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A Challenge to Chemtrail Believers - Explain this 1969 Issue of Popular Science:

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posted on Jul, 24 2012 @ 10:04 AM
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reply to post by fireyaguns
 


Get back on yer tractor, and think things over some more, and maybe you should wear a gas mask or something while you sit up there polluting the countryside, trundling along through the fields of delusion in a zig zag fashion, due to your constant skyward gaze. What a sight. Remember to watch out for rabbit holes, they're pretty deep where you live I hear!

If it came down to it I'd prefer ATS to give people an IQ test when they try to sign up, anyone deemed borderline retarded would be refused, then people like you would be relegated to facebook and bebo where you and your rumor-mill logic belong.


edit on 24-7-2012 by seabhac-rua because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 24 2012 @ 10:31 AM
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Originally posted by Thorazine
reply to post by AndyMayhew
 



It seems Rosalind Peterson- one of the earliest and most vocal of the "chemtrail" decriers - and who has been studying this issue for almost 10yrs- has changed her mind:

She says "I have no proof- whatsoever- that the jets are releasing anything but jet fuel emissions"

www.youtube.com...

metabunk.org...
edit on 21-7-2012 by Thorazine because: (no reason given)
edit on 21-7-2012 by Thorazine because: (no reason given)
edit on 21-7-2012 by Thorazine because: (no reason given)
edit on 21-7-2012 by Thorazine because: (no reason given)


Do you know if she had a gun pointed at her head?



posted on Jul, 24 2012 @ 10:46 AM
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reply to post by seabhac-rua
 


You are hilarious......I think some of your posts are quite funny albiet somewhat incorrect. Just for a moment think about history. Greenland was once farmed by the Vikings, archealogists have excavated several sites and found seeds and grass roof material with wood beams, Greenland today is mostly covered by ice and snow, the Elite or PTB claim that if that melted the oceans would rise so high as to swallow up shore, well that is a Lie, isn't it. The vast expanse of the oceans would only rise a very small amount and not feet.

Second, there is much talk about population control, the Elite/PTB have used vaccinations, disease and the like to try and find a way to reduce population for over 100 years. They have been able to wipe out whole civilizations like the Mayans, Inca's, Aztecs, and so many others we don't know about, Native American Indians were almost wiped out.

It is about control, they want it and can't obtain it. I would think they would try everything available, as they obviously have. Some people who have spoken up have changed their minds, why. No evidence, well what happened to it. And what about Nickola Tesla and all his inventions, if they REALLY wanted to eliminate carbon emissions they would release his electric car, electric power plant all based on free energy, it is obtained freely from the atmosphere, that is the "free" part. Not that it is free to sell. That is the problem, the Elite can not control it or sell it for profit.

It's all about control and wealth. How hard is that to understand. Are chemtrails real? Who knows for sure with all the lies out there and all the liars.
edit on 24-7-2012 by daddio because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2012 @ 11:00 AM
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reply to post by daddio
 

Firstly, thanks for the compliment.

I don't see it like you. Climate change I know nothing about, it's a broad subject, but there are changes happening, to me that is obvious, is it natural? I think yes. Is human activity helping it along? Well, if you think humans are not making an impact on the environment and that there aren't consequences to our actions then I think thats crazy.

Secondly, no offense, but as far as I'm concerned all the population control stuff is bullsh*t, I know you can post videos and links of whoever saying whatever, but think about it for a minute, if these 'TPTB' are so smart why is the population growing at an alarming rate? Whatever they're are supposed to be doing isn't working is it?

As far as Tesla and inventions that can save us and the planet and all that. It's about money, it's about big corporations holding all the cards and making money. It's about the military industrial complex making money. Same goes for big pharma, profit, greed.

I don't buy into this depopulation crap at all. Or the chemtrail rubbish. That's all Alex Jones bullsh*t as far as I'm conerned. But don't get me wrong, yes there are lots of things wrong with the way the world works, but there always have been. What I see nowadays is people just believing crap because they watched a youtube video. I know people are concerned, of course, but we have to keep our feet on the ground and deal in facts. And what are facts to some people aren't to others.


edit on 24-7-2012 by seabhac-rua because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2012 @ 01:37 PM
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reply to post by seabhac-rua
 


Very well put. Agree completely. And yes, Tesla's inventions would eliminate a lot of the pollution, but then it's all about money. i use natural remedies for illness and work on helping others understand the lies. Facts are what is believed and not proved these days as you so well put. And the fact is, we don't know anything for sure, we can only guess and speculate.

Would love to find more people like you and sit down and have a drink and shoot the crap around and conjecture!! Would be interesting and fun.



posted on Jul, 24 2012 @ 06:07 PM
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Originally posted by daddio
reply to post by seabhac-rua
 


Very well put. Agree completely. And yes, Tesla's inventions would eliminate a lot of the pollution, but then it's all about money. i use natural remedies for illness and work on helping others understand the lies. Facts are what is believed and not proved these days as you so well put. And the fact is, we don't know anything for sure, we can only guess and speculate.

Would love to find more people like you and sit down and have a drink and shoot the crap around and conjecture!! Would be interesting and fun.


Yes I agree. If I ever find myself on foggy mountain I'll give you a shout, we can drink some beers.



posted on Jul, 24 2012 @ 06:14 PM
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Originally posted by fireyaguns
What are we being sprayed with?






Why are we being sprayed?


so people and freight can travel on aircraft


And
Who is spraying us all?


commercial airlines, andyone else who operates an aircraft, and also people who drive tractors tha spew out the same sort of pollution.



posted on Jul, 26 2012 @ 02:17 AM
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reply to post by seabhac-rua
 


Thanks for your input although aren’t you calling the kettle black.



Get back on yer tractor

the word is spelt you, just for future reference.




If it came down to it I'd prefer ATS to give people an IQ test

From what I've read of your post you would be one of the beggar/applicants refused.



posted on Jul, 26 2012 @ 06:45 AM
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reply to post by fireyaguns
 


Originally posted by fireyaguns
the word is spelt you, just for future reference.

Since you're so concerned about spelling, perhaps you should check your own spelling and grammar before pointing out flaws in other posts (even though it is obvious that "yer" was intentional
)


Originally posted by fireyaguns
it doined on me
it dawned on me

Originally posted by fireyaguns
under stood
understood

Originally posted by fireyaguns
the plane going by which are dispersing
"the plane going by which is dispersing" or alternatively "the planes going by which are dispersing"

Originally posted by fireyaguns
come in on queue
come in on cue
And that's all in one post. I don't normally point out such mistakes, but perhaps you'll appreciate it for future reference.


Originally posted by fireyaguns
chemtrails is easily under stood without have any knowledge of aircrafts or science.

You're right. A lack of knowledge and understanding seems to be a requirement for those who believe that a massive chemtrail conspiracy is taking place without even considering the possibility that there may be other explanations for the evidence presented. But it takes a certain level of intelligence to be able to ask the right questions if you truly want to find the right answers.


Originally posted by fireyaguns
All you need to do is look at the plane going by which are dispersing long lasting toxic chemicals into our atmosphere and you will soon be on track with common sense and an urge to ask

Well there is your first mistake. You have already made an assumption, without asking the appropriate questions. The first question should be "Is the plane going by dispersing long lasting toxic chemicals?". This question cannot be answered simply by looking at the plane from afar, but you can ask further questions to deduce the likelihood of whether or not extra toxic chemicals are being added that aren't already in the exhaust (look at the post above yours if you are unsure what these are).

You could say that there are toxic chemicals in jet exhaust, as these are there regardless of the formation of a white trail behind the aircraft. But that is not what the chemtrail theory hypothesis consists of. But this is where the assumptions start being made...

For some absurd reason, people started making the assumption that a contrail couldn't last more than a few minutes. If they bothered to look into the topic further, they might begin to understand why this is not the case (at least not since aircraft have been able to fly at high enough altitudes). People also started assuming that chaff and cloud seeding were proof of these mysterious white chemtrails, without bothering to ask how. But from past experience, some people don't even want to consider any other alternatives, as they simply want to believe in a massive conspiracy.

I have looked into the chemtrail theory thoroughly, much like seabhac-rua probably has, and have found that all the evidence presented has been weak at best (downright wrong a lot of the time), requiring many assumptions that should not be simply assumed. I have never said that there is no way that there are any form of chemtrails, just that there is insufficient evidence to claim without doubt that a massive chemtrail conspiracy has been taking place over the last couple of decades. But I guess that according to you, that means I'd fail the intelligence test too, right?



posted on Jul, 26 2012 @ 10:09 AM
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Originally posted by fireyaguns
All you need to do is look at the plane going by which are dispersing long lasting toxic chemicals into our atmosphere and you will soon be on track with common sense and an urge to ask,
What are we being sprayed with?...

Almost all of that white trail you see is water ice, and the bulk of that water ice comes from the air rather than from the plane itself -- although the plane's engine helps that water condense and freeze out of the air.

There is certainly a bit of nasty stuff that is contained in jet exhaust, but that's the unfortunate reality of burning fossil fuels. However, the long white trails are NOT primarily the exhaust, but water droplets that have been condensed out of the air by the jet, and frozen in the cold of the upper atmosphere. The amount of nasty stuff being exhausted would be that same whether we can see the white trail or not.

It should be pointed out that automobile exhaust as a whole causes more air pollution than jet exhaust. Gallon-for-gallon, modern jet engines air cleaner-burning than cars, but you don't seem to be making a big deal about automobile exhaust.

edit on 7/26/2012 by Soylent Green Is People because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 26 2012 @ 01:40 PM
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reply to post by Soylent Green Is People
 


In 1977 the Military before Congress did admit to spraying biological and chemical agents over 250 cities . It is history and unclassified . They also admitted to injecting unsuspecting people without their consent with radiological and biological agents that was tracked to their conclusion whether it was sickness or death . Some of these injections were known to be lethal from the onset . What have they sprayed and injected sense that time ? They have also tried to propagate lung cancer with borate's spraying . Why does NE Florida have the highest rate of Lung Cancer on this continent ?



posted on Jul, 26 2012 @ 01:44 PM
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reply to post by Soylent Green Is People
 


I don't believe that contrails are chem-spraying but I don't believe they are finished . In fact I see where they will probably step up their spraying to control us or our population . I am a pilot and do understand contrails .I believe they would spray at night when the wind has calmed down and the spray would be unlikely to be seen .



posted on Jul, 26 2012 @ 01:54 PM
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reply to post by SimonPeter
 


Whether there is some sort of spraying of poisons going on or not is usually not the question on these "contrails are chemtrails" threads.

Has there been spraying of biological agents in the past on unsuspecting population? It looks that way. Is there some sort of spraying going on right now? I don't know. HOWEVER, that is a totally different question than "are those white trails we see behind jets that most people call contrails really "chemtrails".

The point is that people want to use persistent and spreading contrails as some sort of proof that TPTB are spraying us with poisons, when actually those trails could simply be normal contrails behaving in a normal fashion.



posted on Jul, 26 2012 @ 02:04 PM
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reply to post by Soylent Green Is People
 


Yes I know but the real problem here is that we do not trust our government . And we don't know when and if they will spray .But yes their misunderstanding and calling every contrail will cause people to dismiss the whole thing as a conspiracy .



posted on Jul, 28 2012 @ 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by milominderbinder

There's nothing to "figure out". A cirrus cloud doesn't even resemble a contrail or a chemtrail.


did you miss the bit where contrails can "spread out" to become cirrus??



Thus, you know you are dealing with something other than simply exhaust contrails if said "contrail"-like formation still retains more or less it's original shape many hours later.


Why?

surely it all depends upon atmospheric conditions - if the conditions aer right for contrails to spread out then they spread out - if conditions are right for them to dissipate they dissipate, and if they are right for them to remain as identifiable contrails then that is what they do.

If there is no wind they will remain where they are, if there is wind they will blow along with it.


Doubly so if this "contrail" also persists over the same geographic area and doesn't tend to move along with the rest of the clouds in the atmosphere.


Depends on altitudes of the contrails and clouds I would have thought - there may well be different winds at different altitudes.

And if a contrail can stay in one place despite whatever wind there is at its altitude then yes I'd agree that would be very suspicious!!


edit on 19-7-2012 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)


Ummm...one of the defining characteristics of chemtrail is it's tendency to persist in a contrail-like formation far longer what is typical of a standard-issue contrail. When precipitation binds to particulate at high altitudes to form cirrus clouds it is generally a fairly slow process. Thus a contrail produced in, say, Minnesota won't form cirrus cloud until it is quite some distance away...such as in Wisconsin or Michigan.



posted on Jul, 28 2012 @ 02:19 PM
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reply to post by milominderbinder
 





far longer what is typical of a standard-issue contrail


And what is a standard issue contrail compared to a non standard issue contrail?



posted on Jul, 28 2012 @ 03:11 PM
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Originally posted by milominderbinder

one of the defining characteristics of chemtrail is it's tendency to persist in a contrail-like formation far longer what is typical of a standard-issue contrail.




Yes, what is the duration of a 'standard issue' contrail?








edit on 28-7-2012 by seabhac-rua because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 28 2012 @ 05:19 PM
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reply to post by seabhac-rua
 


Really people I would be more interested in the many Vaccines they have been pushing for the last 25 years .Then what has been going in our food and water such a Floride .
99 % of the jet contrails are just that . Jet exhaust .



posted on Jul, 29 2012 @ 09:28 AM
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reply to post by SimonPeter
 


Like I said before if these PTB are so smart then why is the earth's population growing exponentially.

There are so many easier ways to depopulate or reduce the birthrate, and as we're constantly reminded by people on here, supposedly 'they' can do whatever 'they' like, so why not just hit a switch and pop off a few nukes or even just turn the power off like an EMP strike or something?

Vaccines, chemtrails, HAARP, depopulation? What's it gonna be today?

I am actually starting to think Alex is working for the bad guys, coz he makes his believers look like idiots.
If somebody tells me they listen to AJ or reference infowars I find it very hard to take anything that they say after that seriously.




edit on 29-7-2012 by seabhac-rua because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 29 2012 @ 11:35 AM
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reply to post by seabhac-rua
 

It's coming soon . The work to find a pandemic that will kill large numbers of population such as the recent Dutch scientist development with the Bird Flu ( improvement ) they were raving about is just one effort to kill you . Who knows who else is working on similar projects and why are they working on them and who is paying for it ????
There are reports of deep underground bunkers being built and rich people leaving America . The war brewing in the Middle East is going to affect the USA in a few ways. One is oil the other is a nuclear exchange between Russia and us .





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