Obama backs race-based school discipline policies

reply to post by Kashai

I am not arguing with you...I am simply adding content

barely relevant to the topic at hand.
obviously not considered by the Chief instigator/author of the EO in question.
and certainly isn't enough to have the EO repealed, is it ??
yet somehow, you infer it has relevance --> to what exactly?

since you probably won't answer the above questions, get over it, eh

reply to post by Honor93

ok, this isn't meant to be a snub although it may sound like it ... now that you are 20 or so, how willing and how often are you venturing back to those badlands to make a difference in some younger persons life ??

Maybe once I graduate college and get on my own success.

ps: regarding that other topic, are you even aware that in 2 northern states (NY, MD), around 1860, there were more slaves (not indentured servants) than existed in 4 sourthern states ??

I already addressed that. The thread you linked was revisionist history by people that repeat talking points and never read anything. You don't even read my posts but yet reply to them. I doubt they've even read the state decelerations of secessions. The quote is from an elite cohort that mingled with the southern powers that be... why would anyone care what that guy had to say? It'd be like trusting Obama's words about the Libya mission.

The Slave Power (often called the "Slaveocracy") was a term used in the United States ca. 1840-1865 to denounce the political power of the slaveholding class in the South. The argument was that this small group of rich men had seized political control of their own states and was trying to take over the national government in illegitimate fashion to use it to expand and protect slavery.

en.wikipedia.org...

The northern powers were afraid the southern plantation powers were going to take over the country. The commercialization of the cotton gin gave way to huge profits and more power to the south. Slavery in the south had a huge boom before the civil war. It was becoming too powerful and the north was in a panic. The north had a lot of house slaves and less profits from their slavery.

reply to post by Honor93


Jim Crow laws had nothing to do with the "pale black man". It was a couple centuries after that. A white court also granted him the slave.

yes, the Civil War happened but let's not look at the real reasons why cause slavery is just wrong.

You're so uneducated. It was one of the main factors. Go read the deceleration of secessions.

yes, slavery in America was bad but let's not look at the fact that there was none until a black man demanded it in a court of law.

Entirely not true. Indentured servants are slaves.

yes, slavery was popular in the South, but let's not look at the fact that Northern states held more of them and didn't free them upon the Emanicipation Proclamation ... that only applied to Confederate slaves.

This goes back to slave power. The whole reason why the northern powers wanted to end southern slavery. It wasn't for ethical reasons. Shortly after that the amendment to end slavery was ratified.

Originally posted by timetothink
reply to post by Honor93

 

My apologies...just the way it was worded felt kind of attackish

couldn't understand why.

cause i'm old and crabby and RealSpoke was tapdancing on my nerves
sorry, glad you spoke up

I don't think I was getting my point across that whoever was here in the very beginnings of our country, whatever color..were not slaves that I know of...but here of equal stature...so for it to be said that it was started as a white supremacist country is just a ruse to continue the race tensions.

just so you're not confused, we agree completely and i often get frustrated easily with this topic because i was taught the same things ... it took a great deal of personal interest to rectify my own prejudicial tendencies (and i was raised in PA - taught to believe Northern Aggression was necessary - what a load of crapola)

once i started looking for African-American pioneers, a whole new world of understanding and curiosity opened for me (although, i was older than RS is now ... so i really do try to be patient)

reply to post by Honor93


Ignore more of my posts again. White supremacy did not come into the law until the Virginia slave codes came into play. As I discussed here; www.abovetopsecret.com...

You just keep repeating the same things without realizing that what you are saying is historically inaccurate.

I'm done with this thread. I'm sick of saying the same thing over and over to be faced with no argument that never provides any sources.

reply to post by RealSpoke

Maybe once I graduate college and get on my own success.

fair enough but a more direct answer would be ... No, not yet.
i do notice that you didn't answer the other relevant question ... do you believe it is someone else's duty ?

shame on you ... that thread is full of facts, source documents AND the other side of the story. you know, the one they don't teach in school.

fool, i've quoted your posts ... see above.
at this point, i'd have to agree with many others ... you exhibit extreme troll behavior, why is that ??

the original secession papers were linked on many pages, guess you didn't bother to look.
forget that right ?? it's ONLY history.

so, all the Confederate leaders were "elite cohorts" eh ?
interesting ... and i'd suppose you think Lincoln is a hero rather treasonist, right?

typical ... well, within T&C, you are free to express your racism all you want.
wiki is for those who are too weak-minded to do the research themselves.
it's been fun.

The northern powers were afraid the southern plantation powers were going to take over the country.

really ??
do tell, how were they going to do that as seceded states ??
several states seceded BEFORE Lincoln was inaugerated.
technically, Lincoln didn't have a "Union" to defend.

pffft, the rest is mere rhetoric and propaganda with one or two valid points mixed in ... puhleeeez.

so, what does any of this have to do with the latest and greatest SEPARATIST policy this country has seen in nearly 60 years ??
remember, the EO states specifically ... African-Americans ... it offers no grace for any other minority.
so, does this mean we should re-create the "labor industry" that would benefit the greatest number of people?

according to you ... anything would be better than what they endure presently, right ?
now can you see why i don't/can't follow your train of thought ??

Originally posted by de_Genova
reply to post by groingrinder

 

My point though was that the malevolent legacy of slavery and all that it entails is an inherited thing - to the conscious psyche - as well as to the unconscious mind - the genes - the DNA - the bloodline itself - all that..............please don't think those things don't matter - they do!

whoaaaaa there, is that your twisted version of Original Sin?

reply to post by RealSpoke

Jim Crow laws had nothing to do with the "pale black man". It was a couple centuries after that. A white court also granted him the slave.

not hardly ... the JC era was a DIRECT result of Homer's actions.

would you trust wiki ?

www.ask.com...
Plessy v. Ferguson, 163 U.S. 537 (1896), is a landmark United States Supreme Court decision in the jurisprudence of the United States, upholding the constitutionality of state laws requiring racial segregation in public facilities under the doctrine of "separate but equal."

before Plessy, it was practiced but it was NOT Federally mandated.

Homer wasn't happy with the railroad decision and was offended that some states - Louisiana in particular - still practiced segregation within its borders. so, he and a group of activist lawyers decided to do something about it and the Jim Crow era was the final result.
like it or lump it, it's history dude.

Go read the deceleration of secessions

been there, done that.
you really should give it a try.

oh no they are not. they never were and many indentured servants were released from their bondage. slaves had no such option.

but the amendment didn't end slavery.
it only addresses INvoluntary slavery and servitude -- ever wonder why?

So it wasn't enough for POTUS to go around Congress, he now feels the need to go around the Dept of Education? Isn't the Dept of Education already full of socialists? Or wait, maybe I'm thinking of the NEA, or maybe both....why the need for an EO?

reply to post by RealSpoke

which posts am i ignoring ??
did i miss a page or something ??
odd, you still haven't answered many of my questions, what's with the whine now?

which state educated you?
[primary not secondary]
why are you afraid to consider or even acknowledge the "other" side of the story ??

weren't you taught there are 3 sides to every story ?
what other 2 sides have you considered/contemplated ?

white supremacy had been actively practiced since before and after Reconstruction, it didn't begin a decade later (ie Virginia that you quoted)

You just keep repeating the same things without realizing that what you are saying is historically inaccurate

yes, you do ... wiki just doesn't qualify as a "historical" anything.

I'm sorry I don't buy the race card one bit. Hardly anyone under the age of 40 has ever experinced racism to the extent before the civil rights movement. I'm 34 and grew up with black, white, asians and hispaincs in my class and we were all treated the same. Every resturant I went to everyone was treated the same, all the churches I went to we were all threated the same. Everywhere I went we were treated the same and no one was given special treatment until it came time to graduate high school. When I went to my finanical aid adviser she informed me that my parents made to much money and there was no scholorship program for a white male B student. My parents were not rich my dad was a postman and my mom was a teacher, and I had a special needs sister who recieved no handout whatsoever and the majority of my parents resources went to helping her. So I had to work two jobs and take out loans to get through college. Yet, I read that over a billion dollars in scholarship money goes unused in the black and hispanic scholarship funds.

Everyday I see black/hispanic teachers, lawyers, doctors, businessman, CEO's, judges, state and federal congressman, senators, high positions in the excutitve branch, generals in the military and even the President of the United States. No race is keeping any other race from being successful, yet all I ever hear is how bad the african american community has it and needs additional help and handouts. Everyday they are allowed to speak their mind without an ounce of guilt or backlash from the community, while I must always walk on eggshells and make sure everyone is happy and give up more and more of my tax dollars to help special interest groups and races. Like I said I was born after the civil rights movement, long after slavery, and have seen every color and race reach to the top of every profession and financial class.No more excuses.

And unfortunately it is starting. The race war is being forced upon us, and most people don't even realize it.

Things like this will cause not only more resentment between blacks and all other races but eventually it will lead to an open war of the races.

Racist movements like the new Black Panthers will acquire more members and it won take much for all this resentment to explode and become more physical attacks beetwen people of different races.

When the time is right Obama, or whomever is in office will call Marshall Law and claim that "we need help from outside sources like the UN to deal with the violence." The countries that would give the most manpower would be Russia, China, and their allies, and voila; there you have it. A full invasion of the U.S.A., meanwhile ushering the troublesome Americans into interment/fema camps for not supporting the policies of Obama, or whomever else is in office, even if they are white, Chinese, Hispanic, any other race in beewent including blacks.

To everyone going on and on about how bad their European ancestors had it: I don't care how you look at it, no matter how long and how often your European ancestors had to go through the fire, survive Potato Famines and whatever NONE OF THEM WERE BROUGHT TO AMERICA IN CHAINS! None of them were chained and bound at the bottom of a cargo hull for three months on the Atlantic, given little to eat, if anything out the the proper diet, raped, maimed, and/or killed and treated like worthless chattel. More importantly, not a single one of your European ancestors lost their CULTURE, LANGUAGE, RELIGION, and WAY OF LIFE. They CHOSE to come to this country. Even the indentured servants that came here were treated like HUMAN BEINGS. Do not DARE compare the ancestral experiences because there is no comparison. Africans were brought here to do European's bidding PLAIN AND SIMPLE and by the time the slaves came to American en masse the system of chattel slavery had been perfected that complete cut off the United States slaves from CULTURE, LANGUAGE, RELIGION, TRIBE AFFILIATION, and overall WAY OF LIFE.

The United States slaves were the only slaves in the African Diaspora who did NOT self-free themselves in a revolt. The slaves here were "given" their freedom in order to capture a cheap work force for the budding industrialist north. The Civil War had nothing to do with slavery; the North knew it could not expect white workers to work in the factory conditions that were inhumane. The North also knew it needed to break the wealth of the South to go uncontested with a different labor export that could thrive without the necessary need or expense of maintaining hundreds of slaves since Northern industrialization did NOT rely on a plantation system. The slaves were tricked into fighting for the North, believing they would be given equality and their freedom and instead inherited the right to take care of themselves independently of a slave system but now with the added bonus of racism. They truly were this country's first cheap labor pool. When Lincoln freed the slaves, he did it with provisions. He had no intentions of breaking the slave system and modified it to appease his southern constituents. Such clauses as 3/5ths of a human being come to mind, as well as slaves falling in a never ending slave system constantly owing their master for working their land, but never quite right getting ahead. Slaves couldn't read or write, nor challenge a white man. It's slavery by another name. As the Northern industrial system grew southward, the prison system sprung up all over the south and rich white men made their fortunes wrongfully keeping blacks in jail on trumped up charges because they were free workers. This cycle continues to this day as the prison industrial complex makes a heap of money from predominantly black slaves hitched on the work detail that you commonly know as the chain gang. Watch the documentary on PBS's website called Slavery By Another Name for more details.

Black people in the U.S. have been the source of a lot of medical testing against their knowledge of will. I'm not going into it but pick up Medical Apartheid by Harriet Washington to find out about this government willingly torturing black people for different medical procedures without their consent. Tuskeegee Experiement is the most known one but there are thousands more, including, but not limited to the woman who's cells actually could regrow and the white doctors intentionally let her cancer grow and ultimately die so they could harvest her. Read the book, it starts back from the establishment of the colonies to present.

Originally posted by RealSpoke
reply to post by Honor93

 

*snip*

ps: regarding that other topic, are you even aware that in 2 northern states (NY, MD), around 1860, there were more slaves (not indentured servants) than existed in 4 sourthern states ??

I already addressed that. The thread you linked was revisionist history by people that repeat talking points and never read anything. You don't even read my posts but yet reply to them. I doubt they've even read the state decelerations of secessions. The quote is from an elite cohort that mingled with the southern powers that be... why would anyone care what that guy had to say? It'd be like trusting Obama's words about the Libya mission.
*snip*

"Revisionist history" is the stuff you were probably taught in school. Recommend checking out the local used book stores in your area (based on your stated age), or even thrift stores, and looking for some older textbooks, and older history books. As for wikipedia, that is a very unreliable source for anything. You might get lucky and get factual data, but the problem is that ANYONE can, at ANY time, edit those pages. I have personally seen pages change, in the last few years, with lots of good data removed, and ambiguous to false data added in. You can start there, but I would strongly suggest looking at other sources to verify anything you find, especially if it relates to any controversial topic.

As for secession, well, it isn't as simple as you were probably taught. States rights were a far larger issue, and in fact, slavery came in as something to motivate people, not because the government really cared about the issue. They used it as a tool, to get people fired up, and to discourage other countries from aiding the South in breaking blockades. Yes, slavery was wrong (here, as in every other place throughout history that it was practiced), but it was by no means the foundation of the country. Nor is it a reason for people today, close to half a century after the Civil Rights movement, to refuse to try and make their lives better, or take any responsibility for their own actions.

By the way, just for added interest, I was IN the South in the 60's (well, some of them), and the people that we knew thought all the rioting and whatnot was plain stupid. I can remember my parents sitting in the yard chatting with neighbors (of different skin tones) about how crazy people were acting in some places. Yes, the South. We simply didn't care. The ONLY racism I saw was, as I mentioned before, in the schools, after all of the stupid "bussing". None of us were well off, or even really "middle class". My mother's family was seriously, and literally, dirt poor. They didn't blame anyone. Didn't go around attacking each other, either. Poor doesn't have to mean criminal. It can, for ANY etnic or cultural group, but that is a matter of learning.

The problem now, as the OP stated, is that we have a president that is actually feeding the fires of racial strife. At every single opportunity, he makes things worse. Condemning police for arresting a man that was hostile, claiming a teen that was shot, for attacking someone, would be like "his son", telling the "Justice" Dept. not to prosecute the NBPP and other such groups, various comments he made during the election, and now this racist legislation. The man isn't helping anyone. He's trying to divide the nation, and doing a good job, sad to say.

What is your opinion on his actions?

Originally posted by Vitruvian
America for the first time in its slavery ridden history finally has to face up to what she has done. What you are witnessing today is the legacy of slavery and its coming time to acknowledge that the "Piper must be paid" and paying the piper is exactly what is happening. The American people ELECTED Obama so that this could come about because a WHITE government would never have accomplished it and the American voting public was well aware of that fact.

The legacy of slavery is very broad and very deep............its still within the psyche of American blacks to this very day, but more importantly its still within the psyche of American whites. This is a major reason why black Americans ‘seem to be’ so "unfortunate" or make up the major portion of the under class culture in America. Just look around in your cities and you will see the major aspects of SLAVERY manifesting itself everywhere - in crime - in poor housing - poor education and the list goes on and on...........and the WHITES are directly responsible because THEY THEMSELVES have also inherited the evil legacy of SLAVERY.............Its PAYBACK TIME like it or not.

I am white BTW and I am willing to face the responsibility for what has happened in America because of my inheritance – so its about time I faced up to that awful reality………..so might the rest of you smug whites.

edit on 28-7-2012 by Vitruvian because: editing

Two wrongs don't make a right.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
And unfortunately it is starting. The race war is being forced upon us, and most people don't even realize it.

Things like this will cause not only more resentment between blacks and all other races but eventually it will lead to an open war of the races.

Racist movements like the new Black Panthers will acquire more members and it won take much for all this resentment to explode and become more physical attacks between people of different races.

When the time is right Obama, or whomever is in office will call Marshall Law and claim that "we need help from outside sources like the UN to deal with the violence." The countries that would give the most manpower would be Russia, China, and their allies, and voila; there you have it. A full invasion of the U.S.A., meanwhile ushering the troublesome Americans into interment/fema camps for not supporting the policies of Obama, or whomever else is in office, even if they are white, Chinese, Hispanic, any other race in between including blacks.

...and that is what this is all really about! People (some) were saying this back in 2008 and a bit before. There are many other ways he's making ready for this. Even some EO about vaccinations, that would allow incarceration, things like that "service" program he wants (mandatory for youths), etc.

Have to correct one minor point, though. Not "starting", but "started". Look at all of the attacks (more every day) by one race against others, and all of the so-called "flash mobs" (that seem to share one common denominator), and how such things are treated. One side is already at war.

Let me amend that - "one side" means SOME, by no means all, that fall into that group. Many do NOT want such things happening, and are as appalled as everyone else. Unfortunately, there isn't a lot they can do to stop it, when the powers that be won't act (and in fact encourage).

reply to post by PaladinRoden
and who says any of us posting (besides RealSpoke) is under age 40 ??
are you really believing that none of us could have experienced the riots of the 60s or the march of MLK ?? (first hand)

yes, at your age, you and my daughter probably experienced similar civil response, however, you cannot remember "hate crimes" as a child, can you?

you cannot remember what it was like to cross the street so you didn't endure a confrontation, do you?

you cannot reflect on times that you never experienced, can you?
yet, some youngins think they know so much.

and you nailed it right here ...

Everyday I see black/hispanic teachers, lawyers, doctors, businessman, CEO's, judges, state and federal congressman, senators, high positions in the excutitve branch, generals in the military and even the President of the United States. No race is keeping any other race from being successful, yet all I ever hear is how bad the african american community has it and needs additional help and handouts.

yes, change is needed but not like this EO is written to be.
i agree ... no more excuses would be great !!!
now, who is gonna convince our illustrious leader of same ??