U.N. Commission Calls for Legalizing Prostitution Worldwide

Originally posted by getreadyalready
[#1. Some people (even healthy people), like to be degraded and/or used. In fact, I am one of those people. Not all the time, but just for giggles every now and then. You'll find a lot of people that constantly find themselves in control of every situation, and are always looked to for advice, and always looked to for supervision, can get really turned on by being completely submissive every now and then. I am also very turned on by pleasing a woman, so being ordered/forced to do it is fun for me. At the same time, I also LOVE to completely defile a woman (as long as she likes it as well). I can play either role, and be very turned on by it, and I've met a lot of people that have similar tastes to me. I'm not talking about damaged people either. I'm talking about people that are very educated, successful, and respected. There are women I know that enjoy being degraded very, very much. It is a fantasy for them to be treated like and object and used up and forced to perform, and then afterwards they can go right back to being friends, and being in control of their lives as usual.

It is not degrading or defiling if it is consensual. In my opinion. You cannot choose to be defiled or degraded. Doing it for the giggle (with a straight face), or the thrill, or even just the experience is not actually defiling someone or degrading them or you. It is play-acting, role playing. And as long as all are fully-fledged adults, and all are enjoying themselves, then there is no harm done. The point being, if you were 'defiling' a sexual partner, and he/she genuinely wasn't into it, or if you had had to talk them around, it wouldn't be fun, it would be you imposing your will on another person, and that is coercion. Giving yourself over, in trust, safe in the knowledge that they will respect your boundaries, is something very different. We all have a variety of fantasies, some of those are a result of our psycho-sexual development, while others are a result of our curiousity and imagination, and I am all in favour of a good imagination. But trust in any sexual arrangement is of paramount importance, and getting naked with someone, or not so naked, requires an acceptance of mutual vulnerability, and this is more than anything else, what should be taught to young people, girls and boys equally, when we instruct them about sex. To avoid any confusion or misunderstandings later.

Again, referring back to the study that I linked to, many of those men questioned went to prostitutes because of the 'dirty whore' fantasy, and I think, as you pointed out, that many women harbour very similar fantasies, but due to the constructs of society feel pinnioned to behave in certain ways, and that in general, male and female roles within society are far too constructed and confining to allow such expressions even in the privacy of a marriage or otherwise monogamous relationship. Which is sad, but I think it is a situation that is improving. Social morality in the past has played an important role in hampering couples from expressing themselves freely to each other, because it was, and in some communities still is, taught that women, particularly, are whores or angels, and perhaps, that men are good upright citizens or perverts. Honest, open communication is key, and while I am supportive of a man or woman's choice to engage in prostitution if that is his/her choice to do so, I do not believe that that should be on the basis of capitalising on someone's inability to communicate and serve to belittle the relationships that they already have. Meeting the need for a service is one thing, creating the need for a service, due to societial judgements and conditioning, is another thing entirely. And, again, going back to that study, that the greatest use of prostitutes correlates with countries where religion dictates the roles of women, quite stringently, seems to confirm that this is very often the case. I don't think anyone, in those cases, is truly getting any satisfaction.

reply to post by SibylofErythrae

Yes, truncation is a great way to stay alive and continue on as a specialized pet. Prostitution is a socialized form this truncation is taking on, and as with most of the forms of truncation it is a dead end. People breed themselves out.

Dang I am learning all kinds of new things,
truncation

Been married over forty years, and my husbands favorite song was A man needs a maid, lol


A while ago somewhere
I don't know when
I was watching
a movie with a friend.
I fell in love with the actress.
She was playing a part
that I could understand.

A maid. A man needs a maid.
A maid.

I looked up truncation, I don't get it.

reply to post by SibylofErythrae

I am familiar with all types of vampires and even energy vampire types, you need say nothing more. And I would not be so sure about specialization or the whole prostitute truncation breeding themselves out so much as you seem to think they will. After all its not like there a rare breed in the human species. If anything I would say that if there is anybody or any type that may be breeding themselves out, it's the opposite types of what you purpose. Nice avatar by the way.

reply to post by Biliverdin


There are trades and then there are trades, but they all trade this and that for tit and tat. And like the world turns on unseen forces, I suppose you can say the the human world also turns on unseen vocation know thyself being one that if its not a trade its something that is pivotal to everything. And ya your right people need to know themselves a little before they go about trying to figure out others. I think it will save a lot of time and hot air from going around.

I really don't share your mistrust of marriage like you do, but then again I have never been married. So who know you may know something about it that I do not. But I think again, people go into such arrangements without knowing themselves and what there really about or what they really want and are capable of doing, and when things turn out to surface and the glimmer fades. Well the truth on things comes out and there are very few scarier things then the truth. But in all I suppose its like they wake up one day and find that they woke up right next to a stranger, and one on opposites sides of you or the things you are about.

And sorry I didn't read your link because frankly I ain't reading all that. Its freaking hella long, like 17 pages, it would take me like 30 minutes to read all that, and really who has that kind of time. And besides, I think I got a quick gist of what it was about from your posts. I do not think you got some of the things I said, but whatever close enough, and maybe some other thread some other time. Or not.

reply to post by getreadyalready

Actually ya this is one of the things we were talking about. And Biliverdin is right, I mean how can it be considered degrading when the person your going on the very acts about likes it, wants it, and even craves it. Its not really degrading or defiling it's just something you and them get off on, a fetish and even the fact that you and them think that other people think its degrading that to is just part of the fetish, because in a lot of cases it's basses is not upon the social aspect of things, or to put it more simply. Its based on what they think other people think on it. Like I said its a fetish.

Now if the other person was doing it against there will, or had no choice then its a whole nother story. And ya its not all that surprising that all kinds of people are into all kinds of stuff, from all walks of life. That's kind of just obvious, its almost not even on the subject at hand. Its not surprising at all that successful men and women would be into that, in fact that would be the first place to look for such things in a lot of cases. But in all the two things are not mutually exclusive, its the fact that you and others think that they cant be one and the same thing that is contradictory.

I think a lot of people are confused on this subject. But like I said making prostitution legal would not do much, it would not even make it all that safe anymore then it already is, because already the people that want to go at it of there own free will already do that. I do not think government or the UN can wave a magic wand and make the whole seedy aspect or the drugs or crime aspect go away, after all that is not in there power. But what is in there power is to make sure the revenues instead of going to the pimps go to them, and off-course make laws on things....And you can see how great our current laws work already on such things.

And the other thing they can do is make it and the whole thing socially accepted in the long run, which would make it more safe in the long run, but that would only be switching one problem for another, and besides all of that was done before, it's nothing new. Just look at ancient Rome, or any of the other precursors to this civilization to see what it was like, because it will be pretty much what it will be like again.

And really if you have to look to an outside institution to give you the green light on doing something you want to do, then that speaks of deeper underlain problems then the surface of things shows.

reply to post by galadofwarthethird

I think a lot of people are confused on this subject. But like I said making prostitution legal would not do much, it would not even make it all that safe anymore then it already is, because already the people that want to go at it of there own free will already do that. I do not think government or the UN can wave a magic wand and make the whole seedy aspect or the drugs or crime aspect go away, after all that is not in there power.

I work in regulation of healthcare fields, and one of those fields is massage. We see A LOT of prostitution, and quite a bit of human trafficking, and we know what it would take to clean up the profession. I agree that the UN involvement is just odd and creepy, and we shouldn't need the UN's blessing. Most of my commentary on this subject is from my point of view here in the United States, and the UN endorsement is just a vehicle to open up the conversation to our political right that keeps these things under tight lips.

To get the seedy criminal element out of the prostitution business is as easy as providing a safe and legal alternative to turn to. If a man has $100 to spend, and he is looking for sex, would he rather take a risk on getting a disease, getting arrested, getting robbed by going to a seedy establishment somewhere for a crackhead to do something for $50, or would he rather go to a legitimate business, with a Department of Health license on the wall, with no chance of getting arrested or robbed, and where he could talk openly about what he is paying for? Even if the legit business was twice the price, it is a better deal considering all the risk is wiped out, he can walk in, look at the menu, talk openly, make an informed decision before he spends his money. You can't get any of that at an illegal establishment, and you're more likely to get mugged than get sex.

If we were to legalize prostitution, it would be set up similar to massage, and electrolysis, and surgery centers; it would entail:

1. An establishment license
-------> An establishment would be inspected semi-annually (6 months).
-------> Everyone working at the establishment would have to also be licensed with licenses displayed, and identification on file to make sure they are legal residents, of proper age, here voluntarily, and properly trained in certain aspects like disease prevention.
-------> Establishment would have to have protocol on file for environmental health, disease prevention, human trafficking recognition, etc.
-------> Establishmen would have to have all the proper materials and equipment to satisfy the protocols, and proof that they are using the equipment and following the protocols.

Those things are similar to other licensed establishments already, but they would of course be tailored for this particular profession.

2. The prostitutes would also have to be licensed, legal right to work, proper age, and have continuuing education hour requirements each year for disease prevention, environmental health, and recognizing the signs of human-trafficking in their co-workers or profession. They would also have to have a physical and blood test at least semi-annually.

If those simple things were made requirements for a legal prostitution profession, then the majority of customers would seek out legal establishments. Of course some customers would still go the illegal route, just like some people go to voodoo haitian doctors instead of emergency rooms, and some customers get butt implants in back alleys from transvestites instead of going to a surgery center. (Ask me about the Cement and Caulking case if you haven't already heard.)

BUT, the giant benefit is that we would have income from the licensing aspect to have more investigators out there looking for unlicensed establishments and people, we would have more licensed people protecting their trade by turning in the unlicensed ones, we would have many, many more eyes out in the community to recognize human trafficking or underage prostitution, and we would have a legal avenue for customers to report things that raised their suspicions. The way it is now, if a man hires a prostitute, and he suspects she is underage or being held against her will, who can he call? If he calls the police, they'll arrest him too!

Legalizing it has many, many layers of benefits, and really no down-side, because we all know that being illegal has not stopped the trade, and therefore has not protected the vulnerable element of the trade. Making it legal helps to protect the vulnerable element in many ways. It won't be 100% effective, but it will be much more than we have now.

reply to post by getreadyalready

What are you some sort of government regulatory detective person dude. I bet that is popular with the ladies, being a private dick and all, you must get many ladies swooning over it eh.

But anyways to more serious things.

Somehow I do not think it would be that easy what you purpose. And given that almost every time any big money business out there when it becomes all legit, that usually only just means that the show is run a bit more smooth, but the same things still remain behind the back doors. In all what your purposing would just make the lucrative business of prostitution more mainstream, and accepted by law. And seeing as it being against the law does nothing, then I suppose given the alternative that is as good as its going to get. But I do not hold any misconceptions that things will be solved, that would just be silly.

Which is a to tell the truth just a tad sad. And I am sure you seen people and there quotes in this site and even there links to other sources that say that even in countries were prostitution is legal like Amsterdam and whatnot and therefor, the seedy aspect is pretty much still there if albeit toned down.

But in the end people will do what they want to do, no matter the laws. One more thing that making it legal would do is make this whole aspect a job, and once it becomes a "job" it will just become routine which will just be a self serving circle jerk in a lot of way. That is they clock in, do your shift and put your time in, clock out get paid in time it will become like any other job out there, and in fact they will probably be looking and putting more effort in keeping it that and there jobs, then actually thinking and working toward ways in eliminating the whole thing. Because when they do, well then they will be out of a job then.

It literally will just spreed the money coming in from prostitution around to more people, and in some ways that will be like when the CIA got rid of the mafia, and clamped down on there drug trade in this country and others. All that really did was displace and replace one drug dealer, for another, in a lot of ways it was like giving the Fox the keys to the chicken coop, as the institution and bureaucratization behind the drug trade today is on a whole way more efficient and better at the drug trade business, then the mafia and the drug lords ever were. But even after all that time it did not get rid of it, it just made it more well hidden and in fact more spreed out. In a lot of ways that is what you are purposing, and given human nature, I am pretty sure where this whole thing will lead, good intentions or not.

SO in all, people do as you will and to some extent given the fact that people will actually prefer this line of work and this paradigm as in some cases its easy money and they like sex, then really that is on them and they got to live with the consequences. Making more dependents on government machination will lead in circles ultimately. But to some extent they do need to not make prostitution legal, because frankly people will do it regardless, and it will help with keeping track of the trafficking of illegal sex both of minors and of others who had no say in getting into that business. And if some placard on the wall will make people fell safe about things, well why not, given what it is now, that is a bit better alternative.

Legalizing it has many, many layers of benefits, and really no down-side

If you cant think of any down-sides then you may have to think a little harder on this, that or your thinking on other things all together, and with the wrong head. In fact you would not be thinking on it in the right context, but more thinking in the context of how things can lead to the things that you want. Or better said you would just be looking for justifications on things. Like I said none of this would exist if people really did not want it.

reply to post by galadofwarthethird


I can't think of any downsides that don't already exist? Legalizing it would shine a light on the subject, and roaches scatter in the light.

Can you name any downsides to legalizing it? We have supply and demand here. The demand won't change, the demand is already high. So, if the supply becomes more readily available, more transparent, more regulated, less seedy, then what are the downsides?

ETA:
And yes, that is exactly what I am, a government regulatory investigator.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by galadofwarthethird

 

I can't think of any downsides that don't already exist? Legalizing it would shine a light on the subject, and roaches scatter in the light.

Can you name any downsides to legalizing it? We have supply and demand here. The demand won't change, the demand is already high. So, if the supply becomes more readily available, more transparent, more regulated, less seedy, then what are the downsides?

ETA:
And yes, that is exactly what I am, a government regulatory investigator.

edit on 31-7-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)

Child Prostitution rose in the Netherlands, and they have legalized Prostitution their already........

Heres a good list.......

1. MYTH: Legalizing prostitution gets rid of its criminal elements - pimps and traffickers.
FACT: Legalizing prostitution benefits pimps and traffickers. It also benefits johns.

2. MYTH: Men need sex therefore prostitution must exist. Prostitution is a natural form of human sexuality
FACT: The sex of prostitution is not “sex” for women in it. Most men who use women in prostitution have other sexual partners.

3. MYTH: Prostitution is sexual liberation
FACT: Prostitution is sexual exploitation.

4. MYTH Women choose to enter prostitution. It’s better to choose to make lots of money as a prostitute than to choose to work at a minimum wage job like McDonald’s.
FACT: It is profoundly unjust to declare that prostitution is an acceptable job for some women - those who are mostly poor, mostly women of color, mostly young. Prostitution is an intrinsically abusive institution and women stay poor in prostitution (although lots of cash passes through their hands on the way to pimps, stripclub managers, bartenders, taxi drivers, casino hosts and other predators).

5. MYTH : Prostitution is a victimless crime. Legal prostitution protects women in prostitution.
FACT: All prostitution harms those in it. Legal prostitution does not protect women in prostitution from harm.

6. MYTH: Most prostitution does not involve pimps.
FACT: Most prostitution involves pimps. Health service providers, shelter staff, survivors of prostitution, and law enforcement sources estimate that 65%-85% of all prostitution is pimp-dominated.

7. MYTH: Legalizing prostitution would protect sexually exploited children. When prostitution is legal, licensed brothel owners do not hire minors or trafficked women.
FACT: Legal prostitution increases the sexual assaults of children in prostitution.

8. MYTH: Prostitution is the world’s oldest profession.
FACT: Slavery and pimping and agriculture are the world’s oldest professions.

9. MYTH: Social stigma is the most harmful aspect of prostitution.
FACT: The worst thing about prostitution is not social stigma, it is rape, strangulation, beatings, toxic verbal abuse, and other violence from johns and pimps.

10. MYTH: If you try to abolish prostitution, it will go underground.
FACT: There is no evidence for the extortionate myth.

11. MYTH: Prostitution is a deterrent to sex crimes.
FACT: Research indicates that prostitution is associated with increased rates of rape.

12. MYTH: Pornography and stripping are not prostitution.
FACT: Pornography, stripping/exotic dancing/lap dancing are almost always prostitution.

13. MYTH: Legalization of prostitution is an entirely separate issue from human trafficking.
FACT: Prostitution is the destination point for trafficking. Legalization of prostitution promotes sex trafficking.

14. MYTH: Even if it’s not perfect, legalizing prostitution would at least make prostitution a little bit better.
FACT: Legalization of prostitution increases illegal prostitution. It does not improve the lives of women in prostitution.

15. MYTH: Legalized prostitution would control the sex industry.
FACT: Legalization/decriminalization of prostitution expands the sex industry.

16. MYTH: Legal prostitution brings tremendous tax benefits to cash-strapped regions. Nevada’s rural counties reap economic benefits from legal prostitution.
FACT: Regions with legal prostitution experience adverse economic impacts.

17.MYTH: If you oppose legalization of prostitution, you’re saying that prostitutes should be arrested.
FACT: The abolitionist Swedish law, which is a model law, decriminalizes women in prostitution but arrests their predators: johns, pimps, and traffickers.

18. MYTH: If you oppose legal prostitution, you’re a moralistic, judgmental, prudish person who is pushing your value system on people who think differently from you.
FACT: While people are entitled to their moral and religious beliefs, our opposition to the institution of prostitution is based on evidence of the harms of prostitution documented by researchers, health service providers, and law enforcement.

Myths & Facts about Legalized Prostitution

reply to post by sonnny1


I see that your source has "research" in its title, but those are far from "facts."

Ask any pimp or drug-dealer if they are a fan of legalizing drugs or prostitution. You'll quickly find out that is the WORST thing that could happen to their illegal business, because instead of having pimps, you'd have corporations running the show, with board members and stock holders and such.

And how can anyone argue the demand for sex? Of course there is a demand, otherwise the issue wouldn't exist in the first place. Of course the "sex" is for the paying client, because it is just business for the person offering the services. However, there is something called lingem massage, which is an accepted practice in most circles, sexual in application, but spiritual in theory.

I think your source is flawed and uninformed. It just isn't logical and well-informed in its application.

This one really illuminates the flaws in the source...

16. MYTH: Legal prostitution brings tremendous tax benefits to cash-strapped regions. Nevada’s rural counties reap economic benefits from legal prostitution.
FACT: Regions with legal prostitution experience adverse economic impacts.

Really? What impacts? Where are the examples? As opposed to illegal prostitution? I can assure you the illegal prostitution has negative economic impacts on a region. They don't call it the "red light district" or the "seedy side of town" for nothing! They didn't show any examples, because there are not any examples that support their "fact."

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by sonnny1

 

I see that your source has "research" in its title, but those are far from "facts."

Ask any pimp or drug-dealer if they are a fan of legalizing drugs or prostitution. You'll quickly find out that is the WORST thing that could happen to their illegal business, because instead of having pimps, you'd have corporations running the show, with board members and stock holders and such.

And how can anyone argue the demand for sex? Of course there is a demand, otherwise the issue wouldn't exist in the first place. Of course the "sex" is for the paying client, because it is just business for the person offering the services. However, there is something called lingem massage, which is an accepted practice in most circles, sexual in application, but spiritual in theory.

I think your source is flawed and uninformed. It just isn't logical and well-informed in its application.

I gave a list. I said it was a good list. If you actually go to the website, they have many great articles and links, that give you the research, you want and need.

Like........

In this PsySR Member Perspective, Melissa Farley offers a brief overview of human trafficking and prostitution. Melissa is a research and clinical psychologist and she directs Prostitution Research and Education.

According to U.N. estimates, approximately 2.5 million people are being trafficked around the world at any given time, 80% of them women and children. Conservative estimates suggest that the sex industry generates some $32 billion annually. However, estimates of income generated from prostitution in one city, Las Vegas, are as high as $5 billion. Today, sex trafficking is a high-tech, globalized, electronic market, and predators are involved at all levels, using the same methods to control prostituted women that batterers use against their victims: minimization and denial of physical violence, economic exploitation, social isolation, verbal abuse, threats and intimidation, physical violence, sexual assault, and captivity. Despite the illogical attempt of some to distinguish prostitution from trafficking, trafficking is simply the global form of prostitution. Sex trafficking may occur within or across international borders, thus women may be either domestically or internationally trafficked or both. Young women are trafficked for sexual use from the countryside to the city, from one part of town to another, and across international borders to wherever there are men who will buy them.

It is important to address men’s demand for prostitution. Acceptance of prostitution is one of a cluster of harmful attitudes that encourage and justify violence against women. Violent behaviors against women have been associated with attitudes that promote men’s beliefs that they are entitled to sexual access to women, that they are superior to women and that they are licensed as sexual aggressors. Those concerned with human rights must address the social invisibility of prostitution, the massive denial regarding its harms, its normalization as an inevitable social evil, and the failure to educate students in the mental health and public health professions. Trafficking and prostitution can only exist in an atmosphere of public, professional and academic indifference

Human Trafficking and Prostitution


All I did was provide a list, since you didn't seem to think of one thing, that is negative, with Legalized Prostitution.

reply to post by sonnny1


Human trafficking is a significant problem, I agree with many of the negative aspects of prostitution in its current form. I see it regularly. But, legalizing and regulating the industry, putting more feet on the ground, more eyes out in the community, and providing a safe alternative, and a safe way to report abuse and illegal activities can not possibly make the situation worse. It can only better it better. The situation is currently bad, but there is a clear way to make improvements, and the arguments against it are irrational at best.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by sonnny1

 

Human trafficking is a significant problem, I agree with many of the negative aspects of prostitution in its current form. I see it regularly. But, legalizing and regulating the industry, putting more feet on the ground, more eyes out in the community, and providing a safe alternative, and a safe way to report abuse and illegal activities can not possibly make the situation worse. It can only better it better. The situation is currently bad, but there is a clear way to make improvements, and the arguments against it are irrational at best.

But human Trafficking is STILL occurring in the Netherlands.Of course, those who promote Legalized Prostitution, call those "sex workers", illegal, or criminal. Turkish gangs, are still running their prostitution rings, out of the Netherlands also. Yes, its big business, for all those involved, except the Prostitutes..

"Although there was a belief that legalization would make possible control of the sex industry, the illegal industry is now 'out of control'. Police in Victoria [Australia] estimate that there are 400 illegal brothels as against 100 legal ones. Trafficking in women and children from other countries has increased significantly. The legalization of prostitution in some parts of Australia has thus resulted in a net growth of the industry. One of the results has been the trafficking in women and children to 'supply' legal and illegal brothels. The 'sex entrepreneurs' have difficulty recruiting women locally to supply an expanding industry, and women from trafficking are more vulnerable and more profitable."

Richard Poulin, PhD, Professor of Sociology at the University of Ottawa, wrote "The Legalization of Prostitution and Its Impact on Trafficking in Women and Children"

Victoria's illegal sex industry has enjoyed a decade of unparalleled growth due to a systemic failure by police, Consumer Affairs, the Immigration Department and local councils, which are variously hamstrung due to inadequate powers, legal loopholes and under-resourcing.

Ms Yan, one of the central targets of the Richmond police operation, has run a multimillion-dollar prostitution racket in Melbourne for over a decade despite efforts by authorities to disrupt her.

In 1999, the now disbanded Victoria Police vice squad told a court that Ms Yan was running several illegal brothels, including one in Nicholson Street, North Fitzroy.

Ms Yan or her associates were simultaneously managing a licensed brothel, the Oriental Plums, in Thomastown. A year later, after police raided Oriental Plums, immigration authorities found at least one Chinese woman working there illegally.

The secret world of Melbourne's sex trade

10 years, of exploiting women, under the guise of legal. More Bureaucracy needed ? Cant get it right, after 10 years?

reply to post by sonnny1


We're facing that same crisis here in Florida, where prostitution is illegal. There is nowhere near enough police resource to make a dent in the illegal prostitution trade. In fact, even when other law enforcement agencies like DEA or FBI refer cases to local police forces, they refuse to follow up on them. There are literally entire newspapers printed and distributed in Miami, with nothing but ads for prostitution. Dozens of pages of brazen advertisements, addresses, phone numbers, advertising an illegal activity. Many of those places have human-trafficking from Brazil, the Caribbean, Russia, and Asia. It is a well-known problem, with no solution. They would have to quadruple the size of every agency involved just to make a dent, and even then when they do make a bust, the girls just disappear the next day. The undercover operations don't work, because the criminals are too fast at rotating personnel, and moving locations, and disrupting surveillance, etc.

BUT, if it were LEGAL, then a new trust fund would be set up from those licensing fees, and inspection fees, and taxes, and that trust fund could support new regulators that would oversee it. The customers that are currently taking advantage of girls that may or may not be working against their will, would suddenly be free to turn in those operations to the authorities and go to a legal establishment instead.

I'm not saying it is a miracle cure, but it would be an improvement over what we have now. Right now we have no semblance of a handle on the situation at all, but if we legalize it, we start getting our foot in the door to solving the bigger underlying problems.

reply to post by getreadyalready


Woman and Children are going to be exploited , regardless of legalities. Legalizing it, empowers the traffickers to even make more money, off Prostitution, by circumventing legal laws, and promoting human trafficking. Buy a legal Prostitute for 50, or get an Illegal one for 10 . Remember, this is all for a piece of flesh, not marriage, not lifelong commitment. As long as you wear protection, you are fine, as most Johns, would agree. They are not looking at these women with respect, only as MEAT. You wanted the negative, I gave you a few. You might not want to see, or dilute it, for societies advantage, but I find Prostitution, Legal, or Illegal, a bane on society. That's my Opinion, right or wrong.

reply to post by sonnny1


Currently, there is a "shared risk" between the John, Prostitute, and Pimp. That shared risk ensures secrecy. A John shows up to hire a prostitute, and maybe he has some suspicion that she is being held against her will, or that she is underage, but he nobody knows where he is, the pimp is lurking around somewhere in the shady neighborhood, the girl is in danger, the John could be in danger, and if he calls the police they are liable to arrest him for everything from soliciting a prostitute to child molestation or kidnapping. So, it goes unreported.

If there were a legal option, and the same John shows up, he doesn't see a license or a sign, he has suspicions about the girl, then he can call the police. They can check the place out, the John isn't going to get arrested, and he won't even have to be a witness, so if he is embarrassed about his actions he can keep them secret. Every John becomes extra eyes and ears for the authorities. Plus, if there is a legal option, and it is in a little better neighborhood, with a good parking lot, and a sign outside the building, then the John is going to choose hat option instead of going to a seedy neighborhood and getting robbed. Pretty soon the demand for those seedy places starts to dry up.

At the licensed facilitly the girls are documented and licensed, and we know they are here legally and of legal age. Random unannounced inspections by regulatory officials will find any violations and help get the girls out of bad situations.

I mentioned earlier that I am certain of human-trafficking at the Chinese restaurants in my town. The female waitresses won't talk about themselves, they all come to work and leave in a single car, they live with the restaurant owner, they work open to close every day, they don't work typical shifts. And it isn't just one restaurant, it is pretty much all of the chinese restaurants. There is no prostitution, but there is certainly exploitation and laws being broken.

People get all weirded out when sex comes into the equation, and it is illogical. Selling one's body as an athlete, or selling one's body for a pharmaceutical study at a university, or selling one's body to wait tables is just as dangerous, and much more common, but nobody gets upset until sex is mentioned.

reply to post by getreadyalready


I hear you,and yes you are right, when it comes to sex. I hate ALL illegal trafficking, regardless if its for sex or not. I know your job consists of Helping, and that's to be commended, always. We disagree with the whole prostitution thing though. It wont change my mind, as it hits close to home.........Like I said, I worked in the industry, and saw first hand how woman are treated "legally".


Peace.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by galadofwarthethird

 

Can you name any downsides to legalizing it? We have supply and demand here. The demand won't change, the demand is already high. So, if the supply becomes more readily available, more transparent, more regulated, less seedy, then what are the downsides?

edit on 31-7-2012 by getreadyalready because: (no reason given)

I can dive into many but lets put it simply that everytime any industry is commercialized and/or traded as a commodity on the stock market, it has to show the growth and profits. When you have share holders and profits involved, competition takes over including outsourcing ( I can just imagine this rant when prostitution has been legalized and foreign prostitutes start to pour into the industry on work visas similar to the H1 and IT industry). Although the Orientals and Russians have already created this stir in the existing underground economy of strip clubs and massage parlours.

Do you think its far fetched? Do you think new/existing companies will not be looking into expanding their presence and return more profits to their investors once it is legalized? Look at the casinos as per how they started and where they are now in Vegas where big companies own them with private investors expecting profits In actuality, what are we really producing besides turning the unemployed into a 'service' oriented employee or turning a human being into a sex machine which can earn profits. Ofcourse we can compare several industries and aspects of ourselves and make logical connections and views to compromise on the thought that 'we are already bending over' for the bosses at the workplaces. But this once again depends on how one views Sex besides a basic necessity or from a sacred and spiritual viewpoint or something that shapes our thoughts and attitudes in general as a human being adhering to the laws of society which are nothing more than collective thoughts and real life experiences including ups and downs of thousands of years. One by one, it seems we are starting to dismantle and/or going backwards and questioning the entire foundation of the societies around the world. This is not a problem nor invalid but it can certainly lead to nothing more than lack of inner peace and chaos as an Individual and society as a whole. Not everything can be documented and/or experienced ahead of time. Most of the time, the wisdom and knowledge are only realized when a human being is close to death. This is the sad truth.

You did mention that the demand is already high so what do you think will be feeding the vacancies of the legal entities (a whore house or a free lancer working out of his/her home/home office/strip mall). Where do you think they will find the talent? On the streets? From the middle class? from the Upper class? How will you promote the industry so that more talent is acquired/recruited and there is no shortage of professionals unlike the 'Doctors' or medical industry? What exactly do you think happens to anything once the corporations have jumped in? Just look at GM crops Get the farmers hooked to cheaper loans, GM seeds which should be purchased every year as thats how they are modified/designed genetically. Farming industry is exploited big time not just for local politics but for geopolitics as well but thats a whole different subject and a thread Look at the fast food and/or pre-cooked meals (frozen/canned) types. Where is the quality and real value of the product regardless of the price in comparison to a gourmet restaurant with a highly skilled and specialized chef?

Now I'm not advocating that prostitution should be illegal and remain as such just to maintain the quality of the prostitutes I only see the human dignity declining as a whole if it becomes legal around the world. It is a unfortunate circumstance and situation of our societies that exists but cannot be eradicated. So why promote, nurture and flourish it? Can we make 'Discrimination' legal since there is so much of it around us? It is illegal as per EEOC. We can make it legal so that it will lower the existing Discrimination(s) in the societies
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I'm simply using other commercialized industries as an example to drive the point that it does create demand however it also leads to many negative aspects down the road that eventually its downside will be realized (if at all if it ever becomes legal) down the road where it just might be too late to turn the tide around.

I think in my previous posts I have made my thoughts on the "sex buisness" pretty clear, I don't like it...to the core of my being.

For a moment I would like to focus on the UN.....I have been listening to an Irish historian named Micheal Tsarion this morning, and this man is very brilliant and interesting, and whatever you may think of his views, he gives a very well thought out and well researched account of "history".....and I hope you will take the time to consider his work......

He connects the dots to more information then I can possibly absorb and explain in a sound bite...but he points out very clearly the connections, motives, and "evil" intentions that the UN was "born" from....ANYTHING these people are involved in is "all bad".......anyways, I will connect the link....and would welcome any thoughts or insights on WTF this all means?

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