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Matthew 10:34-38 becomes a disturbing reality when you begin following Jesus

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posted on Aug, 1 2012 @ 09:37 PM
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Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 How does a god who loves unconditionally yet allows those he loves to suffer for eternity make sense?


Not scriptural. God does not love unconditionally.

1st John 2:15 (KJB)


Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.


God loves us just enough to give us a choice - to get into a deeper and meaningful relationship with God, not with the world (you will hate it) and the other choice, to be with the world or give higher priority to the world, than God, same thing of partaking with the corrupt System which helps to sustain it's evil which inflicts hardship upon many.

Note: You do not love God for salvation's sake or you simply want to go to heaven for 'good afterlife'.. You love God for His entire being, for you also begin to love the same thing he does, his Word (Jesus), righteousness, justice!

This corrupt world system is run by injustice. "The world is unfair". Sounds familiar?? If you partake or your ambitions are for this unjust system, the love of God is not in you for He loves justice! Please do not use 'for the sake of God's Kingdom I like to make more money' as an excuse. God doesn't need your money, he hates it, he wants your love! God will provide your needs, you do not worry if you truly LOVE God. You don't even have to beg anyone!




posted on Aug, 1 2012 @ 10:05 PM
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Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


It means self-evident. Snakes do not make it self-evident that they talk, neither do bushes.


I see you're Googling again. It basically means "obvious". When the text is obviously a literary device it's treated as such. When not, it's understood literally. That's the "golden rule" of Bible interpretation. And the Hebrew word is "nachash" which came to also mean "snake" but get back on Google and search for the other meaning of "nachash".

Then consider 2 Corinthians 11:14.



posted on Aug, 1 2012 @ 10:34 PM
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Exodus 15:13 "In your unfailing love you will lead the people you have redeemed. In your strength you will guide them to your holy dwelling.

Psalm 6:4 Turn, O LORD, and deliver me; save me because of your unfailing love.

Psalm 13:5 But I trust in your unfailing love; my heart rejoices in your salvation.

Psalm 21:7 For the king trusts in the LORD; through the unfailing love of the Most High he will not be shaken.

Psalm 31:16 Let your face shine on your servant; save me in your unfailing love.

Psalm 32:10 Many are the woes of the wicked, but the LORD's unfailing love surrounds the man who trusts in him.

Psalm 33:5 The LORD loves righteousness and justice; the earth is full of his unfailing love.

Psalm 33:18 But the eyes of the LORD are on those who fear him, on those whose hope is in his unfailing love,

Psalm 33:22 May your unfailing love rest upon us, O LORD, even as we put our hope in you.

Psalm 36:7 How priceless is your unfailing love! Both high and low among men find refuge in the shadow of your wings.

Psalm 44:26 Rise up and help us; redeem us because of your unfailing love.

Psalm 48:9 Within your temple, O God, we meditate on your unfailing love.

Psalm 51:1Have mercy on me, O God, according to your unfailing love; according to your great compassion blot out my transgressions.

Psalm 52:8 But I am like an olive tree flourishing in the house of God; I trust in God's unfailing love for ever and ever.

Psalm 77:8 Has his unfailing love vanished forever? Has his promise failed for all time?

Psalm 85:7 Show us your unfailing love, O LORD, and grant us your salvation.

Psalm 90:14 Satisfy us in the morning with your unfailing love, that we may sing for joy and be glad all our days.

Psalm 107:8 Let them give thanks to the LORD for his unfailing love and his wonderful deeds for men.

Psalm 107:15Let them give thanks to the LORD for his unfailing love and his wonderful deeds for men.

Psalm 107:21 Let them give thanks to the LORD for his unfailing love and his wonderful deeds for men.

Psalm 107:31 Let them give thanks to the LORD for his unfailing love and his wonderful deeds for men.

Psalm 119:41 May your unfailing love come to me, O LORD, your salvation according to your promise.

Psalm 119:76 May your unfailing love be my comfort, according to your promise to your servant.

Psalm 130:7O Israel, put your hope in the LORD, for with the LORD is unfailing love and with him is full redemption.

Psalm 143:8 Let the morning bring me word of your unfailing love, for I have put my trust in you. Show me the way I should go, for to you I lift up my soul.

Psalm 143:12 In your unfailing love, silence my enemies; destroy all my foes, for I am your servant.

Psalm 147:11 the LORD delights in those who fear him, who put their hope in his unfailing love.

Proverbs 19:22 What a man desires is unfailing love; better to be poor than a liar.

Proverbs 20:6 Many a man claims to have unfailing love, but a faithful man who can find?

Isaiah 54:10 Though the mountains be shaken and the hills be removed, yet my unfailing love for you will not be shaken nor my covenant of peace be removed," says the LORD, who has compassion on you.

Lamentations 3:32 Though he brings grief, he will show compassion, so great is his unfailing love.

Hosea 10:12 Sow for yourselves righteousness, reap the fruit of unfailing love, and break up your unplowed ground; for it is time to seek the LORD, until he comes and showers righteousness on you.
reply to post by ahnggk
 


What does the bible mean by 'unfailing love' if not unconditional? Unfailing means without fail, no matter what. Unconditional means no matter what, so yes he does love unconditionally.
edit on 1-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2012 @ 10:38 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Yes I have.

There's nothing wrong with gaining new knowledge. The golden rule of bible interpretation was coined by who? I'm sure it was a Christian.

So Satan masquerades as an angel of light? If that's the case, how can you be so sure that Christianity is not a work of Satan?
edit on 1-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2012 @ 11:36 PM
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If Earth is hell within heaven and Satan is the ruler of hell, that means the rich and powerful are Satan, because they rule Earth.

Who are the ones who edited the bible? Who are the ones who run Christianity? The rich and powerful.

Why did the rich and powerful edit the bible? To hide the truth.

What is the truth? That we are already in hell and hell on Earth resides within heaven.

Why would they make us believe that we are not in heaven and that we only go to heaven after this life? So that their followers would not care about our planet because there is something better after this life.

Why would they want us to not care about our planet? So that they can take advantage of it and us so that they can gain more wealth and power.



posted on Aug, 1 2012 @ 11:57 PM
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reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


Rule #1 applies to those verses. What is the context? Is it the elect, righteous or sinners and wicked? What do correlating verses say about the unrighteous or wicked?

A good place to start would be Poverbs 1:24-33.





edit on 2-8-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 12:08 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm not sure I understand what your point is. Could you clarify?

Also, how are you so sure Christianity is not a work of Satan? The edits applied to the bible were done by the rich and powerful, so how are you so sure that they haven't deceived you?



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 12:18 AM
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Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm not sure I understand what your point is. Could you clarify?

Also, how are you so sure Christianity is not a work of Satan? The edits applied to the bible were done by the rich and powerful, so how are you so sure that they haven't deceived you?


I use Bibles that come come the majority text mss. I know full well what the guys at Alexandria were doing with the letters of the NT. Their mss are quite corrupted. Have you researched the heptadic structures underlying the text itself or the ELS codes of Isaiah 53 for example? And prophecy authenticates the Bible. Only God exists outside of the dimension of spacetime and prophecy is how He authenticates His message to us.

When you have free time watch Dr. Chuck Missler's 6 or 7 part series on YouTube entitled "How We Got our Bible the New Testament". A lot of your questions are directly addressed and covered there. Quite some astronomical probabilities too that I really found amazing.



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 12:21 AM
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reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


Satan doesn't rule hell, he rules the systems and kingdoms of the world. Hell will be his place of torture. Satan is a defeated foe, the only power he has is the power yielded to him by man of their free will.



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 12:23 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


You do realize that history repeats itself correct? Those who wrote the bible knew this, the prophecies are kept vague for a reason.

You didn't answer my question. If Satan masquerades as an angel of light, how can you be so sure that Christianity is not a work of Satan?

I prefer an answer from you because you are the one I am asking. Is that fair?



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 12:27 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


The rich and powerful rule the systems and kingdoms on Earth.

If Satan rules the kingdoms of hell and hell is made up of these kingdoms, then how is that any different from ruling hell?

Haven't the followers of Christianity yielded power to it by their free will to believe what it teaches? If you don't think those who run religion are powerful, you are sadly mistaken.

If Satan is a defeated foe then why does he have so much power over some on Earth?
edit on 2-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

edit on 2-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 01:07 AM
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reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


There are no kingdoms in Hell. And satan doesn't "rule" Hell. He has the authority, for now, of the kingdoms of the Earth. There is a demon principality spirit over ever nation on the globe. Adam ceded dominion to the devil in the garden of Eden.



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 01:18 AM
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Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


You do realize that history repeats itself correct? Those who wrote the bible knew this, the prophecies are kept vague for a reason.

You didn't answer my question. If Satan masquerades as an angel of light, how can you be so sure that Christianity is not a work of Satan?

I prefer an answer from you because you are the one I am asking. Is that fair?


Prophecies are not vague at all, they are absurdly precise. Read Psalm 22.. it's written first person singular as Christ hung on the cross.

Check THIS out. And I'll answer anything you ask if I feel your motive is sincere, if I refer to a source it's because it's not my material and it would be intellectually dishonest for one thing and for two in a discussion like this people should not be lowed to be arbitrary with their arguments.

Just watch it sometime when you have the time to kill, it's fascinating and also details the men and groups involved with perverting manuscripts that nearly all modern Bible versions rely upon. A big reason there are thousands of different sects to Christianity today. It was a quite sinister attack centuries ago.



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 02:22 AM
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reply to post by ahnggk
 




Even more disturbing, that it happened in an old CHRISTIAN family who all believes in Jesus, been baptized and Born Again!!


So do you think water baptism is what makes someone born again?



We are all Christians for more than a decade now. We strive to obey the Laws, read the Bible, generous to the poor, do not curse, not have any vices, do not annoy our neighbors, typical Christian family...


So these things is what makes somebody a Christian?




My family thinks I'm getting too radical in my faith. That martyrdom, Christian radicalism, etc is only reserved for FEW Christians!!!


I wasn't aware that their was such thing as Christian radicalism. Jesus was radical that's why he was killed.



My parents wishes for me to belong to the society, to be accepted by it, not to live like a loser. But Jesus commands otherwise. "He who is in the world, the love of the Father is not in him"


What is loser about living for Jesus? I don't know your parents but It doesn't seem like your parents are really born again.
edit on 2-8-2012 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 06:11 AM
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Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
What does the bible mean by 'unfailing love' if not unconditional? Unfailing means without fail, no matter what. Unconditional means no matter what, so yes he does love unconditionally.
edit on 1-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)


His love only doesn't fail for the righteous. Read the verses you quoted again, there is no mention there that God loves the wicked, but there is mention of the righteous. Even more extreme "silence my enemies; destroy my foes", it's all up there.

It was mentioned there that the "Earth is full of his unfailing love". Earth =/= world. Whenever you see the word 'world' in the Bible, it's usually referred to the world government or world economy or material things invented by man or the fallen angels or secular human civilization or even human world where the prime motivation is greed at the expense of others, particularly nature and poor people.

God loves the Earth but hates the World which he will bring to judgement soon. Sodom and Gomorrah is one such example Earth cried out to God and God came to the Earth's rescue and wiped out the city.

@RevelationGeneration


What is loser about living for Jesus? I don't know your parents but It doesn't seem like your parents are really born again.


Sadly, I might have to agree. They still would depend more on wits than God. That is what poverty taught them.

They taught me to do my very best, even lie, or beg just to succeed on a goal, then pray that God will open doors for me to succeed.

The goal is usually to find work in USA or Europe or Australia which is a big thing in Philippines but not for me anymore. The goal of anyone who really loves God is no longer to look for the good things in this world. The prayer becomes, "let your will be done..." no longer for any personal ambitions, etc.

Their justification for me to work in USA to earn 10x more for the same job so we help more to our local churches, personal esteem/pride, and financial security. This is threading on dangerous grounds of your relationship to God especially the last two reasons. Also God will not favor more those who give more $$ (Parable of the Widow) to church, missions, etc. Jesus frequently demonstrated his indifference to money/wealth regardless of the amount and whether you're using it for ministry or poor!

It's a sad predicament for me. My parents have suffered much in their poverty when they're young and I want them to be saved so they can be happy and content in any situation, and finally, in heaven! Our living conditions is still miserable compared to standard American living. Their longing for the 'American Dream' is what making it really miserable when we can be very happy and content for we are having our needs met!

They now consider me their enemy. The fact they've invested in my education and they're counting on me to realize their 'American Dream' but it's no longer what I want. I'm teaching them the 'good stuff' will kill you but now they think I'm in league with the Devil. Their belief is still, God wills His children to be wealthy and full of good life while still on this World! Prosperity Gospel is Evil!! False Preachers, evil Bible Canon, look what you did to Christianity



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 06:52 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 

. . . if I refer to a source it's because it's not my material and it would be intellectually dishonest for one thing . . .
The Bible is "not your material"?
If there is a correlation between the Old Testament and the Gospels, its ok to know and understand what those are and to be able to articulate them, no matter where you learned it from.
You seem to me to have been more intellectually lazy, to just post a link rather than citing your argument, and not concern for "intellectual property" or something. Is it worrisome to you to make an actual argument, maybe because you might look bad when unable to defend it? How is that cross feeling?
edit on 2-8-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 08:39 AM
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Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I might offer that he meant attachment to the world... when he said do not love the world...

Matthew 10:37
He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

denying attachment to the physical is what he taught throughout the gospels...



Thanks, sometimes if I haven't had a date in months and I take a look around at all the girls who don't really care it creates a bottomless pit in my soul because 'I think' that love will cure my emotions of longing. It tells me that the physical longing I have for earthly love should not be put in front of the greater love outside of this world, yet I don't know if that really fixes anything.



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 10:01 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


If he has authority over hell then that means he rules it. There is no difference between authoritate and rule.

If Satan is a defeated foe then how does he have dominion over kingdoms of Earth? How does god allow this?



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 10:03 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I am being sincere right now, these are honest questions.

Asking me to watch a video instead of answering my question is a complete cop out. Why can't you just answer the question? I am asking you, that means I want an answer from you, not some video.

You not answering the question is you ignoring it, and you ignoring it is you blocking it out.
edit on 2-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

edit on 2-8-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 10:08 AM
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reply to post by ahnggk
 


I''ll have to concede that you are probably right here, but that still leaves all the other points I made un-answered.




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