Jesus Christ's Superderterministic, Cosmological, Magnum Opus.

Originally posted by Blue Shift
My take on the historical Jesus thing is that Jesus was a practicing sorcerer having learned the art from esoteric texts in or near the Library of Alexandria.

This however, is very helpful, and something that I've been pondering over lately due to this thread, so I would like to thank you very much for this little tidbit), and it just seems well "synchronistic" to our quest, at least to me it does.

Where oh where did Jesus get simultaneously exposed to just about every stream of philosophical thought and spiritual tradition and ancient wisdom literature, known to mankind? Over and above his Jewish tradition and mysticism, Jesus' philosophy and methodology, as we've explored in this thread, possesses aspects to his teachings and understanding and comprehension, which include simultaneously: Greek and Egyptian thought, which leads to Pathagoras, but ALSO Eastern wisdom teachings and streams of spiritual insight (via Lao Tsu, Confuscius and Buddha, who were contemporary to one another about 500BC), including the Yogic Tradition of Taoism (deep meditative contemplation and relationship between Atma and Brahma), now Hinduism, along with the Zoroastrian connection that's been outlined in relation to the mysterious "Magi" of the East which I say were Persian who shared info with Daniel's descendants, and who saw his star, and who later took him into their care for his "lost years". But when we look at the map (see a number of posts up) the possibility of the sharing of info with all "initiates" right across, pretty much that entire region, stretching from Israel, all the way to Tibet is possible, even likely or probably if the Jew's predecessors were one of the wandering caucasian Aryan Tribes (meaning "civilized") who settled for a long time in the Indus River Valley Civilization, before eventually settling in Judea, and building the city of Jerusalem. But even the Persians, or the ancient Indians, wouldn't have had the strictly rational Greek and Pathagorean system of thought and the finely honed art of debate perfected. So while there's a lot of possibility there in terms of shared influences throughout that whole region, which include ancient Babylon in Sumaria, there's no single place, other than the Library of Alexandria, which would represent a crossroads of all the information and traditions in one repository of human knowledge and wisdom.

Somewhere along the way, he found it all, the whole treasure trove and fully integrated it or "grokked" it all, synthesizing the conclusions that he drew therefrom, inspired by/with his deep spiritual contemplative tradition ie: prayer, the whole kit and caboodle (don't forget he had almost 20 years within which to do this).

Therefore, I purport that Jesus, as a young man and adult, had access to that singular repository of all human knowledge and intersecting wisdom streams, contained at that precise location, at the Library of Alexandria. I am convinced beyond any doubt in fact, that he studied there, that he, Yeshua, went to school there (too bad they burned all the records I'd like to see what he got in math!).

The Royal Library of Alexandria,
or Ancient Library of Alexandria, in Alexandria, Egypt, was the largest and most significant library of the ancient world.[1] It flourished under the patronage of the Ptolemaic dynasty and functioned as a major center of scholarship from its construction in the 3rd century BC until the Roman conquest of Egypt in 30 BC. The library was conceived and opened either during the reign of Ptolemy I Soter (323–283 BC) or during the reign of his son Ptolemy II (283–246 BC).[2]

en.wikipedia.org...

Nothing else and no other conclusion makes any sense other than that he had access, either directly, or indirectly, to the contents of this particular Library, right here. Where else are you going to be able to absorb all these traditions, and sources of knowledge and understanding, and the ability to debate (see Jesus vs. the Pharisees) like there's no tomorrow!

I think that's where the Magi sent him to school once he'd mastered everything they could offer him.

Honestly, I think that Jesus was a Genius, who, when he walked back onto the scene at the age of about 30, was absolutely armed to the teeth, intellectually and in every way, and he did bring them to a loss of words, more than once!

Originally posted by ImaFungi

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
In the field



Just imagine this guy with a big genuine smile, and there we are.

why would he be smiling if human affairs on earth arent all groovy?

It's a good question.

Because he'd already been there done that got the t-shirt (quite literally) and the 2nd half of his life, sat there, on the other side of that eclipse, containing the fullness of life (a whole life lived to the full), and if he was to take it back up again, he had to have the courage to be absolutely happy and to generate the space of eternal happiness and bliss, which to exist anywhere, would have to be made manifest by him right here on earth as heaven on earth also lived - to prepare a place for us in the fullness of him, both as man and even yes as God.

Then, at about the age of 67 or 68, after dropping his body, he wasted no time in accosting Saul from the domain of light, like a brick wall, as the poor man was knocked blind off his horse to the ground, to the sound of a loving voice saying "Saul Saul, why do you persecute me?"

"Who are you Lord?"

...and so the dance went on, and still goes on to this very day if we would but allow it, allow the unreasonably reasonableness to persuade us to allow it, simply because it makers perfect rational sense when nothing but the very best will do.

Who among us has to couragae to do THAT - to also live the better part of life for all the right reasons, but not just for one's self, but as a shared joy and celebration of life?

It is perfects as great a courage (to be happy) as was required to do the "heavy lifting".. and what does THAT invite us into? A life of debaucher? LOL Hardly. Jesus was way way beyond the need to do that, even if his girlfiend did accompany him as he rode out of town (with bells ringing out..?)

I'll crack you guys up yet, in the best possible way.

It is hard for me reading you reading me, not to see the humor of real understanding come about, like a sudden epiphany.

Don't fear the doctrine. Listen only to the spirit and your own rational faculties, and don't take my word for it, investigate open-mindedly and willingly, free from any bias whatsoever, and hey, if you come across a sparkling diamond in the process, sell everything you own (attachments) and buy it, but only you'll know when you see it, but at that point you do "grok" it and laugh, then laugh some more.

I cannot be the only one to get this supra-rational HUMOR in the metaphysical proposition of Jesus, made by him and then directed at everyone. Takes a while to work it out, the double bind, and the solution posed.

It's both humorous and one's humor restored, imho.

It's important I think, while we continue to explore these things and continue to investigate, that we don't forget the um..stellar frame of reference, or in other words that we don't forget that Jesus was on schedule, perfectly.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
If, like me, and I'm sure most ATS'rs, you're impatient to get to the heart of a largely unexplored mystery and try to solve the "conspiracy", here's a preview of what's to come, which will serve as a type of foundation stone for our subsequent investigation, one which will I am convinced prove this piece of the puzzle to be completely valid.

The Real Star of Bethlehem (part 1 of 7)

www.bethlehemstar.net...

Testimonials

"well-researched and reasonable"

Former Chief of Planetary Astronomy, NASA, and Technical Editor, Sky & Telescope magazine

"an interesting look... at the star... genuinely thought-provoking"

Christianity Today magazine

"models the scientific method at its best"

Distinguished Professor of Old Testament Studies, Dallas Theological Seminary

"wide-ranging and insightful scholarship"

Former Publisher and Editor, Scientific American magazine, and President, American Association for the Advancement of Science

"a convincing case...a mystery solved"

Former Director, NASA Dryden Flight Research Center

"This explanation of the Star is compelling..."

NASA's Chief Engineer for the Space Shuttle and the International Space Station, Director of the Columbia Shuttle Accident Task Force

And at the same time, while it's true that he might have been caught up in a type of "wedge" from which there was no escaping, nevertheless, he himself, from his early training and spiritual development, was never out of direct intimate contact with the God of his understanding, except maybe for a brief and agonizing period while on the cross.

Thus, he immediately took the wedge he was given and employed it, in accordance with his very careful and evaluative discernment in the spirit of truth ie: that he always sought to carry out the will of the father within whom he lived, moved and had his being, even as the son of the father, where atma and brahma are one.



His USE of the wedge, when he'd successfully unravelled his destiny and fated calling, now that's another matter altogether, whereby Jesus may also be considered, at one level, the greatest leader of all time (I hate to use the word politician these days.. ), who's reason and persuasive skills, and his use of story and metaphor largely unparalleled in terms of it's insightful and often cutting genius. On wedge issues, Jesus knew how to move an argument in favor of the very best possible idea, and to the best mutual interests of all involved, fully "bracketed" or balanced you could say, as a thinker and as a human being, even unshakable in so many ways.. like a rock of ages who's reason is so sound that against it nothing that is unreasonable or utterly absurd can stand the test of time.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


Re: Library of Alexandria.

Plutarch (AD 46–120) wrote that during his visit to Alexandria in 48 BC Julius Caesar accidentally burned the library down when he set fire to his own ships to frustrate Achillas' attempt to limit his ability to communicate by sea.[3] After its destruction, scholars used a "daughter library" in a temple known as the Serapeum, located in another part of the city.

Um, so I might have been wrong about the PRECISE location, since it burned down sometime between 30 and 50 BC, sorry! Hey we all make mistakes.

However, the daughter library, the Serapeum COULD still hold out possibility.. anyway, somewhere it ALL came together, and was available, all the ancient wisdom literature and spiritual traditions and philosophies, and Jesus accessed that resource, I'm certain of it, or there's no way to explain his whole style and approach which in many ways is out of alignment with traditional Jewish thinking of his time. He even spoke differently from everyone with many seemingly cryptic sayings not always easy to understand at first glance.

It was as if Jesus was asking the question of himself - what are our common responsibilities to one another and what's our common bond, on the unconditioned ground of being (in the holy of holies)? This concept of familial love and the brotherhood of man, is then used as the cornerstone to his philosophical outlook. He was always thinking, not of himself, but of God AND of us, or OUR ("our father, who art in ...), never the selish tendency, which he'd long transcended as a result of his thorn encircled sacred heart, even as a child.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
Interlude

This video segment, while you may assume that it represents an attempt to "convert" you, isn't really that at all, just a series of statements of fact really, and then there's the humor (because we all know him deep down at some level simply because he's also the very very best part of ourselves also, at core wherein we're all one human family)

Albeit the video seems to start out sounding perhaps a little too heavy on the southern evangelical baptist side, I agree, which, if you had a strong anti-religious sentiment might risk turning you off from really listening to any more, but it gets better, trust me.

..and it's all true, and fits rather well into this part of the puzzle we're assembling as to the true nature and identity and great work of the real life historical person of Jesus Christ, the same one anyone can find in the gospels today, in fact, in one reading (if you just read the red parts.. ; )

But this isn't a "goading" or preaching @ anyone with a hidden agenda, don't get the wrong idea here about my motives, which is only to in the end bring you to your very knees in ecstatic laughter, and in tears both of sorrow and regret and of joy and happiness and the humor that also wipes away the tears from the eyes..

Best Regards,

NAM

And if it all means anything at all, then by extension it means everything and it means everything that it means everything.

Life is not absurd and meaningless, and principals must be proven right by their application. Love, within a familial framework with none excluded is the highest ideal, it's the only thing worth doing, both to love and be loved.

Jesus is infinitely lovable for his own love for us, I wish more people could see that, and then fathom much more deeply and profoundly, what the significance of his life and work really involves, for each and every one of us within the framework of "the relativity of human being".

It's a world waiting to be born, not as an anti-Christ in some form, but of Christ himself having come of age, such that God himself in spirit will come to live with us and we will be his people and he will be our God and he will also call us, his son.

This is what Jesus makes possible, as a domain of possibility, that the day will come when the spirit and the bride can say in all honesty, come and freely drink the living water of eternal life, a domain wherein the possibility of separation has been forever removed.

"Surely goodness and love will follow me all the days of my life and I will dwell in the house of the Lord, forever."
~ 23rd Psalm ending.

It is a participatory eschatology at the end of judgement and Jesus Christ himself is the Eschaton at the end of time (in eternity). Therefore the church doctrine (in opposition to the messianic hope to immamentize the eschaton) is flawed, since Jesus' very goal, vision and passion, was to bring heaven to earth (and vice versa). "Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven."

Peace on earth. Good will to man.


or I am getting just totally carried away at this point?

Nah just kidding around, it's important, even vital that we come to understand these things so much better so as to deploy Christ's love as he intended for us, so that he and his love for us and for one and all would be known, by our love for one another.

"Love one another as I have loved you."
~ his only commandment.

too tired for a proper reply....but I want to congratulate you on this beautiful thread.

I am not a "follower" of the "faith", and not a fan of proselytizing. however, I believe you have made your point quite clearly....to anyone that is listening.

a couple of years ago I wrote a thread which spun up a huge flaming backlash against me and was promptly deleted within an hour of posting. in it, I attempted to render my own brief narrative which carries the same message which you are now trying to portray.

the title of my thread was a phrase which I believe carries the sum of the message:


"will no one help the widow's son?"


nice job.

Originally posted by tgidkp
too tired for a proper reply....but I want to congratulate you on this beautiful thread.

I am not a "follower" of the "faith", and not a fan of proselytizing. however, I believe you have made your point quite clearly....to anyone that is listening.

a couple of years ago I wrote a thread which spun up a huge flaming backlash against me and was promptly deleted within an hour of posting. in it, I attempted to render my own brief narrative which carries the same message which you are now trying to portray.

the title of my thread was a phrase which I believe carries the sum of the message:


"will no one help the widow's son?"


nice job.

I know you, for your reason, and scientific understanding, and for own intellectually rigorous "complexity", so coming from you that's a big compliment, so thanks a bunch for the wonderful feedback tgidkp (Yoda would be able to pronouce that I'm sure..).

Blessed are those who "pop" in the face of absolute reason and love.

Me I'm just the messenger, reporting what I've found nothing more, and it's a good thing too, because it it was all on me I would have "blown the assignment" before I even made it out of my teen years!

Best Regards,


NAM

reply to post by NewAgeMan


great thread bud

i have been following your progress

the complexity of some things require order, in a simplistic way we are all trying to understand the chaos or "randomness" of a very complex life,
and reduce it to a simple world or life view.

in the simplest of things is complexity,
in the most complex of things is simplicity,

i find that the saying,

we are at one with all,
and all is at one with me.



keep smiling and remember the unity of unconditional love (the most powerful force in the universe)

peace and light

xploder

Jesus Christ's Superderterministic, Cosmological, Magnum Opus.

It's like a sparkling, multifaceted, diamond of splendour and awe, who's light shines and radiates outwardly, in truth and righteousness. It's like a placed star in the heavens, yet in the body (His body), distributed right across the entire depth and breadth of all being and becoming, set in place and within human history, as the highest standard of the twin pillars of a severe justice, and a tender mercy - a light that shines in the darkness, even when the very face and light of the sun was eclipsed by a full, blood-red moon.

So it is both superderministic and cosmological, and of a degree of ingenuity that simultaneously defies reason, yet which also beckons us to give it further consideration, in it's absolutely unreasonable, reasonableness. (like I said, you'll either "grok" this or you won't).




"Love one another, as I have loved you."

Is that unreasonable? Anyone?

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
And in spite of the controversial or scandalous aspect of his physical birth, and that his nature appears to have been not of the flesh but twice-born of the spirit (three times, if you count the resurrection from the tomb), the actual birth of the person, the human being Jesus (God Saves), is well worth celebration as well, so the whole integrity of Christmas is not only maintained but highlighted still further by these discoveries, I hope.

And so on that note, good night, and God bless you all.

may you enjoy this little piece in remembrance and awareness of the one who transcends and yet who also caps the solstice, renewing the world with hope and the possibility of newfound joy and celebration in a shared mutual triumph over everything that would otherwise threaten to rob life of it's most intrinsic value, meaning and good-willed, good-natured, humor, and charm. I love you.

Blessed are we, who are moved to tears of laughter love and sorrow and more laughter and love without the sorrow and still more laughter and love because the sorrow is gone. OMG what do we do NOW? It's a hyperfreedom we knew nothing about, but how did HE know? So it's a shared joke with none other than God who punk'd us all!

Originally posted by troubleshooter

God's Conspiracy is to blindside the wise, learned, mighty and noble...

...and most of you have been punk'd.


God first said He would do this through His prophet Isaiah who wrote in the 8th century BC...

"...behold, I will proceed to do a marvellous work among this people, even a marvellous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent men shall be hid." Isaiah 29:14


Paul quotes from Isaiah in his first letter to Corinth (one of the undisputed letters of Paul)...

"For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent (learned, intelligent). 20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?" 1 Corinthians 1:19-20


He did it by turning the human notions of wisdom on its head...

"For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called: 27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; 28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:" 1 Corinthians 1:26-28


God designed a way to reveal Himself that would be rejected by the world's best and brightest...
...and it is still blindsiding those who think they are special because of wealth, education or power.


How did God punk most of you?

He revealed Himself as a babe, conceived and born in scandal...
...as a man He healed the sick, sided with the oppressed and raised the dead...
...He opposed the religious and secular elite...
...who executed Him for telling them who He really was...
...but He then turned this corporate murder into a victory over death itself.


Paul said it like this...
"...the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God...the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men."


Your responses will reveal whether you have been punk'd by God or not.

So loving, so funny, is God, you have no idea, or maybe, you do...

Best Regards,


NAM

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
In the field



Just imagine this guy with a big genuine smile, and there we are.

There's one vital distinction that needs to be made here I think, that I'd like to add, just in case anyone was wondering.

In laying his life down for his friends, Jesus went into the ordeal obediant unto death (he was double-blind), and really did lay down his life. But in taking it back up again, having only lived half a life up until that point, retaining, up until that moment, his absolute purity and perfection (unblemished) as the Lamb of God (who is inspected in the house), - that he did not in some way "twin" (he thinks THAT's really funny btw, at least in the spirit as far as I can tell, to me), and experience half of himself (the better half) "beamed straight up", while the "other half" went off (ran off), riding out of town, into a life of debauchery, although as I said, all indication is that his wife-to-be was surely at his side (there's nothing wrong with that, with a little romance..).

But he did not lose integrity over the long haul in living life to the full, for the duration, it simply wasn't in his character, and wasn't part of the other half of the great work he still needed to perform, which was to generate the space of happiness and bliss capable of recieving saints, many ir not most of whom died, like Peter, for the sake of their unduring faith in him, which was well founded. He went on to prepare a place, both on earth and in heaven above, so that they too would be reunited with him in glory "afterwards". He understood what was at stake, but he did not abandon them, as is implied in daVinci's masterpiece "The Last Supper", and neither did he lose his character or experience a break down in integrity, which would be an absurd and ridiculous notion, given who he was and what he was all about.

Which is why I say that we can only HOPE that His Holiness, Pope Benedict XVI, seen here smiling-laughing as a Santa type figure back in December of '05


..is laughing for all the right reasons..


The Two Thieves on Either Side

Thus, when the two thiefs at each side of him had their say, with the one deriding him and mocking him, the other asking him to forgive him and remember him when he came into his kingdom, to whom he said "I tell you today, you will be with me in paradise" that he, the repentant thief, was not disappointed in the outcome, while the one who said "why can't you save yourself?" and who mocked him, was both absolutely right, and yet, at another much much deeper level (where the first/last cause is involved), sadly mistaken.. even there Jesus got the last laugh.. remarkable!

I would also like to note in regards to that image of Jesus "In The Field", that that's from a laminated picture given to me by a street person I know who likes to visit the Catholic Book store for iconography as talismen to protect him from evil (yes, some people have strange ideas about the spiritual life), which is where it came from, and which I then had scanned yesterday, for this thread, as I could not find the image anywhere on the net. So that's from a Roman Catholic source, that image of Jesus wth sacred heart and crucifixion marks in hands, standing in the open field (beyond the cross and the grave) wearing his red cape (first superhero?). It came out very nice and made a valuable addition to this thread. Later that day, as I still had the lamiinated photo with me when I saw him, my good friend Johnny, a Catholic himself (and ex biker type), wouldn't let it go when he got it in his hands and took a good look at it, and he was pleased when I told him where it came from originally.

Best Regards,

NAM

reply to post by NewAgeMan

which is why I say that this..

The Broken Sphere - Vatican Museum



unless it symbolizes the breaking-in of the spirit of God, from the outer sphere (the Tao) to the inner (the son) in Jesus' re-birth, from above

means that we've got another "quaruple-bind" on our hands (on someone's hands anyway) which would otherwise represent nothing less than the fall of Babylon. (that's funny too, on the other side of all the weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth, that is)

I guess that's the advantage of playing both sides of the fence, so that when and if one kingdom falls, you can always flip over and keep it propped up by another keystone, in this case the stone that was rejected by the builders..

I guess time will tell, or maybe it already has.


And why is it again that priests are not allowed to marry nor women to take an equal role to men in the RCC? One wonders..

And no, as you can see I'm not anti-Church and am just following where the trail leads..

reply to post by NewAgeMan

I realize The Broken Sphere aka Sphere within a Sphere may just be nothing more than a work of art without any esoteric meaning, and I apologize for veering off topic, but it's interesting I think that another one of them is situated at The United Nations.

Sphere within a Sphere, United Nations, New York City


A tourist's video

Here's what the Italian Foreign Affairs Minister said about it, in terms of it's meaning and significance.


It should be noted, however, that when Franklin D. Roosevelt called Winston Churchill and asked "what shall we call this war?" Churchill responded without hesitation, "the unnecessary war!" (and I'm thinking here of the Rothschild connection, and even the collusion of "Americans" like Prescott Bush, or even something called a "Concordat"..).

Also, those twin towers at the World Trade Center (where there was yet another Sphere Within a Sphere object of art), they also symbolized the twin pillars of Joachim and Boaz (Mercy and Severity), and, suffering a complete and catastrophic "failure" in integrity, during the 9/11 event, resulted in the spearhead of empire targeting the area of what was once Babylon, in Iraq, with the aim being to forge a "New World Order" from the ash heap of death and destruction, combined with an increase in insecurity (fear), and a decrease, in individual civil liberty.

"... sacrificed, on the alter of freedom."
~ Rudolf Guiliani (9/11 memorial service, 2003 or thereabouts)

It may be important therefore, to draw a distinction between a singular willing sacrificial atonement by the high priest himself, who said "I ask for mercy, not sacrifice" (no longer required) and an unwilling sacrifice of 1000's of victims (if not millions) in service to the pursuits of an imperialistic empire at the behest of special Jewish nationalist interests. The first is the cross of the Magnum Opus of Jesus Christ, as outlined in this thread, while the second bears all the hallmarks, of anti-Christ, and/or a modern and very bloody, crusade (in diametric opposition to the principal of Christian love as a focal point of inspiration and, of transformation - see "Parable of the Good Samaritan").

If we do not or cannot learn from history, it DOES have a tendency of repeating itself, more often than not in the most horrific manner.


ok, back on topic, back on track..

and no I'm not crazy, just very perceptive where sometimes, from time to time, it may be said that "perfect paranoia is perfect awareness"!

Regards,

NAM

Before moving on, I think it's worth noting, that Judas

was of Arabic descent (black sheep of the family?)

Whose field he purchased with the money, came to be called the "field of blood".

Matthias Chosen to Replace Judas

12 Then the apostles returned to Jerusalem from the hill called the Mount of Olives, a Sabbath day’s walk[c] from the city. 13 When they arrived, they went upstairs to the room where they were staying. Those present were Peter, John, James and Andrew; Philip and Thomas, Bartholomew and Matthew; James son of Alphaeus and Simon the Zealot, and Judas son of James. 14 They all joined together constantly in prayer, along with the women and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brothers.

15 In those days Peter stood up among the believers (a group numbering about a hundred and twenty) 16 and said, “Brothers and sisters,[d] the Scripture had to be fulfilled in which the Holy Spirit spoke long ago through David concerning Judas, who served as guide for those who arrested Jesus. 17 He was one of our number and shared in our ministry.”

18 (With the payment he received for his wickedness, Judas bought a field; there he fell headlong, his body burst open and all his intestines spilled out. 19 Everyone in Jerusalem heard about this, so they called that field in their language Akeldama, that is, Field of Blood.)

20 “For,” said Peter, “it is written in the Book of Psalms:

“‘May his place be deserted;
let there be no one to dwell in it,’[e]

Acts 1:12-20

And yet here we are, still one human family.

Strange how these things can continue to fester behind the scenes, under the surface of history, as if lying in wait for the schemes of wicked men to employ with devastating consequences.



"I ask for mercy, not sacrifice."
~ Jesus Christ, reiterated, on more than one occasion.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

which is why I say that this..

The Broken Sphere - Vatican Museum



unless it symbolizes the breaking-in of the spirit of God, from the outer sphere (the Tao) to the inner (the son) in Jesus' re-birth, from above

means that we've got another "quaruple-bind" on our hands (on someone's hands anyway) which would otherwise represent nothing less than the fall of Babylon. (that's funny too, on the other side of all the weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth, that is)

I guess that's the advantage of playing both sides of the fence, so that when and if one kingdom falls, you can always flip over and keep it propped up by another keystone, in this case the stone that was rejected by the builders..

I guess time will tell, or maybe it already has.


And why is it again that priests are not allowed to marry nor women to take an equal role to men in the RCC? One wonders..

And no, as you can see I'm not anti-Church and am just following where the trail leads..

edit on 3-8-2012 by NewAgeMan because: edited

enjoying the thread!!

my interpretation of this sculpture is.......

the complexity of simplicity ( how complex a simple sphere is),,,, the mathematical, mechanical and quantitative nature of nature..... and the inescapable underlying passage of time as well as effects causing causes which cause effects,, all neatly or messily tied into one another,, all occurring one after the other,,many of these occurring at the same time, for all time,,, something has to happen,, which is dictated by that which has happened before,

Originally posted by ImaFungi
the complexity of simplicity ( how complex a simple sphere is),,,, the mathematical, mechanical and quantitative nature of nature..... and the inescapable underlying passage of time as well as effects causing causes which cause effects,, all neatly or messily tied into one another,, all occurring one after the other,,many of these occurring at the same time, for all time,,, something has to happen,, which is dictated by that which has happened before,

Yes, as per the famous saying "from chaos - order". However, you'll note that the inner sphere within a sphere is also cracking up, and therefore, unbeknownst perhaps to our friendly neighborhood makers of chaos, who rely on the will, not of God, but the self-willed, will to power as their catalyst and driving force - that it's a recipe, for cataclysm, amid a complete breakdown in integrity, not perfection, with increasing degrees of wholeness (and integrity). It thus represents man's interpretation of the creative process (which is always stupid), not God's (which is always infinitely intelligent). imho.

P.S. Your interpretation was great btw, I didn't mean to imply that it was stupid by any means, I just wanted to point out how it (the sculpture) also represents cataclysm (see 9/11 video posted above for more on that).

What we've both highlighted I think, is the vital importance of learning from history, from real history as it really is.

"There is nothing now hidden which will not be made known and brought to light."

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
Before moving on, I think it's worth noting, that Judas

was of Arabic descent (black sheep of the family?)

It should also be noted here, since we've mentioned Judas, that the Qur'an denies that Jesus actually went to the cross, intimating instead that it was Judas who took his place, as a "lookalike"..

The Koran teaches that someone who looked like Jesus was crucified on the cross in a case of mistaken identity. Many Muslims appeal to the Gospel of Barnabas as proof that the unknown look alike was Judas Iscariot.

"they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them" (Qur'an 4:156)

"Verily I say that the voice, the face, and the person of Judas were so like to Jesus, that his disciples and believers entirely believed that he was Jesus" (Gospel of Barnabas)

www.bible.ca...

Either way, in the fullness of time and history, it does appear that "Judas" has indeed been "scapegoated" within the framework of a Jewish conspiracy (at least in part).

Sometimes I really wonder about the origin of the Qur'an, moreso even that the Book of Mormon..

If what I suspect is true, then things sure did and have gotten "out of hand"...

Well, the historical Jesus is the same Jesus of the bible. Much of what we know of him is drawn from that book, which has been archeaologically proven to be a historically accurate text. This ties into the debate of Christ's deity. Some believe he is God, some believe he was just a man. But if he was just a man, how then did a man know both past, present and future? He knew what a person had done, was doing and thinking and what they were going to do. That's not something a man can do. Only God has the ability to see outside the fluid of time to be able to know past present and future. Below we will see an example of his knowledge of a woman upon first meeting her.

John 4:13-26

13 Jesus answered and said to her, “Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, 14 but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into everlasting life.”

15 The woman said to Him, “Sir, give me this water, that I may not thirst, nor come here to draw.”

16 Jesus said to her, “Go, call your husband, and come here.”

17 The woman answered and said, “I have no husband.”

Jesus said to her, “You have well said, ‘I have no husband,’ 18 for you have had five husbands, and the one whom you now have is not your husband; in that you spoke truly.”

19 The woman said to Him, “Sir, I perceive that You are a prophet. 20 Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, and you Jews say that in Jerusalem is the place where one ought to worship.”

21 Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe Me, the hour is coming when you will neither on this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews. 23 But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him. 24 God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”

25 The woman said to Him, “I know that Messiah is coming” (who is called Christ). “When He comes, He will tell us all things.”

26 Jesus said to her, “I who speak to you am He.”

So we can clearly see he had both foreknowledge of her previous sins, and also knew that she presently had no husband for the man she was with was not her husband. Demonstrating knowledge of a person's past and present. We can see through this discourse that Jesus began to talk about God, and then the Samaritan woman said "i know that Messiah is coming, when he comes he will tell us all things". To her the Messiah was the same as God and that his knowledge is of all things. So we can see that not only do present day christians share this same belief but the Samaritans who were also of the Northern Kingdom of Israel (Israelites) also shared this same belief back then. Before the Assyrian Exile around 740 B.C. the 10 northern tribes of Israel made their capitol in Samaria, and not all of Ephraim (the Northern Kingdom of Israel) had been taken and the Samaritans of Christ's time were the decendants of those who escaped that exile.