What you're doing wrong in an interview... and in your life.

I agree with most of your sentiments OP but please don't tell me you are making jobs for me. You're making jobs because you need people to fill the posts to make you money!

Are you telling me you'd make jobs if you weren't getting anything out of it? Maybe a few charitable people do but it's pretty rare.

Not that I don't think you fully deserve the rewards of all your hard work but when you tell me you're making jobs for me it appears a little condescending.

Originally posted by bisonpowers
I agree with most of your sentiments OP but please don't tell me you are making jobs for me. You're making jobs because you need people to fill the posts to make you money!

Are you telling me you'd make jobs if you weren't getting anything out of it? Maybe a few charitable people do but it's pretty rare.

Not that I don't think you fully deserve the rewards of all your hard work but when you tell me you're making jobs for me it appears a little condescending.

Anyone making a job for someone to earn a living is a good thing...don't you think...

ETA: You obviously aren't familiar with the OP. And you don't listen to the ATS live broadcasts. If you did, you'd at least know he is a well respected, and very informative member of ATS. People flock to his threads because they know, there will be substantive content. Did you take the time to read this whole thread.


Des

I didn't read the entire thread to find out where this all went but I'll throw in my 2cents as a sales manager of a successful US company that employs just over 400 people and makes 100 million dollars / year in a global market. I've been successful in business for my entire life, I have been the employee and I have been the employer. I would never use that wording or take the OP attitude on many of his points. The tone is condescending and demeaning. The employer / employee relationship is a two way street. I challenge my workers to excel. I do not belittle them or their personal issues. At the end of the day we are all human beings with basic human rights. I was taught business from some of the best. Teamwork starts at the top with good leaders.

I would never hire the OP as a manager.

Another dictactor looking for more wage slaves.

A more fitting thread title would have been,

"What you're doing wrong in an interview... and in your life (according to my brainwashed sensibilities)

reply to post by Destinyone


Yea sure I read the whole thread and it was pretty interesting too. Yea I think it's good when honest jobs are created for people looking for work.

I'm sure the OP is well respected and probably a pretty decent guy but that doesn't mean I have to agree with him and his post. I stand by the fact that he probably advertises for employees based on the logic that expanding his business or replacing lost staff will make him more money or a least maintain his income.

The opening post alluded to the fact that he was creating jobs for us, which he is, but that's not why he's creating jobs - he's creating jobs because he needs to.

wEll op could have created a post saying , do as i do , not as i say .

i always treated employers as a business deal , they got 0% extra from me while i used them , and found ways to lever more money better conditions ,less time on the hard bits . which made me good at my jobs and they never complained .


As a business owner i find honesty issues with advising our friends on ats how to work for mcdonalds

@op 's advice , you may as well go and bash your head on a brick wall , he really is talking about a road to ___no-where

Originally posted by hadriana
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

It was a REAL job. It was Kroger.
He has had other interviews similiar - also REAL jobs.

It's what happens when the unemployment rate goes sky high in an area.

Why would he waste his time interviewing for a job that is minimum wage for 12 hours per week? He would be better off delivering pizzas, or working in a drive-through somewhere. It would pay better, and have better opportunity for quick advancement.

If the job market in your area is so bad that 50 people are applying for every pizza delivery job, then you just need to move.

But its not fair to abase the op he did not set up life as we know it and he does provide variable beneficials in his post . Its not bad advice , is what i mean .

But it likens to the parable of the talents . Here presented is the way of the one who buried the one talent his master entrustment to him , and returned it , without any gain from his prudence with it , on his master's return ., much to the displeasure of its owner. The other two had made plans and re-invested it , sharing the returns with the master as interest payments . Not a usury situation , but their decision , and their honest repayments .

So it is with the jobs environment . Who do you want to work for , a big company ? Ask yourself , what do you expect , someone may ask you the same question after you leave there .
And why the massive rush to work ? Surely to sit back , relax and play is the object of life , not strife and hassle .
By far the best option , to put things simply , is no matter what the qualification or aspiration , make it your immediate aim to 1. Be self employed > this doesnt mean starting a business as much as 'selling your services'
That way , any real profit made , comes to ___ you , not , anyone else . Any tax paid , is then also your responsibility . But dont let niggling matters like that stop you getting started - get sarted , right away , as if there is nothing to declare , why declare anything ?

People need a severe wake up call , wake up . Get a business head on , you only need to be able to add up , subtract , and make estimates . Anyone on ats can do that . Go, leave 'work' , and use your talents , supplying (essential) resources

Originally posted by getreadyalready
If the job market in your area is so bad that 50 people are applying for every pizza delivery job, then you just need to move.

? , who is eating the pizza ? 50 people dont know how to make pizza s , deliver leaflets and answer the phone , yet they expect to do all three , for a pittance , just because it was advertised as a _job ?

Do they have a phone or an oven at home ? how many drove to the interview .

reply to post by bisonpowers

ABSOLUTELY I would make jobs in order to make me money! That's the whole point of this thread. Those who expect different are living in a dream world.

I'm not sure where I said differently...

What I am saying all boils down to this: the guy interviewing you is looking at you as a way to do a job that makes him (or his company) money. As the employee, you should be concerned not with how much he is making, but with how much you are making, what you could be making elsewhere, and what you have to do to make that. If you are not happy with the offer, why take the job?

If you are happy with the offer, you should do your part of the deal and expect your employer to do their part. If you slack on your part, you have no gripe when they slack on theirs.

Too many people approach an interview, their job, heck, their life with the attitude of trying to make sure someone else doesn't make more than they do. That's not only futile, but self-defeating. Business runs on mutually beneficial arrangements; it does not run (for very long) when either party is constantly getting the short end of the stick. That's why those companies that have poor middle management or who constantly abuse workers have such a high turnover. Each time someone is fired for cause or quits for cause, that is a failed business relationship. Enough of these failures from a business, and the business itself will collapse and disappear. Enough of these failures from a worker, and they will not be able to get a decent job. Everybody fails when they take constant advantage of others, whether employee or employer.

If everyone would look out for themselves, look for the job that provides them with what they need, and stop looking to see if someone else is getting a better deal, there would be a lot less of these business failures. That is a good thing for both parties.

TheRedneck

reply to post by TheRedneck


I think that's a bit naive , not to pick holes , but there's a wide one in that , business is about exploitation , not one-upmanship or looking good . Its about who takes the profit , where the benefits are in the deal , generally . not about sustainable incomes , or long term relationships . Maybe it is at your company , but then, you have attempted to generalise advice from your point of view.. Its more about minimising burdens to me , which is where keeping other parties happy come in .
Take it from me , I d sooner take a cold shower for half an hour than sign any typical contract of emplyment these days , aka , the workforces being ripped . They work , how many hours , for what ? If the figures normally involved at the levels i imagine you suggest , are compatible with todays 'economic climate' then no chance ia m going there 5 days a week , not till hell freezes over maan.

reply to post by ZIPMATT

Its about who takes the profit

I'm sorry you see things this way.

As long as you see things that way, as long as you believe you have to do to the other guy before they can do to you, as long as you have that confrontational attitude, that is exactly how all your relationships will operate. It won't be because the other guy wants it to be that way; it will be because you want it to be that way. They'll just be protecting themselves from the true aggressor.

I hope someday you will see the error in your thinking. It's all that stands between you and success.

TheRedneck

I think this is utter bull#. There may be some good business owners out there, but a lot of them are assholes which is why employees do not see eye to eye. From your writing it seems you are one of them too, because good bosses do not spend time writing up drivel like this.

Let's take my third and last boss. I did everything that was asked of me, put in overtime and was never compensated for that. The guy called me at all times, even on Christmas for matters that are unimportant, the douchebag ran a multi million dollar operation but refused to put anyone on payroll so we had to pay all our taxes without any benefits. The crook registered the company overseas to avoid any legal problems. There are some #ty people out there, it's not always the employees fault, and I know friends with similar bosses.

I did what you said and quit that job after suffering health problems, found something else part-time, back in college, moved back home, and much happier. I learned that there is more to life than just a salary and toxic bosses should be left out of one's life.

reply to post by mbcsmc




You chose to work for him. You even chose to take those calls when you knew it wasn't important. You could have put him in his place at any time, but you didn't.

put in overtime and was never compensated for that.

If it was overtime, and you weren't compensated, then you both broke the law. If you were on a salary, and certain things were expected of you, then it wasn't really overtime, it was just part of your job.

There is an old adage that there are no bad students, only bad teachers.... it is wrong. There are plenty of lazy, uninterested students, just like there are plenty of bad employees.

If you were a good employee, you could have and would have gone elsewhere instead of putting up with the abuse you claim was happening. I've quit a lot of jobs. I've even been fired a time or two. I've had some terrible bosses, but I know I had some part of the situation. I beat up a boss with a telephone one time, and got him fired, because he was prank calling my wife while we were at work, and he knew I wasn't home. He scared the hell out of her! Now THAT is a bad boss, but he got his, LOL!

Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by InTheLight

And you forget that without the business, those employees have no job.

Ironically, this is one of the things I am considering: is it even feasible to hire people in today's society, what with all the concessions that have been negotiated? I'm coming to the conclusion it probably is still feasible, but barely. I do not consider it feasible to spend my time and money and sweat on something that someone else will expect to just walk in and take from me; thankfully, I believe at this time I will be able to start up with a few hand-picked employees, mostly older workers who do not have the youthful sense of entitlement.

Again, you want the company profits, or feel you deserve the company profits? Start a company and they're all yours.

TheRedneck

I don't really understand why you would go for older employees if you are trying to avoid the people who feel entitled.

Those older employees come from a time where they were mostly all paid a liveable wage. From a time where medical benefits were assumed and not really considered Where getting a pension upon retiring was common, as were raises for being there longer.

Younger workers, who have only been a part of the workforce recently are the exact opposite. They are used to working for crap wages, they are used to never getting a raise, even after a couple years, used to not having any health insurance, and the idea of your employer providing retirement for you is a completely foreign concept.

In the past even people who occupied positions we now consider "menial" were able to have a decent standard of living from their job.

So why would you choose older workers, who are the ones that are used to, and will expect a lot more from an employer than younger ones would?

reply to post by mbcsmc

I think this is utter bull#. There may be some good business owners out there, but a lot of them are assholes which is why employees do not see eye to eye. From your writing it seems you are one of them too, because good bosses do not spend time writing up drivel like this.

Hmmm, interesting perspective.

I did what you said and quit that job after suffering health problems, found something else part-time, back in college, moved back home, and much happier.

Congratulations!

Now I am a bit confused... you disagree with my advice, but you took it and it worked.

Nah, nevermind. It's not important. The important part is this:

I learned that there is more to life than just a salary and toxic bosses should be left out of one's life.

Thanks. You just made my day.

TheRedneck

Originally posted by getreadyalready
You chose to work for him. You even chose to take those calls when you knew it wasn't important. You could have put him in his place at any time, but you didn't.

How could I have known it wasn't important. I'm not psychic. This was a tech company so we were expected to be in "constant" communication.

If it was overtime, and you weren't compensated, then you both broke the law. If you were on a salary, and certain things were expected of you, then it wasn't really overtime, it was just part of your job.

Employees don't break the law when they don't get paid, that's nonsense.

If you were a good employee, you could have and would have gone elsewhere instead of putting up with the abuse you claim was happening. I've quit a lot of jobs. I've even been fired a time or two. I've had some terrible bosses, but I know I had some part of the situation. I beat up a boss with a telephone one time, and got him fired, because he was prank calling my wife while we were at work, and he knew I wasn't home. He scared the hell out of her! Now THAT is a bad boss, but he got his, LOL!

Yes I was a good employee, extremely respectful even when I was belittled and used as a punching bag for his bad days. The guy begged me to stay. My health and sanity is more important. If you beat up your boss you would be in jail, more nonsense.

Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by mbcsmc

I think this is utter bull#. There may be some good business owners out there, but a lot of them are assholes which is why employees do not see eye to eye. From your writing it seems you are one of them too, because good bosses do not spend time writing up drivel like this.

Hmmm, interesting perspective.

I did what you said and quit that job after suffering health problems, found something else part-time, back in college, moved back home, and much happier.

Congratulations!

Now I am a bit confused... you disagree with my advice, but you took it and it worked.

Nah, nevermind. It's not important. The important part is this:

I learned that there is more to life than just a salary and toxic bosses should be left out of one's life.

Thanks. You just made my day.

TheRedneck

Just look at your own picture, man. That's the best shot? You look so damn unfriendly. Anyway, good bye and good luck to whoever your employees are presently and in the future.

reply to post by James1982

I don't really understand why you would go for older employees if you are trying to avoid the people who feel entitled.

Those older employees come from a time where they were mostly all paid a liveable wage. From a time where medical benefits were assumed and not really considered Where getting a pension upon retiring was common, as were raises for being there longer.

Wow, do we have a different perspective! I must be getting old!

When I joined the work force, there was no guaranteed retirement; it was specified at some places, but definitely not all of them. The running joke was you worked your entire life and wound up with a gold watch. Health insurance through an employer was a new thing that not everyone had... health care was expensive, but affordable. Of course, the doctors still made house calls back then too...

I remember the mantra being "an honest days work for an honest days pay". That's not entitlement as I define it.

As I define entitlement, it's a regular raise just for not getting fired, as opposed to a raise for doing something to deserve it. It's demanding health insurance, even making it illegal not to offer it. It's demanding sick leave, vacation time, counselor services when your feelings get hurt, having to put in writing when you can't manage to show up on time so you don't sue for 'wrongful termination'... then demanding a share of the business profits on top of your pay.

And on top of all that, showing no respect or appreciation whatsoever for having all that handed to you in the first place. Instead, spending all day every day complaining about how I am taking advantage of you because you actually have to move during the day. That's what I see from the 'younger' generation and that's what I call entitlement.

Maybe the difference is what I call 'older'... as in 50+. Some of those old retired guys still have a little juice left.

TheRedneck

Originally posted by getreadyalready


There is no employer, not even a menial factory job, or box loader at UPS, that doesn't want intelligent people that require little supervision.

Not true. If a higher up is insecure in their abilities, they will be afraid of those who they see as more capable. I've seen it happen quite a few times, even if its to the companies detriment. Remember, stupid people dont make smart decisions.