Jobs are a RIGHT, not a privilege. All are entitled to employment.

Originally posted by DJMSN
reply to post by James1982

 

Property taxes are not extortion...we have to be able to pay those that do provide services like schools...police and fire....water and sewage...trash pick up....and yes the roads that we drive on to get to and from work. Taxes are excessive between city state and federal and unless we provide jobs like trash pick up to those of you who would rather have a job assigned then there is no other way to get around it....government does not produce revenue on its on except through taxation...if you really wish to live off the grid...one can frow you own food,,,hunt and fish...burn your trash....secure yourself and have a bucket brigade to put out fires...but if you wish to be able to go and get a burger at BK...then you have to have so sort of road to get there...if you want internet then the infrastructure has to be there...water then you need pipes....school then money is required

Hence the problem, we are not allowed to "opt out" as I said. Just as a slave is not allowed to decide to stop being a slave, we are not allowed to stop being involved with the system that controls and governs us. Therefore, just as a slave-master always provides work for his slaves, the government should provide work for its citizens (slaves)

Why do I need water from pipes? Why can't I obtain my water from lakes or streams, and take the personal responsibility to make sure it's potable? And if property tax pays for water pipes, what is my monthly water bill paying for? The water? The water is free. It's just sitting there.

Why do I need the internet? And if property taxes pays for the internet, what's my monthly internet bill all about?

Where are my gas taxes and million other car fees going to if property taxes pay for the roads? What do I need roads for if I don't buy my food from the store, or have a job?

If property taxes pay for trash pickup, why do I pay a monthly bill to waste management? They stop picking up my trash when I stop paying my bill, shouldn't my property tax be covering it?

If property tax supports the infrastructure of the country where are all my state, and federal income taxes going?

if you really wish to live off the grid...one can frow you own food,,,hunt and fish...burn your trash....secure yourself and have a bucket brigade to put out fires..

But that's the problem, I'm not allowed to do that. Even if I'm 100% independent and don't require roads, or bridges, or water and sewage service, etc I still have to pay property tax. I am not allowed to escape the prison of generating and using income.

Everyone has the right to work, not the right to a job. A job has requirements if you meet those requirements you have the right to accept it or reject it.
Employers have the right to hire or reject you for what ever reason.
Now adays there is less demand, less supplys and less work.
Someone is willing to take less than you and do more work just to survive.
The system needs us to survive, yet we are afraid of the system, and afraid to leave it, so we accept that we can not survive without it.
You are a slave only if you accept it.
Stop blaming the system, "We" , as a people, generation after generation lost control.
You want to change the system ?
Start at home in your own town / city, get involved, help decide what are the real prioritys.
Get involved and change the laws and police proceedures.
Get involved set your taxes or elimiate them.
Stop leaving these jobs to strangers .

Originally posted by DJMSN
reply to post by Sinny

 

How can you expect the services you recieve as a property owner without paying for them ? The legalaties in accordence with the Constitution aside...we must pay towards fire...police...clean water....in some places you can opt out of fire protection by not paying...dont pay for clean water....and as for police it comes with the territory....not arguing in favor of taxes but we cannot have what we have without paying for it

All of those things are not a choice, they are forced on us. And like I previously said, what are all my state and federal income taxes going to if property tax is supposedly paying for all the services that I don't even use?

The government should at least offer a job's program doing something useful in the community for money.

Or better yet, IMO I think we should completely remove the concept of volunteering and replace it with money.

Seriously, if we have to live in this System which requires you to have money, then money should be abundant and easy to obtain.

And at the same time we raise the quality of life and create a sense of community...

I think the only solution for the op and like minded people is another country with a different form of government, specifically no government.

Because what you are describing is not a constitutional republic but a ...I don't know..does it have a name besides "the wild"?

You don't want to live in a society and you want to subject the majority to this anarchy for your comfort, that's insane...you are in a tiny minority so it is up to you to live with it or move on.

The Amazon, Columbian rain forest, Somalia...anywhere there is no civilized society.

reply to post by timetothink


If you don't own land, then you must rent, which costs money. The entire basis here is that if we are REQUIRED to earn us dollars in order to simply stay alive, then we also have a right to be guaranteed the means with which to generate those dollars.

Most of you people are still hopelessly tied to the idea that money = life. Such an ideal is not natural nor is it right. People lived for thousands upon thousands of years without being required to pay to live.

If you require me to pay to live, then it's up to you to make sure I have the means to pay.

reply to post by James1982


Sorry it doesn't work that way. It would be better if it did, but nothing says we're entitled to employment. If that were true there would be no unemployment, homelessness, or accute poverty. There would be no illegals coming over here to do "jobs Americans won't do"

Even going to college doesn't guarantee you a job in your chosen profession.

Reply to post by 1loserel2

That is how it works if you think about it. I mean if you are unemployed you can get unemployment. Most people living in poverty do have jobs they just dont make living wages. The homeless are a tricky issue because a lot of them suffer from substance abuse or mental illness.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by James1982


Then you want to abolish the monetary system...but there has always been some sort of trade system whether it was furs or beads or gold.....its human nature tit for tat...

You cannot just change human nature and the way of the world...slow down...it's like the feminists denying that women are women....we are what we are and things work in a certain way...this for that.

I agree with you because its logical. I understand that everyone has different opinions about jobs and some get paid more than others but im certain more people would feel diferent if minimum wage was reduced to 5 dollars an hour.
Now for a well paid person that gets lets say 35/hr and if you were to reduced 5 dollars off that person he would probably get pissed off but a at least hell still be getting paid 30 dollars an hour which is still good.
For someone thats was getting paid 10/hr and reduced to 5, now thats a BIG difference it would make a Huge impact on that persons life.
Pretty much the concept is to work hard, and I agree, but thats the concept. Working and trying hard on mostly anything can make some people successful. But its not true for everybody and everything.
Now imagine if minimum wage was reduced to 1/hr and everyones wage has been drastically reduced. It would create chaos just like it happens in 3rd world countries.

if that were to happen in the United States, what would the American people do?
Would some of then still say "Just go with the flow" and would actually still work for the governments, OBVIOUS, selfish economic ways even though now they are getting paid 1/hr and food prices are still high?

Or would they actually finally wake up and realize that the Greedy Power Hungry Bosses are being unfair and we must do something about it!?

Im quite sure that alot of people would actually start breaking into homes and stealing from there neighbors, who are in the same situation as they are, but why would they do that?
Why not just take back whats yours and make the system right and fair, as it should be and as it always should have been from the beginning.

reply to post by James1982
If you own property and want the additions that come with paying property taxes (schools, roads, emergency services, sewer, et al) then payment should be vouluntary.

But if you own property and don't require those services, then I agree, you should have the abiliy to opt out.

reply to post by James1982


So you don't drive anywhere by using a road....you don't live in a house or aprtment that needs fire protection...and police protection...did not go to school...federal taxes are a joke as most of us get a check at the end of the year and don't pay much in taxes...but they did help pay for the research that created the internet snd you do use that...those federal tax dollars also go toward agencies that regulate banks....and other industry...not a perfect system but it does seem to work...and our taxes are the lowest in the world at this time...but get ready...they are about to increase.

None of these services are forced on you...not until you need them and then you want them...the government would not be able to pay you for any job they gave you if you did not pay taxes...they do not do anything that creates revenue...instead they collect it thru taxation right or wrong that they only recieve when you work. Nothing is a right in this world and certainly not a job...time to grow up and face the facts

reply to post by James1982


Conservative republican says get your own damn job ya bum, but please don't tax me according to the constitution!

I agree with you though. I think everyone should have a decent paying job, enough to pay the bills and provide the necessities of live. Maybe even have a little left over at the end of each month for a few indulgences or room to save up some money.

As long as those that live friviless keep pushing their greed promoting ideals, that will never happen. Pure capitalism is a greed based economy. It rewards those that already have, and those willing to do whatever it takes whether morally correct or not. It really doesn't reward honesty and hard work.

Not that long ago I watched a news feature where one of our local anchors took the police to a homeless "camp" in the woods and got them all removed. I think the problem started when we all drew imaginery lines and said, GET OFF MY LAWN!

Yes you are entitled to participate in your slavery, yes, you should have a right to ensure you CAN pay taxes, yes you should be a good little beaver and throw yourself out of the door every day (well six a week at least) and waste your life doing something that doesn't really matter.
Yes you should spend the time better used to be bringing up your children, in the pursuit of barely enough money to support them.
Yes you should be entitled to all the stresses that come with working in an environment controlled by someone else, and hopefully their won't be any personality clashes that make life a living misery.
Yes you should be entitled to a job that may in some cases cause life long illnesses or even death at work.
No you shouldn't have a choice in it, and by making sure everyone has a job, and it is a "right" we your loving and trusting government will ensure there is a position in life for you.
You maybe asked to go into the sewers and shovel # all day for pennies, you may be asked to go to the coalface and chew the coal out with your teeth and fingertips, we will find you a position with an employer who doesn't really want you there, and who will no doubt treat you with little more than benign neglect as you stagnate for year after year in the same place, literally sapping your will to live.
But, you will have a RIGHT to be there.

Or, how about, we organise society so that people can do what they want, when they want, long term free education, and TRAINING to become the best that you can be, for EVERYONE.
That should be a right, think Bigger.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by James1982

 

If you own property and want the additions that come with paying property taxes (schools, roads, emergency services, sewer, et al) then payment should be vouluntary.

But if you own property and don't require those services, then I agree, you should have the abiliy to opt out.

edit on 22-7-2012 by beezzer because: (no reason given)

Beezer your taxes DO NOT PAY FOR THOSE THINGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

Your taxes are barely paying the interest ALONE on the massive amount of money the government has borrowed.
You personally at birth owed a massive sum that was leveraged against your lifetimes taxes.
Your taxes pay this "Loan" back, in fact if you didn't have to pay those taxes, you would have been able to afford a $300.000.00 Home, above and beyond, what you may already own,(providing you maintain the payments they expect you too)
Taxes are the literal theft of your lifetimes output by labour, for products and services, for which money was borrowed and pissed away on other things you will never see any benefit from like.
Underground bases, Military research, funding the IRS, maintaining corrupt politicians, TARP, other to big to fail programs, tax cuts for the uber rich, all your infrastructure is knackered, needs repairing, and is in danger of being sold off to private corporations.
Everything else is "Privatised" water, gas, electricity, all the things that are necessary to maintain "Modern" slavery, and the illusion of freedom.

reply to post by James1982


I think you've made a very good point. I never did see it quite that way before.

S and F