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We are made in the image of The Creator - The Creator is NOT The Destroyer (A New Philosophy Creativ

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posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 02:26 PM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


Yes but ImaFungi is right. All we can know in this journey called life is our own subjective experience. Reject this, and you are left with nothing. Rejecting any truth derived from this experience reduces our lives to meaningless existence. I don't know about you, but I like to think there is a reason for my existence, and that gives me conviction to base my morals upon.




posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 02:39 PM
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reply to post by ashleygwsmart
 


"Yes but ImaFungi is right. All we can know in this journey called life is our own subjective experience. Reject this, and you are left with nothing. Rejecting any truth derived from this experience reduces our lives to meaningless existence. I don't know about you, but I like to think there is a reason for my existence, and that gives me conviction to base my morals upon."

No ImaFungi thinks he's right, and from his perspective he's probably correct. Whats the journey of life got to do with the assumption that one must know thy self?Also for all we humans know life could very well be meaningless in the grand cosmic scale of things.

Its what we do in life that echoes in eternity not what we think we know, certainly not what we think we know about ones self. If there is a reason(And i think there is) for our existence your most certainly not supposed to be privi to said reason in this existance, that would be counter productive would it not?
edit on 8-7-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 03:08 PM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


Well if human life is meaningless how can what we do 'echo in eternity'? It either holds meaning or it doesn't. You either follow a moral code or you don't. What you choose to do in life (your actions) is based upon what you 'think you know'. I agree with you in the movement away from knowledge based on self, as I try to base my morals upon a foundation of what I believe to be eternal, objective ethical knowledge. Even then I cannot be certain I am right in any given circumstance. I simply follow my heart, in accordance with my true will, and this gives me solace from negative influences which would affect my judgement.

As for it being counter-productive as such to be privy to the reason for existence, yes it is, in the sense that if we knew the meaning of life we would have no need to live it (if there were a meaning of course). But then the argument becomes cyclical if you acknowledge that the meaning of life is to discover the meaning of life. So I guess, life is what you make of it. There is nothing else we can be sure of!



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 03:22 PM
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reply to post by ashleygwsmart
 


"Well if human life is meaningless how can what we do 'echo in eternity'?"

I did not say life is meaningless, i said it was a possibility not my opinion.

"It either holds meaning or it doesn't."

Very perceptive of you.

"either follow a moral code or you don't. What you choose to do in life (your actions) is based upon what you 'think you know'."

Im in complete agreement there pal.

"I agree with you in the movement away from knowledge based on self, as I try to base my morals upon a foundation of what I believe to be eternal, objective ethical knowledge."

Eternal, thats a long time depending on how one measures infinity. Can something, even knowledge last forever? If it can then will the knowledge be infinitely relevant? I mean over time it may become meaningless due to the fact that change is also Eternal?

"Even then I cannot be certain I am right in any given circumstance. I simply follow my heart, in accordance with my true will, and this gives me solace from negative influences which would affect my judgement."

Its nice to think we know something, and even better to know we know nothing, kind of gives reassurance.

"As for it being counter-productive as such to be privy to the reason for existence, yes it is, in the sense that if we knew the meaning of life we would have no need to live it (if there were a meaning of course). But then the argument becomes cyclical if you acknowledge that the meaning of life is to discover the meaning of life. So I guess, life is what you make of it. There is nothing else we can be sure of!"

Yep, the argument's most certainly is circular, but then again how does the line go........"I think there for i am".

Just think 200 years ago they could have burned me for those 6 words, progress i hope.
edit on 8-7-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 03:36 PM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


If something 'echoes in eternity' as you put it,it must transcend time, and is therefore objective, as it applies to the whole of time. As for eternity, I'd rather not get into a debate about that, I would be here forever!



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 03:37 PM
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reply to post by ashleygwsmart
 

"If something 'echoes in eternity' as you put it,it must transcend time,"

I was just quoting Gladiator, chill! But yes it could well transcend time.

"and is therefore objective, as it applies to the whole of time."

I agree, but whats you point? Just because it applies to the now does not mean it will eternally be so if change is indeed a constant.

"As for eternity, I'd rather not get into a debate about that, I would be here forever!"

That's very apt! LoL
edit on 8-7-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)

edit on 8-7-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 03:52 PM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


Lol I've had enough little revelations writing these replies, does Descartes' logic apply to "I think I am f***ed, therefore I am f***ed"? lol



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 03:54 PM
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reply to post by ashleygwsmart
 


Sometimes, but not always. LoL



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 04:32 PM
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reply to post by ashleygwsmart
 


"If everyone thought like you
we would all still be sitting around in caves
scratching our arses,
never bothering to do anything."

of value i might add!
replace caves with say,, Wall Street Corporate Offices,, and i would agree.



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 07:17 PM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


all i meant by anything i said in relation to what you wrote was if you knew yourself and were your best friend,,, and were comfortable with all your thoughts and all your ignorance,,, it would be know problem not knowing yourself.,,.,. well actually id say you would know yourself quite well,..,.,,.,.. all i meant to say was by judging your seemingly insecure notion of not being able to know yourself,,, it sounded like you may not know yourself,.,.,. in which i replied.,,.,.something to the extent of,,,, it is possible to know yourself,,,, so know yourself,,, for it is a good thing,.,.,. all this concept means is be comfortable in your own skin and mind,,, unlike being programmed and following orders and receiving all your information and ideas,, and outlooks and insights from external sources,.,.,. work things out within yourself,,, use your imagination to explore yourself and the world,,, and be comfortable with the things you can think and discover,,.,.,.,. I know some people just by observation who may "hardly" know themselves.,,.., my self by observation,, i am comfortable as a cat is with itself,,, i am open to all truths,,, i am aware,,, i am fine with it,,, i accept reality and myself,,,, i embrace it,.,,.,. its all good,.,.,. i can dwell in my imagination and thought,,, and dissect the surrounding world .,,.., i can take on other perspectives,,,, i can solve problems,.,.,. i can create solutions,.,.,. i can construct material,..,,. i can construct ideas.,..,,. know thy self.,.,.

I dont really know what were arguing about.,,.,.,. when you were a child did you play with yourself and pass the time,,, and live in a world of wonder,.,.,.,.,. when you grew up did you learn things,,, and have conversations in your head to work out ideas and gain insight and knowledge,..,,. to you have particular favorite things you like to do,,, pet peeves,,,, favorite meals and colors,...,. have you ever objectively observed you behavior,, caught yourself being jealous or conniving,,,.. ever caught any bad behavior and then corrected it for the future,.,,. learn how you would like to be and be viewed,, based on the power of your will to create yourself in your own image,,,..

this is my side and all of how i look at this in simple terms,.,.,.,. if you understand where i was coming from with what i said that is cool.,.,.,., if not let me know whats up.,,..,, and lets proceed with some arguments
edit on 8-7-2012 by ImaFungi because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 08:32 PM
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reply to post by ImaFungi
 


I only asked you a few questions ImaFungi, i dont think the discusion qualifies as an argument. And yes i think i can see where you are coming from in some areas all through i do find your posting style a little hard on the eyes.

As to the Know thyself statement, you realise this is and old greek proverb, nosce te ipsum in latin, the proverb is applied to those whose boasts exceed what they are, and that "know thyself" is a warning to pay no attention to the opinion of the multitudes.

I here lots of new-age nutters spouting this "know thyself" crap all the time, when its plainly obvious that they know nothing at all, or if they do have half a clue as to what is going on and how things work there version is so fragmented and full of disinformation that it borders on mind control. So its not personal mate, im generally intrested.

So i ask you again, by knowing ones self as you say are you not simply confusing knowledge of oneself with confidence in your own actions and abilities?

edit on 8-7-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 09:25 PM
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Originally posted by andy06shake
reply to post by ImaFungi
 


I only asked you a few questions ImaFungi, i dont think the discusion qualifies as an argument. And yes i think i can see where you are coming from in some areas all through i do find your posting style a little hard on the eyes.

As to the Know thyself statement, you realise this is and old greek proverb, nosce te ipsum in latin, the proverb is applied to those whose boasts exceed what they are, and that "know thyself" is a warning to pay no attention to the opinion of the multitudes.

I here lots of new-age nutters spouting this "know thyself" crap all the time, when its plainly obvious that they know nothing at all, or if they do have half a clue as to what is going on and how things work there version is so fragmented and full of disinformation that it borders on mind control. So its not personal mate, im generally intrested.

So i ask you again, by knowing ones self as you say are you not simply confusing knowledge of oneself with confidence in your own actions and abilities?

edit on 8-7-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)


I only read your first paragraph so far and am a little offended.,,.,.,. my posting style can be dumb, stupid, bizarre.,,etc...... but all the words are there,.,., you can take your time.,,,. part of the reason i post like that is because it usually requires a bit of time and pause to read and comprehend,,, its the way i think,



posted on Jul, 8 2012 @ 09:36 PM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


"So i ask you again, by knowing ones self as you say are you not simply confusing knowledge of oneself with confidence in your own actions and abilities?"


knowledge of oneself .,,..,,. what would this entail? social security number? genetic traits? address? favorite tv show? favorite food? pet peeves?

confidence in actions and abilities,..,,. what would this entail? going to school and learning math, and then being confident in your math skills? growing up and playing a lot of basketball and being confident playing basketball?

by knowing oneself I am simply talking about everything an individual self can be and do and think and feel,,,, every smidgen of detail,,, of information that can be gathered about a human that lives a life from baby to growing up,..,,.,. the self erected morals,,,, the self created outlook on others,,,,,,, the rambling daily thoughts and how they are treated,.,.,.,. literally the awareness of oneself,..,. knowing oneself,.,.,. being in control,,,, this is why i said if you doubt a human can be in control or know them self,,, i will say,,, speak for your self.


see how its hard for me to explain to you the potential clarity of my vision,, how you may only be capable of understanding a certain amount of things and in certain ways,,,, its why and how people are different,..,,,. some people use the phrase to think outside the box..... i never knew there was a box there,,, and if there was or is,, it was built by that person,,,,,
edit on 8-7-2012 by ImaFungi because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 9 2012 @ 06:34 AM
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Thank you for explaining your notion of "know thy self". I think i get the gist of your concept now, turns out is rather similar to something we to do here in sunny Glasgow its called learning. LoL. Please dont take offense to my questioning of your posting style, it does take me a while to read however but that may be due to the fact that im mildly Dyslexic.
edit on 9-7-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 9 2012 @ 02:17 PM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


I wish I'd never said it now! Please don't put me in the new ager pile, I don't belong there! What I meant, and should of clarified was that to know yourself doesn't mean you know everything about yourself...it means to know that your self doesn't know everything. Know yourself means first acknowledge the boundaries your self posits and then you can transcend them.



posted on Jul, 10 2012 @ 12:54 PM
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reply to post by ashleygwsmart
 


let's get transcendental then! LoL



posted on Jul, 10 2012 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


Lol, I just finished the final year of my Philosophy degree, so all that wisdom has left my head now to return to wherever it came from.



posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 05:03 AM
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Congratulations Ashley, well done!



posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 08:46 AM
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reply to post by andy06shake
 


Thanks mate, I think I joined ATS because I missed the debating already.



posted on Jul, 11 2012 @ 09:07 AM
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reply to post by ashleygwsmart
 


If you like debates, come on over to the "What is so wrong with religion?" thread, its beginning to get interesting.



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