THE Ancient Knowledge for which we have been searching, hidden in plain sight (go figure) - 5 Parts

Originally posted by SilentKoala
reply to post by JohnPhoenix

 

So you're a lawyer now? Please post your credentials showing how you are qualified to make judgments as to what does and does not constitute Fair Use. If the dude's videos where copyright infringing YouTube would take them down. It isn't against ATS rules to post a YT video. You just don't like the content of the videos, but that doesn't make it okay for you to try to make up fake rules to censor them. That's really low.

If you don't believe in free speech for the people you disagree with, you don't believe in it at all.

I may disagree with everything someone says, but I will defend to the death their right to say it.

Are you kidding me? I love the content of the videos themselves. I have seen them all before by their original creators. It's the uploaders slant I don't like. YouTube only takes stuff down if they get a lot of complaints about the videos. I can point you to hundreds of very illegal popular videos that are still up. Google / YouTube doesn't care. No need to be a lawyer.. as the courts will tell you, it is a citizens duty not to be ignorant of the law.

Originally posted by seaez
Yet you then ignorantly go on to discuss all these thing ancients could not do, relate too or understand, and lol even say no one could possibly know the speed of light until the 18th century!?

Because the speed of light is based on discoveries preceding it, including, but not limited to the development of the telescope. This did not exist at that time. Other than the speed of light I did not say they were incapable of building the edifices that we are discussing.

Just because you can not fathom how it was done, does not mean it was not done to paraphrase what you had said. Hence, the whole point of "lost knowledge" or not knowing who the true builders were / are.

The is a difference between 'lost' knowledge, the exact method used to lift the blocks of the pyramids, and the ability to calculate a phenomenom that was not comprehensible due to the lack of tools and equipment needed to peform the experiment. One could speculate on how to construct the pyramids and have a resonably good explanation on how it was accomplished with tools available at the time. Using the premise I would like you (or anyone else for that matter) to explain how the Egyptians, with the tools available, could have calculated the speed of light.

Absence of evidence, is not evidence of absence.

Neither does the absence signify it was at one point present.

reply to post by seaez

Absence of evidence, is not evidence of absence.

If absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, then what evidence must be present to prove the absence of the evidence of absence to prove that the absence is evidently absent?

The problem with knowledge( well in my opinion) is that the more of it we get on the whole general spectrum more people regardless of skin color or beliefs realise that there is no need for strugle to survive on the day to day basis.So big riots start happening and harsh law come to life than bigger ones apear and fema camps start to fill and eventualy when the people see that they can't be heard more radical and quite extreme manifests apear and the martial law comes and shaks the ground.Where i am going with this is that they are expecting this to happen because protesting it's the legal fighting back way of the citizens.Where the peak of their power and control is that's what they will do but where the low points are they will start wars and they already have done that.So the fight of the people basicaly against their destruction and the destruction of the humanity eventualy has to not be focused only on mass street protesting but it has to be just a part of the general wish for a change plan because at the end of it noone knows if it will work but the way things are in the world right now point to the direction of that happening.You have to use your mind kus that's where they don't have plans made already but some are in progress tho( for example the US Military capability to alter stuff in your brain).Replacing this goverment with another won't change anything so the only thing that has to change when awakening reaches critical mass is the ruleing few that are making so many plans to get rids of us have to go.You cut of the cancer PERMANENTLY and you get rid of the problem.Now i am sorry where my writting was bad or just continous.Thats my level of thinking so no harsh judgments.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus
Because the speed of light is based on discoveries preceding it, including, but not limited to the development of the telescope. This did not exist at that time. Other than the speed of light I did not say they were incapable of building the edifices that we are discussing.

Granted that telescopes assisted our most recent discovery of the speed of light (halfheartedly granted as there are many formulas that uses the speed of light currently, somehow knowing all other variables would let you work backwards towards at the very least an approximation) and here is a good link describing such

The speed of light is something we've figured out only in the last 100 years, right? Well, once more, our forebears surprise us. It turns out we've known the speed of light since before the birth of Johann Sebastian Bach. That knowledge came close on the heels of the invention of the first telescopes in the early 1600s. In 1644, Ole Roemer was born in Jutland, Denmark. He took up the new study of astronomy with the early greats of that field. By 1675 Roemer was 31 and working in Paris with Picard. He was interested in the movement of Jupiter's nearest moon. He tracked it as it orbited in and out of Jupiter's shadow. It entered the shadow, then reemerged exactly 42 hours, 28 minutes, and 35 seconds later. It moved with constant and exact regularity. So Roemer measured 100 cycles and found that in one hundred cycles, Jupiter's moon could be relied upon to emerge EVERY TIME - right on schedule - to the exact second!! So he measured different lengths of time!! One was six months -- 100 laps -- and it was then that Roemer set his clocks and focused his telescope on Jupiter in the winter. In the spring - he waited and waited - but no moon appeared!! Finally it danced out of the shadows a full 15 minutes late. But why was the moon late - there MUST be a reason!! After much discussion, Roemer concluded that the moon was still appearing at the same time - and it was the earth that had moved!! The earth had swung hundreds of millions of miles away from Jupiter during the long winter months so light had to travel that vast distance to see Jupiter's moon!!! It had obviously taken the extra time to do so. (Also discovering that earths orbit around the sun is egg-shaped - NOT a circle!!)

Again, this is where I say that our modern telescopes allowed us to surveil such in the 1600s, yet I again quote you saying:

Just because you can not lay out the designs or construct the edifices using the tools the ancients had does not mean they could not. The majority of the people on the planet do not understand higher-level math (geometery, calculus, etc.), this does not mean that because they are fundementally ignorant that every one preceding them was.

Take your own advice, and a bit of mine: toss in a few Milena into your view of the word "ancients" and what you know of them.

The is a difference between 'lost' knowledge, the exact method used to lift the blocks of the pyramids, and the ability to calculate a phenomenom that was not comprehensible due to the lack of tools and equipment needed to peform the experiment.

What would you consider methods, tools, vehicles, music, culture, entire societies and languages lost to our modern history? Lost to our current world views and laughable mainstream history books? I would consider it "lost knowledge", as in, lost to time - to us.

Absence of evidence, is not evidence of absence.

Neither does the absence signify it was at one point present.

Agreed, yet a pointless assertion in denying ignorance on the topic of "lost knowledge".

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by seaez

 

Absence of evidence, is not evidence of absence.

If absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, then what evidence must be present to prove the absence of the evidence of absence to prove that the absence is evidently absent?

edit on 12-7-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

Why, undeniable evidence of such, of course.

Originally posted by seaez
Granted that telescopes assisted our most recent discovery of the speed of light...

Telescopes did not assist, they were the prime facilitator and without them the speed of light would not be calculable. And by 'most recent' I take that you believe it was caluclated prior to the time period I mentioned (and which is confirmed by your external source)? If so, how was this done? What tools were employed?

Again, this is where I say that our modern telescopes allowed us to surveil such in the 1600s, yet I again quote you saying:

Where and who had telescopes prior to their invention in the Renaissance? Where is the literary, epigraphic, numismatic, archeological or stelegraphical evidence? Why stop with telescopes? Why not claim other technology just because you want someone to prove a negative?

Take your own advice, and a bit of mine: toss in a few Milena into your view of the word "ancients" and what you know of them.

I have never discounted the ability of our ancestors but I will not be foolish to attribute to them technology which was obviously outside of their ability to grasp and which requires the development of other technologies and scientific concepts which they never had or recorded.

What would you consider methods, tools, vehicles, music, culture, entire societies and languages lost to our modern history?

Of course, but I was not discussing a civilization (the Egyptians) that is 'lost' to history. Only the very specific detail of what method was used to place the blocks of the pyramid in their final positions.

Agreed, yet a pointless assertion in denying ignorance on the topic of "lost knowledge".

It would be ignorant to assert that because we do not evidence of 'A' that it was feasible when 'A' is an extraodinary concept (the calculation of the speed of light) it is somehow probable. There is zero evidence that the Egyptians even understood the concept of the speed of light, let alone calculated it with great precision. Please produce evidence to the contrary if you have some otherwise this will become even more pointless a position than it is currently.

reply to post by six67seven


So-if my conscious mind creates my environment and therefore every perception becomes my reality--

I need to go outside and breathe in nourishment and feel the new world I WANT to experience.

Pleasure. Peace.

That deep draught of an icy cold beverage on a hot day.

Aaaaaahhhhhhhh........

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by seaez
Granted that telescopes assisted our most recent discovery of the speed of light...

Telescopes did not assist, they were the prime facilitator and without them the speed of light would not be calculable. And by 'most recent' I take that you believe it was caluclated prior to the time period I mentioned (and which is confirmed by your external source)? If so, how was this done? What tools were employed?

I don't know, I wasn't there, nor has all possible evidence been vetted, all possible existences in the past proved or found. If I knew how it was done, the knowledge wouldn't be lost now would it? But I posit that neither do you know how it was done, nor when for that matter, beyond a doubt. If so, please enlighten the world with your mighty masonic insight. One thing I do know is that I will not close my mind to the possibility that it was known and encoded into this mysterious structure for future generations to find.

Again, this is where I say that our modern telescopes allowed us to surveil such in the 1600s, yet I again quote you saying:

Where and who had telescopes prior to their invention in the Renaissance? Where is the literary, epigraphic, numismatic, archeological or stelegraphical evidence? Why stop with telescopes? Why not claim other technology just because you want someone to prove a negative?

I am not claiming they had telescopes, I am claiming they had knowledge enough to construct one of the most mysterious and amazing buildings this world has ever seen. You are the one who posits the information within could not have been done prior to the invention of telescopes and it is all simply coincidence. My answer to that is that for starters who are we to say that no one never conceptualized or created a telescope to study one of the most important constant societal reminders of our existence, all existence in this universe: the stars and heavens above over the countless millennium our race has existed.

Take your own advice, and a bit of mine: toss in a few Milena into your view of the word "ancients" and what you know of them.

I have never discounted the ability of our ancestors but I will not be foolish to attribute to them technology which was obviously outside of their ability to grasp and which requires the development of other technologies and scientific concepts which they never had or recorded.

What would you consider methods, tools, vehicles, music, culture, entire societies and languages lost to our modern history?

Of course, but I was not discussing a civilization (the Egyptians) that is 'lost' to history. Only the very specific detail of what method was used to place the blocks of the pyramid in their final positions.

Oh since you know this information on the method used to place the blocks of the pyramid in their final positions, when exactly was the great pyramid completed? What day was it? Year? Was it raining out? Really, please tell me, I've never believed the ~5000 year old age, how old is it really? I'd like to know to the day so I can start a birthday celebration for it.

I'm dying to know this too since I do have an open mind: it really was the Egyptians who built it?

Agreed, yet a pointless assertion in denying ignorance on the topic of "lost knowledge".

It would be ignorant to assert that because we do not evidence of 'A' that it was feasible when 'A' is an extraodinary concept (the calculation of the speed of light) it is somehow probable. There is zero evidence that the Egyptians even understood the concept of the speed of light, let alone calculated it with great precision. Please produce evidence to the contrary if you have some otherwise this will become even more pointless a position than it is currently.

You can't even prove beyond a shadow of a doubt how old it is and who constructed it. Since there is contention on that point, what was feasible or not can not be ascertained.

Great post. I tend to think there's a bit of truth and bit of lie in everything. The trick is to sift through the BS and get to the heart of information. Good stuff.

reply to post by seaez


I read that the pyramid of Khufu was begun August 23, 2470 B.C., so start planning the birthday party! I bet it would like a new capstone for its 4492 birthday.

Admittedly there is some controversy about the Sothic calendar and the list of Pharoahs, but Egyptologists that disagree differ only by ~139 years.

Originally posted by no1smootha
reply to post by seaez

 

I read that the pyramid of Khufu was begun August 23, 2470 B.C., so start planning the birthday party! I bet it would like a new capstone for its 4492 birthday.

Admittedly there is some controversy about the Sothic calendar and the list of Pharoahs, but Egyptologists that disagree differ only by ~139 years.

edit on 14-7-2012 by no1smootha because: (no reason given)

Cheops / Khnum-khuefui / Khufu's heirs must be so proud, he certainly convinced many people of his legacy.

That's one party I'd like to attend! However, I'll hold off on penning in the date. I'm a bit suspect of a reckoning circa 443 B.C. written by Herodotus who at the time was known to his contemporaries as the "Father of Lies"...

Now why would anyone ever lie to the masses!? Hard to believe... although Herodotus himself was an initiate of the Egyptian Mystery Schools...

Do ya 'ken they had conspiracies back then? Whenever it was again then was...

reply to post by seaez


Egyptologists arrive at the date for significant events in Egyptian history by using Manetho's list of Kings, the reign of the king in funerary hieroglyphics and comparing it to the Sothic calendar. none rely on Herodotus' histories.

Originally posted by no1smootha
reply to post by seaez

 

Egyptologists arrive at the date for significant events in Egyptian history by using Manetho's list of Kings, the reign of the king in funerary hieroglyphics and comparing it to the Sothic calendar. none rely on Herodotus' histories.

I won't for a moment believe you speak for all Egyptologists, nor do I doubt that many mainstream ones such as Zahi Hawass champion these dates.

However, as you point out all we have to more accurately assess our histories is the written accounts of such in hieroglyphics. Where are the Fourth Dynasty hieroglyphics detailing Khnum-khuefui's creation of the largest pyramid ever? Was this construction, a symbol of absolute rule and an endeavor that left an ever lasting legacy not worth documenting?

“Those in power write the history, while those who suffer write the songs.”
― Frank Harte

"All the ancient histories, as one of our wits say, are just fables that have been agreed upon. "
―Voltaire, Jeannot et Colin

reply to post by seaez


I didn't say that written history is all that we have to go on. We also have radiocarbon dating of materials found in the tombs of Pharaohs (who are also found on Manetho's list) With ALL of this evidence, archeologists are able to suggest a date for a given King's reign +/- some decades. What have you got? Ancient Aliens?

"I'm not saying it was aliens...but it was aliens!"

I'd love to watch these videos but there's too much new age music mixed in. I would like to watch the videos for their information, not the new age music and CGI effects.

If you can re-edit your videos to something more suitable to academic standards, you might have something worth discussing.

Until then, I will be flagging this thread to be moved to skunk works where it belongs.

reply to post by BottledWater


Skunk Works? For the music.

It's got a nice rhythm, but you can't dance to it? What's wrong, BW, do you have an Old Age brain? If Lawrence Welk provided the background could ya get your brain around some indepth elemental physiological mumbo jumbo?

Let's see. I'll help. Turn everything down. Any music, kill the kids, beat the dog. Whatever you need to do to make silence in your space....

I want you to imagine the solar system. Not the vastness of space, and don't worry about perspectives. Sun with its satelitte planets spinning around... Got it? Good.

Now, to continue the example...Jupiter and her satellite moons...spinning around. Got it?

A flower..with insects and birds and critters that interact with it daily...

Next--an atom, with positive and negative charges spinning like satelites around...see the pattern?

Now. The stuff that the satellites spin in? That empty space? Weather dark matter or vacuum, or even the vast nothingness? That is the part that you can imagine. If you want to create a number for a chemical compound that
could be found there..you could find it.

responding so I can read this later!

Originally posted by seaez
I don't know, I wasn't there, nor has all possible evidence been vetted, all possible existences in the past proved or found. If I knew how it was done, the knowledge wouldn't be lost now would it? But I posit that neither do you know how it was done, nor when for that matter, beyond a doubt.

What further evidence needs to be vetted? Why stop at calculating the speed of light. Why not posit that the Egyptians had anti-gravity, fusion reactors and interstellar travel? We have not found any evidence to the contrary so, by your line of reason, all of these inventions could have been developed by them.

If so, please enlighten the world with your mighty masonic insight.

Since you have now decided to resort to smart-ass comments I will keep this in mind in future discussions.

One thing I do know is that I will not close my mind to the possibility that it was known and encoded into this mysterious structure for future generations to find.

I see, so the Egyptians, with their complete grasp of cosmological knowledge, determined the speed of light, spent a good deal of time, energy and resources constructing the pyramids to 'encode' this knowledge in a measurement system that would not even be invented for close to 4,000 years. Yeah, that makes sense.

You are the one who posits the information within could not have been done prior to the invention of telescopes and it is all simply coincidence.

Because to calculate the speed of light you need a telescope (or even more sophisticated apparatus).

My answer to that is that for starters who are we to say that no one never conceptualized or created a telescope to study one of the most important constant societal reminders of our existence, all existence in this universe: the stars and heavens above over the countless millennium our race has existed.

You are right, who are we to say. To further your point, who are we to say that they did not work the measurements derived from their mythical telescope on the mythical laptop computers they had and then broadcasted this knowledge to the citizenry on their mythical television network that they also developed.

Oh since you know this information on the method used to place the blocks of the pyramid in their final positions, when exactly was the great pyramid completed?

I never said I knew this, only that we were discussing this topic before you decided to interject yourself to let everyone know that the Egyptians could have invented technology that would not be seen again for 4,000 years.

What day was it? Year? Was it raining out?

Thursday, August 4th 2539 BCE, sunny with no precipitation.

I've never believed the ~5000 year old age...

What you believe is sadly irrelevant.

You can't even prove beyond a shadow of a doubt how old it is and who constructed it. Since there is contention on that point, what was feasible or not can not be ascertained.

So by using your rather juvenile arguement no one knows the exact date the Parthenon was built so it can be safe to say that it may not have been the Greeks who also probably calculated the speed of light and most likely invented the iPhone while not building this structure.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


I simply wish to remind you: just because you get lots of stars, doesn't mean you're right. And if you get lots of stars, you're probably wrong, because no one cares what's RIGHT in today's world.

Get what I'm saying?