Atheist/Christian/Muslim = no problem: fundy = arguments.

Originally posted by queenofangels_17

Originally posted by DelayedChristmas
reply to post by ahnggk

 

Let me shoot a different scenario to you...

What if a believer is rich? He/she didn't seek to earn extra finances, but it was just given to them; it was a blessing. And in return, the financially blessed help the poor in love and humility.

Would that person(s) not be deemed a true believer, because they are blessed financially? Remember... Everyone has their own callings of God, one reason why Paul stressed being a virgin and not being married but couldn't say it was a decree by Father because every member of the body of Christ has their own callings, just as every body parts has specific functions to make it work.

edit on 10-8-2012 by DelayedChristmas because: (no reason given)

edit on 10-8-2012 by DelayedChristmas because: (no reason given)

Paul stressed being a virgin..yet another one of his inventions, aside from making Jesus God and son of God and totally leading people away from the true teachings of Jesus.

57:27 Then We caused Our messengers to follow in their footsteps; and We caused Jesus, son of Mary, to follow, and gave him the Gospel, and placed compassion and mercy in the hearts of those who followed him. But monasticism they invented. We ordained it not for them. Only seeking Allah's pleasure, and they observed it not with right observance. So We give those of them who believe their reward, but many of them are evil-livers.

Jesus is the Son of God, and God in the flesh. 1 John 4:1 - 3. The First Epistle of John was written by John the Evangelist, so if John the Evangelist and Paul agree with this certain subject, what does that mean? I have had vivid moments where I put this to the test and unholy spirits can NOT answer this question truthfully; they kind of shudder and freeze in fear when asked this question.

What does it mean to be the Son of God and God in the flesh? Doesn't make sense, does it? How can you be 2 in 1 and yet be totally unique, and separate? How can the flesh contain the Creator? Aren't we all technically sons and daughters of Father? If Jesus of Nazareth was NOT the son of God, why did he have to complete all the prophecies concerning his arrival in the Old Testament?

I am not saying that Jesus Christ is greater than Father, Father is the highest in the power chain. My own opinion is that Jesus Christ's spirit was one of Father's spirits, instead of like the rest of us; we all have a spirit of man. That is why I think Jesus Christ said: "My Father and I are one," to claim his divinity... How else can you claim divinity if you do not have a spirit that is one of God's own spirit? That is why Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God.

Paul stressed abstaining from sexuality because, in his own words, the lust for flesh is really tough, but Paul does address that it his own urging advice instead of a decree because he knows everyone has their own gifts and callings from God, as I stated beforehand.

1 Corinthians 7:1-7, BOLDED vs 6-7, mine to show emphasis.
7:1 Now with regard to the issues you wrote about: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.” 2 But because of immoralities, each man should have relations with his own wife and each woman with her own husband. 3 A husband should give to his wife her sexual rights, and likewise a wife to her husband. 4 It is not the wife who has the rights to her own body, but the husband. In the same way, it is not the husband who has the rights to his own body, but the wife. 5 Do not deprive each other, except by mutual agreement for a specified time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then resume your relationship, so that Satan may not tempt you because of your lack of self-control. 6 I say this as a concession, not as a command. 7 I wish that everyone was as I am. But each has his own gift from God, one this way, another that

reply to post by DelayedChristmas


Jesus being called God and son of God has caused a great sedition in his time, which Jesus has addressed in his Gospel where he denied being God and being son of God.

At this time there was a great disturbance throughout Judea for the sake of Jesus: for that the Roman soldiery, through the operation of Satan, stirred up the Hebrews, saying that Jesus was God come to visit them.

Whereupon so great sedition arose, that nigh upon the Forty days all Judea was in arms, insomuch that the son was found against the father, and the brother against the brother, for that some said that Jesus was God come to the world; others said: `Nay, but he is a son of God'; and others said: `Nay, for God hath no human similitude, and therefore begetteth not sons; but Jesus of Nazareth is a prophet of God.'

And this arose by reason of the great miracles which Jesus did.

Then Jesus, having lifted his hand in token of silence, said: `Verily ye have erred greatly, O Israelites, in calling me, a man, your God. And I fear that God may for this give heavy plague upon the holy city, handing it over in servitude to strangers. O a thousand times accursed Satan, that hath moved you to this!'

And having said this, Jesus smote his face with both his hands, whereupon arose such a noise of weeping that none could hear what Jesus was saying. Whereupon once more he lifted up his hand in token of silence, and the people being quieted from their weeping, he spake once more:`I confess before heaven, and I call to witness everything that dwelleth upon the earth, that I am a stranger to all that ye have said; seeing that I am man, born of mortal woman, subject to the judgment of God, suffering the miseries of eating and sleeping, of cold and heat, like other men. Wherefore when God shall come to judge, my words like a sword shall pierce each one [ of them] that believe me to be more than man.'

And having said this, Jesus saw a great multitude of horsemen, whereby he perceived that there were coming the governor with Herod and the high-priest. Then said Jesus: `Perchance they also are become mad.'

When the governor arrived there, with Herod and the priest, every one dismounted, and they made a circle round about Jesus, insomuch that the soldiery could not keep back the people that were desirous to hear Jesus speaking with the priest.

Jesus drew near to the priest with reverence, but he was wishful to bow himself down and worship Jesus, when Jesus cried out: `Beware of that which thou doest, priest of the living God! Sin not against our God!'

The priest answered: `Now is Judaea so greatly moved over thy signs and thy teaching that they cry out that thou art God; wherefore, constrained by the people, I am come hither with the Roman governor and king Herod. We pray thee therefore from our heart, that thou wilt be content to remove the sedition which is arisen on thy account. For some say thou art God, some say thou art son of God, and some say thou art a prophet.'

Jesus answered: `And thou, O high-priest of God, wherefore hast thou not quieted this sedition? Art thou also, perchance, gone out of thy mind? Have the prophecies, with the law of God, so passed into oblivion, O wretched Judaea, deceived of Satan!'

And having said this, Jesus said again: `I confess before heaven, and call to witness everything that dwelleth upon the earth, that I am a stranger to all that men have said of me, to wit, that I am more than man. For I am a man, born of a woman, subject to the judgemnt of God; that live here like as other men, subject to the common miseries. As God liveth, in whose presence my soul standeth, thou hast greatly sinned, O priest in saying what thou hast said. May it please God that there come not upon the holy city great vengeance for this sin.'

Then said the priest: `May God pardon us, and do thou pray for us.'

Then Jesus, having lifted up his hands, said: `Lord our God, this is my faith wherewith I shall come to thy judgement; in testimony against every one that shall believe the contrary.' And turning himself towards the people, he said: `Repent, for from all that of which the priest hath said that it is written in the book of Moses, the covenant of God for ever, ye may perceive your sin; for that I am a visible man and a morsel of clay that walketh upon the earth, mortal as are other men.And I have had a beginning, and shall have an end, and [am] such that I cannot create a fly over again.'

Thereupon the people raised their voices weeping, and said: `We have sinned, Lord our God, against thee; have mercy upon us.' And they prayed Jesus, every one, that he would pray for the safety of the holy city, that our God in his anger should not give it over to be trodden down of the nations.

WOE to the corruptors of Jesus' Gospel, and woe to whoever believe in them!

reply to post by queenofangels_17

Very interesting. I've never heard of a Gospel of Jesus. Should I go searching for it, or do you have a little information that is easy to share.

reply to post by DelayedChristmas


Jesus is the Son of God, and God in the flesh. 1 John 4:1 - 3. The First Epistle of John was written by John the Evangelist, so if John the Evangelist and Paul agree with this certain subject, what does that mean? I have had vivid moments where I put this to the test and unholy spirits can NOT answer this question truthfully; they kind of shudder and freeze in fear when asked this question.

My answer...

Jesus is not the son of God, nor was he God in the flesh.

These are the words of Jesus while discoursing with his disciples about the attributes of God. Who would you believe, Jesus or Paul and John?

****

'Tell me, I pray you, if ye should give your money into the bank to a publican, and he should give unto you tenfold and twentyfold, would ye not give to such a man everything that ye had? But I say unto you, verily, that whatsoever ye shall give and shall forsake for love of God, ye receive it back an hundred-fold, and life everlasting. See then how much ye ought to be
content to serve God.

When Jesus had said this, Philip answered: 'We are content to serve God, but we desire, however, to know God, for Isaiah the prophet said: "Verily thou art a hidden God," and God said to Moses his servant: "I am that which I am."

Jesus answered: 'Philip, God is a good without which there is naught good; God is a being without which there is naught that is; God is a life without which there is naught that liveth; so great that he filleth all and is everywhere. He alone hath no equal. He hath had no beginning, nor will he ever have an end, but to everything hath he given a beginning, and to everything shall he give an end. He hath no father nor mother; he hath no sons. nor brethren. nor companions. And because God hath no body, therefore he eateth not, sleepeth not, dieth not, walketh not, moveth not, but abideth eternally without human similitude, for that he is incorporeal, uncompounded, immaterial, of the most simple substance. He is so good that he loveth goodness only; he is so just that when he punisheth or pardoneth it cannot be gainsaid. In short, I say unto thee, Philip, that here on earth thou canst not see him nor know him perfectly; but in his kingdom thou shalt see him for ever: wherein consisteth all our happiness and glory.'

****

Do you still believe Jesus to be God? Jesus himself said that God has no father, nor mother. We all know that Jesus has a mother, although he has no father, like Adam, who was created just from a simple Word, "Be!" Jesus also said, He has no sons, no brother and no companions, while we all know that Jesus has brothers and companions. Most of all, Jesus said that on earth we cannot see God nor know Him perfectly, but in His Kingdom we shall see Him forever.

Jesus is not God in the flesh, who was crucified to erase the sins of mankind. Jesus is a Prophet of God, a spirit from God, but not God.

4:171 O People of the Scripture! Do not exaggerate in your religion nor utter aught concerning Allah save the truth. The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a messenger of Allah, and His word which He conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers, and say not "Three". Cease! (it is) better for you! Allah is only One God. Far is it removed from His transcendent majesty that he should have a son. His is all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth. And Allah is sufficient as Defender.

Would you provide a link to the source you're quoting from?

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by queenofangels_17

 

Very interesting. I've never heard of a Gospel of Jesus. Should I go searching for it, or do you have a little information that is easy to share.

The true teachings of Jesus are contained in his Gospel, a Prophet is always sent with a book, confirming the book and the Prophet who came before him and the Prophet who will come after him.

In his Gospel Jesus confirmed the Torah and the Prophet Moses, and announced the coming of the Prophet Muhammad.

If God wills, I will make a thread dedicated for the purpose of unveiling the True Gospel of Jesus, for those who are really seeking his true teachings. His sheep will know his voice, and God willing they will be joined to his other flock.

*** For now, here are some more teachings of Jesus..

Jesus answered in parable: `A man goeth to fish with a net, and therein he catcheth many fishes, but are bad he throweth away.

`A man went forth to sow, but only the grain that falleth on good ground beareth seed.

`Even so ought ye to do, listening to all and receiving only the truth, seeing that the truth alone beareth fruit unto eternal life.'

Then answered Andrew: `Now how shall the truth be known?

Jasus answered: `Everything that conformeth to the book of Moses, that receive ye for true; seeing that God is one, the truth is one; whence it followeth that the doctrine is one and the meaning of the doctrine is one; and therefore the faith is one. Verily I say unto you that if the truth had not been erased from the book of Moses, God would not have given to David our father the second. And if the book of David had not been contaminated, God would not have committed the Gospel to me; seeing that the Lord our God is unchangeable, and hath spoken but one message to all men. Wherefore, when the messenger of God shall come, he shall come to cleanse away all wherewith the ungodly have contaminated my book'. (Messenger of God here refers to the Prophet Muhammad)

Then answered he who writeth: `O Master, what shall a man do when the law shall be found contaminated and the false prophet shall speak?'

Jesus answered: `Good is thy question, O Barnabas; wherefore I tell thee that in such a time few are saved, seeing that men do not consider their end, which is God. As God liveth in whose presence my soul standeth, every doctrine that shall turn man aside from his end, which is God, is most evil doctrine. Wherefore there are three things that thou shalt consider in doctrine - namely, love towards God, pity towards one's neighbour, and hatred towards thyself, who hast offended God, and offendest him every day.

Wherefore every doctrine that is contrary to these three heads do thou avoid, because it is most evil.

Verses from the Qur'an mentioning the Torah and Gospel of Jesus..

5:46 And We caused Jesus, son of Mary, to follow in their footsteps, confirming that which was (revealed) before him, and We bestowed on him the Gospel wherein is guidance and a light, confirming that which was (revealed) before it in the Torah a guidance and an admonition unto those who ward off (evil).

5:47 Let the People of the Gospel judge by that which Allah hath revealed therein. Whoso judgeth not by that which Allah hath revealed; such are evil-livers.

5:66 If they had observed the Torah and the Gospel and that which was revealed unto them from their Lord, they would surely have been nourished from above them and from beneath their feet. Among them there are people who are moderate, but many of them are of evil conduct.

5:68 Say: O People of the Scripture! Ye have naught (of guidance) till ye observe the Torah and the Gospel and that which was revealed unto you from your Lord. That which is revealed unto thee (Muhammad) from thy Lord is certain to increase the contumacy and disbelief of many of them. But grieve not for the disbelieving folk.

5:110When Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Remember My favor unto thee and unto thy mother; how I strengthened thee with the holy Spirit, so that thou spakest unto mankind in the cradle as in maturity; and how I taught thee the Scripture and Wisdom and the Torah and the Gospel; and how thou didst shape of clay as it were the likeness of a bird by My permission, and didst blow upon it and it was a bird by My permission, and thou didst heal him who was born blind and the leper by My permission; and how thou didst raise the dead, by My permission and how I restrained the Children of Israel from (harming) thee when thou camest unto them with clear proofs, and those of them who disbelieved exclaimed: This is naught else than mere magic;

reply to post by BagBing

Why (and I ask this question honestly) do certain areas of the world feel the need to threaten over ones beliefs? Surely, if ones beliefs where strong enough, this wouldn't happen. Or maybe I'm naive.

No, you are not being naive. This falls under the heading, "Only in America." For myself, I tend to be like the people you described, don't care one way or the other.

Originally posted by BagBing

Originally posted by NihilistSanta
reply to post by BagBing

 

This is why multiculturalism is intentionally forced upon us. To sew the seeds of discord over our differences and keeping people from focusing on real problems to better their families and communities.

Governments seem to import people as much as products in a scheme to flood the market so to speak. The host country is then forced to slowly chip away at their sovereignty and national identity/culture in order to be more multicultural. This causes the people to be forced to live in a homogenized society that no one really wants except the rulers because the end result is erosion of freedom and individuality not to mention the other effects of the divide and conquer stratagem.

It is quite ingenious if not down right diabolical. Makes me wonder if we will see a shift towards ultra nationalism as a backlash to forced globalism which will be the beginnings of isolationist policies and movements to rid undesirables. History repeats itself. Eventually you end up with world war 3 and once the people are tired of the war they will beg for a world govt.

Seems each world war has followed this pattern and each time failed attempts at global govt are made (league of nations/U.N.)

They play on our fears and sympathies. The majority of us want to live lives of peace and harmony with people we share some sort of familial or cultural connection too while at the same time we do not wish to condemn others for wanting the same. What we end up with is political correctness as a form of soft censorship. Take the commander in chief for instance hard to criticize the man when you are called a racist regardless of his policies lack of effectiveness.

It's nice too see racists still exist...

Please show me where what I said was racist. You are aware of what racism means right? Or are you one of these progressive wannabes who throw about buzz words without understanding the actual meaning? Study sociology a bit and understand why people develop their own culture in the first place then get back to me......

reply to post by queenofangels_17

response sent via PM
2nd

reply to post by queenofangels_17

I still wish you had presented a source. Are you talking about this: www.ask.com...
with the full title of The Aquarian Gospel of Jesus the Christ??

Can anybody else help me with this?

reply to post by charles1952


God bless you for looking for the Truth.

Come here and May God guide you!

Be one of 144,000!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Peace!

It really is a shame that some people dont have the inner strength to accept that their own and others views may differ... luckily i have had the pleasure to know many diverse folk and have had great indepth discussions and disagreements with Jews, various types of Christians, Muslims, Sikhs, Hindus etc etc without punching each other in the face.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


No, no we are not - as Babloyi said earlier people should simply avoid reading the Daily Mail (i am assuming that this is where you garner such info, ofc i may be incorrect, but many others do) - it really is a worthless rag who's only purpose seems to be to tell old folk in pretty little villages that their hard working plumber who moved here from Bosnia/Zimbabwe/wherever wants to rape them and eat their cat.
We are a rather tolerant lot overall, and realise that a few screaming crazies means nowt. We get more trouble from our fellow "natives", and anyway, people can bomb us and we'll just go for an extra cuppa and a few custard creams and then get back to work and talking about when it's going to rain next.