Is Jesus the only way to God?

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by jhill76
reply to post by Deetermined

 

No, that talks about changing ways, but not confessing him as savior as a requirement. I appreciate you looking, but this has been taught by others and not Jesus himself. If I am wrong, I will gladly admit it.

Well, this we know for sure.

John 10:9

9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

So, JHill76, go ask Father what Jesus meant when he said, "by me IF any man enter in" and get back to me on that, would you please? Thanks!

Yes, by doing what he says to do in this life, you will enter. Still, not confessing him as savior is a requirement. It's all about choices and actions, and where your heart is. Outward showings of faith are great, but not a requirement as others will tell you.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by UB2120

 

I am a follower of the teachings of Jesus as presented in the Urantia Book. In the Life and Teachings of Jesus laid out in its pages he does say the above quote that no one comes to the Father except through me. But let me explain the expanded view of what that means as described in the Urantia Book (www.urantia.org...).

I'm not interested in how the Urantia Book describes it.

I only want to know Jesus' quotes that are in it.



What quotes from Jesus do you have there? Care to share any others?

A quater of the book is about his Life and Teachings. Very inspiring.

From Paper 180: (www.urantia.org...-jump-result-0)

(1947.3) 180:3.4 “Let not your hearts be troubled. You believe in God; continue to believe also in me. Even though I must leave you, I will not be far from you. I have already told you that in my Father’s universe there are many tarrying-places. If this were not true, I would not have repeatedly told you about them. I am going to return to these worlds of light, stations in the Father’s heaven to which you shall sometime ascend. From these places I came into this world, and the hour is now at hand when I must return to my Father’s work in the spheres on high. *

(1947.4) 180:3.5 “If I thus go before you into the Father’s heavenly kingdom, so will I surely send for you that you may be with me in the places that were prepared for the mortal sons of God before this world was. Even though I must leave you, I will be present with you in spirit, and eventually you shall be with me in person when you have ascended to me in my universe even as I am about to ascend to my Father in his greater universe. And what I have told you is true and everlasting, even though you may not fully comprehend it. I go to the Father, and though you cannot now follow me, you shall certainly follow me in the ages to come.”

(1947.5) 180:3.6 When Jesus sat down, Thomas arose and said: “Master, we do not know where you are going; so of course we do not know the way. But we will follow you this very night if you will show us the way.”

(1947.6) 180:3.7 When Jesus heard Thomas, he answered: “Thomas, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man goes to the Father except through me. All who find the Father, first find me. If you know me, you know the way to the Father. And you do know me, for you have lived with me and you now see me.”

Originally posted by jhill76

Yes, by doing what he says to do in this life, you will enter. Still, not confessing him as savior is a requirement. It's all about choices and actions, and where your heart is. Outward showings of faith are great, but not a requirement as others will tell you.

Can you show me the scripture where it says as long as we do what he says that we will enter in and be saved?

Thanks!

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by jhill76

Yes, by doing what he says to do in this life, you will enter. Still, not confessing him as savior is a requirement. It's all about choices and actions, and where your heart is. Outward showings of faith are great, but not a requirement as others will tell you.

Can you show me the scripture where it says as long as we do what he says that we will enter in and be saved?

Thanks!

Your scripture you just posted states this, by him you will enter. By doing what he says you will enter, by him coming down and doing what he did, you now have a chnace to enter, but by him. It still does not state you have to profess him as savior to enter heaven. No one has still provided scripture, saying otherwise. All we have is others drawing this conclusion, but Jesus never said this.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by UB2120

 

I found this quote inside your Urantia Book link:

The Urantia Book, first published by Urantia Foundation in 1955, claims to have been presented by celestial beings as a revelation to our planet, Urantia.

We already know you can't trust every celestial being.

Have these particular celestial beings been tested by the receivers?

What tests were they put through?

The story about how the book came into being is an interesting one. Although a human was used as a way to initiate communication, it was not channeled through this human. They called him a sleeping subject as these celestial beings would only speak through him once he was asleep. And the human had little interest in what was being transmitted. He worked with a doctor for many years at the request of his wife and once this doctor was convienced that these things were not originating in his own mind the celestial beings began direct communication.

The book was actually received in 1934/35 and was published in 1955. Many believe they waited till the human known as the sleeping subject was dead. They did not want human authorship to be associated with the book. You only have to read a little bit to see that it is far beyond anything a human could write.

The book should be judge by its teachings. You will not find a book that glorifies God more. Also you won't find a book that describes an afterlife that is more fair. Basically every individual is given an honest attempt at the afterlife regardless of how they lived their life. You are given a choice. God compells no one.

What I did when I first started reading the UB is to search for answers to questions I had from Christanity. I found suitible answers to all my questions that Christanity had no answers for. That may not work for you, but what does it hurt to look?

reply to post by UB2120

(1947.6) 180:3.7 When Jesus heard Thomas, he answered: “Thomas, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man goes to the Father except through me. All who find the Father, first find me. If you know me, you know the way to the Father. And you do know me, for you have lived with me and you now see me.”

So, what does it take to really "know" Jesus according to the Urantia Book?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by UB2120

 

(1947.6) 180:3.7 When Jesus heard Thomas, he answered: “Thomas, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man goes to the Father except through me. All who find the Father, first find me. If you know me, you know the way to the Father. And you do know me, for you have lived with me and you now see me.”

So, what does it take to really "know" Jesus according to the Urantia Book?

It's golden rule/common sense stuff. The core of his teachings in the Urantia Book are: To love God as your Father and Man as your Brother. He didn't go around teaching about himself other than to say that he was one with the Father and "who has seen me has seen the Father". But he basically only taught about God, not about himself.

From paper 162: (www.urantia.org...-jump-result-0)

1790.4) 162:2.1 The first afternoon that Jesus taught in the temple, a considerable company sat listening to his words depicting the liberty of the new gospel and the joy of those who believe the good news, when a curious listener interrupted him to ask: “Teacher, how is it you can quote the Scriptures and teach the people so fluently when I am told that you are untaught in the learning of the rabbis?” Jesus replied: “No man has taught me the truths which I declare to you. And this teaching is not mine but His who sent me. If any man really desires to do my Father’s will, he shall certainly know about my teaching, whether it be God’s or whether I speak for myself. He who speaks for himself seeks his own glory, but when I declare the words of the Father, I thereby seek the glory of him who sent me. But before you try to enter into the new light, should you not rather follow the light you already have? Moses gave you the law, yet how many of you honestly seek to fulfill its demands? Moses in this law enjoins you, saying, ‘You shall not kill’; notwithstanding this command some of you seek to kill the Son of Man.”

Originally posted by jhill76

Your scripture you just posted states this, by him you will enter. By doing what he says you will enter, by him coming down and doing what he did, you now have a chnace to enter, but by him. It still does not state you have to profess him as savior to enter heaven. No one has still provided scripture, saying otherwise. All we have is others drawing this conclusion, but Jesus never said this.

Well, all of this just brought us back to square one with this:

John 8:24

24) I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

I don't think this was "others" conclusion. No, those were Jesus' words.

reply to post by jhill76

Could Jesus have meant, imitate me, be like me, and you can enter heaven?

I will give you an answer just as soon as you bring sight to the blind, make the lame to walk, and raise the dead.

No he's not. Yaaaaaawn, Same old man made fairy tale discussion. It's nothing short of the greatest lie ever told. Foolish mortals. For the brainwashed sheoplized believers. Take a step outside tonight, and if it's a clear one take notice of the one true God above you. = The Universe. ~$heopleNation

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by jhill76

Your scripture you just posted states this, by him you will enter. By doing what he says you will enter, by him coming down and doing what he did, you now have a chnace to enter, but by him. It still does not state you have to profess him as savior to enter heaven. No one has still provided scripture, saying otherwise. All we have is others drawing this conclusion, but Jesus never said this.

Well, all of this just brought us back to square one with this:

John 8:24

24) I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

I don't think this was "others" conclusion. No, those were Jesus' words.

Believe that he was sent from above from what is written. This still does not state confessing him as savior to enter as a requirement. For if they believed in him, they will change their ways, because their current ways are of sin.

Can you provide scripture stating that you have to confess him as Savior to enter, from his own words?

If you do not know, just please state this, if I don't know something, I will gladly say it.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by jhill76

 

Could Jesus have meant, imitate me, be like me, and you can enter heaven?

I will give you an answer just as soon as you bring sight to the blind, make the lame to walk, and raise the dead.

I see, many still cannot answer the question at hand.

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.

Originally posted by jhill76
Many are taught that accepting Jesus Christ and accepting him into your life, you will be saved from hell. But, did Brother make this claim? The closest we can come to this is:

John 14:6

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

Could Jesus have meant, imitate me, be like me, and you can enter heaven? Do you really think people who lived their lives like Brother, but don't accept him as Savior will be sent to eternal damnation?
You have other scriptures that talk about accepting Christ, but did Brother specifically say to do this or perish? Is it possible with having a direct relationship with God, or choosing your own way to God, but being good?

edit on 19-7-2012 by jhill76 because: (no reason given)

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King James Version

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1And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; 2Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: 3Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. 4But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved) 6And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: 7That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

11Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; 12That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: 17And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. 18For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father. 19Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; 20And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 21In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: 22In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
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New American Standard Bible

1“Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. 2“In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. 3“If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also. 4“And you know the way where I am going.” 5Thomas said to Him, “Lord, we do not know where You are going, how do we know the way?” 6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.

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King James Version

1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

7Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

reply to post by chrisb9


Is saying Jesus is my savior a requirement to enter heaven?

Originally posted by jhill76

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by jhill76

Your scripture you just posted states this, by him you will enter. By doing what he says you will enter, by him coming down and doing what he did, you now have a chnace to enter, but by him. It still does not state you have to profess him as savior to enter heaven. No one has still provided scripture, saying otherwise. All we have is others drawing this conclusion, but Jesus never said this.

Well, all of this just brought us back to square one with this:

John 8:24

24) I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

I don't think this was "others" conclusion. No, those were Jesus' words.

Believe that he was sent from above from what is written. This still does not state confessing him as savior to enter as a requirement.

JHill76, you do realize that your words sound exactly like the ploys of Satan don't you?

As in half truths?

You and I both know that in order for people to believe that Jesus was sent from above would also require an understanding as to why he was sent from above!

No, the disciples who walked with Jesus knew what he was talking about and you didn't walk with Jesus in human life. This is where I discredit you by leading others to believe that the men who walked with Christ didn't understand the message that Jesus had them spread in the first place.

For you to undermine the work of the disciples, discredits the ability of God and Jesus to speak to them. This would undermine the Holy Spirit as well and you know what the Bible says about that! Blasphemy! That is exactly what you are trying to do. I object.

Regardless of whether you claim that Jesus said it himself, let me remind you what else Jesus had to say.

John 6:36-40

6 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.

47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

Get that? "Every man therefore that hath heard"! Heard the calling from God! God is the one who directs people to Jesus by way of the Holy Spirit! Jesus said that since none had seen the Father that the only ones who he will raise up are those who believeth on him because of it!

Read John 6:36 again, not everyone who saw Jesus believed in him. It takes the Holy Spirit to hear and recognize what is being said and the disciples were speaking through the way of the Holy Spirit too!

I have thought on this question some years back. Is Jesus Christ the only way to God? I would have to say yes. Reading what he said and did and has done perpetuates a yearning to be like him. He took pity on us all. How did we repay him? For those that do not believe that he was the Christ I put to you this question. Would you die for a lie? I would not.

I have read some posts that say that Christ's words are the only ones that matter. I ask this question of you. Why would he choose his apostles to follow, listen, watch, and gather information from him. He told them he would send the spirit to comfort them after he left. His spirit. That is why I believe that their words and instruction are very important also.

One poster wrote that Paul had nothing to do with Christ.
Well he started his journey with the name Saul. He was against those that followed Christ. He even held someone's cloak for them as they stoned Stephen to death. Stephen was a follower of Christ. So we can see that Saul was not looking to be a follower of Christ. He was dead set against it. He persecuted the followers. Then all of a sudden he changed his mind. He claimed Christ appeared to him and that is all it took. Oh yeah, there is the whole going blind thing that happened. As soon as he was healed at the hands of Anani'as he began spreading the good news.

You see the Apostles of Christ also healed many people from their afflictions. So unless anyone amongst us can heal the blind or make the lame walk, I think I will take guidance from the Apostles before the guidance of what most of these posters think is the right way of doing things. Just my 2 cents.

Peace, Love, and Harmony.

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by jhill76

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by jhill76

Your scripture you just posted states this, by him you will enter. By doing what he says you will enter, by him coming down and doing what he did, you now have a chnace to enter, but by him. It still does not state you have to profess him as savior to enter heaven. No one has still provided scripture, saying otherwise. All we have is others drawing this conclusion, but Jesus never said this.

Well, all of this just brought us back to square one with this:

John 8:24

24) I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

I don't think this was "others" conclusion. No, those were Jesus' words.

Believe that he was sent from above from what is written. This still does not state confessing him as savior to enter as a requirement.

JHill76, you do realize that your words sound exactly like the ploys of Satan don't you?

As in half truths?

Wow, questioning organized religion will get you labeled Satan quite rapidly.

I sure am glad I believe in the God that isn't too self conscious to be questioned. My God knows he is God and welcomes any and all questions, as they are the way to the truth. the real truth that is.

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by jhill76

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by jhill76

Your scripture you just posted states this, by him you will enter. By doing what he says you will enter, by him coming down and doing what he did, you now have a chnace to enter, but by him. It still does not state you have to profess him as savior to enter heaven. No one has still provided scripture, saying otherwise. All we have is others drawing this conclusion, but Jesus never said this.

Well, all of this just brought us back to square one with this:

John 8:24

24) I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

I don't think this was "others" conclusion. No, those were Jesus' words.

Believe that he was sent from above from what is written. This still does not state confessing him as savior to enter as a requirement.

JHill76, you do realize that your words sound exactly like the ploys of Satan don't you?

As in half truths?

You and I both know that in order for people to believe that Jesus was sent from above would also require an understanding as to why he was sent from above!

No, the disciples who walked with Jesus knew what he was talking about and you didn't walk with Jesus in human life. This is where I discredit you by leading others to believe that the men who walked with Christ didn't understand the message that Jesus had them spread in the first place.

For you to undermine the work of the disciples, discredits the ability of God and Jesus to speak to them. This would undermine the Holy Spirit as well and you know what the Bible says about that! Blasphemy! That is exactly what you are trying to do. I object.

Regardless of whether you claim that Jesus said it himself, let me remind you what else Jesus had to say.

John 6:36-40

6 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.

47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

Get that? "Every man therefore that hath heard"! Heard the calling from God! God is the one who directs people to Jesus by way of the Holy Spirit! Jesus said that since none had seen the Father that the only ones who he will raise up are those who believeth on him because of it!

Read John 6:36 again, not everyone who saw Jesus believed in him. It takes the Holy Spirit to hear and recognize what is being said and the disciples were speaking through the way of the Holy Spirit too!

I agree with this post.

reply to post by Deetermined

JHill76, you do realize that your words sound exactly like the ploys of Satan don't you?

You label my words of those of Satan because I am asking you to provide proof that you have to claim Jesus as your Savior to enter into the gates.

Many resort to this tactic, when they can't provide what is asked of them. Any time someone questions a Christian, they resort to blaming these things on Satan.

I do not want to know anything else besides what I asked of you to provide. If you can not do that, just admit it. Don't attack my questions.

You and I both know that in order for people to believe that Jesus was sent from above would also require an understanding as to why he was sent from above! No, the disciples who walked with Jesus knew what he was talking about and you didn't walk with Jesus in human life. This is where I discredit you by leading others to believe that the men who walked with Christ didn't understand the message that Jesus had them spread in the first place. For you to undermine the work of the disciples, discredits the ability of God and Jesus to speak to them. This would undermine the Holy Spirit as well and you know what the Bible says about that! Blasphemy! That is exactly what you are trying to do. I object. Regardless of whether you claim that Jesus said it himself, let me remind you what else Jesus had to say.

Again, my question stands: Where does Jesus state, you have to confess him as your Savior as a requirement to enter heaven?

Answer the question, instead of going around the question. Even in his day, when Jesus came around, they thought he was the work of Satan. You are doing the same exact thing.

reply to post by jhill76


Let me show you what else the Bible says about blasphemy.

Matthew 12

30 He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.

31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

So, JHill, Jesus warned us that blasphemy against him was forgivable, but blasphemy against the Holy Ghost was not and when you discredit the workings and teachings of the disciples, that's exactly what you do. For most of them even said that it was through the Holy Ghost that they were even speaking in the first place!