George Takei's blog on the BSA reaffirmation of the ban on LGBT Scouts & Leaders

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by Christian Voice
reply to post by Annee

 

No, equality must not be forced. A disability cannot be helped, nor can the color of your skin, but the choice of homosexuality can.

I really have no tolerance for ignorance anymore.

Same sex attraction is a birth right - - it is how God made them.

Why don't you get out of your "cloistered world" - - - and get some real facts.

Yeah, I hear you Annee. Unfortunately, the ignorant Christian fanatic hate groups will always be here, but their voice is getting smaller. Pretty soon, we won't even be able to hear them anymore. We just have to be patient.

Some where in the Bible is also says all Naysayers will be punished.

HMMPH. Leading a life of hate may be punishment enough. Stop hating the gays.

SCIENCE 101:
What is the outcome of the male orgasm?
answer - Sperm
what is the only function of sperm?
to fertilize an egg to create another life
Given that naturally speaking of course that sperm is the Natural result of the male orgasm, and that it's only function Naturally is to fertilize an egg for procreation then we can assume that the Natural function of sex is for procreation. Men do not produce eggs and women do not produce sperm. So how can two men having sex with one another or two women having sex with each other be concidered Natural? When two men have sex with each other, they emulate heterosexual sex, likewise women emulate heterosexual sex. In other words they immitate heterosexual Natural sex. Women use penis shaped items on each other and men insert in "holes" to immitate a vagina. It is unnatural, plain and simple.

reply to post by kaylaluv


Again,,,, answer me SOMEONE PLEASE!!! Why do we hate you just because we disagree with you? Answer this before this thread goes any further please.
Since you disagree with me then doesn't that mean also that you must hate me?

Originally posted by Christian Voice
SCIENCE 101:
What is the outcome of the male orgasm?
answer - Sperm
what is the only function of sperm?
to fertilize an egg to create another life
Given that naturally speaking of course that sperm is the Natural result of the male orgasm, and that it's only function Naturally is to fertilize an egg for procreation then we can assume that the Natural function of sex is for procreation. Men do not produce eggs and women do not produce sperm. So how can two men having sex with one another or two women having sex with each other be concidered Natural? When two men have sex with each other, they emulate heterosexual sex, likewise women emulate heterosexual sex. In other words they immitate heterosexual Natural sex. Women use penis shaped items on each other and men insert in "holes" to immitate a vagina. It is unnatural, plain and simple.

are you trying to tell me the only reason people have sex is to get pregnant? 0.o

reply to post by truthinfact


The Bible says that God put pain in childbirth and that he would make her desire for her husband and his for her. Sex has to feel good and be enjoyable or people would not do it considering the pain in childbirth. I am saying the Natural purpose for sex is reproduction. That's why it's called sexual reproduction. Children are the outcome of sex so I would say Naturally yes, reproduction is the only Natural function of sex

My last post in this thread will be about CHOICE. Choice is what America is. Not allowing a gay person into a private organization is legal and upholds our rights as people. That is choice. Directly harming another individual is NOT a choice. So until these private organizations directly hurt or harm a gay person then they're within the law and I do not see why anybody is arguing about it.

This link lists some alternatives to the Boy Scouts of America private organization:
www.bsa-discrimination.org...

And if you want to argue that not allowing gays into BSA is hurting or harming the gays who tried to gain admission then you'll be busy for a long time because there're a lot of people who don't gain admission to various private groups for various reasons. I've already given a couple examples in this thread. The first was the NBA. There're so many african americans and most of hte players are tall. Isn't that discriminatory? Lets force them to sign more short players and more caucasions and asians. The other example I gave was MENSA. It only admits members who have a specific benchmark IQ. Is that not discriminatory? So shouldn't we force MENSA to allow people entrance into their organization irregardless of their IQ? Another example I can think of is how chinese restaurants try to hire mostly asian employees to be the waiters and cashiers and so on. Shouldn't we force them to hire more non-asians to be less discriminatory? And I'm certain I could list many more examples.

Again, the BSA is a private organization. NOBODY is forcing anyone to join them. Yes, they're a large (private) organization, but that's because christianity is a large religion. Gays, by comparison, are a minority. Demanding that the BSA allow them admittance is compromising our constitutional rights to create private enterprises and/or religions. Just because christianity is popular and this is why the BSA is so large does not mean it has to now abandon its rights as written in the constitution.

I already gave a link of potential alternatives to BSA. Use your rights as free citizens to express yourself and stop trying to jam your beliefs or attitudes or behaviors down others' throats.

Lastly, I have a gay brother. I love him very much. I do not disrespect him. I believe that homosexuality is natural and not a choice in most cases. But I believe people have rights in this country, so long as they're not directly harming others. I do not think BSA is hurting homosexuals simply by not signing them up. The BSA certainly is looking old and out of fashion, but it's not preventing free expression since there're alternatives and nothing stops them from forming. If anything I get the sense that people are using this occasion as an excuse to attack christianity and its beliefs, and more broadly, freedom and as a conduit to enforce their opinions onto others.

Homophobia will disappear eventually, just as slavery and the ban on interracial marriages did. Besides, the bible couldn't have been against homosexuality, since such classifications are quite recent. In those times, sexuality was fluid, and hence people didn't feel the need to label themselves as bi or straight.

reply to post by reppie


The word homophobia insinuates a fear of homosexuals. I would not think anyone on here fears homosexuals. The Bible is very clear on homosexuality even in the Old Testament days. It tells in the story of Sodom and Gomorrah that the men in those cities were wicked and wanted the men and not the women. Please do not attempt to argue the Bible until you know what you are talking about.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
reply to post by kaylaluv

 

Again,,,, answer me SOMEONE PLEASE!!! Why do we hate you just because we disagree with you? Answer this before this thread goes any further please.
Since you disagree with me then doesn't that mean also that you must hate me?

Referring to gays as "perverts", "weirdos", and "pedophiles" ain't exactly loving.

reply to post by Christian Voice


Those cities were punished due to lack of hospitality shown by the natives. Nothing to do with homosexuality or sexuality of any kind.

reply to post by Turkenstein


How sad and ignorant for you that you can't tell the difference between a homosexual and a pedophile. Maybe you should refrain from commenting until you know the difference.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
reply to post by reppie

 

The word homophobia insinuates a fear of homosexuals. I would not think anyone on here fears homosexuals. The Bible is very clear on homosexuality even in the Old Testament days. It tells in the story of Sodom and Gomorrah that the men in those cities were wicked and wanted the men and not the women. Please do not attempt to argue the Bible until you know what you are talking about.

Sodom and Gomorrah was not about committed monogamous gay relationships, or gay parents raising families in a caring, nurturing environment -- it was about sexual promiscuity, which the Bible is against, no matter what your sexual orientation.

Originally posted by HandyDandy


Seeing as Sandusky was suppossedly a "straight" married man with children, how the hell would the BSA policy to keep out gay people deter your child coming into contact with a Sandusky?

I guess it is better to leave your son with a "straight" football coach for a week than a "gay" scout leader?

Funny how the first scenario is the one where kids got molested eh?

edit on 19-7-2012 by HandyDandy because: (no reason given)

The first scenario would never occur in a properly trained Scout group. There is tons of training and policy and procedures to follow to hopefully insure that an Adult leader and a Scout are never alone together where things like that could occur. Say what you will about the BSA, they do seem to really care about protecting youth from abusing situations. The only time you hear about things gone wrong is when the procedures that are supposed to be in place are not implemented or followed.

I have had to tell parents of children that the parent could not go on an outing due to their background check coming up with "problems". I always would have rather been safe then sorry when it came to protecting a group of 20 to 30 kids.

The BSA is a private group and gets to decide how it will run it's own business. I know nowadays people would rather have Government tell them how to eat, be green and healthy, but I'd rather leave that up to the people.

reply to post by petrus4


So in your previous post, you slander people for their sexual orientation, accuse them of taking over, then make up an agenda on what they are going to do in the future with your pretty magic crystal ball,

but then the only response you have regarding heterosexuals is that nobody's behavior affects you.

Unless your making it up.

Talk about a homophobe, might want to see someone about that.

If other people's behavior doesn't affect you, this should be a non issue for you.

I wouldn't want my daughters to go camping with a male or lesbian leader. I wouldn't want my sons to go camping with a woman or gay leader. I am sure many parents feel the same. It's not proper. (if I had kids of my own)

Originally posted by pavil
The first scenario would never occur in a properly trained Scout group. There is tons of training and policy and procedures to follow to hopefully insure that an Adult leader and a Scout are never alone together where things like that could occur. Say what you will about the BSA, they do seem to really care about protecting youth from abusing situations. The only time you hear about things gone wrong is when the procedures that are supposed to be in place are not implemented or followed.

Are you stating that a homosexual can not be trained?

Also, how does training stop a Sandusky from molesting your boy in the BSA? Furthermore, how does the BSA not allowing gays stop a Sandusky from molesting your boys?

This whole debate reminds me of the South Park Episode where Big Gay Al was banned from the BSA and they brought in a mocho marine type instead only to have their children molested by big bad "straighty".

reply to post by kaylaluv


The word Sodomy comes from the word Sodom. It is non penis/vagina sex like anal and oral.

The term comes from the Ecclesiastical Latin: peccatum Sodomiticum, or "sin of Sodom" and derives from the Greek word Σόδομα Sódoma.[2] The Book of Genesis (chapters 18-20) tells how God wished to destroy the sinful cities of Sodom and Gomorrah. Two angels (literally "messengers") are invited by Lot to take refuge with his family for the night. The men of Sodom surrounded Lot's house and demanded that he bring the messengers out, so that they can "know" them. Lot protests that the "messengers" are his guests, and offers them his virgin daughters instead, but the Sodomites threaten to "do worse" with Lot than with his guests; whereupon the angels strike the Sodomites blind, "so that they wearied themselves to find the door." (Genesis 19:4-11, KJV)

en.wikipedia.org...

Get your facts straight. Yes it was destroyed because of sexual immorality but particularly homosexuality.

reply to post by kaylaluv


You can Love someone deeply and sincerely that you do not like, and you can like someone passionately that you do not Love.
I do not have to like you or your lifestyle to Love you. According to the Bible homosexuality is perverse and weird. So that means I hate you? That is a very juvenile way to think.
I have friends that are gay and they are fully aware of how I feel about their lifestyle and I am fully aware of their views towards Christianity. I am there anytime they need me but they know to never ever attempt to gain my approval and I do not push my faith upon them.
However this is a forum discussing the issue so I have given my input.
I hate noone......

Originally posted by Christian Voice
I have friends that are gay and they are fully aware of how I feel about their lifestyle and I am fully aware of their views towards Christianity. I am there anytime they need me but they know to never ever attempt to gain my approval and I do not push my faith upon them.

How are they friends exactly if you have such differing views? I know none of my friends have such a conflicting view from me that my whole lifestyle is an abomination to them.

I doubt you have gay friends.

Aquantences maybe but friends I highly doubt. They probably are your "friend" just so they can make fun of you behind your back as I would.