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Satellite study of Asian mountains show that glaciers are NOT melting - and some are actually gainin

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posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 08:47 PM
Well I guess that's that then! Let's continue drilling and burning billions of tons of fossil fuels!

Nothing can beat the smell of car exhaust in the morning!

posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 10:17 PM
reply to post by JameSimon

Well we may aswell start blaming the ancients because I guess they caused the ice age as well, hey? It is a cycle and the only thing that we are doing is poisoning ourselves with the crap we release into the atmosphere. Here in Australia, I have not seen anything out of the ordinary that would even suggest any evidence of climate change yet we are the ones who have implied the first climate tax...

The same as the GST, it is nothing but a revenue raiser for the government and if you don't play the game, it is more revenue than before in fines. Climate change is not a hoax, but it is something that we are not causing and definetly not something we should be reaching into a pockets for because of corporations who emit most of it. The only emission I release is from out of my backside...

posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 10:21 PM
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

It's not global warming, it's Global environment restructuring, get it right!

posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 10:42 PM
reply to post by ElectricUniverse
If I had to venture an educated guess as to why this is, its because the temperatures close to sea level, and the temperatures at altitude are controlled by two different environmental factors. Air temperature near sea level is controlled by ocean convection, radiation and retention of ground heat, and cloud cover. At altitude its controlled by air pressure changes (expansion of the air), and the other factors have less influence on it.

posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 10:43 PM
I edited this comment. Apparently the sulfur in China's air pollution is known to cause cooling. It also creates acid rain. China is busy adding scrubbers to remove the sulfur and this should result in a much greater warming effect. China will have clean coal causing a much greater global warming effect and I wouldn't be surprised if they really work at getting rid of the sulfur, they might be able to start melting the local glaciers as well. That is if the sun isn't about to go into a multi decade solar minimum that could result in global cooling if the amount of solar radiation is a much bigger factor than some scientists think it is. That's a debate for another thread. We'll probably know in 10 to 20 years who is right.

I still think a cheap and viable temporary solution to cool down the planet should involve dumping iron ore powder in the ocean in various spread out locations.

Iron ore powder would be cheap. Massive plant life would grow and absorb carbon in the ocean reducing global CO2 levels which if scaled up, should cause global cooling. If the iron ore powder was spread out to reduce any one spot in the ocean from getting oxygen depleted, perhaps oxygen levels could stay high enough so as not to cause too much harm. Of course experimenting on cheap solutions is not politically correct when the people can be taxed instead. (sarcasm). I'm not in favor of emitting tons of extra sulfur to cool down the air near the US.

Added note: I haven't heard this discussed before but it might be worth a discussion about adding sulfur to the atmosphere over a very large ocean as long as it doesn't cause acid rain in the US or other countries. This could cool down the air to help control rising global temperatures. It's just a thought.
edit on 11/7/12 by orionthehunter because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 11:30 PM
Some of these studies are puzzling. I'm almost tempted to conclude that the Earth itself is intelligent, a giant cell that has the ability to adjust and get rid of whatever toxins we put into it..

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 12:38 AM
Global Warming, which has been changed to Climate Change (because it can now be used as a catch all for every event that falls outside the norm) is a psyop to cover for unpredictable climatic events that are the result of something that was foreseen or that is even being caused by technology (weapons or weather mod tech). Don’t ask for evidence because I do not have any. That is just my suspicion.

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 12:51 AM

Originally posted by Atzil321
The bottom line is that glacier variations can be dependent on localized conditions but that these variations are superimposed on a clear and evident long term global reduction in glacier volume which has accelerated rapidly since the 1970s.

Bottom line is that it has been clear for decades that the warming was not mand-made.. The climate is ALWAYS changing, and worse Climate Changes have occurred in the past...

There is not one iota of evidence that proves the warming is man-made and making claims that "you are an idiot if you think differently than me" as another member did does not make your argument right...

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 12:56 AM
reply to post by defcon5

But haven't we been drilled how "man-made" activities are the MAIN/MAYOR cause of Climate Change?... In fact yes, that has been the claim made by the AGW camp to the point that claiming man-made CO2 is stronger even than the Sun itself.

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 12:59 AM

Originally posted by wagnificent
And to respond to the OP, just because emissions are concentrated in China, it does not mean that the effects of those emissions will be felt in China.

Ah, so you are one of those people who thinks it should be warmer farther away from the fire?

Originally posted by wagnificent
Example: Japan's nuclear junk from Fukushima is washing up on Hawaii and the West coast of the US, and I'm sure plenty of our trash is washing up on their shores as well.

In general where has been the worse damage due to Japan's nuclear disaster?

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 02:16 AM
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

Maybe reply to some of the awesome posts in your duplicate thread of this topic?

"Earth is losing a huge amount of ice to the ocean annually, and these new results will help us answer important questions in terms of both sea rise and how the planet's cold regions are responding to global change," said University of Colorado Boulder physics professor John Wahr, who helped lead the study. "The strength of GRACE is it sees all the mass in the system, even though its resolution is not high enough to allow us to determine separate contributions from each individual glacier."... "One possible explanation is that previous estimates were based on measurements taken primarily from some of the lower, more accessible glaciers in Asia and extrapolated to infer the behavior of higher glaciers. But unlike the lower glaciers, most of the high glaciers are located in very cold environments and require greater amounts of atmospheric warming before local temperatures rise enough to cause significant melting. This makes it difficult to use low-elevation, ground-based measurements to estimate results from the entire system."

I'm not going to quote what othwald said after presenting this information, but it's worth checking out...

Lets just say, it's rather clear that you're twisting this information to suit some agenda...

This next comment, I'd say hits the nail on the head:

These glaciers account for 3% of the worlds ice layer (discounting Arctic / Antarctica) - it is a specific part of that mountain chain. Some other glaciers are also showing signs of growth.

However, the larger bodies of ice (Arctic / Antarctica) are showing definite signs of ice loss.

In itself, this is not proof of either glacier retreat or advance globally. All it shows is that glaciers in a very specific part of the world that account for a tiny percentage of global ice coverage are growing a bit.

Claims for either pro or anti climate change cannot be made on this data.


The reason I bring these two up, is because they go to reiterate my point which was:

Originally posted by FractalChaos13242017

1. The mountains and the glaciers, are they land locked?

To which you responded:

This would not help you in either argument in the least.

Any thoughts about this dismantling of your argument?

Here's another classic in which you are yet to respond to, recall you saying the following:

Are you warmer closer to a fire or farther away from it?... If CO2 was the cause of any noticeable warming then the areas with the most warming should be those closer to the sources of anthropogenic CO2. There is no way around that no matter how hard you try... This is called logic, not silly comments like the ones you made...

To which I then rebutted:

There's much more to the interaction with the atmosphere and anthropogenic CO2 before it can be considered impacting 'global warming' or the 'greenhouse effect'... I know you know this! To pretend that these interactions and cycles are regional, and remain so is so incredibly shortsighted that I'm debating if this topic is worth spending the time debating with you. Again, I've seen some of your previous posts, 'I know you know this'... I'm almost at a loss for words.


Anyways, I'm not going to copy and paste everything. It's truly unfortunate that you double posted this... you had some real golden moments of ignorance on that particular thread. Especially the part where you decided to quote me, and chop off the quote at "also...", completely failing to comprehend what was said. EPIC!!!

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 02:39 AM

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
reply to post by defcon5

But haven't we been drilled how "man-made" activities are the MAIN/MAYOR cause of Climate Change?... In fact yes, that has been the claim made by the AGW camp to the point that claiming man-made CO2 is stronger even than the Sun itself.

Greenhouse gasses supposedly trap more of the suns heat, and cause overall ambient temperature to increase. However, at high altitude, the air is cooled by the same principle that an air conditioner uses. The expansion of hot air causing its temperature to drop. I would suspect that the more hot air you have at the surface raising into the atmosphere and expanding, the cooler it will get in the upper altitudes.

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 03:05 AM
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

If it was true that the main reason for Climate Change, or warming is anthropogenic CO2, then these glacies should be melting at an alarming rate, but they are not, so the causes of the warming, and the causes of the dramatic Climate Changes must be natural.

You can form no such opinion from an isolated study. The affects of climate change are complex and will in some places cause heating and in others cooling...

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 01:48 PM

Originally posted by milkyway12
Considering one of the founders of Global Warming renigged on his ideology and the head founder of Global Warming is in hiding in China.

Considering in the 1970s - 1980s , we were suppose to have an Ice Age. lol

Global Warming is nothing but a fraud. In my opinion. (Man-Made) The Earth is getting hotter for whatever reason , and i dont think it is because of pollution / humans.

The Earth has cycles. Hot , Cold , Hot , Cold , Hot , Cold.


He now says the Earth is doing its ' Usual ' tricks.
edit on 11-7-2012 by milkyway12 because: (no reason given)

the guy who originally proposed the gaia hypothesis is NOT the founder of global warming. he came up with a theory but he's not a climate scientist.

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 02:20 PM
i love how people take random studies and say "AH HA!! seeee.... global warming is a hoax" with out any further review of this so called evidence. all climate scientists will tell you that some areas of the world will get colder during global warming.

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 02:21 PM
The biggest factor in glacial advance is not temperature but precipitation.

Increased winter precipitation could result in glaciers increasing in extent, even if temperatures are higher. Likewise, decreased precipitation can result in retreat or loss of glaciers altogether regardless of temp. There are no glaciers in parts of Antarctica, for example, for precisely this reason (the Dry Valleys)

Therefore we should be very wary of using glacial advance, retreat, or whatever as proof of warming or cooling. Though it may, instead, be indicative of precipitation pattern change. Which may or may not itself be caused by human activities thousands of miles away (deforestation in Indonesia can affect the monsoon which in turn affects where snow falls in the Himalaya, for example)
edit on 12-7-2012 by AndyMayhew because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 06:16 PM
I believe the combination of sulfer which creates a cooling effect and the sun being less active in years past was explained fairly well in the article I linked above and here again.

The large loss of arctic sea ice and glaciers world wide reveal to me our planet has warmed up. I'd like to have global cooling instead of summer temperatures of 108. I do believe high concentrations of certain gases can influence the temperature. I'm in favor of having China cut down their CO2 emissions with requirements on new coal plants. They are building them like crazy I heard. We don't need to add to the problem.

As China removes the sulfur which is creating a cooling effect, things may start to warm up if solar radiation doesn't drop.
edit on 12/7/12 by orionthehunter because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 13 2012 @ 10:39 AM
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

There is not one iota of evidence that proves the warming is man-made
There is an overwhelming amount of evidence to support AGW. You are either ignorant of this evidence or choose to ignore it completely, i am not sure which is worse

posted on Jul, 14 2012 @ 02:16 AM

Originally posted by purplemer

You can form no such opinion from an isolated study. The affects of climate change are complex and will in some places cause heating and in others cooling...

No...I formed such opinion from data from NASA which shows that in the past 50 years the largest temperature increases have been in isolated areas. Areas FAR AWAY from cities/sources of anthropogenic CO2...

You have been around for a long time, you should know this by now...

Current warmth seems to be occurring nearly everywhere at the same time and is largest at high latitudes in the Northern Hemisphere. Over the last 50 years, the largest annual and seasonal warmings have occurred in Alaska, Siberia and the Antarctic Peninsula. Most ocean areas have warmed. Because these areas are remote and far away from major cities, it is clear to climatologists that the warming is not due to the influence of pollution from urban areas.

I formed such opinion from the thousands of peer-review research papers that show atmospheric CO2 as it exists on Earth has no noticeable influence on the global climate...

I formed this opinion when the main proponents of the AGW scam were caught in several occassions lying, fudging the data to meet their agenda, and using all sorts of tactics, including illegal ones to keep the real research that refutes their AGW religion...

This is just one of the many nails in the coffin of the AGW scam...

posted on Jul, 14 2012 @ 03:20 AM

Originally posted by FractalChaos13242017

Maybe reply to some of the awesome posts in your duplicate thread of this topic?

First of all it wasn't a duplicate thread. I posted this in the Alternative Forum as it was a day old, and the forum rules allows for the same thread to exist in two different forums...

Now, let's see what those members are CLAIMING...

Originally posted by FractalChaos13242017
I'm not going to quote what othwald said after presenting this information, but it's worth checking out...

Your buddy othwald is making an assumption that I am basing my opinion just on this one research, but that is not true....

If you would check all the threads I have made in the past I have posted hundreds of peer-reviewed research that debunks the AGW religion.

The reaction of this glacier is not new, and it is not happening only on these mountains... It is happening ALL AROUND THE WORLD...

Oceanic Influences on Recent Continental Warming
Climate Diagnostics Center,
Cooperative Institute for Research in Environmental Sciences,
University of Colorado, and
Physical Sciences Division, Earth System Research Laboratory,
National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration
325 Broadway R/PSD1
Boulder CO 80305-3328
(303) 497-6115
(303) 497-6449

Compo, G.P., and P.D. Sardeshmukh, 2008: Oceanic influences on recent continental warming. Climate
Dynamics, doi: 10.1007/s00382-008-0448-9.
This article is published by Springer-Verlag. This author-created version is distributed courtesy of Springer-Verlag.
The original publication is available from at

Evidence is presented that the recent worldwide land warming has occurred largely in response to a worldwide warming of the oceans rather than as a direct response to increasing greenhouse gases (GHGs) over land.

Atmospheric model simulations of the last half-century with prescribed observed ocean temperature changes, but without prescribed GHG changes, account for most of the land warming. The oceanic influence has occurred through hydrodynamic-radiative teleconnections, primarily by moistening and warming the air over land and increasing the downward longwave radiation at the surface. The oceans may themselves have warmed from a combination of natural and anthropogenic influences.

A mysterious phenomenon is causing four major glaciers in the Antarctic to shrink in unison, causing a significant increase in sea levels, scientists have found.

The rise in atmospheric temperatures caused by global warming cannot account for the relatively rapid movement of the glaciers into the sea, but scientists suspect that warmer oceans may be playing a role.

"There is a possibility that heat from the ocean is somehow flowing in underneath these glaciers, but it is not related to global warming," said glaciologist Duncan Wingham of University College London. "Something has changed that is causing these glaciers to shrink.

"At this rate the glaciers will all be afloat in 150 years or so."
However, it would take about 200 years for extra heat from the ocean to reach the underside of the glaciers, which makes it difficult to believe that the present shrinkage is due to global warming, Dr Wingham said.

In that article Prof. Wingham is saying that "anthropogenic CO2", which is blamed by some scientists to have cause Global Warming, is not the cause for the melting of these glaciers.

At least one of the reasons for this melting is the following.

The Arctic shelf is currently undergoing dramatic thermal changes caused by the continued warming associated with Holocene sea level rise. During this transgression, comparatively warm waters have flooded over cold permafrost areas of the Arctic Shelf. A thermal pulse of more than 10°C is still propagating down into the submerged sediment and may be decomposing gas hydrate as well as permafrost.

The warming has been linked to be caused by the Holocene warming, or the overall warming the Earth has been undergoing since the last Ice Age.

Those two links prove that both the Arctic and Antarctic oceans are undergoing warming caused since the last Ice Age, during the Holocene period.

As to Flavian, he is again making assumptions which are wrong. All the research demonstrates that AGW is a scam, and atmospheric CO2 doesn't cause the "massive warming" that the AGW believers claim...

As to your question, you keep trying to twist the facts, if CO2 is so powerful as to affect GLOBAL temperatures, then it should be powerful to affect LOCAL temperatures as well... As such if it was true that CO2 is the cause of the warming, then the largest warming should have been occurring in areas close to the sources of anthropogenic CO2... BUT THIS IS NOT HAPPENING...

No matter how much you try to twist the facts, you won't win...

Your idols were caught red handed lying, and fudging the data because NATURE has been doing the oposite to what they have been claiming...

What most of you AGW believers fail to understand is that there are natural factors occurring right now which are known to affect the climate, and to cause extreme Climate Changes.

There is the fact that Earth is not the only planet which has been warming at the same time. Planets, and even some moons in the Solar System with an atmosphere have been experiencing dramatic Climate Changes in the form of WARMING, just as Earth has.

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