Obamacare Causing Insurance Stocks to Plummet

reply to post by EvilSadamClone


You are most likely correct, Evilsaddam. I enjoy your posts, they are often intelligent and cut right to the heart of the matter.

reply to post by TWISTEDWORDS


Good insight.

One question, do we really need the middleman (insurance) to provide coverage to everyone? The gov't is already going to tax us to provide coverage. Therefore, instead of going to the insurance company why not have the gov't keep its own pool of money versus paying a middleman?

reply to post by FissionSurplus


I was thinking along the same lines as-well. I must say that I'm somewhat stumped on this one ,since it would be very unlikely for Washington to actually pass something that doesn't benefit the big dog lobbyist such as the medical ,pharmaceutical, and insurance industries.

However, the only one from the three listed above that I see that stands to lose is the insurance industries from what you stated. The Medical and pharmaceutical industry will be able to sell more products and possibly at a higher rate, and reach more customers since everyone will be covered and it won't come directly from their pockets.

Of course there is always the possibility that maybe Obama is truly trying to do what he thinks will help the country regardless if it $crews the lobbyist.

The part of the story I have not seen anybody talk about on here yet.




The hospital stocks went up. Where the money should be.

Health care stocks divided after ruling
money.cnn.com...

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Health care stocks were sharply divided Thursday, with hospital stocks rallying after the Supreme Court upheld President Obama's health care reform bill.

"Hospitals are going to be compensated for the uninsured that they cover," said Robb Granado, senior analyst at Sageworks. "No matter how you shake it, it's a positive for hospitals. It takes away a lot of uncertainty."

Hospital operators, and companies that own hospitals, celebrated the ruling. HCA Holdings (HCA, Fortune 500), United Health Services (UHS, Fortune 500), Community Health Systems (CYH, Fortune 500), Health Management Associates (HMA, Fortune 500) and Tenet Healthcare Corp (THC, Fortune 500) surged between 5% to 10%.

Providers of Medicare and Medicaid also got a substantial lift. Wellcare Health Plans (WCG, Fortune 500) rose 9% and Amerigroup (AGP, Fortune 500) jumped 5%. Centene Corp. (CNC, Fortune 500) rose 2% and Molina Healthcare (MOH, Fortune 500) rose 9%.

The ruling had the opposite effect on health insurances stocks, which slumped significantly.

Wellpoint Inc. (WLP, Fortune 500), Aetna Group (AET, Fortune 500) and Cigna Health Group (CI, Fortune 500) all dropped between 3% to 5%. Unitedhealth Group (UNH, Fortune 500) eked out a 0.5% gain, while Humana Inc. (HUM, Fortune 500) was flat.

So the money has moved to where it should be. The insurance companies that make money by not treating people or paying for there care lost money. The Hospitals that treat people and try to help them no matter if they can even pay gained money. This is a correction that should make sense to people. Unless you only care about the money and not peoples health.

reply to post by JBA2848


Good point. I had seen on several financial channels that the hospital stocks are doing really well. I guess they are thinking that Obamacare means that their emergency rooms will be cleared out somewhat, as people are actually able to go to the doctor for their minor ailments.

But I suppose that depends on where the hospitals are. In the southwest states (California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas), there will still be illegals that use the ER under a pseudonym and fake SSN who still won't pay their bills. Their situation will remain the same, as they are under the government radar to begin with.

reply to post by FissionSurplus


But don't forget the other 46 states you did not mention will do better. They will get paid not just for the people who do not have insurance. But those that do have insurance and the insurance company refuses to pay the bill and drags it out in court for years. And that samething will happen in the 4 states you listed. the illegal alien portion would be a part of the problem that will still fall under the part where every body gets treated for life threatening injuriies or illness and released.

Originally posted by TWISTEDWORDS


SO this leads to people only using insurance for expensive needs and then dropping it when they are done. So the insurance companies won't have long term clients, only pay as you go clients and the costs will surge. So wallstreet is saying the insurance companies won't survive with this model.

See how its not going to work?

That goes for those who are unemployed, or self employed. Arent employers now requierd to provide health care for their employees? There is that side of the coin too. You have 40 million uninsured probably minimum wage workers with no benefits. You have the self employed, who have coverage anyway probably. Then you have like 30 million unemployed? So the companies are looking at at least 10 Million more clients who work and 30 Million unemplyoed, who will be covered anyway.

Originally posted by FissionSurplus
reply to post by milominderbinder

 

Oil is very easy to hate, but people aren't stopping driving or using plastic or any of the other myriad of products made from petroleum. It has permeated our world, unfortunately. I had to come to terms with my intense dislike of the oil industry when I married into his family. I have an uneasy truce with it.....I don't trust it (as I don't trust natural gas companies like Chesapeake), but as of now, it remains front and center in our economy.

Well of course people aren't shifting away from petroleum. It's pretty hard to do when a single person is allowed to hold position on the board of directors for both oil companies and car companies simultaneously. Ditto for the plastics industry.

The VERY FIRST diesel engine developed by Rudolph Diesel himself between 1893-1897 was designed to run on VEGETABLE OIL. The VERY FIRST passenger car was ELECTRIC. People don't need to stop driving. The only thing that needs to happen is for anyone who develops or pushes alternative and superior technologies to petroleum to stop dying under unusual circumstances.

It's not a coincidence that Rudolph Diesel himself died under extremely unusual circumstances after returning from a trip to the United States to bring his vegetable-oil running engine to the masses.

As it stands today we can supply 100% of all of humanities needs for transportation and plastics off of 100% renewable bio resources CHEAPER than using oil. Remember...you have to factor in the trillions and trillions of dollars we have spent on warfare in the Middle East into the equation of your overall costs.

I can understand that you have old investments and are receiving dividend income from the oil industry...but it's incredibly irresponsible to KEEP that money invested in those companies. Doing so really makes you no better than a bribe-taking politician who is willing to sell out their country and the entire human race in exchange for the table scraps they are tossed. It's like the guy who works and the bomb factory who thinks he's not at fault for blowing up women and children.

If you have a conscience you really should dump those investments as soon as possible.

reply to post by milominderbinder


At the time petroleum was plentifull easily accessible and had to be made only avaiable for a fraction of humanity. No cars in china. No conspiracy there.

Of course, because they are going to be put out of business. Why would you want to be holding THAT bag?

Originally posted by TWISTEDWORDS
Well that's not why it is plummeting. Stock analysts are predicting that all to most Americans will not pay for the insurance and just pay the small $95 tax penalty. Then these same people will use the insurance when needed as they can't be denied coverage. So this will kill the profits of the health insurance carriers.

SO this leads to people only using insurance for expensive needs and then dropping it when they are done. So the insurance companies won't have long term clients, only pay as you go clients and the costs will surge. So wallstreet is saying the insurance companies won't survive with this model.

See how its not going to work?

this is exactly what my wife and i talked about doing

and thats what were gonna do