Why is it that people think we cannot CRITICIZE ISRAEL? Israel is NOT A RELIGION, It's a Nation..wi

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posted on Jul, 30 2012 @ 10:05 PM
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Originally posted by Fromabove

Originally posted by JRockABM
I've wondered why in the US, it is considered "antisemitic" to publicly speak out about Israel, like why can't I just say F#$% Israel in public, without being considered "hateful".

Truth is, most Americans....even Jewish Americans DON'T know the difference between a Religion and a Nation! I currently live in Los Angeles which has a HUGE Jewish population. I have plenty of friends that are Jewish...but WHY is the DEFINITIONS so cloudy when it comes to the Jewish culture. First off, being a Jew...is a RELIGION. A Black person can be Jewish (Sammy Davis Jr). If you don't like Jews...it has nothing to do with RACE, it has to do with Religion! It has to do with how the Religion carries themselves...It has nothing to do with skin color or where you were born!

As for Israel, the topic of this thread, I think American need to wake up...and start questioning why our country is on the brink of WW3 for a NATION...not a race, not a religion. It is a country, with politicians, and a government that wants to go to war with Iran. Dragging the US into this war would be calling Russia and China's bluff on their support for Iran and the other nations that at conflict now (Syria for example)

Speak out...if you agree, let people know. Don't be dumbed down sheep scared to speak out about Israel and their politics. If a Jewish person get's offended, put them in their place...tell them to apply for citizenship in Israel and go fight that war by themselves if it's that important to them. Stop spending our troops lives, our tax dollars, and stop acting like Israel is the "N" word of politics. Don't be bullied into putting a pacifier in your mouth when it comes to criticizing Israel...if their POLICIES SUCK...SPEAK OUT!

I'll say it loud.. F#$% Israel!


Have a nice day!


Alright, I'm speaking out. I totally support Israel and it's right to exist. Not only that, but it's right to defend itself with any means possible to protect and ensure it's survival. There, I said it. I feel much better for speaking out now.


You support 2 World Wars, a coming Third, countless skirmishes and BS maneuvers, the total March into Fear Religious War, End of Times... Let's make this look EXACTLY like the Book of Revelations SCUM ??

That has actually got Jews as suckered into a corner as the Palestinians ??

Living behind walls in total fear, having the life sucked out of them all the while proclaiming victory to a God/Alien group of beings who created all these religions to play with energy and OWN YOUR ASS ??

Funny not even in ANY version of ANY religious book does it state THIS Israel has anything to do with ANYTHING...and yet it is still supported by the Christian fanatics who are completely had and dump all the cash and prayers on these guys as possible, and then claim that it is GOD'S WILL that this state exists, at WHAT COST must such an abomination and distraction unto all men be carried to its inevitable, Destructive Conclusion.

It does not matter HOW you look at this, the current state of Israel is a symbol of fear and domination, to subdue all people, and IT IS...and it has NOTHING to do with any Creator God that you think...we know who they are, the goals sought for by MANY nations is almost complete...too bad it will FAIL.




posted on Jul, 30 2012 @ 10:19 PM
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reply to post by GrinchNoMore
 

I suspect you'll have more direct comments than mine, but a few observations.

Do you think the Jews are trying for a New Testament, Book of Revelations, end? Why would the Jews use the New Testament as their plan?

Actually, looking back on it, I do support the two World Wars.

It does not matter HOW you look at this, the current state of Israel is a symbol of fear and domination, to subdue all people, and IT IS
I thought you said they were backed into a corner like the Palestinians.
They're not doing too well with the subdue all people part, are they?

And, leaving aside any religious issues, I support them as a relatively democratic, tolerant, and free ally in an area where those are hard to find. (And we're losing those we had.)

Living behind walls in total fear, having the life sucked out of them all the while proclaiming victory to a God/Alien group of beings who created all these religions to play with energy and OWN YOUR ASS ??
Quite an interesting image, almost sexual in a twisted way, but I may be missing your point on this one. It's not too clear to me.



posted on Jul, 30 2012 @ 10:48 PM
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reply to post by Pedro4077
 


I Don't Really Know Either Way but I think it's worth noting that the cause of Al Dura's death (some even claim he didn't die) and the authenticity of the video have been questioned since the day it aired on France 2



posted on Jul, 30 2012 @ 11:08 PM
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reply to post by glasshouse
 





I Don't Really Know Either Way but I think it's worth noting that the cause of Al Dura's death (some even claim he didn't die) and the authenticity of the video have been questioned since the day it aired on France 2


Yes it's strange how no reporter can verify if the child died


How hard would it be to track him down - after all, a reporter tracked down Bin Laden for an interview, when he was the most wanted man on the planet.




Some people aren't able to make the distinction between Judaism and Israel. I think it's fair to say, as well, that there are some that aren't able to make the distinction between anti-semitism and anti-zionism. I definitely realize alot of people pull the anti-semite card(unfairly) on anyone that opposes zionism. That being said, do you believe the less educated can sometimes drift back and forth between anti-zionism and anti-semitism without even realizing it?


Good point - I sometimes find myself getting angry at the Jews, when it is the Zionists who are the War Mongering Puppet Masters. My Bad.



edit on 30-7-2012 by Pedro4077 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 30 2012 @ 11:42 PM
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Let's cut the Bullshnickens people! I've seen how the elite act about Israel, I have plenty of over-privileged, rich, Jewish friends that went to private schools here in the US, have a free ticket in life, and act like their poop doesn't stink. They create exclusive social circles, moving up the latter in life, and "keep it in the family". I have a very mixed social circle since I am in the Entertainment Industry here in LA.

Being around these circles of people got me interested in why they are so "pro-Israel". Why are they so against the Arab nations ( I've traveled to a few nations including Turkey and Egypt...beautiful, passionate, loving people!), why do they feel they are better than everyone else? Why do they feel their country has the right to keep expanding into lands that were not theirs pre-WW2? Can't a religion exist ANYWHERE in the world..does a RELIGION really need it's own NATION?

You almost get this vibe of a crazed sports fan just rooting for their Soccer team on the world stage...regardless of right or wrong.

Somehow our mostly Christian nation became their bodyguard, they became our giant military base smack in the middle of the Middle-East. With that being understood, they have had a terrible time keeping the peace, using democracy to keep the area stable. Instead, this same mentality I see in the social circles in LA, is the same mentality in the Government in Israel. Our poop doesn't stink, we are entitled to ANYTHING we want, and that's that...

I'm all for a President that has the balls to say..."Ok little brother, you have the balls to pick a fight on the playground, then have the balls to fight, and FINISH the fight ON YOUR OWN.". Don't expect a single ground troop from the US...we have plenty of issues at home we need to fix. We also need to be BUILDING relations with Russia, China, and YES Iran...if we want our economy to grow. Times are changing. If we were really smart, we would play both sides of the fence and not get involved and be a neutral party. Let them have their crazy holy war.

But no, I'm sure by the end of the year....Israel will attack Iran. We will supply troops, weapons, air support, etc, etc...and maybe even turn into a global conflict.

That day...I will take off from work, drive to every pro-Israel hotspot in LA...and scream at the top of my lungs..."To hell with Israel".



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 02:55 AM
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If your life literally depended on everything you thought, said or did - you'd be very careful. Unless you were suicidal or programmed for self-destruction, then your *criticizing* Israel, would be understandable. But since most people today are simply following their ego's dictate, all bets are on that you're consciously choosing to *criticize* Israel. In which case, what you are thinking, saying (in writing or verbally) or doing, will come back to you 10 fold. It is actually written in stone FYI. Some restraint for life. Go with the *flow* of your ego spells death. Slowly or quickly - is anyone's guess how the judgment will be meted out.

Do whatever it is you desire now.

Genesis 12:3
I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse;
and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you.



edit on 31-7-2012 by rootbranch2012 because: (no reason given)
edit on 31-7-2012 by rootbranch2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 02:59 AM
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Zechariah 14:12 This is the plague with which the LORD will strike all the nations that fought against Jerusalem: Their flesh will rot while they are still standing on their feet, their eyes will rot in their sockets, and their tongues will rot in their mouths.

reply to post by JRockABM
 


Zechariah 14:12 This is the plague with which the LORD will strike all the nations that fought against Jerusalem: Their flesh will rot while they are still standing on their feet, their eyes will rot in their sockets, and their tongues will rot in their mouths.Zechariah 14:12 This is the plague with which the LORD will strike all the nations that fought against Jerusalem: Their flesh will rot while they are still standing on their feet, their eyes will rot in their sockets, and their tongues will rot in their mouths.



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 06:17 AM
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Welcome to PALLYWOOD - completely debunked and proven to be yet another (very lame and pathetic) ruse to gain sympathy for the Falsetenian *plight* - READ AND UNDERSTAND HOW PALLYWOOD USES MEMES!


reply to post by Pedro4077
 



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 06:31 AM
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From my perspective Israel gets PLENTY of criticism. There isn't a day that goes by on ATS without at least 10 threads damning Israel. Its the Palestinians and other Islamic countries around Israel that seem to escape any real criticism. Most of you just make excuses for them and join in the "JUICE DID IT!".
edit on 31-7-2012 by PvtHudson because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 06:41 AM
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And isn't it interesting that a few days, months or years later you will be noticing that those *criticizers and scoffers* either mysteriously stop posting or they start posting threads about their depression, illnesses and general paranoia?

Just saying......



Originally posted by PvtHudson
From my perspective Israel gets PLENTY of criticism. There isn't a day that goes by on ATS without at least 10 threads damning Israel. Its the Palestinians and other Islamic countries around Israel that seem to escape any real criticism. Most of you just make excuses for them and join in the "JUICE DID IT!".
edit on 31-7-2012 by PvtHudson because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 07:06 AM
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No, it's actually disinformation, stemming either from ignorance or maliciousness. Either way - as far as the world is concerned as of right this minute - all things and people connected to the Jewish people in whatever category they choose to identify themselves with including *Zionism* are hereby one and same and there NO distinction between the 2. There are Jews who are Orthodox Zionists who are reclaiming the Land and therefore this applies specifically. Lest you think that somehow the 2 concepts are mutually exclusive.




Originally posted by Pedro4077

Good point - I sometimes find myself getting angry at the Jews, when it is the Zionists who are the War Mongering Puppet Masters. My Bad.



edit on 30-7-2012 by Pedro4077 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 07:22 AM
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Originally posted by PvtHudson
From my perspective Israel gets PLENTY of criticism. There isn't a day that goes by on ATS without at least 10 threads damning Israel. Its the Palestinians and other Islamic countries around Israel that seem to escape any real criticism. Most of you just make excuses for them and join in the "JUICE DID IT!".
edit on 31-7-2012 by PvtHudson because: (no reason given)


Prove the ten threads a day damning Israel. Usually the thread is about how Israel is killing unarmed people that live on the land that Israel wants to steal. And when these people fight back they are labeled terrorist by the media and Israel especially groups like Hamas and Hezbollah. When you are fighting people that invaded your land you are not a terrorist you are a freedom fighter.



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 07:42 AM
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You seriously sound like a shill.



Originally posted by buster2010

Originally posted by PvtHudson
From my perspective Israel gets PLENTY of criticism. There isn't a day that goes by on ATS without at least 10 threads damning Israel. Its the Palestinians and other Islamic countries around Israel that seem to escape any real criticism. Most of you just make excuses for them and join in the "JUICE DID IT!".
edit on 31-7-2012 by PvtHudson because: (no reason given)


Prove the ten threads a day damning Israel. Usually the thread is about how Israel is killing unarmed people that live on the land that Israel wants to steal. And when these people fight back they are labeled terrorist by the media and Israel especially groups like Hamas and Hezbollah. When you are fighting people that invaded your land you are not a terrorist you are a freedom fighter.



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 08:10 AM
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reply to post by Xtrozero
 





So I'm not sure your point...one is a group of people or persons and the other is a nation.


His point was that we can discuss, and disagree with, the policies of the government of Israel and it's military, without "hating jews by proxy". And this thread is a great example of why we can't. Because there is no distinction between Israel the country, Judaism the religion, and Jewish people. There isn't.

I support Israel's right to exist and defend itself. I support Palestine's right to exist and defend itself.

But see, that's the game that is played here and elsewhere:

I disagree with the policies of Israel, consider it a quasi apartheid state, and do not feel that they are doing what they could and should to help bring stability to the region.

Now, for someone like me, reading that statement a few things are considered to be a "given".

1. I don't hate people, I don't hate jews, and I don't support terrorism
2. I am also aware of the roles these other nations play in the instability, but we're not discussing them as the US and Canada and the UK have not sworn money and blood to protect them.

But see, the response I get here is:

You hate jews, you are a nazi.

And that's the game. Once you learn the game, you spot the players pretty fast and I for one, am pretty good at ignoring them.

Israel is not a religion. Israel is not "the jews". Israel is a country, an ally, with a government, and very advanced military. Thousands of years of persecution do not give them a free pass.



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 08:20 AM
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reply to post by DerekJR321
 





If Israel simply has "the right to defend itself". Then let it. On its own. They certainly don't need our money (which Obama just increased by $70 million). They don't need our weapons. They don't need our soldiers and they certainly don't need our support. They should be able to handle themselves. I think if Israel would stop poking the hornets nest and then hiding behind its bodyguard United States, peoples opinion of that so-called Nation would be different.


It's not that simple my friend. Israel does have a right to defend itself, and it does have enemies, some of which are self created, others are just hating on the jews, that is a fact, and no one can pretend it isn't.

But there is a clear distinction between defending yourself and making efforts to bring peace and stability to the region, and constantly flaunting your disregard for international law while demanding other nations be bombed for the same or lesser offenses.

But that's not even what this thread is about. This thread is about the fact that when you say, he, lets take a look at the nation of israel, you are automatically a nazi.

I dislike many of the US policies, as do plenty of vocal americans here... do they hate America? No, of course not. I hate the nazi party, and everything it did to Europe. Do I by extension hate all Germans? No

Because there are clear distinctions.

Tell you what, to the people agree with my points, AND to the people about to call me a nazi...

Go download, by, pirate, steal or borrow:

The wandering Who.

Read it, read it twice if you have to. But before you call me a nazi, make note it was written by an Israeli Jew who served in the IDF.

Read it. It's about Jewish Identity politics, and goes very deep into the way this game is being played, and explains that until a distinction can be made, a line drawn where these things are distinct, you will never be able to even pretend to talk about ISrael or it's policies, as currently, Israel, Zionism, Judaism, and Jews are interchangeable terms.

Zionism, the current "neozionism" is quite obviously a political ideology, yet, I'm told, it's the new "antisemitism"

Hell, my own government, and people here, are telling me the only reason I have a problem with Israel is because I'm a jew hater.

It's insane, and with that insinuation, it's understood that I obviously support all terrorism globally, and eagerly await watching them march the jews into gas chambers.

That's not a generalization or exaggeration, I've literally been told that, on this forum I think.



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 09:28 AM
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OH please. Let's all bring out the violins right now. It's all BS. Capital B Capital S.


Originally posted by phishyblankwaters

It's not that simple my friend. Israel does have a right to defend itself, and it does have enemies, some of which are self created, others are just hating on the jews, that is a fact, and no one can pretend it isn't.

But there is a clear distinction between defending yourself and making efforts to bring peace and stability to the region, and constantly flaunting your disregard for international law while demanding other nations be bombed for the same or lesser offenses.





posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 09:35 AM
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Having founded a secular state, the Jews in occupied Palestine can no longer hide behind the cover of religious tolerance. "Israel" will have to take criticism like any other state.

Given that, why should we support them given what they have done?

Further, for the benefit of those who quote Biblical verses which could be construed to mean that we should support them, let me remind you that almost all of the Jews in occupied Palestine are descendants of the Kazars, a branch of the Turkish peoples. The Turks and Kazars are descended from Japheth, and their ancestors were never in Palestine. "Israel" the secular state is a fraud - even if they had named it "Judah" it would still be a fraud. True Israel is another entity entirely.



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 09:43 AM
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You have zero knowledge of what is actually going on. What you're doing is repeating spin and rhetoric from talking heads across the liberal board. Better to keep silent than be thought a fool would probably be an apt proverb to adhere to right now.


Originally posted by Lazarus Short
Having founded a secular state, the Jews in occupied Palestine can no longer hide behind the cover of religious tolerance. "Israel" will have to take criticism like any other state.

Given that, why should we support them given what they have done?

Further, for the benefit of those who quote Biblical verses which could be construed to mean that we should support them, let me remind you that almost all of the Jews in occupied Palestine are descendants of the Kazars, a branch of the Turkish peoples. The Turks and Kazars are descended from Japheth, and their ancestors were never in Palestine. "Israel" the secular state is a fraud - even if they had named it "Judah" it would still be a fraud. True Israel is another entity entirely.



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 09:49 AM
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I dont get it. Is their some Bizzaro America where you cant do this? I see people all the time critize Isreal. I see people all the time argue back. I see people all the time not giving an ass either way.

Where do you all live where you cant criticize Israel?
edit on 31-7-2012 by TsukiLunar because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 31 2012 @ 10:10 AM
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Nation/Religion....

Has everybody forgot... RACE?

Yea, no so clear cut now is it? Many Jews don't see the term "Jew" as a religion, but as a "race"

How often I've heard some people say "I'm half Jewish"..

I didn't realise you could be half a religion???

They Nation of Isreal, hoem to the *race* of Jews has created a rod for its own back.

Somebody else on page one jusr said "but if you were persecuted to a thousand years"..

Well, first of, I think its more like 2000


Secondly, I haven't know any other darn "race" to be persecuted for so long, but throughout history, its Jews this, Jews that.. Everybody on Earth have found them unbearable since their inception, ergo, common denominator: JEWS.

Its like they've personally made it their mission to p*ss of the rest of the world.

And I'm not trying to be *Racist* AKA anti-semimetic...

I'm looking from the other side of the glass.. In.

Its like walking into a party and greeting someone, for them to walk off, a bit confused you shrug it off, and greet an next person, for them to walk off to... Further confused, you greet an acquantance, who gives a funny look, and pulls you to the side... "Psssttt, hate to tell you this... But you've got some body odor going on there! I know you've come from the gym, get up stairs and get washed!"

So what? The whole worlds decided to "pick" on Israel, or have they got serious issues no one likes?

Doesn't take a genious.

And I know that doesn't count for every Jew, I personally judge each man/woman on individual merit.

But when it comes to generalisations, Zionist Jews and the Nation of Israel suck ass!

As does the anti-defamation league, who create this wall of *racism*, to deflect any criticism on the antics and flaws of the nation and *race*.

*********************************************

Now IMO, you've got be some arrogant f*ck wits to take a religion, turn it into a race, buddy up to some powerful allies and just take a chunk of land, and claim they and only they, are Gods people. Not to mention there special nuclear status.

Not bein funny, but they should have won there land 2000 years ago like *most* empire and terrortories were earned.

Times have changed, and their taking of that land was uncivilised in todays societies.
Rome kicked their ass good and proper, with the last stand at Masada, there Jews their fell with honour and diginity, and it should have been left at that.

This entire situation and scenario is absurd, sick, and disgusting.

I'm also most interested in the relationship between America, Britain, Rothchilds and Israel.

I bought a book for £15 a few months with its cover art being that of the American and Jewish flag, its about their *special* relationship, dating back from its beggining, sadly I left it at a friends, and we've since fell out, I'm hoping to get it back and learn about this in detail. If not, I'm afraid I can't remember the title or the author, if anyone knows, please tell me!


*Disclaimer: All IMO, which I'm entitled to.





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