The UFO Debunkery of Major Hector Quintanilla.

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posted on Jul, 27 2012 @ 05:37 PM
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"During Air Force Major Hector Quintanilla's tenure as Blue Book's director, the flag of the utter nonsense school was flying at its highest on the mast".

Dr J Allen Hynek, Chief Scientific Consultant for Air Force Investigations of UFOs from 1948 until 1969



For folks who haven't heard of him before, Major Hector Quintanilla was a pretty infamous chap in the history of UFO research and was the longest running Chief of Project Bluebook UFO investigations for the U.S. Government from 1963 until its closure in 1969.

As Chief Scientific Advisor Dr J. Allen Hynek mentions in the statement above, Major Quintanilla's debunking antics didn't really have the best reputation for objective analysis and it's said he received a lot of criticism for his non-scientific, non-investigative approach to explaining specific UFO cases (basically he just made them up).




The Major Quintanilla era:






Major Hector Quintanilla took over as Blue Book's leader in August 1963. He largely continued the debunking efforts, and it was under his direction that Blue Book received some of its sharpest criticism. UFO researcher Jerome Clark goes so far as to write that, by this time, Blue Book had "lost all credibility."

Physicist and UFO researcher Dr. James E. McDonald once flatly declared that Quintanilla was "not competent" from either a scientific or an investigative perspective. However, McDonald also stressed that Quintanilla "shouldn't be held accountable for it", as he was chosen for his position by a superior officer, and was following orders in directing Blue Book.

Blue Book’s explanations of UFO reports were not universally accepted, however, and critics — including some scientists — suggested that Project Blue Book was engaged in questionable research or, worse, perpetrating cover up. This criticism grew especially strong and widespread in the 1960s.




Dr Hynek:


He held Quintanilla in especially low regard: "Quintanilla's method was simple: disregard any evidence that was counter to his hypothesis." Hynek wrote that during Air Force Major Hector Quintanilla's tenure as Blue Book's director, “the flag of the utter nonsense school was flying at its highest on the mast.” Hynek reported that Sergeant David Moody, one of Quintanilla’s subordinates, “epitomized the conviction-before-trial method. Anything that he didn’t understand or didn’t like was immediately put into the psychological category, which meant ‘crackpot’.”


link



Major Quintanilla reported to Colonel Eric de Jonckheere who in turn reported to Brigadier General Cruikshank and it was suspected by many (including atmospherical physicist Dr James E. Mcdonald) that he was under direct orders from his superiors to actively 'debunk' UFO cases with contrived 'force fit' explanations thereby reducing the number of 'hot reports' and statistical unknowns.

Whether that's true or not, he did write a book on the UFO subject called 'UFOs, An Air Force Dilemma' and it's available on free pdf format here -there's also a relevant newspaper article below from 1965 in which the Major reassures the American public that no UFO incidents have ever been 'a threat to our national security or beyond the range of present day scientific knowledge or ET':




Flying Saucers? Absolutely Not,

Says Chief Air Force Investigator”,

29 August 1965 (St. Joseph News-Press, Missouri)

Newspaper Article



The Major's TV appearances were pretty rare but he does pop up in 3 videos I could find -in this first one he once again reassures the U.S. public that 'the Air Force is not hiding any information on UFOs; in the second one found below he discusses Michigan's infamous 'Swamp Gas' case and in the third one found in Orkojoker's thread here he talks about the examination of Joe Simonton's pancakes.




See 39:00

edit on 18-4-2013 by karl 12 because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 27 2012 @ 05:39 PM
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Examining the Debunks.


From 1963 until 1969 there were some pretty remarkable UFO incidents in the United States and considering this is a thread about the Chief of Government UFO investigations during that time I thought it might be a good idea to look at some of the official 'explanations' put forward by Major Hector Quintanilla and his team - there are also some relevant (and pretty damning) statements made here from Dr Hynek about the group's active agenda and lack of objectivity.



1: The Portage County Incident:


Multiple Police Officers chase apparently structured, low level UFO that was '50 feet across and 15 to 20 feet high with a large dome on its top and an antenna jutted out from the rear of the dome' over 85 miles from Ohio to Pennslyvania - the object was witnessed by 'hundreds' of town residents and Police Officers reported it to be moving to side to side about 50 feet above the road before it shot straight up into the sky.


Quintanilla / Bluebook Debunkery:


The investigation by Major Quintanilla actually consisted in a two minutes and a half phone call to the sole Dale Spaur, starting with this question: "tell me about this mirage you saw." Then a second one minute and a half phone was passed again only to Dale Spaur. According to a written and signed testimony by Spaur, Quintanilla wanted him to sign a text specifying that the sighting lasted only a few minutes. When Spaur protested that it was at least a 60 miles car chase covering two states, Quintanilla put an end to the conversation. It required Congressional pressures to have Quintanilla make his way to Ravenna to meet and interview Spaur and Neff. This time, Weitzel was there because Spaur asked him to tape his interview with Quintanilla. A partial transcription of the tape reproduced in Dr. J. Allen Hynek's first book "The UFO Experience," is very telling of the ways and manner of Quintanilla when he interrogated UFO witnesses.

Police chief Gerald Buchert was on duty in Mantua when he heard over his radio that strange lights were headed east in his direction. He raced home for his camera, and with his wife at his side, took a single photograph of the object glowing in the sky. Buchert quickly developed his film and contacted the FBI, who referred him to Wright-Patterson Air Force Base. Major Hector Quintanilla, head of the UFO debunking Project Blue Book, asked Buchert to send the negatives to him. Later, Quintanilla issued a press release stating that his film was “severely fogged” and claimed that the UFO was a processing defect. He went on to say that the officers involved had chased the planet Venus.



Explanation:

The Planet Venus.


Thread

*Above BlueBook* - Ohio UFO Chase , Portage County April 17, 1966







2: The Minot Air Force Base Incident:


Multiple separately located U.S. Military personnel witness low level UFO over the ICBM missile fields surrounding Minot Air Force Base, the crew of a B-52 aircraft flying overhead also witness the object which the pilot described as 'a minimum of 200 feet in diameter and hundreds of feet long with a metallic cylinder attached to another section that was shaped like a crescent moon' - the UFO was confirmed on ground and air radar and proceeded to fly in formation along the same heading as the B-52 whilst exhibiting electromagnetic interference effects on the aircraft's transmitters.


Quintanilla / Bluebook Debunkery:


Quintanilla completed his evaluation and forwarded the Minot UFO case report to SAC. The final report consists of a one-page letter providing his conclusions in the form of multiple-choice possibilities, and eleven pages of attachments cobbled together supporting the conclusions:

"The ground visual sightings appear to be of the star Sirius and the B-52 which was flying in the area. The B-52 radar contact and the temporary loss of UHF transmission could be attributed to a plasma similar to ball lightning".



Explanation:

Stars.


Thread:

The Minot AFB B-52 UFO Incident
edit on 18-4-2013 by karl 12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 27 2012 @ 05:40 PM
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3: The Red Bluff Incident:


During a six day period of UFO sightings in northern California involving dozens of town residents and at least 14 police officers, two policemen witness a low level, highly maneuverable, oblong shaped object with two definite red lights at each end - the UFO shone red beams of light down towards the officers and performed 'aerial feats that were actually unbelievable', they also reported they experienced strong radio interference each time the unknown object came towards them (the object was also witnessed by two other policemen and a town jailer).


Quintanilla / Bluebook Debunkery:


The Bluebook explanation that came out after a few days attributed this very detailed, close range sighting of a large object, seen by two experienced officers to "refraction of the planet Mars and the two bright stars Aldebaran and Betelgeuse".
NICAP referred the question to one of their astronomical advisors, who found that none of these three celestial objects were even in the California skies at that time. Bluebook then changed the explanation to read Mars and Capella. Capella, the only one of those celestial bodies that was even in the sky at 2300, was nowhere near the location of the sighted object, and could not, of course, give the impression of the various movements clearly described by the officers.



Explanation:

Planets and stars.


Thread:

Red Bluff Incident, 1960 - Police nearly shoot at UFO







4: The Edwards Air Force Base Incident:


Several unknown objects described as having 'flashing red lights on the bottom and green, glowing lights on top' are witnessed by several U.S. Military personnel performing highly unusual flight characteristics over the restricted airspace of Edwards Air Force base - the UFOs were verified by five independent radar installations and the pilot of an F106 fighter jet sent up to intercept the objects stated one UFO gained a 'tremendous amount of altitude' and 'appeared to move right out into space'.


Quintanilla / Bluebook Debunkery:


1. Astro: Star / Planet
2. Balloon
3. Returns Due to meteorological condition



Explanation:

Stars and Planets and Balloons.


Thread:

UFOs Over Edwards Air Force Base





Miscellaneous:


Texas, 1965:


Bright blue UFO confirmed and tracked on radar from Oklahoma witnessed (and photographed) hovering at about 45 degrees elevation over Highway 82 in Sherman, Texas - unknown object also seen by Police officer 30 miles to the North and Civil Servant 7 miles to the South.


Quintanilla / Bluebook Debunkery:


The objects observed may have been the planet Jupiter or the stars Rigel, Capella, Betelguese or Aldebaran which were visible at the time of the reported sightings.


History of the United States Air Force UFO Programs




Illinois, 1963:


Two motorists witness a big, white object 'about the size of a washtub' moving along at treetop level (about 20-degrees above the horizon to the southwest) near Wayne City, Illinois - the UFO then paces their vehicle for several miles zig-zagging over the road before hovering over the car and causing electromagnetic interference effects on the radio and engine.


Quintanilla / Bluebook Debunkery:


The AF, and especially Quintanilla, were ridiculing many witnesses who claimed sightings of UFOs. The "explanation" issued after the investigation was "a refueling operation" or the "planet Venus". The AF must have considered this case important. They had flown in the special team of physicists from Wright-Patterson AFB, Dayton, Ohio. Normally, when investigating a case, they would send the local "UFO officer" from the nearest airbase


1963, The Wayne City, Illinois Car Chase
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posted on Jul, 27 2012 @ 05:41 PM
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I'm sure there'll be quite a few other examples out there of highly dubious USAF UFO debunkery but if anyone's got any opinions about Major Quintanilla's antics or the UFO cases mentioned (or explanations) then please post away - there's also a pretty controversial statement in the paragraph below which mentions that Project Bluebook was shut down after Major Quintanilla's tenure because it 'could not be justified either on the grounds of national security or in the interest of science'..






1963 would see another head of Blue Book, Major Hector Quintanilla, who for the most part, assumed the role of debunker. Many critics claimed that by this time, Blue Book had little, if any, credibility left.

Finally, Secretary of the Air Force Robert C. Seamans, Jr. announced that Blue Book would be closed, because further funding "cannot be justified either on the grounds of national security or in the interest of science."

The last publicly acknowledged day of Blue Book operations was December 17, 1969, but officially it closed on January 30, 1970.

Almost without exception, the Blue Book legacy is one of disregard of sighting facts and downright debunking cases of high credibility. Today, the United States government does not investigate UFOs. At least not officially.

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..and in its 'USAF Factsheet on UFOs' the U.S. Government also now claims that 'no government agency has ever taken an interest in UFOs since the closure of Project Bluebook' so it's all a bit of a paradox because there are quite a number of their own official documents found here which completely contradict that 'fact'.


Links:

A Puzzling Radar Incident - An Interview With A Man That Knew Quintanilla

The Closing of Project Blue Book
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posted on Jul, 27 2012 @ 07:02 PM
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Yet another top-notch thread, my friend. I think this subject would benefit from a well-made feature-length documentary dedicated specifically to calling out the U.S. Air Force on it's misleading and irresponsible stance on UFOs. We could also use a modern day Donald Keyhoe - someone with the ability to get on mainstream prime time television and lay it all out there in front of millions of people, forcing the Air Force to either respond to him or to look ridiculous in their lack of response.
edit on 27-7-2012 by Orkojoker because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 27 2012 @ 08:35 PM
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I think it needs to be pointed out that Blue Book was designed to be a debunking outfit, coming on the heels of the original investigation, Project Sign and its quick to follow and debunking vehicle, Project Grudge. The original Blue Book head was Capt. Edward J. Ruppelt. If you happen to read his classic book, The Report On Unidentified Flying Objects you can easily see how his hands were tied by outside influences to his investigations. He says at one point that investigators were required to take busses to investigate sighting reports.

Few know it, but he was Jewish. His wife later publically complained that he was given that thankless job because he was Jewish. She said he was "heartbroken." It was a deadend job that no one would want. Was she simply claiming racism or was there something too that? Guess what ethnicity is Quintanilla. There is your answer for the people chosen for the job. Q. seems to have carried out his mandate with a passion. Officially chosen as debunkers both men did their duty as the country (their superiors) demanded. You really can't blame them.



posted on Jul, 27 2012 @ 09:41 PM
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Another "Pillar of ATS" thread. S&F.

Project Blue Book heads Captain Edward J. Ruppelt and Major Robert J. Friend, Blue Book scientific consultant Dr. J. Allen Hynek, and Blue Book Public Information Officer Colonel William T. Coleman all publicly came out, but not Blue Book head Major Hector Quintanilla. Major Quintanilla’s nemesis Dr James E. McDonald got into the UFO circus because of a personal sighting, and Colonel Coleman was the pilot in a multiple-witness sighting in 1955 but kept quiet about it until directly asked in 1978. But Major Quintanilla followed orders until the end, whether he believed in them or not.



posted on Jul, 28 2012 @ 04:47 AM
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reply to post by karl 12
 
HQ was certainly an interesting character - a blockhead in many ways. All too often we see complaints that the USAF operated a cover-up because it 'knew the Truth.' With HQ, it's more obvious that he was a rigid thinker and genuinely thought that saucer-talk was for nuts. Not just nuts, they were bringing negative attention to the USAF through allegations of 'silence groups' and guys from NICAP, like Keyhoe and Hall. pointed public attention right at the USAF.

On top of that, the USAF had to field all these 'nutty' reports and good men were forced to spend time on what he thought was foolishness. The debunking campaign was endorsed by HQ but bit him on his ass too when Hynek made a fool of himself, Blue Book and the USAF with that marsh gas explanation and pissed off a lot of the American public. Before he knew it, HQ's mission to put the UFO-hysteria to bed had backfired and the Press were generating even more attention. Sightings like Lonnie Zamora didn't help him either! Then MacDonald showed up and actively went at HQ.

In a comedy sense, he was like Sideshow Bob stepping on one garden rake after another. He must have hated saucer-heads even more!


There was one thing that all my Commanders; Colonel Raymond S. Sleeper, George R. Weinbrenner, Brig. General Arthur J. Pierce, and Brig. General Arthur W. Cruikshank, had in common and that was “Project Blue Book was a great big pain in the ass”. That quote came from Colonel Sleeper, but the rest of my Commanders felt the same way and said the same thing using different words. The Project was a drain on space, money, engineering, talent, clerical help, and it subjected the organization to unwanted publicity. Every time a reporte4r
came to visit me, my Commanders would cringe for fear that my remarks would bring the organization unwanted publicity.
p101 of HQ's draft


Hynek annoyed the crap out of HQ for being a civilian hanging around. As much as he was happy for Hynek to be BSing about refractions, mirages and refueling aircraft he didn't like the way he spent time just chatting with his men. When Hynek 'did the dirty' and changed sides, HQ was given more reason to detest the UFO-nuts. He wrote about him claiming to be a 'USAF Consultant' and argued that he was dishonest as he was only a consultant to Blue Book. Hair-splitting?

My own view is slightly unpopular: For all the efforts of one side or the other to stick a pin in the UFO and disc-sightings...nobody did. Neither side have proven one thing or another and if the UFOs had the momentum and presence to break through into public acceptance they stopped short. So chances are, if the UFO researchers/organisations had succeeded and Grudge/Blue Book/Colorado all said 'Yes! Structured craft,' we'd be having a different discussion, but still talking about intangibles. Whatever constituted the UFO Waves of that period, it wasn't dependent on official, public acknowledgment. We could argue about intent and display all day long, but maybe the UFOs just don't give a ....



posted on Jul, 28 2012 @ 04:43 PM
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Originally posted by Orkojoker

I think this subject would benefit from a well-made feature-length documentary dedicated specifically to calling out the U.S. Air Force on it's misleading and irresponsible stance on UFOs.


That would definitely be an interesting documentary to watch mate because many USAF UFO explanations are complete bullsh#t and show utter contempt for the scientific method or any kind of intellectual honesty.

Some of UFO cases mentioned in the links are truly intriguing and when writing the summary for the Edwards Air Force Base Incident I forgot just how compelling the case actually was - especially when the radar operators direct the pilot towards the objects and he describes one UFO as 'gaining a tremendous amount of altitude' and 'moving right out into space'.

Francis Ridge also makes some interesting comments about the case below and describes how the incident is classified as an 'S5P5' - 'S5' because the objects were highly strange and suggest intelligent guidance and 'P5' because the case is highly credible and leaves almost no doubt - he also mentions that out of the 13,000 reports 'investigated' by Bluebook, over 800 are in need of serious reappraisal.





Cheers.
edit on 25-9-2012 by karl 12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 28 2012 @ 06:09 PM
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reply to post by Aliensun
 


Aliensun, thanks for the reply -can't really say I've ever heard of the 'religious persecution' angle before but I have read Captain Ruppelt's book and going by some of his public statements over the years I'd say he was far more objective, open minded and informed than Quintanilla ever was.

It does mention in the paragraph below that Quintanilla took the Bluebook position due to his reluctance to get involved with the Vietnam war - Kevin Randle also brings the subject up in his commentary about Quintanilla's book although I don't know the theological opinion of the other heads of Bluebook like Captain Hardin, Captain Gregory and Major Friend.




He was selected to be the next Project Blue Book Officer by Colonel Eric T de Jonckheere, who explained to Quintanilla that he was looking to fill the position with a man with a degree in physics, with maturity, drive, and a man who was cool under pressure. Quintanilla shook his head and felt he only met the degree requirement. Col Joncheere told Quintanilla to take the job for a few weeks and report to him.Quintanilla felt he was offered the job due to his reluctance to take several other job offers in the escalating Vietnam War.


link



Quintanilla And UFOs


I looked up Quintanilla's manuscript on the NIDS website and was somewhat surprised at the venom that dripped from many of the pages. Now I admit to being biased here... I believe that some UFOs represent sightings of alien craft, so I might have read things into this manuscript that weren't there, but it seemed to me that the purpose was to attack "self-styled" UFO investigators (though he named few names), attack the UFO "hobby clubs" (though he only mentioned NICAP in the negative light and the single reference to APRO was surprisingly positive), and to go after scientists who seemed to disagree with him (namely Hynek and McDonald)..

It looked to me as if Quintanilla (Quint or Q but not Hector) approached his assignment from the point of view that there is nothing to UFOs therefore there is nothing to UFOs. He was interested in solving the cases and didn't care if those solutions fit the facts... I think here of the Minot AFB sightings of 1968 which he did not discuss, but had labeled as B-52s (unrecognizable by members of SAC) and ionized air that, I guess, he believed glowed so that it would account for some sightings and was responsible for both the degradation of an aircraft's radios and the object 'seen' by radar.

Anyway, the manuscript provided a look at Blue Book in its last years but does not explain why Q was left in that assignment for so long, how he avoided service in Vietnam, and why he retired once Blue Book was ended... And oh, I certainly enjoyed how he had to fight everyday in school because he didn't speak English so the Texans didn't like him but he didn't speak Spanish the way Mexicans did so they didn't like him. In other words, I didn't buy the 'poor little me' routine, but "I overcame all that to be an Air Force officer."

link


Cheers.
edit on 17-4-2013 by karl 12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2012 @ 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by Kandinsky

The debunking campaign was endorsed by HQ but bit him on his ass too when Hynek made a fool of himself, Blue Book and the USAF with that marsh gas explanation and pissed off a lot of the American public. Before he knew it, HQ's mission to put the UFO-hysteria to bed had backfired and the Press were generating even more attention. Sightings like Lonnie Zamora didn't help him either! Then MacDonald showed up and actively went at HQ.

In a comedy sense, he was like Sideshow Bob stepping on one garden rake after another. He must have hated saucer-heads even more!


Thanks for the post mate and that was a great read
- did see your relevant post in the Michigan 'swamp gas' thread quoting from the pages of 'Forbidden Science' and can well believe Jacques Vallee's claims that Major Quintanilla 'didn't give a damn':





- also found it interesting that according to Sheriff Doug Harvey, Dr Hynek was at a 'complete loss' to explain the sightings but then received a mysterious telephone call from Washington which prompted him to use the 'swamp gas' debunk:



Harvey said, "it was a call for Hynek and it was from Washington."

"How did you know it was from Washington," I replied.

"Because the dispatcher stepped into the office and said, 'Dr. Hynek, you've got a call from Washington.'"

Harvey told me that Hynek stepped out of the office to take the call and then returned in a few minutes looking a bit perplexed. And then, according to the sheriff, Hynek said, "it's swamp gas they saw, swamp gas."

link



To be fair to Dr Hynek, it seems he did make more than one attempt to improve the 'scientific methodology' of Bluebook's methods during Major Quintanilla's tenure (and easy access through the computerization of files) ...but was completely turned down:




"A proposal for elementary computerization of the data in the Blue Book files, devised by Jacques Vallee and myself and submitted by me directly to Major Quintanilla at Blue Book, was summarily turned down".


link



Scientific criticism:



Severe Scientific criticism of Project Bluebook - suggested changes in protocol completely ignored:

In September 1968, Hynek received a letter from Colonel Raymond Sleeper of the Foreign Technology Division. Sleeper noted that Hynek had publicly accused Blue Book of shoddy science, and further asked Hynek to offer advice on how Blue Book could improve its scientific methodology.

Hynek was to later declare that Sleeper's letter was "the first time in my 20 year association with the air force as scientific consultant that I had been officially asked for criticism and advice regarding the UFO problem."

Hynek wrote a detailed response, dated October 7, 1968, suggesting several areas where Blue Book could improve. In part, he wrote:



A.... neither of the two missions of Blue Book [determining if UFOs are a threat to national security and using scientific data gathered by Blue Book] are being adequately executed.

B.The staff of Blue Book, both in numbers and in scientific training, is grossly inadequate...

C.Blue Book suffers … in that it is a closed system ... there is virtually no scientific dialogue between Blue Book and the outside scientific world...

D.The statistical methods employed by Blue Book are nothing less than a travesty.

E.There has been a lack of attention to significant UFO cases ... and too much time spent on routine cases ... and on peripheral public relations tasks. Concentration could be on two or three potentially scientific significant cases per month [instead of being] spread thin over 40 to 70 cases per month.

F.The information input to Blue Book is grossly inadequate. An impossible load is placed on Blue Book by the almost consistent failure of UFO officers at local air bases to transmit adequate information...

G.The basic attitude and approach within Blue Book is illogical and unscientific...

H.Inadequate use had been made of the Project scientific consultant [Hynek himself]. Only cases that the project monitor deems worthwhile are brought to his attention. His scope of operation ... has been consistently thwarted ... He often learns of interesting cases only a month or two after the receipt of the report at Blue Book.



Despite Sleeper's request for criticism, none of Hynek's commentary resulted in any substantial changes in Blue Book.

link



It mentions in this newspaper article that although 1966 was a big year for UFO reports, Major Quintanilla states that 'all but 16 have been accounted for by conventional explanations' so perhaps massaging the figures was all he was bothered about?



posted on Aug, 3 2012 @ 06:01 PM
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Originally posted by xpoq47

..but Major Quintanilla followed orders until the end, whether he believed in them or not.


Xpoq47, thanks for the post mate and I'm sure the good Major followed his orders through the chains of command from De Jonckheere through to Cruikshank without question - still haven't found out who General Cruikshank worked for yet though.


It seems Quintanilla may well have attempted to discourage objective interest in the UFO subject and even wrote a 'blazing' letter to the Rand Corporation in response to their internal document 'UFOs: What to Do?' (letter now at CUFOS) -he was also quite bitter about ex-US President Gerald Ford's efforts to realize open congressional hearings on the UFO subject as a result of the 'hundreds' of UFO sightings in Michigan 1966:






"In the firm belief that the American public deserves a better explanation than that thus far given by the Air Force, I strongly recommend that there be a committee investigation of the UFO phenomena. I think we owe it to the people to establish credibility regarding UFOs and to produce the greatest possible enlightenment of the subject."

U.S. Senator Gerald Ford


link



He did pen this article in late 1966 though -it states at the link it was taken from the (formerly classified) CIA publication entitled "Studies in Intelligence" and is quite surprising in its content as he openly discusses historical UFO sightings:



'History and methodology of flying saucer intelligence'




There's also this synopsis penned by Quintanilla about the Zamora case (from the same CIA publication) that doesn't really fit with his image as pathological debunker who 'disregarded any evidence that was counter to his hypothesis' - maybe the Major had dual attitudes towards the subject?






"There is no doubt that Lonnie Zamora saw an object which left quite an impression on him. There is also no question about Zamora"s reliability. He is a serious police officer, a pillar of his church, and a man well versed in recognizing airborne vehicles in his area. He is puzzled by what he saw, and frankly, so are we. This is the best-documented case on record, and still we have been unable, in spite of thorough investigation, to find the vehicle or other stimulus that scared Zamora to the point of panic."


link


Cheers.
edit on 02/10/08 by karl 12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 18 2012 @ 05:13 PM
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Full statement in context taken from Dr Hynek's 'flag of the utter nonsense school' comment - it seems there are even claims that Major Quintanilla and his subordinate Sgt Moody went back through the old Bluebook files and 're-edited' many of the evaluations..



"When Major Quintanilla came in, the flag of the utter nonsense school was flying at its highest on the mast. Now he had a certain Sgt. Moody assisting him...Moody epitomized the conviction-before-trial method. Anything that he didn't understand or didn't like was immediately put into the psychological category, which meant "crackpot." He would not ever say that the person who reported a case was a fairly respectable person, maybe we should look into it, or maybe we should find out. He was also the master of the possible: possible balloon, possible aircraft, possible birds, which then became, by his own hand (and I argued with him violently at times), the probable; he said, well, we have no category "possible" aircraft. It is therefore either unidentified or aircraft. Well, it is more likely aircraft; therefore it is aircraft.... An "unidentified" to Moody was not a challenge for further research. To have it remain unidentified was a blot... and he did everything to remove it. He went back to cases from Captain Gregory's days and way back in Ruppelt's days and redid the files. A lot that were unidentified in those days he "identified" years and years later".

Dr J Allen Hynek, Chairman of the Department of Astronomy at Northwestern University and scientific consultant for Air Force investigations of UFOs from 1948 until 1969 (Projects Sign, Grudge and Blue Book



Do any 'objective' sceptics or debunkers here on ATS think this approach is in any way acceptable for supposedly impartial Government investigation into the UFO subject?

Dr Hynek's attempts to improve the 'scientific methodology' of Bluebook's methods during Quintanilla's tenure were also flatly refused - surely this should have been applauded and implemented straight away?



posted on Aug, 27 2012 @ 11:25 PM
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Ironic end for Major Hector Quintanilla who lived long enough to see his son Karl become a 'UFO Believer':




..'The Cleveland Scene' article also reports that Major Hector Quintanilla was focusing on golf after retirement from the Air Force, until a golf cart accident resulted in head injuries from which he never recovered, and he died in 1997. He lived long enough to see his son become a 'UFO Believer' who worked as a staff member on the production of several television UFO documentaries.


Link (pdf)



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 11:04 AM
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Dr Willy Smith describes in his book 'On Pilots and UFOs' how Major Quintanilla's team went back and substituted official summary cards for unexplained Bluebook cases 'to reduce the number of unknowns at any cost'

Free Download: "On Pilots and UFOs” by Dr Willy Smith

Chapter 5: Anchorage, Alaska, 16 February 1953


edit on 25-9-2012 by karl 12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2012 @ 06:53 AM
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Hector starts smoking again - the Lonnie Zamora case:


Hector Quintanilla wrote a memoir about his experiences as the UFO officer for the Air Force. It is an interesting document, in which it becomes clear that his time at Project Blue Book was not a good one. He seems to have detested many people, including Dr. J. Allen Hynek and he believed that no UFOs were the result of alien visitation.

Hector Quintanilla and The Socorro UFO



posted on Oct, 27 2012 @ 02:46 PM
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Originally posted by karl 12
Hector starts smoking again - the Lonnie Zamora case:


Hector Quintanilla wrote a memoir about his experiences as the UFO officer for the Air Force. It is an interesting document, in which it becomes clear that his time at Project Blue Book was not a good one. He seems to have detested many people, including Dr. J. Allen Hynek and he believed that no UFOs were the result of alien visitation.

Hector Quintanilla and The Socorro UFO



The USAF wanted out of the business of investigating UFO sightings from the public for a long time. They tried to pawn it off on the FBI at one point, but J Edgar Hoover wanted all the best info available in return and that was a dealbreaker. It's surprising Blue Book never pulled the trigger and labeled Socorro as what at least one of their investigators, Sgt David Moody, thought it was . . . a hoax. I'm not sure why they never did and the case became downright legendary.

Regardless, the USAF finally got what they wanted thanks to the Condon Committee.



posted on Oct, 28 2012 @ 09:49 AM
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thanks for the info karl12

according to hynek and vallee, the Air Force officer assigned to BlueBook are more interested in drinking and bar hopping. i think they are under order to debunk anything and maybe these orders make them stressfull inwardly.. no rational man would read all those reports and not intrigued. a real open minded man would act like Hynek, from sceptic to believer.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 12:48 AM
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Originally posted by milomilo

no rational man would read all those reports and not intrigued. a real open minded man would act like Hynek, from sceptic to believer.


Couldn't agree more there mate and he certainly believed the UFO subject needed to be taken seriously, there's a nice clip here where he states about 20 percent of Bluebook cases could not be explained and there's also some articles in this thread about the true nature of USAF unexplained UFO report percentages which make for some interesting reading - it looks like the U.S. Government were busy fudging the stats right through up until Quintanilla's era and a great many official unexplained UFO reports went 'missing' or were sent somewhere other than Project Bluebook.
Cheers.
edit on 15-11-2012 by karl 12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 29 2012 @ 12:14 AM
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Originally posted by karl 12

Originally posted by milomilo

no rational man would read all those reports and not intrigued. a real open minded man would act like Hynek, from sceptic to believer.


Couldn't agree more there mate and he certainly believed the UFO subject needed to be taken seriously, there's a nice clip here where he states about 20 percent of Bluebook cases could not be explained and there's also some articles in this thread about the true nature of USAF unexplained UFO report percentages which make for some interesting reading - it looks like the U.S. Government were busy fudging the stats right through up until Quintanilla's era and a great many official unexplained UFO reports went 'missing' or were sent somewhere other than Project Bluebook.
Cheers.
edit on 15-11-2012 by karl 12 because: (no reason given)


i think USAF and US Goverment are just as blind as ordinary citizen regarding UFO phenomenon. thus they are trying to poohpooh and hide under the carpet all these UFO data they got.

i think USAF are trying to hide UFO Facts because they dont want to admit they are powerless to prevent UFO phenomenon (since they are responsible for US Air Space / Defense)

i think these move by goverment are not the 'Conspiracy' that some people love to talk about. the real motive is more down to earth , that is to hide their own incompetence.

ditto with other world goverments (eg France with all those UFO data from military, still no answer and the military are powerless against the phenomenon)





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