Congress Passes Restrictions On Military Funeral Protests, Delivers Blow To Westboro Baptist Church

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posted on Aug, 4 2012 @ 11:00 PM
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Originally posted by iwilliam
I am a man of such strong principle I have extreme difficulty standing behind censorship in any capacity. But I have to say I really, really, really dislike this group, and this was a deserved move, for all involved.


While I don't blindly support the military any more than I support hateful church groups, IMO one should have a certain amount of respect for the soldier, and their families, even if not for the institution. These are people. People whose families have fought, believing in this country, regardless of the real agenda of their puppet masters.

I almost take this as proof that god exists. Or maybe that he feels the same way about westboro baptist as the rest of us.



While (and this is an important point) I do not endorse the limitation of freedoms by the government, especially in areas of free speech, I have seen these people go too far. Some of their tactics could be considered harrassment. Kudos to congress for doing this. Just don't ever do it again.
edit on 4-8-2012 by iwilliam because: (no reason given)


Exactly, they're not protesting, they're harassing people - most of the time, their protests have nothing to do with the people they're protesting against. They've been banned from ever entering the U.K. and I think every country should ban them, including their own U.S. which they seem to hate so much. I bet they'd have a ton of fun if they had no place to live.




posted on Aug, 4 2012 @ 11:40 PM
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Originally posted by PsykoOps
So 1st amendment only applies if you agree with the message? That's not very american.


The problem is that Westboro was trampling on the rights of others. They still have the right to protest. Then the grieving family have the right to bury your loved ones in peace. The first amendment does not allow one groups rights to trump anothers. Protesting is still allowed, just in a fashion that makes sense.



posted on Aug, 4 2012 @ 11:41 PM
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I dont know if i agree with this. I just dont know. I couldnt imagine some one protesting at a family members funeral , but limiting free speech is a no no.

Westboro church should be morally held accountable by the public instead of the government.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 12:17 AM
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Originally posted by jacobe001
Of course you don't mind losing the right to protests at funerals, and others don't mind if we loose the right to protest (insert here). It's a slippery slope your going down and making yourself the enemy of freedom loving people, which our criminal politicians have already taken much away.


Originally posted by nunyadammm

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Their right of free speech is no less valuable or critical to our overall freedom than mine.


There are certain types of speech that are already against the law.
I really do not mind losing the right to protest funerals.
I cannot see any just need to ever do so for anyone in civilized society.


If anyone here has a decent argument, I want to hear it. Just pointing out what I said is not enough. What is wrong with it and be specific.
There are lots of things you cannot say just because you want to.
Convince me that protesting funerals is something I am going to want or need ever.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 01:16 AM
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-SAP-



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 01:27 AM
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Originally posted by nunyadammm


If anyone here has a decent argument, I want to hear it. Just pointing out what I said is not enough. What is wrong with it and be specific.
There are lots of things you cannot say just because you want to.
Convince me that protesting funerals is something I am going to want or need ever.


Why does it have to be about you?
Show me in the Constitution, The Bill of Rights, ANYWHERE where it is against the law to have your feelings hurt.

You are narrow-minded and have no respect for the freedom of others.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 01:30 AM
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Passing any kind of legislation like this is wrong from both ends. First, it will only give these WBC loons validation. Putting them in the national spotlight AGAIN is just what they want. Why do we keep helping their cause? Second, and most important, this is a huge slap in the face to the very people this law is meant to protect. These soldiers died in the line of duty. Part of that duty, as far as I know, is protecting and upholding the Constitution and the freedoms it grants us. Sort of hypocritical that some people want to usurp it just to protect feelings. Would they want that?



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 02:10 AM
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reply to post by Bakatono
 


I wasn't complaining about the funeral services that they already give the servicemen and women. All I meant is that allowing the family privacy away from people who protest their family members is a good addition. I don't think the government treats them good enough while they are living though (homeless vets, poor quality of care in some VA hospitals)

As for WBC and freedom of speech, no, I don't think they should get their freedom of speech taken away completely. As you pointed out it would be unconstitutional. I guess I didn't word my original post correctly. I dont think banning them from exercising that free speech too close to the funeral site and giving them set times to do so is infringing upon their freedom of speech at all.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 02:25 AM
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Originally posted by beezzer
Why does it have to be about you?
Show me in the Constitution, The Bill of Rights, ANYWHERE where it is against the law to have your feelings hurt.

You are narrow-minded and have no respect for the freedom of others.


Who said anything about my feelings being hurt?
I do not see you crying about how unconstitutional it is that you cannot threaten my life or commit libel against me.
Why not?
Are you only concerned about SOME aspects of free speech, like protesting funerals?


The truth is, you do not have an answer. You have no idea why you need this so called freedom. Now you are trying to make it about me.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 02:28 AM
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Originally posted by DarthOej
Passing any kind of legislation like this is wrong from both ends. First, it will only give these WBC loons validation. Putting them in the national spotlight AGAIN is just what they want. Why do we keep helping their cause? Second, and most important, this is a huge slap in the face to the very people this law is meant to protect. These soldiers died in the line of duty. Part of that duty, as far as I know, is protecting and upholding the Constitution and the freedoms it grants us. Sort of hypocritical that some people want to usurp it just to protect feelings. Would they want that?


I am having a trouble finding any soldiers proudly cheering about how they will die for your right to libel, threaten, or harass dead people and their grieving loved ones. Why is that?

You all act like free speech means you can always say anything you want anywhere you want. That is not the case.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 02:35 AM
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Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
Then the grieving family have the right to bury your loved ones in peace.


I have never heard of such a right. As I said they've been limited in their actions already to keep them peacefull. There's this slippery slope thing that I'd worry about. I mean next ows they would just cry "I have a right to work and these protesters insult me and make me afraid to go to work" and by same standard you can throw any hope of OWS out of the _



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 03:54 AM
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Originally posted by PsykoOps

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
Then the grieving family have the right to bury your loved ones in peace.


I have never heard of such a right. As I said they've been limited in their actions already to keep them peacefull. There's this slippery slope thing that I'd worry about. I mean next ows they would just cry "I have a right to work and these protesters insult me and make me afraid to go to work" and by same standard you can throw any hope of OWS out of the _


You have the right to practice your religion. Many religions have burial rites. I am glad you have now heard of the right I mentioned. You're welcome. When the actions of the rights ofone group infringes on the rights of another group something must be done. The Westboro Church still has the right to preach whatever vile hatred they want, they have simply been prevented from disturbing people performing a religious ceremony. I think this should extend to all funerals, not just the military.
edit on 5-8-2012 by OccamsRazor04 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 07:54 AM
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reply to post by OccamsRazor04
 

You bring up a good point.
No one is telling the WBC that they cannot say whatever they want. They are just being told yet another place they cannot cause trouble. They cannot come inside my church and protest. They should not be able to come into my cemetery either.

The Phelps incest clan can say whatever they want wherever they want.
What freedoms are they losing?
If I never attend a funeral in my life, am I losing a freedom?



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 08:44 AM
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reply to post by OccamsRazor04
 


You're welcome, very clever
I don't see how bunch of closet gays fidling with signs a hundred meters away would prevent anyone from doing anything. They aren't allowed into the churches or semetaries after all.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 09:00 AM
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The problem is WBC is "christian" church, ripping up their own kind. They are doing it simply to grandstand. This is NOT a "free speech" issue at all. What this is a bunch of very nasty people hiding behind something they have no right hiding behind and bullying others.

There is no other group like this: Therefore, they should be outlawed personally and as a group- specifically targeted and dealt with. This is a group of people who are VERY clear about their mission- to make people upset, and to make lawsuits and then make money. They are criminals- right to the core. SIMPLY DEAL WITH THEM AS CRIMINALS.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 10:26 AM
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Originally posted by PsykoOps
reply to post by OccamsRazor04
 


You're welcome, very clever
I don't see how bunch of closet gays fidling with signs a hundred meters away would prevent anyone from doing anything. They aren't allowed into the churches or semetaries after all.


They are allowed just outside the cemetery though and most people might not know this but you can see and hear through most cemetery fences.



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 11:21 AM
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Eight pages later and the realization that the 1st Amendment never protected protests at funerals in the first place for a variety of reasons might finally be setting in for some.




posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 11:39 AM
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Originally posted by Sek82
Eight pages later and the realization that the 1st Amendment never protected protests at funerals in the first place for a variety of reasons might finally be setting in for some.



How so?



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 12:20 PM
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Originally posted by detachedindividual
reply to post by SloAnPainful
 



On the other hand, where do restrictions stop, and why is it okay for a Republican politician to promote intolerance and hatred of others from a political platform to an entire country, but not okay for these freaks in a small event like that?
Even though I am not American, I'm looking at this from the perspective of other American citizens. What the Westboro freaks think wouldn't scare me or threaten me, but the religious beliefs a Republican politician running for Presidency espouses on the podium definitely would.

They can no longer hate on people however they like, but a Republican candidate can quote the Bible as an excuse to remove the rights of American citizens and everyone thinks that's perfectly fine?

Why do you not state DEMOCRAT in your post as well? www.youtube.com... A little biased yourself???? Or did you just fall off the turnip truck?



posted on Aug, 5 2012 @ 01:54 PM
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Originally posted by thebtheb

Originally posted by iwilliam
I am a man of such strong principle I have extreme difficulty standing behind censorship in any capacity. But I have to say I really, really, really dislike this group, and this was a deserved move, for all involved.


While I don't blindly support the military any more than I support hateful church groups, IMO one should have a certain amount of respect for the soldier, and their families, even if not for the institution. These are people. People whose families have fought, believing in this country, regardless of the real agenda of their puppet masters.

I almost take this as proof that god exists. Or maybe that he feels the same way about westboro baptist as the rest of us.



While (and this is an important point) I do not endorse the limitation of freedoms by the government, especially in areas of free speech, I have seen these people go too far. Some of their tactics could be considered harrassment. Kudos to congress for doing this. Just don't ever do it again.
edit on 4-8-2012 by iwilliam because: (no reason given)


Exactly, they're not protesting, they're harassing people - most of the time, their protests have nothing to do with the people they're protesting against. They've been banned from ever entering the U.K. and I think every country should ban them, including their own U.S. which they seem to hate so much. I bet they'd have a ton of fun if they had no place to live.


Exactly. When you think about it, no one's free speech is being removed. They can write on their blog whatever the hell they want and say and feel and think and believe whatever they want. But if they continually do nothing but harass people during funerals, why shouldn't this be legally recognized as harassment?

The laws could be changed all kinds of ways to accommodate ending WBC's attacks as well as preserving free speech. They could just make funerals altogether defined as something different, etc.






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