Guess who's coming to Red Flag?

I was an F-16 Crew-Chief in the USAF. I participated in Red Flag a lot. It usually lasted 4 weeks. Then they would go into Green Flag. For anyone who doesn't know what that is; Red Flag is where all branches that have any type of aircraft in the U.S. inventory will simulate Air War. They also have other countries participate. Like Australia, Singapore, France, Britain etc.... They also have a an exercise called Air Warrior which is only for the U.S. military.

Green Flag is much like Red Flag except they have ground troops in the Desert that coordinated with Air Craft to simulate all out war. I never saw Russians on a U.S. Base in the homeland. This is absolutely absurd. The CIC needs to go in November! If not, we are completely down the drain! Heck, we might not be able to get out of the pit he put us in anyway. Romney isn't any better either. I pray to God that Ron Paul gets the nomination somehow. I am not sure he can pull us out of the pit either, but I think he is our best shot. Anyway, I just thought I would throw all that info out there for everyone to chew on. God Bless All!

Originally posted by charles1952
I've got a really stupid question, I know very little about this.

Would Russia intentionally play at only, say, 80% effort? That way they would see what we have without giving away their capabilities, and that might cause us to underestimate them.

No. They are a very prideful bunch of people. They have something to prove; air superiority. We know what they are capable of; trust me.

reply to post by 74Templar


The USAF / USN / Marines will have F-16's / F-15's / F-22's / F-14's / F-18's.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by charles1952

 

Neither side will play at 100% systems wise. American aircraft are prohibited from using all their systems if a foreign aircraft is involved. In fact for years, the USAF pilots weren't allowed to use all of their threat warning systems even with only US aircraft involved.

When the Indian Air Force brought their SU-30MKIs in 2008 they didn't use their radar systems to prevent giving anything away. The Indian Air Force said that the frequencies of the radar can be used to block certain functions of the aircraft so they were forbidden to use it.

edit on 7/5/2012 by Zaphod58 because: (no reason given)

You are correct sir. It is called an ECM pod that is attched at Station 6 on Block 30 F-16's and Station 2 on Block 40 or higher F-16's. ECM stands for electronic counter measures and EVERYTHING about that pod is at least TS.

Originally posted by charles1952
I've got a really stupid question, I know very little about this.

Would Russia intentionally play at only, say, 80% effort? That way they would see what we have without giving away their capabilities, and that might cause us to underestimate them.

Even our closest allies do not play at 100%. Everyone keeps a lot of tricks up their sleeves. So it's more can our 80% beat their 80%. If they do play at 100% that would be an amazing thing for us. It won't happen though.

reply to post by NoSoup4U


So the F14s are being used just for the purposes of the operation? I had thought the Tomcat had been mothballed from active service.

reply to post by OccamsRazor04


I've read unconfirmed reports that at the very least the French have been known to fly Mirage fighters around the edge of an ACM exercise just grabbing whatever signals they could during the dogfights. I'm sure other countries have done it as well, just that it was pointed out the French were doing it, because I BELIEVE that the F-22 was involved.

reply to post by 74Templar


They have been. The only country that still uses them is Iran. All US F-14s are in the boneyard or museums.

The USAF has been known to bring:

F-15C, F-15E, F-16CJ, F-16C, B-52, B-2, B-1, E-3, C-17, KC-135, KC-10

As well as F/A-18s from the Marines, E-2Cs and E-2Ds, and F-5s from the Navy.

They won't officially release who's bringing what, until shortly before the exercise is scheduled to begin. It's subject to change, so they won't say until the last minute.

www.airfighters.com...

Some great pics of the participants in Red Flag 12-3.

reply to post by Zaphod58


Not surprised at all, least of all it being the French. Not to say they don't intend to use whatever they gleam against our enemies.

Apparently the Nellis Facebook page says that they AREN'T coming, but TheDewLine says that the Air Force says they ARE coming. Personally I'll believe and Air Force update over a Facebook page.

I like the comment that someone made about whether they were going to disband the Aggressors since they've outsourced their jobs.

Originally posted by NoSoup4U

Originally posted by charles1952
I've got a really stupid question, I know very little about this.

Would Russia intentionally play at only, say, 80% effort? That way they would see what we have without giving away their capabilities, and that might cause us to underestimate them.

No. They are a very prideful bunch of people. They have something to prove; air superiority. We know what they are capable of; trust me.

No they are not, you got it all wrong, the U.S. is the pridefull one, Russian's especially at Special Ops level are trianed to destroy the U.S. Spec Ops with respect, and not pride.

Originally posted by ATSWATCHER

Originally posted by NoSoup4U

Originally posted by charles1952
I've got a really stupid question, I know very little about this.

Would Russia intentionally play at only, say, 80% effort? That way they would see what we have without giving away their capabilities, and that might cause us to underestimate them.

No. They are a very prideful bunch of people. They have something to prove; air superiority. We know what they are capable of; trust me.

No they are not, you got it all wrong, the U.S. is the pridefull one, Russian's especially at Special Ops level are trianed to destroy the U.S. Spec Ops with respect, and not pride.

You got it wrong, they are both prideful, and both respectful. You don't come home if you don't respect your opponents cababilities. The two are not mutually exclusive.

We have had joint training with the Russians for awhile now, back to the late 90s. Most of it is small scale. Even the Russian Airborne Troops that came to Fort Carson last month only numbered about 30.

I am seriously surprised they will be coming to Red Flag though.

Typically the "RED" or OPFOR side is played exclusively by the 64th and 65th Aggressor squadrons at Nellis, using F-15s and F-16s painted in various COMBLOC or Middle East paint schemes. And using foreign tactics (ie usually Russian). With paint schemes and flight suit patches mimicing Russian stuff, I wonder how they will think about that.

en.wikipedia.org...

The visiting foreign countries are almost always on the "blue" side which includes the USAF and USN/USMC units selected to participate. But with the Russians here, who really knows.

Canada, England, France, and Germany are common visitors as are Japan, S. Korea, other NATO countries and (while kept somewhat quiet, Saudi, Egypt and Isreal have rotated through.

reply to post by DeadSeraph


Wow, how do they configure this? The aggresser squadron is "always" simulated Russian aircraft aren't they? Visiting nations participate with the "Blues" co-ordinating systems and tactics. What role do the Russians play?

I can't see the US giving their tactics away for future "countering". No SU-35s is telling as well. If the Russians where that proud of it's capabilities, they'd bring them, brag on them and sell more of them....

It also raises the question of whether there will be French Rafales and as well as EFs participating. Seeing the EFs,(German) were at Red Flag Alaska, everyone coming to the party could be real interesting.

You can bet it will be their best drivers, doubt they have many good ones. Either way, they will either come out of this with more respect for USAF abilities and perhaps chill out their politicians.

When is 13-1 supposed to start?

reply to post by NoSoup4U


Ron Paul ensures a Russian victory. He's as anti-military is any left winger. He belly-aches about the military-industrial complex, yet his solution is cut the military rather than cleaning up the "complex', doesn't make sense in my books...

reply to post by nwtrucker


No official word on what they're bringing, or what side they'll be on. They'll make an announcement closer to the start date of the exercise about who is officially coming, and what they're bringing. Red Flag 13-01 starts October 8th or 9th of this year.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by 74Templar

 

They have been. The only country that still uses them is Iran. All US F-14s are in the boneyard or museums.

The USAF has been known to bring:

F-15C, F-15E, F-16CJ, F-16C, B-52, B-2, B-1, E-3, C-17, KC-135, KC-10

As well as F/A-18s from the Marines, E-2Cs and E-2Ds, and F-5s from the Navy.

They won't officially release who's bringing what, until shortly before the exercise is scheduled to begin. It's subject to change, so they won't say until the last minute.

www.airfighters.com...

Some great pics of the participants in Red Flag 12-3.

edit on 7/6/2012 by Zaphod58 because: (no reason given)

I thought A-10's were often involved as well?

*edit: Saw the post earlier about green flag. Guessing they work the warthogs for that

reply to post by DeadSeraph


A-10s have been known to participate in Red Flag, and Red Flag Alaska, but they tend to use them more for Green Flag. That's more their style.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by 74Templar

 

They have been. The only country that still uses them is Iran. All US F-14s are in the boneyard or museums.

The USAF has been known to bring:

F-15C, F-15E, F-16CJ, F-16C, B-52, B-2, B-1, E-3, C-17, KC-135, KC-10

As well as F/A-18s from the Marines, E-2Cs and E-2Ds, and F-5s from the Navy.

They won't officially release who's bringing what, until shortly before the exercise is scheduled to begin. It's subject to change, so they won't say until the last minute.

www.airfighters.com...

Some great pics of the participants in Red Flag 12-3.

edit on 7/6/2012 by Zaphod58 because: (no reason given)

I would like to add the C-12 Huron, or as in this photo, the MC-12W Liberty. She is the name sake of "Club Huron" at ED.

reply to post by Zaphod58


Lord, to be a "fly on the wall" for this one. Especially if the Raptors play as well..

The "could be" the end all of A2A games. All we need now is to invite the Chinese and set up the barbeques.

Bah, I'm fantasizing. Still, Raptors, EFs, SU's, Js , Raffies playing paint ball.......