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The first building to apply the tube-frame construction was the DeWitt-Chestnut apartment building which Khan designed and which was completed in Chicago by 1963. This laid the foundations for the tube structural design of many later skyscrapers, including his own John Hancock Center and Willis Tower, and the construction of the World Trade Center, Petronas Towers, Jin Mao Building, and most other supertall skyscrapers since the 1960s.
Originally posted by stew4media
reply to post by ANOK
I have to look up resources. I do recall it saying it was "One" of the first and unique in it's own way of being built.
It's no longer the most advance way of building (It's nearly 50 year old from first drafts).
Is it possible because the building was actually first drafted in 1958 or 59 (if I got that date right or close enough) that other smaller buildings were built first.. making your claim correct but the Japanese American designer came up with this style of building originally for the first WTC and they went through several designs before they finally chose the 2 towers? No other tower has ever failed. WTC 7 is built the same way? Was the one in Europe built the same way that didn't collapse? I can't believe Obama didn't take office, and say "Reopen the case on this". Way too many people from every walk of life are pissed off about this.
Originally posted by plube
Now all this is within 3months of the 911 impacts...to me this is mass organization of destruction of evidence...They are cutting the columns and beams into little sections for disposal...I know they would have to get rid of it all eventually...but to do it in such a organized fashion within only three months is completely CRIMINAL.
Does money speak so loudly that people do not question what they are asked to do...or is it because it is so fresh they are not thinking straight.
As we can see it was systematic and quick for the disposal of the evidence....good thing we have video evidence available to us to go through everything....I will start to show plans and locations of steel soon...it is a lot of work to go through....but worth the effort.
So far we have a lighter weight upper structure...able to apparently drop and crush the lower stronger structure and this is perfectly acceptable the the experts at NIST and FEMA....Do people realize why these government agencies are used...It is to control the flow of information under the guise of our safety....So it is better to let thousands and thousands DIE...talking about the wars here...by lying to the people for OUR safety.....And people still believe the OS.
Originally posted by plube
reply to post by AvadaKedavra14
You don't like it...well you do realize why it gets said as such don't you...If your reading what i am saying...i am totally against the term...the reason truthers say this is because this is what people are falsly led to believe is what happened.
you do Know about Bazants paper...don't you.
Hope all this is useful information.edit on 083131p://f42Sunday by plube because: (no reason given)
that is the whole issue is it not...why is it just the floors that people state the dynamic load could not be withstood....It is the whole structure as a whole that would take this apparent Dynamic load...So i have shown why the crush gets used....You do not accept Bazants paper...yet that is the one espoused by the OS you have not stated why you think the core should get blown apart...I did not say the hat truss should stay completely intact...but it should at least be a mangled mess of material on top of the debris pile....as there was nothing to crush it into bits...especially in the north tower collapse....You also have not addressed where the hat truss which had no dynamic load on it....basically blow apart within .25 sec of collapse initiation....the images do not lie also If things are being expelled out to the sides...(which they are)...then where is all this mass which would continue the collapse.
all the way up as the towers were constructed the core always rose three stories above floor levels...so does this say it is not able to support itself when 16 floor of the north tower collapsed....nope.
I love how i have been showing actual steel and how it concerns the collapse yet the regulars are not in here arguing the toss....what is being shown is that the OS has lied....It has misled the public...and you yourself have just stated you do not believe the very paper that the OS seems to hold so dear...so therefore you yourself have just said you have been lied to by the OS concerning this matter.
Also if you understood the images of the collapse i have done...you would see that at least 8 floors of the upper block should have penetrated into the lower block by that amount give or take a floor or two...yet that is not what is observed now is it....what is observed is that the upper block is in fact compressing magically into itself before it even affects the lower block....see the markings and the red slider that represents the entire upper block....Please explain this result if you wouldn't mind
where mf is the mass of one WTC floor, assumed to be 1/110 the mass of an entire WTC
tower, namely mf = (510,000,000 / 110) kg 4,636,000 kg
I actually understand exactly what i am seeing...how much should the upper part have penetrated into the lower part...check the line to the right...also each and every column is a solid block in and of itself is it not..
Also i definitely do not consider Bazants PE as true...how can it possibly be that...greening has stated exactly how Bazant et al came up with it...they averaged it throughout the structure...but if you looked through this thread you will see this is not the case....the steel columns in the lower section were as much as 4" thick...yet in the upper section they go down to as little as 3/4" plate....also each and every perimeter column was about 1" thick at the lower levels...yet near the upper section they are down to 1/4" thick....so right there the mass of the upper section are off by a factor of 4 just on the mass of metal alone.
NOTE:just to show i do not just make up generalizations....like this so called professional has.....here....LIES. where mf is the mass of one WTC floor, assumed to be 1/110 the mass of an entire WTC tower, namely mf = (510,000,000 / 110) kg 4,636,000 kg This is from energy transfer by DR greening....The same figures used by Bazant. that is completely erroneous and you are choosing to believe it....the calculation is complete and undoubtably wrong as this thread has clearly shown.....therefore the whole paper is Erroneous.
Also NIST stated SEVERED columns...and as you can see i have been very diligent is seeking out metal from the towers....guess what....i have located burnt columns from the damaged areas...bent...twisted...but not severed...also even the external columns as you can go through the thread...bent twisted...but not severed...bazant also assumes complete failure and a freefall collapse onto the floors below...but explain this please...did the columns just disappear...to cause this initial drop...no..they would need to buckle....bend then drop...this alone would affect the KE .
Now you stated you just consider Bazants' calcs as accurate...so i did say you do not believe in his paper as you stated that it is not a block falling...well according to bazant...it is a block falling...so you either believe his paper in it's entirety or you don't....that is very clear is it not....So as for his calcs....do you still believe the calcs as you now know greening stated how he came up with these false numbers....Why would you believe false data...that is worse than just blindly believing the paper itself do you not think.
Now you state the center of mass is enough to destroy the lower section...the only tower to be consider here would be the north tower...as if it fails the whole scenario fails as it has the least amount of available PE. Please, now knowing what you know about the falsities of the calculations....is the papers calcs to be believed at all....I should think not.
Originally posted by plube
I said i would get back with something on the mechanical floors....but i did come across this which shows something very interesting....watch as the collapse progresses...and then what happens when it reaches the mechanical floors....I see a burst of energy there....laterally....different color smoke expels from the mechanical floor region...the darker gray line area.
lets look at a few frames...
approx a 1/4sec later see the difference at the mechanical floor level
then we move approx another 1/4...six frames of a 29fps vid
then ten frames later...high expenditure of debris laterally....Smoke is white in color at mech floor level...and then axial rotation ceases....then collapse progresses as though no resistance.....what explains this action?
Originally posted by ANOK
The question should be how did the sagging trusses pull the in the columns to begin with?
IF the trusses could put a pulling force on the columns, why did the connections not fail first?
How did failed connections of truss seats cause the central core to break up into individual lengths of steel?