It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Why Obama Does Not Have A Birth Certificate

page: 6
23
<< 3  4  5    7  8  9 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:03 PM
link   
reply to post by phroziac
 


*Sigh* why must you make it so difficult. When you are born the hospital issues you a birth certificate as JOHN DOE SMITH, from here it is sent to the Bureau of Vital Statistics; who makes a copy, and then sends the original to the Department of Commerce.

www.archives.gov...

29.4.4 Records relating to apportionment and vital statistics

29.1 ADMINISTRATIVE HISTORY

Established: In the Department of Commerce and Labor by order of the Secretary of Commerce and Labor, July 1, 1903. Agency name legislatively confirmed by act of August 31, 1954 (68 Stat. 1025).
edit on 23-7-2012 by VeritasAequitas because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:04 PM
link   
You wanna know how dishonest these freeman are?

Google "Shepard/Townsend Act of 1922"

Notice the hundreds, no 10K plus results

Now, if you ACTUALLY go look at the results, what do you find?

Typically you find this:


Within two weeks and three days each Certificate of Live Birth is to be filed in Washington D.C. Evidence reveals that there is even a Federal Children Department established by the Shepherd/Townsend Act of 1922 under the Department of Commerce that appears to be involved in this process in some way. Every citizen is given a number (the red number on the Birth Certificate) and each live birth is valued at from $630,000 Federal Reserve dollars in collateral from the Fed.


But I'd challenge you to go find the text of this act, the one all 10K+ freeman and conspiracy sites claim is the legal basis for their hilarious BS.

Go on... find the text.

Then ask, why are the freeman lying to you?

Hmmm...?

edit on 23-7-2012 by longlostbrother because: (no reason given)

edit on 23-7-2012 by longlostbrother because: (no reason given)

edit on 23-7-2012 by longlostbrother because: (no reason given)

edit on 23-7-2012 by longlostbrother because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:05 PM
link   
reply to post by VeritasAequitas
 


Sigh, it's not true sigh



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:08 PM
link   
reply to post by VeritasAequitas
 


Sigh, digging a deeper and deeper hole huh?

You yourself can't produce a birth cert from the "dept of commerce" can you?

No one has, and no one can. You've been scammed, badly.



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:09 PM
link   
reply to post by longlostbrother
 


Here is a question for you; What do 'freemen' gain by saying stuff like this? Absolutely nothing. What would the Government have to gain if it were true? Everything. For them to just 'make stuff up' is an excuse by people who are unwilling to either A) Accept that they have been lied to, or B) unwilling to do the work themselves so rely on the arguments of others to 'debunk' things.



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:12 PM
link   
In case you can't be bother to google that:

millercenter.org...

The Shepherd Towner act of 1922 (not Townsend) lasted for a few years and:



contributed matching federal funds to states to establish and run prenatal and child health care centers


and guess what, the blog that the OP got his ridiculous birth cert image from, also says this:


Within two weeks and three days each Certificate of Live Birth is to be filed in Washington D.C. Evidence reveals that there is even a Federal Children Department established by the Shepherd/Townsend Act of 1922 under the Department of Commerce that appears to be involved in this process in some way. Every citizen is given a number (the red number on the Birth Certificate) and each live birth is valued at from 650,000 to 750,000 Federal Reserve dollars in collateral from the Fed.


gnosis474.blogspot.ie...

More copied and pasted lies... lets watch how they spin this one...



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:13 PM
link   
reply to post by VeritasAequitas
 


Feeling superior.

Which might be useful if they'd ever once one a court case.



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:17 PM
link   
By the way, the ominous "American Bank Note Company":

en.wikipedia.org...

They print everything from stamps to currency to... guess what, "a wide variety of secure and official documents".

Like, I don't know, birth certificates?

Here's someone on the Ron Paul site explaining it:

www.dailypaul.com...

But sure, you gullible freeman never learn, with your fancy made up "acts" and mysterious stationary companies...



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:20 PM
link   
reply to post by VeritasAequitas
 


ocio.os.doc.gov...


Vital records are records that are essential to the continued functioning or reconstitution of the Department and its operating units during and after an emergency. Vital records are divided into two categories: • Emergency operating records include emergency plans and directive(s), orders of succession, delegations of authority, staffing assignments, selected program records needed to continue the most critical Department and operating unit functions, as well as related policy or procedural records that would be needed to conduct operations under emergency conditions and to resume normal operations after the emergency. • Legal and financial rights records are essential to protect the legal and financial rights of the government and of the individuals directly affected by its activities. Examples of these records include titles, deeds, leases, contracts, personnel files, and similar records. Vital records are duplicate records created and maintained solely in case of an emergency. They may be destroyed when no longer needed because they become outdated or are replaced by more current records. Procedures for the creation and maintenance of vital records and their identification are in the Continuity of Operations Plan (COOP) for each operating unit. Each program office is responsible for identifying, creating, and maintaining its vital records. RMOs are responsible for assisting program offices in identifying records that should be designated as vital and providing advice regarding records management issues.



vitalrec.com



Information about where to obtain vital records such as birth certificates, death records and marriage records from each state, territory and county of the U.S



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:22 PM
link   
reply to post by longlostbrother
 


Admirable, you did some work on your own. However read that act, it was to provide relief for single mothers who had bastard children. Why do they ask for the Mother's maiden name on a birth certificate?



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:23 PM
link   

Originally posted by longlostbrother
reply to post by VeritasAequitas
 


Gold fringe BS, thoroughly debunked:

www.ecclesia.org...

That link list multiple court cases, all lost by flag "fringers" all dealing with this BS.


"a 1925 Attorney General’s Opinion (34 Op Atty. Gen 483) states:

The fringe does not appear to be regarded as an integral part of the Flag, and its presence cannot be said to constitute an unauthorized addition to the design prescribed by statute. An external fringe is to be distinguished from letters, words, or emblematic designs printed or superimposed upon the body of the flag itself. Under law, such additions might be open to objection as unauthorized; but the same is not necessarily true of the fringe."


That is because the fringe as a feature of the flag was not authorized by statute, but by executive order 10834.

This executive order has been mostly summarized but if you look hard enough, you can find an appendix to this order under 3 CFR, 1959-1963 Comp., p. 368.
To save you the work, and to also stop you from posting summarized links to this appendix, I have found a copy of the actual hand drawn original appendix from the department of defense.
What this executive order did was list the dimensions of an official flag, and in the appendix they were drawn.

And in the appendix, the official colors were listed and they are listed as follows.

Red...... 70180
White... 70001
Blue..... 70075
Yellow.. 65001 for fringe when applicable.

Here is a link to the actual hand drawing.
Here is yet another link.

You will notice that it is only used when applicable and it is designated by the Department of Defense and the Department of Army Institute of Heraldry.

This is because this fringed flag is a MILITARY FLAG.

And this is made clear by EXECUTIVE ORDER.

Your court case was not incorrect, but like all court cases the words that they use have specific meaning and can easily create a false impression if you are not armed with vital information.
This fact has been shown to you again and again and again.

The fringe is not integral to the flag because it only applies to a MILITARY FLAG.
It was not unauthorized by statute, but authorized by executive order.

I have shown you the actual law now.
Go back to your deather fantasyland.

edit on 23/7/2012 by kyviecaldges because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:24 PM
link   
reply to post by VeritasAequitas
 


Sorry, but show me in the act where all the freeman conspiracy is setup.

Go on...



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:26 PM
link   

Originally posted by longlostbrother
reply to post by VeritasAequitas
 


Sorry, but show me in the act where all the freeman conspiracy is setup.

Go on...



I have shown you the executive order-

Here is a copy from the federal archives.

link to source

Scroll all the way down to the bottom and read the editorial note.



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:31 PM
link   
reply to post by kyviecaldges
 


Again, that's copied off a freeman site and again it's BS:

www.usa-flag-site.org...




There's a group of folks out there who have conocted a silly story that the fringe on a US flag has some kind of hidden, sinister meaning. As you've seen from the threads here in the forum, they post the same information over and over again. It's mostly quotes that are faked or taken out of context from the 1959 Executive Order, AR 840-10, and the 1925 Attorney General's opinion. None of these documents actually says anything about the fringe having any symbolism whatsoever. In fact, the 1925 opinion quotes a War Department circular that says the opposite:

"For a number of years there has been prescribed in Army Regulations a knotted fringe of yellow silk on the national standards of mounted regiments and on the national colors of unmounted regiments. The War Department, however, knows of no law which either requires or prohibits the placing of a fringe on the flag of the United States. No Act of Congress or Executive Order has been found bearing on the question. In flag manufacture a fringe is not considered to be a part of the flag, and it is without heraldic significance."



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:31 PM
link   
reply to post by kyviecaldges
 


As I also showed him that the Department of Commerce does indeed retain Vital Records. Guess what kids...The Birth certificate is a vital record.



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:33 PM
link   
reply to post by kyviecaldges
 


Read it. IT says NOTHING about Fringes only being on military flags.

NOTHING.



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:36 PM
link   
reply to post by VeritasAequitas
 


The Dept of Commerce DOES hold some records, but I send you to their website where they specifically say they don't.

So unless you can prove they're lying.... you're just, once again, making stuff up.



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:36 PM
link   

Originally posted by longlostbrother
reply to post by kyviecaldges
 


Again, that's copied off a freeman site and again it's BS:


You are making stuff up.

The site with a link to a the original hand drawn appendix is NOT a freeman site.

You obviously didn't visit the site.

I gave you the executive order from the archives.

I gave you a link to a site that describes the process necessary to begin selling official flags for the US government.

You have no other recourse but to make up lie after lie after lie to support your argument.

How thoroughly you have been shot down.
You are obviously uncomfortable and you cannot think of any other argument.



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:38 PM
link   
reply to post by kyviecaldges
 


BS.

I went to the site, looked at the drawing and read the text, no where does it say fringe is only for military flags...

Go and copy that text and paste it here...

As for the D of C:




Age Search and Birth Records

No agency within the Department of Commerce issues, maintains, or makes use of birth certificates, including the U.S. Census Bureau. The state Health Department or the Department of Vital Statistics of the state in which you were born should be able to provide a personal birth certificate. To assist you in your data search, we have enclosed the addresses on where to write for birth records in the United States.


www.census.gov...



posted on Jul, 23 2012 @ 12:41 PM
link   

Originally posted by longlostbrother
reply to post by kyviecaldges
 


Read it. IT says NOTHING about Fringes only being on military flags.

NOTHING.


Yes it does.

I linked the original appendix from the executive order and it states that yellow is one of the official colors for the flag and it is used for fringe when needed.
That is why I told you to scroll to the bottom and read the editorial note.

Read again:

Editorial note: The attachment detailing the proportions of the constituent parts of the flag, which was attached to and made a part of Executive Order 10834, is printed in 3 CFR, 1959-1963 Comp., p. 368.

link to source

And again for you.

And again the link to the original hand drawn appendix made a part of Executive Order 10834 as printed in 3 CFR, 1959-1963 Comp., p. 368.

You are wrong.
You are wrongity wrong in the wrongest possible way and being beat over the head with the wrong stick.
edit on 23/7/2012 by kyviecaldges because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
23
<< 3  4  5    7  8  9 >>

log in

join