Gay Marriage. I am honestly confused, page 65

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reply posted on 6-9-2012 @ 08:25 PM by Annee

Originally posted by SunnyDee

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by SunnyDee

Same with my marriage, and I'll go one further.....we believe marriage is a personal meaningful thing, a deep commitment. It has more meaning than just a tax break, in fact that never crossed our minds when we decided to marry. Marriage has more meaning than just a religious right of passage.

Do you have a legal marriage.

Did you have the choice to have a legal marriage?

We're on the same side here, annee. I was just pointing out that gays want to get married for the same reasons I did, to show our love and commitment, not just some tax benefits. And that is why they are fighting for gay "marriage" not just a civil union.

OK - - this thread got kind of "befuddled" in places. I gave up trying to make any sense on some of it.

The perplexity is - - - gays have been having "natural marriages" for centuries. Gays who are religious - - have had full on church "joining" ceremonies for centuries as well. Seems the holier-then-thou Heteros are lagging in their spiritual concept of "It's all about Love".

As I see it - - LEGAL marriage is about the complexities of the modern world. No One - - should enter any kind of shared union without a contract IMO. The Equal is about privileges that are only afforded through Legal Government Marriage. And those privileges are quite significant and important in the complexities of the world today.

My first wedding was a big church affair (Presbyterian). I was 20 - - I was in love - - I didn't care about a signed piece of paper. I was going to live off love for the rest of my life. (this was also during the Hippie era).

45 years later - - I'm a lot wiser - - not naive and idealistic.

Thankfully - my ex was a fair and honorable man. But - there are so so many horror stories.

reply posted on 6-9-2012 @ 08:27 PM by kaylaluv

Originally posted by ronnieray123

Its not about religion or politics......

You're right - it's not about religion or politics - it's about homophobia. Religion is just used (or misused) as the rationale.

Bottom line is, it doesn't really matter what you think. Gay marriage will be legal nationwide - it's just a matter of time. You can call it whatever you want, but if two people have a loving, romantic, committed relationship with the option of raising a family together - I call that a marriage.

reply posted on 6-9-2012 @ 09:31 PM by windword

reply to post by ronnieray123

I don't understand why you keep bringing up illness (AIDS), and your charitable generosity as a plea for understanding why you want to deny these people a proper legal status of marriage.

Why are you so offended by this? What's in a name? Would a rose smell any less sweet if it was called "Steve?"

Supposing someone on your immediate circle had a child and named her Mary. But your daughter's name is Mary! Would you ask them to change the name to Margaret, or Marion, or would you be able to understand that there are many people, of all creeds, nations, colors and religions that name their daughter Mary?

And just to point that sticky finger back at you in your face, the Supreme Court will make this ruling, not Mitt Romney.

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 06:52 AM by ronnieray123

Stupid is as stupid does, and there are surely a lot of stupid homos here.
No compromise, that is your homo agenda. This is exactly why people by the thousands bought a chicken sandwich.
We are taking your word whether you like it or not!!!! Instead of just being cool about it and saying WoW if it's that important to you we will just call it something else because we love and respect everyone..........you guys gear up for battle.

Your own worst enemies.....you drive people by the thousands to purchase chicken sandwiches because of your all or nothing attitude.....and then wonder why people are getting tired of it all.

You insist on hammering my point of AIDS, I try to speak in a simple term, something easy to understand,,,,and you dumb homos get all confused by it.
I used to like gays until they started getting all in your face
I used to like blacks until they started getting all in your face
I could go on and on,,,,,but alas you are too stupid to see the message inside the words.
Don't get mad at me because of your ineptness, be mad at yourself

Again I will ask ....If i relent and say to you OK take the word marriage, if it makes you that happy it is all yours......Now I ask for you to do something to make me happy.....keep your gayness at home and out in public just act normal. No more dressing like women, no more cross dressing and going to the mall and all those other things that makes people uncomfortable...would you do that for me??

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 07:25 AM by Darkrunner

A man wanting to marry another man is something so alien to me I can't fathom it. But as I get older, I realize I don't have to.

Live and let live I say. You don't bother me, I don't bother you.

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 07:33 AM by wlasikiewicz

Marriage is marriage, so what if a man wants to marry a man or woman? where is the problem in that, if they are in love then leave them alone and let them be.

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 07:46 AM by ThreeNF

Reply to post by Iron7

I think marriage should be a personal decision or choice. Let's not get the government involved.

Unfortunately, I've been married twice. First one ended amicably. We drafted the papers ourselves. The second divorce was a nightmare. Not going to give details on that.

Couples should exist for as long as they are happy, but don't get the government involved.

Be happy, and if marriage helps with that, then do so.

I'm probably way off topic here , but it doesn't or shouldn't matter who you marry ((but really, couples are better )) same gender, opposite gender, does it matter? If the decision makes them happy then so be it.

Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 09:12 AM by kaylaluv

Originally posted by ronnieray123

Again I will ask ....If i relent and say to you OK take the word marriage, if it makes you that happy it is all yours......Now I ask for you to do something to make me happy.....keep your gayness at home and out in public just act normal. No more dressing like women, no more cross dressing and going to the mall and all those other things that makes people uncomfortable...would you do that for me??

White trash men make me uncomfortable with their mullet hairdos, and their toothless grins, and their sleeveless flannel shirts. White trash women make me uncomfortable with their tube tops and cheap shoes, and rudely smacking their gum. Should we force them to start dressing and acting like professional business people, because that would make me more comfortable? Whadda ya say - is it fair to force all people to dress in khakis and polo shirts from here on out to make you and I comfortable?

Something tells me with a name like Ronnie Ray, you would have to change your clothing to suit me. Are you willing?

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 10:25 AM by ronnieray123

Again, your kind show an all take, no give attitude...and that was all i was interested in finding out.
This is what I believe to be the typical liberal/democrat ideology ...and it has been reinforced.

Even if someone offered the gays what they claim they want so badly they are still unwilling to do anything to appease the other side.

Take take take....................give nothing
Just as bad as the anti abortion people who can't be happy with limits on abortion,,,,that want it GONE

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 10:39 AM by Annee

Originally posted by ronnieray123
Stupid is as stupid does, and there are surely a lot of stupid homos here.

Your homophobia is showing. Why am I not surprised.

No compromise, that is your homo agenda.

There is no compromise in EQUAL.

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 10:45 AM by kaylaluv

Originally posted by ronnieray123
Again, your kind show an all take, no give attitude...and that was all i was interested in finding out.
This is what I believe to be the typical liberal/democrat ideology ...and it has been reinforced.

Even if someone offered the gays what they claim they want so badly they are still unwilling to do anything to appease the other side.

Take take take....................give nothing
Just as bad as the anti abortion people who can't be happy with limits on abortion,,,,that want it GONE

You didn't answer my question. Would you be willing to change your clothing to whatever I wanted it to be? In return, I'll let you keep the word marriage. But you have to wear exactly what I tell you to wear. And you have to act exactly how I tell you to act.

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 11:27 AM by windword

reply to post by ronnieray123

When it comes to legal equality in the arena of marriage for gays, what is it that you would like them to compromise? Is it just the the name? Instead of the "marriage" would you like to call it "gayrraige." Don't you think that is a mockery of all things equal?

What would you alter in terms of marriage when it comes to gay people being legally equal in rights?

What is so sanctified about hetero marriage? Should we also rename quicky Las Vegas drive thru marriages, the Bachelor and the Bachelorette TV marriages? Do we rename the past marriages of divorcees as they must have illegitimate marriages in the first place, since they ended in divorce?

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 11:33 AM by ronnieray123

Your argument has merit.....except I am not the one demanding something.
You are demanding something, so in return, I would like something as well. This displeases you doesn't it?
How dare someone ask YOU for something in return for giving you what you desire.
This alone is reason enough to make me fight for defining a legal marriage as being between a woman and a man.
I will do anything I can to annoy and anger people who behave like that.
You insist this is about marriage and gay rights, and I say it is about people who only take and feel no obligation to give..........I do not expect a person with an already dysfunctional brain to understand this. I know it is not a gay persons fault to be born with a brain that is not in perfect working order, it just gets frustrating sometimes when they honestly believe that biologically there is nothing wrong with them.
We already know a gay mind is not in good working order which leaves to question other cognitive abilities. Such as reasoning and comprehension skills. Therefor arguing with a gay person is not unlike arguing with a person with Downs Syndrome or trying to convince a lunatic they are crazy.
If you are not attracted to people of the opposite sex.....your brain is not working right. It is what it is.
Refusing to admit to yourself that a marriage is something a man and woman do,does not change that is what it is.
Hateful, bigot...whatever you want to call me to make yourself feel better about your "problem" is just fine. But I would be just as kind and condescending to you as I would to any person with a mental disability. Like I said, it is not your fault and I would never hold your birth defect against you.

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 11:36 AM by Annee

Originally posted by ronnieray123
I am not the one demanding something.

Yes you are.

You are demanding people adhere to your belief and thinking.

edit on 7-9-2012 by Annee because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 11:43 AM by kaylaluv

Originally posted by ronnieray123
Your argument has merit.....except I am not the one demanding something.
You are demanding something, so in return, I would like something as well. This displeases you doesn't it?
How dare someone ask YOU for something in return for giving you what you desire.

You are demanding that gays don't use the word marriage. I am saying, you can have the word marriage if you do something in return. You have to wear exactly what I say to wear and act exactly as I say to act. I am giving you something you desire, and asking you something in return. How 'bout it? Does that displease you?

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 11:48 AM by ronnieray123

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by ronnieray123

When it comes to legal equality in the arena of marriage for gays, what is it that you would like them to compromise? Is it just the the name? Instead of the "marriage" would you like to call it "gayrraige." Don't you think that is a mockery of all things equal?

What would you alter in terms of marriage when it comes to gay people being legally equal in rights?

This is the problem, all these people fighting about a word is silly, call it something else for the sake of not arguing.
We do not call a faux fur coat, a fur coat .. Even though organic food is still just food...we still call it organic.
All I have herd from the people on the Right is to pick a different name...........not an outright ban of to homo's being together...and that is just how the gays are treating it....you Rightist are trying to outlaw us being together,,,,,,,,no jackass just pick a different word..
You want the word marriage for no other reason because it legitimizes a brain that is not normal, into being normal.

IF YOU ARE GAY THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG INSIDE YOUR HEAD... IT IS NOT WORKING AS INTENDED.......this does not mean you are bad, this does not mean you are evil. It does mean you are biologically inferior . Just because this makes you angry, does not mean it is not true. To say different is like a blind guy telling someone he is a perfect specimen of a human being,
I feel empathy for gays the same way I do for any other handicap person, and as you can see from your supporters , they do as well.

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 11:51 AM by Annee

Originally posted by ronnieray123

You insist this is about marriage and gay rights,

No - its about EQUAL

There is only Marriage. LEGAL Marriage the same for everyone.

There is no separation of: Atheist marriage - gay marriage - hetero marriage - Muslim marriage - arranged marriage - convenient marriage - shotgun wedding marriage.

There is only ONE - - MARRIAGE (legal government marriage contract)

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 12:14 PM by ronnieray123

Like I said, your brain does not work as intended. I am so sorry that you lack the ability to understand many things. Maybe someday science will find a way to cure you. Your symptoms are very similar to Noonan's Syndrome.
There is an option you know, The US Constitution encourages people of like minds to band together and create their state in the image they wish to live in...doesn't say anything about making the whole country kiss your ass.

Could you be happy living in a state where gay law rules?? Or isn't that enough?
Would you be able to survive without straight people paving the way for you??
This is yet another reason why gays are mostly democrats...because they think they know better than the founding fathers

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 12:17 PM by windword

reply to post by ronnieray123

So what if you think that gay's are abnormal! There is no such thing as normal. Nobody is pretending to be a perfect example of a human specimen and certainly nobody would confuse you for such a specimen!

So what if you think that gay's are the equivalent of handicap individuals. We don't curtail equal rights to handicap individuals either.

People used to think that women were to too feeble minded to vote, and look at women today! There are plenty of gays that contribute to society above and beyond some "normal" hetero trailer trash individual collecting welfare.

People used to think that mixed race marriage would produce 1/2 human 1/2 animal creatures, but we've gotten beyond these myths. Your beliefs are just that, myths.

Gays are just as sane of mind and capable of critical thought and positive contributions to society as any other previously disenfranchised group of human beings and deserve to be treated as such.

Here's short list of some notable homosexual people who have contributed to society more than you!

Alexander the Great
*Macedonian Ruler, 300 B.C.
Socrates
*Greek Philosopher, 400 B.C.
Sappho
*Greek Woman Poet, 600 B.C.
Hadrian
*Roman Emperor, 1st-2nd c.
Richard the Lionhearted
*English King, 12th c.
Saladin
*Sultan of Egypt and Syria
Desiderius Erasmus
*Dutch Monk, Philosopher
Francis Bacon
*English statesman, author
Frederick the Great
*King of Prussia
Lord Byron
*English poet, 18th c.
Walt Whitman
*U.S. poet, author, 19th c.
Oscar Wilde
*Irish author, 19th c.
Marcel Proust
*French author, 20th c.
Colette
*French author, 20th c.
Gertrude Stein
*U.S. poet, author, 20th c.
Alice B. Toklas
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Federico Garcia Lorca
*Spanish author, 20th c.
Cole Porter
*U.S. composer, 20th c.
Virginia Woolf
*English author, 20th c.
Leonard Bernstein
*U.S. composer, 20th c.
Pope Julius III
*1550-1555
T.E. Lawrence
*English soldier, author, 20th c.
Jean Cocteau
*French writer, director, 20th c.
Charles Laughton
*English actor, 20th c.
Marguerite Yourcenar
*Belgian author, 20th c.
Tennessee Williams
*U.S. Playwright, 20th c.
James Baldwin
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Andy Warhol
*U.S. artist, 20th c.
Michelangelo
*Italian artist, 15th c.
Leonardo Da Vinci
*Ital. Artist, scientist, 15th c.
Christopher Marlowe
*Eng. Playwright, 16th c.
Herman Melville
*U.S. author, 19th c.
Horatio Alger, Jr.
*U.S. author, 19th c.
Tchaikovsky
*Russian composer, 19th c.
Willa Cather
*U.S. author, 19th c.
Amy Lowell
*U.S. author, 19th & 20th c.
E.M. Forster
*English author, 20th c.
John M. Keynes
*English economist, 20th c.
Ludwig Wittgenstein
*Australian mathematician, 20th c.
Bessie Smith
*U.S. singer, 20th c.
Noel Coward
*English playwright, 20th c.
Christopher Isherwood
*English author, 20th c.
Pier Paolo Pasolini
*Italian film director, 20th c.
Yukio Mishima
*Japanese author, 20th c.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*U.S. stateswoman, 20th c.
Julius Caesar
*Roman Emperor, 100-44 B.C.
Augustus Caesar
*Roman Emperor
Harvey Milk
*U.S. politician, 20th c.
Bayard Rustin
*U.S. Civil Rights activist, 20th c.
James I
*English King, 16th-17th c.
Queen Anne
*English Queen, 18th c.
Marie Antoinette
*French Empress, 18th c.
Melissa Etheridge
*U.S. Rock Star, 20th c.
Pope Benedict IX
*1032-1044
May Sarton
*U.S. author, (1912 - 1995)
Edna Ferber
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Elton John
*English Rock Star, 20th c.
Margaret Fuller
*U.S. writer, educator, 20th c.
Montezuma II
*Aztec ruler, 16th c.
Peter the Great
*Russian Czar, 17th-18th c.
Langston Hughes
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Pope John XII
*955-964
Madame de Stael
*French writer, 17th-18th c.
Martina Navratilova
*U.S. tennis star, 20th c.
Greg Louganis
*U.S. Olympic swimmer, 20th c.
Billie Jean King
*U.S. tennis star, 20th c.
Roberta Achtenburg
*U.S. politician, 20th c.
Barney Frank
*U.S. Congressman, 20th c.
Gerry Studds
*U.S. Congressman, 20th c.
Hans Christian Andersen
*Danish author, 19th c.
Tom Dooley
*U.S. M.D. missionary, 20th c.
J. Edgar Hoover
*U.S. director of the FBI., 20th c.
Frida Kahlo
*Mexican artist, 20th c.
Suleiman the Magnificent
*Ottoman ruler, 15th c.
Rock Hudson
*U.S. actor, 20th c.
Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz
*Mexican author, 16th c.
Ralph Waldo Emerson
*U.S. author, 19th c.
Candace Gingrich
*Gay Rights activist, 20th c.
Margarethe Cammermeyer
*U.S. Army Colonel, 20th c.