Defeat the corrupt banking system with Islamic banking

defeat the financial/banking elites with Islamic banking

www.umgroup.ca...

Everyones getting so sick of the corruption within our banking and financial system which many have attributed to the elitist, some say the Rothschild's control over almost the entire world of banking and finance.

What many people haven't understood is their (banking elites) opposition to Islamic banking , a partial reason why you've seen an "arab spring" and why the media continually propagates an unnecessary war with to Iran. Iran has an Islamic banking system. Many areas in the middle east had an Islamic banking system until the US and others overthrew many nations in the middle east.

The main difference you'll notice is that Islamic banking doesn't have an interest fee. there's plenty of other positives which make Islamic banking a more stable system of finance then what we currently have to deal with in the western world.

Don't let all the hype and fear over muslims and Islam with "Islamic terrorists" "jihad terrorists" thats created in the media get to you. We all know that's just modern day war propaganda.

Islamic banking is giving the financial/banking elites a real black eye, especially when they tried so hard to get it out of the middle east. Imagine if everyone in the west switched to Islamic banks. I promise you the banking/financial elites would have a heart attack and push up daises. Good riddance!

Can we afford any other choice? Look at the shape of the economy. This is all their (elites) fault - not yours, not the people. Don't be intimidated by "Islamic" banking. Check it out for yourself en.wikipedia.org...

I believe that we should demand this model in the western world. While we should perhaps tailor it so that it doesn't scare Christians and others, this (islamic) banking system would do away with all the corruption within western banking/finance. Don't take this as a notion of trying to "islam-ify" the west. It's not like everyone will be converted to muslims just because of switching over to an islamic banking model. I merely trust muslims with my money rather than the Rothschilds/current western banking/fiscal elites

So once again, let's give the elites a real black eye. Switch to Islamic banking. This is exactly what they deserve after trying so hard to get rid of it, to have everyone in the western world switch over to it and demand an Islamic banking model. This would take them down so many notches , it would be the end for them.

Either type of banking ends with the bankers controlling the businesses. The islamic banking you advocate allows those bankers to take part of the business in lieu of interest. There is no "free ride" either way.

reply to post by Utopia2012


Sorry! As much sense as it makes, I cannot support any system that believes women are second class citizens.....

Would you tell me what the lending fee is called? It's not interest, but how does it work? No one believes that any bank in any country will lend money with absolutely no charge.

And how would Sharia banking deal with derivatives and bundled sub-prime mortgages?

basically is against sharia law to commit ursury so is a good idea
(this is real reason we invaded libya/iraq/afghanistan to install non muslim banks)

ursury is...
what federal reserve does to americans
what bank of england does to british
what european central bank does to europe

they charge sovereign goverments interest on their own currency...
(i dont like to be charged £1.50 from a cashpoint for my own cash!!)

read up on rothschilds banking empire/cartel

islamic banking you advocate allows those bankers to take part of the business in lieu of interest

The Islamic banking model for the west should modernize it's ideology of divine financing, where humanitarianism is prioritized over profit. That's about as divine as it gets. That's the only way the bank should interfere with a business model. People first, profits second.

I cannot support any system that believes women are second class citizens.....

The western media creates this illusion that all Muslims treat their women like "second class citizens". This isn't true. Just look at muslim women in the western world. Are they all wearing hi-jabs? No. Most of the times you wouldn't even be able to tell if a women is muslim in the western world. It's only due to a few barbarians in the middle east who demand that women be second class citizens that Islam gets such a bad rep. The media blows it out of proportion and creates this false enemy.

This isn't about free rides. This doesn't even have to be an "Islamic" banking system. While switching over to Islamic banking would defeat the problem in short term, in the long term we could simply copy and adjust the Islamic banking model to serve the people.

reply to post by seeker1963


They don't believe in women as second class citizens, they hold them higher because the keep them covered and not paraded around like tramps. They believe in modesty, and humbleness and protecting their daughters, moms, and wives. Do you actually think we treat women better? By making sexual objects out of them and subjecting them to domestic violence many items a day?

True Islamic banking forbids any form of interest, there are some corrupt 'islamic' banks which are not Islamic at all if they do any sort of fees or anything related to interest.If you are actually interested in true Islamic banking I made a thread about this subject:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

There is an accompanying video which will make you understand everything.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL

Copied from another post in that thread:

Islamic banks apparent non-charging of interest is semantics at best. They charge an up front borrowing fee which is based on the same overall mathematics that would go into paying an interest rate and, in many, MNAY ways is more predatory than a flat interest rate would ever be.

For example, most states have laws on the books that grant borrowers the opportunity to reduce the amount of interest they will pay on a loan through paying it off early, or making larger than the minimum monthly payments. In non-interest lending, it doesn't matter if you pay off a 36 month loan in a year and half, because you paid the interest... ERRRR, lending fee up front and it was based entirely off of nominal interest that would have been paid over a 36 month lending period.

If the bank does not charge interest or fees on its loans, where do they get the money to pay the bank's expenses such as payroll, electricity, etc.?

reply to post by charles1952

If the bank does not charge interest or fees on its loans, where do they get the money to pay the bank's expenses such as payroll, electricity, etc.?

State owned Islamic banks which do not seek profits are true islamic banks. If the bank does not seek profits then the state taxes probably pay for the expenses and that's how it should be. Western banks seek a profit, a true Islamic bank does not seek a profit. Let me reiterate the word TRUE. Any bank that uses interest in ANY way shape or form is not an Islamic bank. There is just as much corruption in those banks as their is in any other banking. The minute they start charging fees, interest or anything, it automatically makes them not Islamic. I really do not know any banks which really are truly Islamic anywhere, there might be but I have not heard of them.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL

Dear THE_PROFESSIONAL,

Thank you very much, a really solid post and, if I may say so, stronger than some of your previous efforts. Well done!

I get the impression that the true Islamic bank is an ideal which we should be striving for, even if it is unobtainable. There's no reason why you should have an answer to this, but given America's current legal, and political position, what would you recommend as a "doable" first step?

With respect,
Charles1952

I have read a little bit about it, seems interesting. It maybe a step in the right direction, but still has flaws, it is still susceptible to speculation (as Dubai Bank showed us in 2009) I also would object to the concept of haraam, where Islamic principles dictate what you can invest in.

reply to post by charles1952


Thank you very much, that is exactly what the educated muslims strive for, but the minute they start up something like that the IMF labels them as 'terrorists' or makes an excuse to invade. I do not know how true it is but I heard that the reason some of the ME countries were invaded were because they wanted to have true Islamic bank with zero interest and gold backing, which would have utterly destroyed the fiat currencies.

Anyway I digress. With the US situation, the US government is in debt with the federal reserve. It is all fictitious debt because it is all fictitious money. The US government must take back its ability to print its own money and lend it at zero percent interest to whoever it deems. There is too much private influence in the US Government.

Thirdly in order for a true zero interest banking to work in the USA, it would have to be working on a donation basis to pay for employee salaries, or on a volunteer basis or the best option would be to have local taxes pay for employee salaries and operating bills. This would be the best way to do it. With zero interest local banking, the community would not be subject to ever expanding debt, predatory lending, seizures, debt collectors, ruined credit, and a general enslavement and economic oppression. In Islami it has been stated that 'God has declared war on the money lender (aka banker)' God hates bankers, even Shakespeare and Thomas Jefferson recognized these things. President Lincoln was assassinated because when he was running the civil war he went to some banks for loans for the war but they were charging exuberant rates. So what did he do? He gave the US Government and therefore the people the ability to print its own money on zero interest to fund the war, he paid dearly for that decision.

I just hope that we can unite in the USA, and recognize that our enemies are the bankers, and not some black, white, person come together, start up community run zero interest banks which has a consumers interest in mind.

What's so bad about paying interest?

After all, banks take risk when they lend money. They put their capital at stake. Not all loans get repaid. Some default. Who eats these losses? The bank.

Shouldn't an investor -- such as a bank making a loan to a corporation or an individual - be entitled to a reasonable profit or return on their investment?

Take a Line of Credit at $100,000, at 5% interest. The borrower has access to $100,000 in cash, and the bank earns a measly $5,000 per year in interest, assuming the full $100,000 is utilized in full over the full 12 months. This is reasonable interest, not usurious in the least.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL

Dear THE_PROFFESIONAL,

The meat of your post seems to be in the paragraph started "Thirdly ..." I know I am not a fair representaive of America, but may I offer some thoughts about the plan?

the best option would be to have local taxes pay for employee salaries and operating bills. This would be the best way to do it.

It seems that this would heavily disadvantage lightly populated areas (such as my town) and poor areas who are living on the edge without new taxes. Further, do you think that Americans are ready to have the government own and run banks? They are pretty upset now with just about any business the government decides to run, even if it's only local. And how would financial centers like New York survive? With the huge number of banks in that one small area, the taxes would be astronomical.

With zero interest local banking, the community would not be subject to ever expanding debt, predatory lending, seizures, debt collectors, ruined credit, and a general enslavement and economic oppression.

How does Islam deal with people who don't pay their debts? I would think seizures, debt collectors and ruined credit would be a part of any system. Or would all the bad debts be paid by the taxpayers? Surely, Islamic as well as American, banks would be able to refuse making loans?

If a business in a foreign country wanted to borrow from an "Islamic bank" in the US, would they be allowed to? At zero interest every business in the world would want to borrow from us and there might be no way to get them to pay. We would end up with warehouses full of IOUs.

If we just kept printing more and more money, we would be in danger of a drastic devaluation of the dollar.

I'm sure I don't understand the intricacies of Islamic banking, forgive me for being a little doubtful at this point.

With respect,
Charles1952

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL

They don't believe in women as second class citizens, they hold them higher because the keep them covered and not paraded around like tramps. They believe in modesty,

Have you seen what they look like after they get s few years on them?? I'd keep them covered too.

But to the banking.

Just how many significant corperations have been financed but muslim banks? Nada!
Just how many new home buyers get a loan from muslim banks? Nada!

If we all want to work for a bakery on the street corner fine. But would you want to deposit your businesses profits in one? What if they feel you are making too much profits? Or are accumulating too much savings?

Originally posted by seeker1963
reply to post by Utopia2012

 

Sorry! As much sense as it makes, I cannot support any system that believes women are second class citizens.....

Your remarks are hatred stemmed from slanders of mainstream media and those who are anti-Islam.

Prophet Muhammad had many wives, each with their own talents. One of his wives, Khadija, was a businesswoman. And he always gave her full support.

reply to post by charles1952


It is a complex thing to tackle, and with failure to pay loans you will get seizures, but you have a much longer time to repay the loans, and with less stress. If these banks were in a Muslim country then even the act of seizing someones property is un-Islamic. That is why reasonable loans with zero interest are great as there no stress burden if your business venture fails for instance, you go back to your old job and pay off the loans as you wish.