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Zimmerman Accused of Molesting his Cousin.

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posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:14 AM
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reply to post by Sparky63
 


It was not his job to play cop and that's final.

There's NO credible defense/excuse for his behavior.




posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:18 AM
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Originally posted by Sparky63

Originally posted by PurpleChiten
The information that Annee just provided shoots that down. Zimmerman claims to have been acting on behalf of the neighborhood watch but didn't follow the guidelines set forth by them, so he was in the wrong.


Guidelines are not laws. If Zimmerman wasn't breaking any laws he did not deserve to be attacked.


He instigated the attack with his actions. He's responsible for his actions. It was not his place to follow or to confront. His rights ended where Martin's began.
Zimmerman reported it and should have left it at that. It was not his job nor his place to follow and confront and that is what started the fight. Martin could have chosen differently and that would have been great, but he was put in the position of having to make a decision and should never have been put in that position to begin with regardless of his guilt or innocence in being where he was.
Zimmerman escalated the situation by his actions so his actions were the catalyst that resulted in a death as opposed to a possible arrest (or "getting away"). It wasn't worth the loss of a life.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:20 AM
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Originally posted by Sparky63

Just wondering, was Zimmerman required by law to identify himself as a neighborhood watch?


I'm not going to do "letter of the law" in this thread.

It was the police who stated he had opportunity to identify himself - - and did not.


Hard to explain that you are a neighborhood watch when your head is getting beat into the sidewalk.


As police stated he had 4 opportunities.

Those opportunities were prior to any physical confrontation.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:20 AM
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reply to post by Sparky63
 





Just wondering, was Zimmerman required by law to identify himself as a neighborhood watch? I am not aware of this requirement. Maybe if they had a polite conversation instead of a fight he would have done so. Hard to explain that you are a neighborhood watch when your head is getting beat into the sidewalk.


Same applies to Trayvon. He was under no obligation to tell Zimmerman what he was doing or where he was going. Zimmerman may not have been breaking the law. But he was breaking the rules of the neighborhood watch program.

Zimmerman acted like a vigilante. The fact that he was carrying a gun gave him that extra bit of courage and he probably acted like he had some authority to interrogate Martin.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:22 AM
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Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by Sparky63
 


That's not the point.

See, that's the problem with a lot of ATS posters.

The point often FLIES over the heads of some of these posters. You try to explain to them that Zimmerman was wrong to take the law into his own hands and they say, "well, the other guy was bashing his head. he deserved to die". How old are you?



I don't agree with your opinion that Zimmerman was taking the law into his own hands, Did he try to arrest Treyvon? Did he try to forcefully detain him? Did he attempt to frisk him or ask for his ID? These actions would probably constitute "taking the law into his own hands" since these are the actions a LEO might take. Following someone and asking them what they are doing in your neighborhood is not against the law.
Might it provoke a violent response in someone easily provoked? Possibly, but then it is the attacker who truly broke the law.
If it is proved that Zimmerman attacked Treyvon, I would have no problem with locking him up and throwing away the key. But it doesn't look like he was the attacker.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:24 AM
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Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by Sparky63
 


It was not his job to play cop and that's final.

There's NO credible defense/excuse for his behavior.


No - there isn't.

However - "Letter of the Law" is what it is - - I'm not getting into that. It could go either way.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:26 AM
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reply to post by Sparky63
 


Let's say for a moment you are taking a trip and driving through a bad part of town in Downtown Chicago around midnight and are lost. You notice someone following you. Let's say it's a big, daunting looking black man and you see him following you and watching everything you do.
Now lets say your car stops and you get out and the guy comes up to you. You're scared because he's ....well, scary looking. What do you do? Do you talk to him or do you lash out to "protect yourself"?
Don't give the answer that you know is "right", give the answer as to what you would do in the situation. You're in an unfamiliar environment, you are being watched and followed by someone that makes you uncomfortable. That person approaches you, puffed up and threatening looking... what do you do?



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:26 AM
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I'm out.

The last Zimmerman excuse thread was disgusting enough.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:27 AM
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reply to post by Sparky63
 





Hard to explain that you are a neighborhood watch when your head is getting beat into the sidewalk.


Once Zimmerman left his house carrying as handgun he was longer acting on behalf of the neighborhood watch.

He was acting on behalf of his own uncontrolled impulses and Napoleon complex.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:31 AM
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Originally posted by IpsissimusMagus
reply to post by Sparky63
 





Hard to explain that you are a neighborhood watch when your head is getting beat into the sidewalk.


Once Zimmerman left his house carrying as handgun he was longer acting on behalf of the neighborhood watch.

He was acting on behalf of his own uncontrolled impulses and Napoleon complex.


Exactly!



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:32 AM
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Originally posted by Annee
I'm out.

The last Zimmerman excuse thread was disgusting enough.


I think I may follow you.... it's pretty ridiculous


they just won't listen to logic and reason at all

edit on 18-7-2012 by PurpleChiten because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:35 AM
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reply to post by Sparky63
 





Following someone and asking them what they are doing in your neighborhood is not against the law


It's funny, because usually people who have your attitude are the ones who would react most violently if you were in Martin's position.

You support Zimmerman's actions but I bet if you were the one Zimmerman was following you'd be dead right now too.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:37 AM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by Sparky63

Just wondering, was Zimmerman required by law to identify himself as a neighborhood watch?


I'm not going to do "letter of the law" in this thread.

It was the police who stated he had opportunity to identify himself - - and did not.


Hard to explain that you are a neighborhood watch when your head is getting beat into the sidewalk.


As police stated he had 4 opportunities.

Those opportunities were prior to any physical confrontation.


I'm glad you're not doing the letter of the law. No one asked you to. However, a court of law and a jury are definitely going to be schooled on the "letter of the law" as it applies to this case. I respect your opinion and when this first happened I felt the same way that you do now. But as the fact of the case have become a little clearer I have changed my views. I at one time believed that Treyvon was just some innocent kid that was stalked and killed by some lunatic with a hero complex. That was a very shallow and inaccurate assessment of what actually took place.
Hey this place would be boring if we all agreed.

I don't think it matters how many opportunities Zimmerman had to identify himself. He was not compelled by law to do so. I don't really think it would have made any difference if he had.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:48 AM
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Originally posted by PurpleChiten
reply to post by Sparky63
 


Let's say for a moment you are taking a trip and driving through a bad part of town in Downtown Chicago around midnight and are lost. You notice someone following you. Let's say it's a big, daunting looking black man and you see him following you and watching everything you do.
Now lets say your car stops and you get out and the guy comes up to you. You're scared because he's ....well, scary looking. What do you do? Do you talk to him or do you lash out to "protect yourself"?
Don't give the answer that you know is "right", give the answer as to what you would do in the situation. You're in an unfamiliar environment, you are being watched and followed by someone that makes you uncomfortable. That person approaches you, puffed up and threatening looking... what do you do?


I am not going to attack someone until I am actually threatened with physical violence. I grew up in Chicago & Peoria Illinois and have been in similar situations many times.I wouldn't attack someone just because they looked threatening. But that's me. I'm a big guy and not too many people instill fear in me. I don't think it is helpful to try to excuse Treyvons violent attack on Zimmerman if that is what truly happened.

Like I said, whoever initiated the violence is the guilty party.I hope the truth comes out in the trial.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 12:54 AM
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Originally posted by IpsissimusMagus
reply to post by Sparky63
 





Hard to explain that you are a neighborhood watch when your head is getting beat into the sidewalk.


Once Zimmerman left his house carrying as handgun he was longer acting on behalf of the neighborhood watch.

He was acting on behalf of his own uncontrolled impulses and Napoleon complex.


Really?
How many times did Zimmerman legally carry his handgun and not murder someone in some impulsive uncontrolled rage? Carrying a handgun was his legal right. Did he shoot Treyvon due to some imaginary Napoleon complex or did he shoot Treyvon when he thought he might be killed? You seem to have it all figured out right down to Zimmerman's state of mind. Glad your not on the jury.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 01:00 AM
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Originally posted by IpsissimusMagus
reply to post by Sparky63
 





Following someone and asking them what they are doing in your neighborhood is not against the law


It's funny, because usually people who have your attitude are the ones who would react most violently if you were in Martin's position.

You support Zimmerman's actions but I bet if you were the one Zimmerman was following you'd be dead right now too.


You would lose that bet my friend.
I only support Zimmerman's actions if he was the one attacked and if he fired because he felt his life was threatened. If Zimmerman attacked Treyvon he should be prosecuted and face the consequences of his actions.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 01:08 AM
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reply to post by Sparky63
 





Glad your not on the jury.


I have served on a jury for an attempted murder case.

If the jury is given options, Zimmerman will be found guilty of second degree murder or manslaughter.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 01:18 AM
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Originally posted by IpsissimusMagus
reply to post by Sparky63
 





Glad your not on the jury.


I have served on a jury for an attempted murder case.

If the jury is given options, Zimmerman will be found guilty of second degree murder or manslaughter.


If your right and you ever come to Central Florida I will buy you a beer.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 01:32 AM
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Originally posted by Sparky63
reply to post by PurpleChiten
 


If Treyvon attacked Zimmerman and was beating Zimmermans head against the sidewalk, he deserved to die. In my opinion.


LIKE I MEAN - IF YOU...yeah YOU ...harass me and attack me, I attack you back in a craze because i'm not really used to violence and bang your head against the sidewalk in hopes of getting you to stop since you're a stranger who just attacked me I deserve to die????
This is what the FFFFFFFFF is wrong with the world nowadays man...HE DESERVED TO DIE? really? that it? So if you see Zimmerman on the street you're just gonna dap him up and tell him good job? Maybe talk about the guys you've killed who fought you before?

Christ...you "deserved to die" guys are so hard, where can I join your club?

Forget about - he deserved a good ass whooping , he deserved to get his # handed to him ..

noo......

he just DESERVED TO DIE.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 01:32 AM
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Originally posted by Sparky63

Originally posted by PurpleChiten
The information that Annee just provided shoots that down. Zimmerman claims to have been acting on behalf of the neighborhood watch but didn't follow the guidelines set forth by them, so he was in the wrong.


Guidelines are not laws. If Zimmerman wasn't breaking any laws he did not deserve to be attacked.


But Martin deserved to be followed, attacked, and shot because he...
looked suspicious?




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