Look no further~ The Gentleperson's Guide To Forum Spies

Just an fyi...

All posts made by user name: "havok" are clearly just opinions expressely used to mis-direct or dilute an opposing persons character, views, or thoughts. All posts made by the aforementioned party are hereby declared "jokes", and cannot be used in the court of law at any time in the future. If any posts are to be used in any form, all posts must be used without prejudice and cannot be selectively edited for nefarious purposes. Any use of the posts from the member stated is deemed illegal without the members permission and can not be used directly against said member. The information this member has posted is merely formed opinions, which all humans are entitled to, thoughts or ideas, not to be taken seriously or acted upon in any sense.
Hereby condemning any illegal activity or nullifying any use period.
All rights reserved 2012.


This is to ensure that you all know I am not paranoid.


Or am I?

The positive replies to this was a bit unexpected, or under expected at the least. If topping this in the forum would help, it may be quite useful for new members and the infrequent readers.

It is a good article while being informative at same time. Just couldn't not share, especially with how often this comes up here throughout the boards.

Lets keep this discussion going if only for the awareness it brings, I'm sure later after lunch it ought to be on a few more radars.

reply to post by ADVISOR


In order to keep the discussion on going....

I would like to know what percentage of ATS users actually have their personal opinions dramatically influenced by a less than credible user who shares a differing or contradictory opinion.

Using a medium such as the ATS forums, i find that this forum does not directly challange my pre-formed opinions, but in some cases, when someone provides a solid argument, with support evidence and has provided a clear argument, support and conclusions...i find my self re-examining my own opinions.

However i would like to conclude by saying that i find it difficult to have my personal beliefs to be swayed by an online forum. I believe direct and in person discussion to have a far more influential effect. In a face to face dialogue communicates so much more then words. In forums you lose the passion, the sincerity and true meanings behind what someone says.

reply to post by MDDoxs

I would like to know what percentage of ATS users actually have their personal opinions dramatically influenced by a less than credible user who shares a differing or contradictory opinion.

I have been pushed deeper into understanding a topic by playing those games in the past, but as the blinders come on as certain facts come up it is just too hard to stay engaged. In some way I have found such tactics to backfire as the original position is just further reinforced and a clearer picture develops through the study and debate.

Another good source to help work your way through errors and manipulation www.informationisbeautiful.net...

reply to post by kwakakev


I would agree that regardless of how credible a user is, or how valid the information presented turns out to be. The fact that a certain topic is brought up does make me investigate the matter a bit more thoroughly.

If that is the intention of someone looking to decieve, then perhaps the have managed to influence me some what, however i do reserve judgement on a issue/topic until i have concluded my own investigation. Whether that is reading in-depth articles or reports, to just browsing some wiki pages.

Nice source to mate

reply to post by MDDoxs


I would have to agree on many of those points. Thus the reason for proper or at least reasonable articulation of ones wor.ds. With correct emphasis and English grammar, one can easily convey what's lost. Short cuts in writing or as it has become typing such as short hand, abbreviations and text speak, evolved out of a need to conserve both time to transcribe and space.

It is not nor has been an accepted form of communication due to the lack of clarity.
That's not so much the issue here, as is context interpretation being taken to extreme.
Everything is not open to interpretation, even though exactly that will be the first attempt at picking an argument or other offtopic negative influence .

This is easily the most avoidable issue, and a first sign of obvious intent.

It should be kept in mind, that everyone has an agenda, good or bad and selfish or selfless there is an agenda.

This is an awesome thread! Take all the points in the article and visit one 9/11 thread.

Then come back here and tell me there's no Cointelpro agent on ATS.

Hint: Never ever comment on a survivalist thread if youre into that kinda thing.


But we ca use it agains them too. Take note of the names of users who frequently use those mentioned tactics.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by ADVISOR
reply to post by MDDoxs

 

It should be kept in mind, that everyone has an agenda, good or bad and selfish or selfless there is an agenda.

I agree, everyone has an intent. From arguing a point to star + flag accumulation.

However the intent of those, as outlined in the op, who use techniques to influence the course of a thread/argument for their own independent purposes seems to bypass the fundamental purpose of discussion. To share ideas and information in search of truth.

Everyone’s reason for participating is different, but for the regular ATS users I would say a common theme is present; to investigate, to learn, to disseminate, to debunk and to learn the truth about what is really out there!

I found this part particularly informative. Who can we trust?

Technique #6 - 'GAINING FULL CONTROL' It is important to also be harvesting and continually maneuvering for a forum moderator position. Once this position is obtained, the forum can then be effectively and quietly controlled by deleting unfavourable postings - and one can eventually steer the forum into complete failure and lack of interest by the general public. This is the 'ultimate victory' as the forum is no longer participated with by the general public and no longer useful in maintaining their freedoms. Depending on the level of control you can obtain, you can deliberately steer a forum into defeat by censoring postings, deleting memberships, flooding, and or accidentally taking the forum offline. By this method the forum can be quickly killed. However it is not always in the interest to kill a forum as it can be converted into a 'honey pot' gathering center to collect and misdirect newcomers and from this point be completely used for your control for your agenda purposes.

reply to post by PlanetXisHERE

You do realize you've just described the entire human race. What exactly was the point of your posts?

reply to post by aaaiii


That series of posts seemed like the work of a narcissist. No source links, no ex text tags. Just a bunch of words vomited all over the thread, taking up the majority of the first page.

If such forum spies can be identified by a mod, such as the OP, why are they not banned on the spot?

I've seen many threads left out there that are obviously what the op speaks of, yet nothing is done.

Thanks for the link Advisor!

Now I can put a proper name to the techniques I see on the forums.

#5 Anger Trolling really makes me question some threads I have read and participated in.

reply to post by ADVISOR



Hey AD.. I understand the reasons behind posting this Its been a hot topic here. However, wouldnt you agree that many traits expressed by the "forum spies" are also traits seen with every day people? Some who just have negative personalities, mental illness, interpersonal communication disorders, etc? I am very disturbed by anyone labeling another as cointelpro or a shill or disinfo when they are truly not. KWIM? We must be careful and not give the knee jerk reaction by labeling a fellow ATSer when that person really may not be what you think they are. Many of the things posted here can apply to even us on this thread. Its not a one point "diagnosis" but a pattern of behavior exhibited over a period of time.. and the end result wished for is disruption. I cant tell you how many times Ive seen a newbie or an introduction post for Gods sake littered with SHILL or DISINFO when the persons behavior hasnt even been observed for any amount of time!

Excellent post Ad.. I hope the readers get the idea and not just use this incorrectly to bolster their dislike of another poster or posting style or opinion they may disagree with

Great post Advisor! This is absolutely the best way to take back threads from the saboteurs...EDUCATION!

You ought to include the link or graphic from this thread (www.abovetopsecret.com...) as part of the tools to use in combating disinfo agents.*

btg

*yes this is my post, I only mention it b/c it dovetails nicely to your topic, and you have gotten people's attention.

reply to post by Advantage


I agree, and those issues are a huge motivation behind my posting this. It is important for ATSers new or not to be familiar with these disruptive modes of ignorance proliferation.

As for the COINTELPRO rowdy bunch, they give themselves away as obviously as the other trolls. When it comes to blatantly obvious a thread is a wreck, and it appears no staff are acting on it, two reasons usually apply.
One were simply not aware of it and two, no one has used the alert feature to help us track it.
If a mod has been made aware, odds are its being discussed among the others for a concession of action.

Also as a note, some of the threads may be left as an example of what not to do.
But no matter what, if any one us ATSers sees such they should feel obligated to the community to alert staff to incidents . We can't monitor every post in all the theads of each forum. Hence why the alert system was implemented.

BTG
Great stuff, just at the top of this page a member posted thisrelated link;

Originally posted by kwakakev
reply to post by MDDoxs

 

Another good source to help work your way through errors and manipulation www.informationisbeautiful.net...

I really like this!! It is definately the best guide for this i've seen, using technical terms that i've never heard of(probably made just for these disinfo agents).

I can't find a source in the guide though?? it doesn't say who its written by, I would assume from a former disinfo agent. Did anyone find a source within the guide??

It also makes you wonder because I could see this being important enough to get disinfoed, so watch who does what on this thread and other related threads right.

Haha. Blar blar blar.

Those lists just decsribed *everyone*.

Like the OP said, everyone has a number of those traits, if not *all* of them throughout life.

So what does it prove? Jack squat.

Plus a proffesional spy would go unnoticed.

reply to post by ADVISOR

It is important to also be harvesting and continually maneuvering for a forum moderator position. Once this position is obtained, the forum can then be effectively and quietly controlled

im onto you

Remember these techniques are only effective if the forum participants DO NOT KNOW ABOUT THEM. Once they are aware of these techniques the operation can completely fail, and the forum can become uncontrolled.

unless, the forum spy directs people to these rules thereby gaining their trust.

TRUST NO1

reply to post by Nephlim


Great points, can't argue as I suspect the disinfo'ers are studying new ways to manipulate ignorance proliferation now that their playbook has been revealed. No doubt some passive measures will be used to approach this or other topics once more are made aware of the guide.

I'm actually surprised this wasn't posted yet, but am glad it wasn't cause I did enjoy bringing it here for everybody. Also after nearly a decade on ATS, this is probably the most reoccurring issue.

Now hopefully with the membership having access to this resourceful info, a new tool has been added to each toolbox, so to say.

I just hope now that common sence prevails, with a dash of patience.