Calling for revolution is the worst kind of ignorance!

I'm going to have my little rant here because it's been building for awhile and I need to get this out. If you recognize yourself in my words, well, it might just be about you. Who knows...because naming names isn't my way. However, those who I have in mind, know who they are.


SO.... You want a revolution do you? Well now, that sounds just fine on the face of it. Our Government is broken from the janitor in the park bathroom to the President himself. Cops are as likely to beat us as serve us even when we call them out ourselves. DHS will smile at a cute baby and then strip it naked to look for bombs or whatever the hell TSA thinks all these people are trying to slip past the eagle eyes of their agents. (The Eagle is ill...like, a fever off the charts)

In short, our Nation is at one of the lowest points I'm aware it's ever been. It's certainly at the lowest in my living memory back into the early 1980's. Never before have I actually questioned the future of my nation or whether my son would even see and know the same systems and structure we've enjoyed here since 1776 (give or take a few).


So... I've established for the discussion that the nation sucks. Yes, it sure does right now. So what do we do about it? Do we perhaps run for office, starting low and working up? Nawww.. how stupid. That *IS* how the other side accomplished this and it took them decades...but we're the NOW generation and it's NOW or it's NOTHING! Hoorah!

Do we..organize and regroup and make damn sure the embarassment of chaos that was the Ron Paul campaign never repeats itself? Shall we insure that where this cycle we had 50 at a caucus, next time we have 500?? Naww.. Again, we're the NOW generation and that takes a few years. Work is just not worth it huh?


So lets have a revolution! YAY! Grab the guns, pack the power and load up the Molotov Cocktails, it's gonna be a roaring time for all!

But... Wait..... How does this work? What do we do? Who is this revolt against? We need to look at this.

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First, every revolution needs targets. After all, you can't revolt against a poster, an idea or a monument. Power won't change by occupying a lifeless building or park. It won't even register on the news to go revolt against "The System" unless there is a target to go carry the revolution TO. So lets start there.

Who is it we're off to kill? Lets not mince words...We know what revolution means and this is NOT the ballot box kind I am talking about here. So many are saying they are past all that. So...again, WHO is it that dies first?

Is it the kind old lady at the courthouse desk who is the evil gatekeeper to all that resides on the floors above? Perhaps it's the record clerk whose toiled away in the stacks for a few decades and marking time to retirement. Someone has to die or we can't have a revolution, can we? Again, power doesn't change hands by verbal jousting. Many say this daily now!

Perhaps.... Yes. I know, It's those evil politicians! GET 'EM! ...Wait though.. Which ones? No one will get within sight of the ones we all know in Washington, so that's out on the face of it. Shall it be the Mayor? State Legislators? elected officials within Police and Fire?

Hey.. Help me out here... I'm all for this revolution idea, but I just can't find who we're supposed to kill first, to get this all going. I search and I search..and I just can't, for the life of me (no pun intended) locate that evil doer who absolutely MUST be the first one to meet the new revolution.

Maybe that is too tough a spot to start.... Lets try a simple goal of what we want to achieve?

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Okay, NOW we're cooking ! I KNOW we can find things to agree on for the end goal because hey, the Government sucks. We all agree! (and in THIS point, we really do). So.... Lets get down to brass tacks. How shall it be and who shall it be in the end?

Well... I want the 2nd Amendment to be held above and used to repeal about 20,000 gun laws I don't like. Thats #1 our revolution is going to accomplish. Next, I want the Death Penalty modeled after China. One verdict, one gunshot and the Jury hears the bang ! Hell ya! I love this revolution idea!!

..........Oh wait.... It's not a conservative revolution some may say? Uh Oh.... Polls, voting and objective measure indicate a near 50/50 split in this nation and it's existed for going on 20 years now between the Liberal/Progressive Mindset and the Conservative Mindset. Hey, that's a problem. See....This revolution, it's gonna be violent. Everyone says so and seems to LIKE the idea. So... When I am sitting at the table with my Desert Eagle casually pointed in a neutral direction, and a liberal is across the table with their popgun pointed in a neutral direction on the table.....Who is it that decides WHICH 50% of that table is deciding?

Seems to me....the target list for this revolution is getting complicated and messy...because hey, I just fought a revolution to get to that table..and I'll be damned if I am giving in. I saw buddies die in this revolution of ours...but so did the Liberal...and they feel as strongly as I do.

Awww crap... We didn't even THINK about how 50/50 would become 100 AFTER all hell broke lose and the Law of the Gun became the ONLY law being enforced, did we? oops... Of course, in this case, I'm conservative. I'm an evil and mad gun nut. So many tell me.....How does THAT detail work into the revolution's future of guns being the rule?

Or....does someone see how all the guns magically vanish AFTER law and order is destroyed when such a goal can't even be considered with the full powers of a police state building before us?

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The above is a rant to make a point. Revolution is a great concept...in theory. It's the answer to all our provlems....in theory. Communism is also the greatest form of Government ever devised by the mortal thoughts of mere men......on PAPER. In reality, I believe revolution is the worst and most ugly form of ignorance to actually hope for or consider trying to help bring about.

As my first section notes... WHO is GOING to be killed? If you cannot answer who YOU PERSONALLY intend to kill in the opening moves, then revolution is still far too abstract to you, as a person, to even talk about. When that question can be answered with conviction...well, I'll be interested to hear the answer and I'm sure those who monitor sites will too.


This talk is half baked, not even HALF cocked and general fantasy land B.S.. The problem, as we've seen in Aurora and many before him, is that not everyone takes the talk as half baked expressions of frustration and impotent anger at the system we're being screwed by. For those who aren't serious... That is something to consider. For those who *ARE* serious. Get help. I don't care where, but before you get innocent people killed. Please, get help somewhere. This talk of armed revolt is suicidal, terminally stupid and makes people look like the lunatics the media make us ALL out to be. It's proving them correct.

- Rant Over (Hops off to take deeeeep breaths and count to 10 a few dozen times)

Well I dont live in your country But I'll ask - what do you suggest people do to cure the world of the evil we all know exists?

Most liberals hate guns and do not own any. Thus we conservatives will be the majority after the revolution. Actually, socialism loving libtards should be equal targets with lawyers, congress critters(mostly lawyers), and most of the appointed members of the executive branch. All of the senior bankers and owners stock trading companies need to go. CEOs who offshored American jobs need to go. Libtards who believe an owl is more important than people need to go. Once all of the above are gone, there will be many more like minded people left and we can start fresh.

What an eloquent and well articulated way of defining just how screwed we are!
The few things that came to mind during the read were check the fed reserve, take money out of politics to some significant degree, utilize your spending power as a consumer to make a statement, and help others in some way directly or indirectly.

I guess a general "we are tired of it all" march I would support, and other than that I can only think of some things R. Paul talked about doing to make significant changes or at least end certain practices that continue to put us in harms way.

The saddest thing to me, is so much trust is lost, from all entities, so it is hard to find an avenue of change to have faith in and get behind. Political strife is so futile, and profits keep trumping people and the planet.
So I don't think calling for revolution is as ignorant as is doing nothing by comparison, but yea, we have to determine where the biggest differences can be made. The problem is, the problems are so multifaceted, that many do not know where to begin.

Thanks for the work though, and it is nice to contemplate such a range of aspects. Heck I am just going to pray more and try and help others some how.

Peace,
spec

reply to post by DarthMuerte

Libtards who believe an owl is more important than people need to go. Once all of the above are gone, there will be many more like minded people left and we can start fresh.

Tards huh? Yea that does a lot of good and is so productive. Just round em all up and get rid of em. You know that is a lot of mothers/fathers, sons/daughters and half of your countrymen right? Do you like to be called repubtard? If not, then why do the same to others? Ever heard of 'your either part of the problem or solution?'

The owl issue was the only thing that could slow the literal raping of the forests. I live in Oregon and have worked in the timber industry for years and have heard both sides of the argument. The common denominator was greed. The environmentalists did not want clear cuts and the industry did not want mono crops that made inferior wood products. The industry workers(not CEOS) wanted to preserve their industry and be able to sustain an industry that their family could keep working for in the future, but the big wigs were not into managing resources. Like so many things they wanted it all and wanted it now. So the issue is more than putting an owl before people, it was using the owl and the law to slow the progress before nothing was left for either the industry or environmentalists. I had forestry guys make me aware of this by the way, not environmentalists, so once again generalizations can do harm. The owl issue was to obtain balance, not just to make the hippies happy.

What we need is a revolution of the mind.
The military and police are made up of people indistinguishable from ourselves.
Fighting them is only an option in self-defense.
What we need is an infiltration of the government and a change to the environment of secrecy.

Violent revolution would work in establishing a NEW NATION. That's the point, not to "re-take America"
if that battle were lost a true Empire would form out of a Republic loss.

Originally posted by VoidHawk
Well I dont live in your country

But I'll ask - what do you suggest people do to cure the world of the evil we all know exists?

In real terms that aren't theory, hypothetical and sunshine blown up each other's tailpipes? I can only tell you what I am going to do. It's taken me weeks of drifting in my thoughts and bouncing this idea or that one. I've tried to look at the angles and what I personally have as options within my abilities and what my college program is adding to those.

I'm not 20. I'm pushing 40 and I've lived a wild and very full life in many ways. All that to say that running for any High political office would give the trash talkers and mud slingers enough ammo to throw things at me for years, even if I had a full lifetime to build the foundation for such a run at something national. So I find my limits. That's the MOST critical thing right? Knowing your own limitations.

Now, it doesn't matter for my future plans if Obama wins or Romney wins. They both represent career corruption and one simply gives us a BETTER chance of reaching 2016 than the other. Little else...but that's enough. If we can just get to 2016 we can do right what was done so sloppy this time, as SO MANY of us were learning this system for the very first time.

Well.... A few million people around the nation learned how the system works by supporting Dr. Paul. I was among them. I don't mean how it works in a theory but how it *REALLY* works. How we REALLY change this damn thing. Prior to the Paul campaign, I didn't even know where to start...Now, millions do. IN ADDITION... I spent time with and was welcomed into the Occupation camp at St Louis last fall. I didn't waste a moment of my time there and I absorbed everything I saw and could learn to the very best of my ability.......for how to recreate it or make such a group on a smaller scale.


So BOTTOM LINE? I'm going to spend the next 4 years in a variety of ways, insuring more people wake up. Everyone who cares to know can EASILY learn HOW to fight this system from the *INSIDE* (We damn near did it with Paul. 4 years of HARD work and we *CAN* do it.). If the follow-on movement to Ron Paul will have me, I'll put everything I have for energy, skill and free time into seeing 2016 BURIES both parties and we break this stranglehold once and for good. Our nation depends on it and our futures hang on it. *IF* we get the grace and good fortune to get a second chance in 2016, I do not believe we ever see a 3rd. We have to get it right...and I've settled on pursuing my college degree and every free moment outside of that, seeing that 2016 is what gives my Son a future I can feel good about handing him.

The alternative is what started this thread, and suicide for nothing just isn't my thing.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Armed revolution is absolutely necessary, as every single avenue to change is closed to us regular types, there is no recourse to be had as there is no negotiating with a tyrant. What option is there really? Peaceful resistance gets you beaten tasered peppersprayed..etc then to top it off labeled a domestic terrorist. Which according the draconian NDAA means they can at any time hence round you up and lock you away without recourse.

There are no options, the people will not suffer a tyrant much longer, and those tyranical elites at the top would rather burn the entire wolrd down than stop being tyrants. To me this is a simple problem to see and solve.

I will name many first strike targets, they are everywhere, EVERY SINGLE person who works at the FED. Sorry if you were just the janitor, see nuremberg trials for details. The world after world war 2 established that even if you were just a janitor at auchwitz your as quilty as everyone else as you could have at any time stopped helping destroy lives but instead did nothing.

EVERY single family member of the "to big to fail banks" as they are trained from birth by their parents to see people as comodities not people, I and surely many many others would agree that they are beyond redemption, as alowing their evil to continue to grow will only allow it to once again take root and spread until it destroys lives wholesale like today.

Every single politician that voted yes on the NDAA bill last year, as they intentionally sold out their constiuents for financial gain.

Every single person on the board or holding more than 100,000 U.s. dollars in stock to any cororation that profits excede their pay roll, as their greed and avarice to their fellow man has destroyed the lives of countless millions across the globe for profit.

Every single member of the judiciary that has at one time or another made bets to see who could rack up the most years sentenced faster, as they are destroying lives for no other reason than to win a bet.

Every single owner operator and stock holder of a for profit prison, as once again they intentionally keep people incarcerated so they can maximise profits.

My point being if you intentionally destroy even one life for financial gain your life is forfeit period.

This sounds like a pretty good starting off point to me, but this is only my opinion.

Also I am not condoning violence or even actual armed "revolution"( as Americans we can not revolt, as this is already our country) I am simply saying IMHO it is time to trim the tree of liberty a little bit.

This is a hypothetical exercise right? Because anyone even attempting any of the above will only find out the hard way that they will wish they hadn't, and I hear a six by nine this time of year is out of fashion anyways.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Thats an impressive answer to my question
Like you I have children, I have grandchildren too, and like you I worry about their future.

I hope your right.

reply to post by inverslyproportional


I'll start with your last point first.

No. The whole point of my rant was to take this out of the Pie in the Sky fantasy land Rambo talk that seems to be almost epidemic lately and move to honest to God ideas and a path forward which works somewhere other than a Hollywood action movie like The Running Man or Total Recall. Great movies.....and absolutely nothing that can or will ever happen in the world we both live in.

Red Dawn, the FIRST one, is a very good movie on this and I think anyone talking revolution should see it. It's one of the closer movies I've ever seen to how I think such a thing would actually go. It starts with the Rah Rah Kill 'em of success and even some winning against the protagonist of the movie. It ends with the reality of loss and death that IS how REAL fighting is defined.

If we suffer total collapse, there is a book series by William Johnstone called the "Ashes" series which hits how I think THAT will end up. That is a long series..but again, pretty though provoking for the real questions of real world action or the lack of it. ..and if anyone ever wanted my full and complete political philosophy, nothing comes closer than the Tri-States Manifesto as shown in that series... but I digress a bit there.


I read and absorbed all you said on this and your energy and conviction. You wouldn't be planning to kill those many thousands of people all by yourself, I imagine. I was at the Federal Reserve Bank at St Louis with Occupy. Have you physically stood on the sidewalk of a real Fed bank center? You may as well be standing at the front entrance to the CIA Headquarters building or Lubyanka Prison. You aren't getting in....or IF you do..you won't leave the place alive. Suicide by security guard...or, actually, dozens of them. All else fails and you WIN??? Well... The Fed has systems to insure a situation where all their people are lost INSURES no one ELSE lives more than a few minutes beyond that point either. Leave it at that, but it's 100% suicide.


Of course.. That is all my opinion mixed with the physical security facts I know of the Fed Bank at STL. I just can't quite make the trip on your logic, because again, you are generalizing and pie in the fly fantasizing. "All politicians" who did this or that? Okay, WHICH ONE are you seeing yourself putting the cold muzzle of your weapon to the head of and..finishing your goal? ..then of course, cleaning of their mind off yourself. There are just realities to all this I see no one even thinking...as the Rambo talk ramps up as if it's a sport.

*I want to add a little note that I don't mean to be hard confrontational on this. It's a rant, so there is that by nature to some degree..but fighting isn't my goal. A hard, blunt and absolutely brutally honest look at the idea of revolt...for those who would call for it, IS the intention. I see a dead end in every literal sense. I'm always open to other ideas with reason and logic to support them.

I agree totally.

I also believe that TPTB will not allow a revolution. There might be new politicians talking their way into congress, but it will still be one in the same. Which is....TPTB

I believe that they have "safety nets: in place to squash such an uprising in the very begining and most people will not even know that a semi-revolution was taking place.

They(TPTB) hold the keys and make the rules.

I really think that people are kidding themselves when they speak of "revolution'.

I know that my post is full of " I believe" and "I think", but I also think that TPTB is one step ahead of us "grunts". After all that is why they are TPTB. They have all of the money, power, and greed to keep the same old system chugging along.

Star and flag from liejunkie for actually thinking about the situation that so many speak of around here

Your post/rant got me thinking a little rabbit.

I was at work today, on the roof again and the whole time on the radio is mud slinging from the politicians wanting us to vote for them and why they are better than the other guy/woman. My supervisor from which I have been working with for about a week at this job site asked me if I was going to vote for Obama. I looked at him and said that I really do not think it matters who gets voted in. I told him that until big business/corporations get their money out of politics nothing will change for the little people. He just looked at me and didn't say anything.

I do not know this guy to well, but he seems to be the type that is stuck on the party lines. I did not push the issue any further. I am an Union Sheetmetal Worker and they try to push the politics. So the party lines are all these people know. I believe that this is the thinking of most of the nation and this is why I believe the problem will not be solved with our current political system. As I stated above I believe that the powers that be will not let anything happen to the current political system, so I think we are stuck in a rut for a very long time.

The American people are not at the braking point yet. There is so much party blame going around and this is what people stick to, basically endoctrinated from a young age.

We need a change in thinking, which I feel is nowhere close to becoming a reality. The masses are "brainwashed"(for a lack of better term) into the current way of doing business.

Liejunkie01 tries to do my part by speaking the things that most people do not want to talk about or never thought about. This is how I hope to enlighten some on the current system and how it should, and needs, to be changed, all being my opinion of course.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


I was merely giving my own version of who I thought should be dragged into the street first when the entire populous freaks and mass histeria kicks in to punish whoever the mob thinks responsible.

As to the point of your fed building remarks, at such a time as my scenario would become possible, their security will be moot no matter the location. As there are buldozers etc to go through the wall not the door. Everyone knows you don't go through the cattle gates, you kick a hole through the side of the barn, so to speak.

As far as opening comments about my oppinion on the need for revolution. I really don't see another way, I am not so prideful to think my oppinion is absolutely right, I just don't honestly see any other way of resolving our gievances with the .gov than complete removal and reconstitution of our system. I am still waiting for other wiser people to make these decisions, I know I am not a great uniter of men, I am more of a fringe lurker, doesn't mind being in the spot light from time to time, but I would never be able to live up to Americans expectations, I am too human, I am as nonpc as one gets and couldn't care who likes it in the least.

I think the way you reason things out sounds wanderful to me, however have a hard time seeing iit doing anything but wasting your time, and eventually leading to you aquiring a domestic terrorism flag . As my thought crime was just another troll in a fringe site. Yours is out in the open, in front of the minds they are trying to control. Example is a good teacher of the tyrant. Once they see what happens to those that speak out can sway those that thought about it to rethink their possition.

I hope your right, only time will tell, we will see in the coming years.

reply to post by inverslyproportional


Also you weren't really overbering at all in your response, I found to be like most of your posts to be well thought out and to the point. Much more so than mine as I am prone to say what I want not what I should, outside of more sterile science threads or higherbrow conversation that is. I can be a lot more elequent in my thought process and corespondence, but this is a rant thread so I said what I really feel at this moment, not what I think the possible outcome might end up being.

reply to post by inverslyproportional

I appreciate the well thought out response. I'll tell you something about my thinking in writing this thread. In strictly the hypothetical and purely theoretical of course, I've mentally explored your approach as well. I'm thinking most members on ATS have to various degrees, if only in pure daydream or imagining what threads are discussing. So this isn't actually the direction I came to first, if one might put it that way....

I'm also realistic and pragmatic and know that in as little as a few weeks or at sometime over the coming years, outside events could make this all a moot point and the system around us could collapse anyway. We'll have the worst days of what I see about any revolution idea whether we liked it or not. I hope that events don't continue as they are on a couple different things in the world. I continue to plan and live as if they weren't. It's the path with everything to gain and nothing to lose, when you think about it.

So the final approach I outlined in an earlier post here is what I settled on as what I can do, is actually realistic and viable and within my skills. I just literally could not see any scenario that started with armed revolt, ended anywhere but a wasteland of what used to be the United States or something like a futuristic nightmare of 1984 in the aftermath of losing such an attempt (the most likely outcome, in any case).

The only thing worse than not trying revolution would be trying and then failing, IMO. Oh.. So So So much worse, and for 330 million people, not just whoever started things. I give odds to actually pull it off at about 2%...and that's only that high because who knows. Maybe a Hollywood movie like twist would happen and the whole military would turn or something.. So.. 2% includes that possibility.

(If we all were to work, work HARD and treat the next 4 years like the last few months were for Dr. Paul, Rand could be the president in 2016....or whoever the Candidate is that people generally get behind for it)

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


I agree completely with your last paragraph. I don't see redvolution if won really winning anything but scorched earth. So this option( even though the one I see being most likely if the current trend continues) is not really a win, unless you count them losing as winning.

Also a fail revolution would be.....apocalyptic. the once mild mannered U.S. .gov would become ROME, the 3rd riiech, etc.

When compared to your logic, I find my particular POV on this particular subject wanting. As compared to either of the above outcomes todays life seems ideal if not extasy.

The world does turn, and everyday things that were once thought impossible happen. That's why I never said I don't believe in humanity, I just don't believe in the ability of men to fairly govern his fellow man.