Sun worship blended into the religion theme"? Your encyclopedia entry refers, apparently, to coins, and the personal beliefs of Constantine (who wasn't a Christian until later in life, and there are some who dispute that he ever converted at all.)

Where is the documentation of changes to scripture, the insertion of passages that promote Sun worship? Since Protestants subscribe to Sola Scriptura, any claims that Christianity is refigured Sun worship would have to include biblical passages that demonstrate it.

And I did ask for books or journal articles, not an encyclopedia. There is a reason that one is taught in junior high school that encyclopedias should not be used as sources.



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 03:36 PM
link   

Originally posted by adjensen
There is a reason that one is taught in junior high school that encyclopedias should not be used as sources.



Pure Non-sense. Your balogna rejects the grinder.

Plus, you missed all the citations of various scholar books.
edit on 6-8-2012 by MagnumOpus because: The promoter of ignorance speaks again, plus can't seem to read. imho



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 03:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by MagnumOpus

Originally posted by adjensen
There is a reason that one is taught in junior high school that encyclopedias should not be used as sources.



Pure Non-sense. Your balogna rejects the grinder.

Plus, so do citations of various scholar books.


lol, what? Misspellings aside, that doesn't make any sense.



posted on Aug, 6 2012 @ 03:56 PM
link   

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by windword
What existing evidence? Do you have evidence that the RRC never merged Christianity with solar deity worship and it remained completely pure of such influence?


RRC? What does that stand for?

Well, first of all, I'm not the one making the claims here, so I'm not sure why it's on me to prove a negative. And secondly, yes, there is a consistent theological thread through both the Old and New Testaments, along with the writings of the church, both early and throughout history, that God is not an object, and objects are not to be worshiped or confused with him.



Everyone knows he meant RCC, so why do you need to nick-pick. Petty non-sense.





new topics
top topics
 
10
<< 1  2    4 >>

log in

join