Stand Up For The Freedom of Women

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by smyleegrl

 

What the Taliban have done to women in Afghanistan is reprehensible, no one would claim otherwise. The question is, is the Taliban the norm of Islam, or the exception?

The norm for Islam is to pattern themselves after Muhammad and it applies to every aspect of their lives. In essence they are running on the teachings of a madman hellbent on conquering the world and they even model their wars and attacks like him. When Muhammad wanted to conquer Mecca and force Islam on the pagan city, he feigned a peace treaty until he could build up enough troops to take the city and when he had enough warriors he made war on Mecca and conquered it. So they still follow his battle strategies today, and it is called Jihad.

...and the battle tactic is extremely well portrayed in 'To Serve Man' and the foolish subservience of the host is also painfully similar to today's bend-over-backwards Islamism facilitators.

www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by tothetenthpower

Originally posted by TheFogHorn

Originally posted by tothetenthpower

Originally posted by TheFogHorn
So what you're saying is that you have no concern for the women whose lives are being affected detrimentally due to these Miss Headscarves setting a precedent in their predominantly muslim areas? This is my point. You need to start to think in terms of how it affects and will affect non-muslim women.

Who are you to say that it's affecting them badly?

That's your opinion, not a fact on what's going on.

How is this affecting non-muslim women? 99% of all muslims I know, don't want anybody but muslims subscribing to their cultural norms. Only the extremists cry about Sharia law and whatever else nonsense they want.

You need to start thinking how your idea of changing things is actually the same as asking Christians to stop going to church because I think it's indoctrination.

~Tenth

I've said several times now on this forum that I have been the victim of chronic sexual abuse and religious cleansing. That explains the 'who are you to say' stance.

You're experiences are not indicative of how the rest of the muslim world treats each other. There are 1.57 Billion of them on planet earth.

What happened to you was very unfortunate, but to use that as a means to judge an entire group of people is wrong.

I've had my fair share of religious bigots and zealots picket my lawn because I am gay and me and my husband have raised 4 children together in a relatively conservative community. I don't use those experiences to judge people I have never met.

Neither should you.

~Tenth

Are you suggesting my experience is an isolated one? Are you completely and utterly blind?

Originally posted by smyleegrl
reply to post by redneck13

 

What the Taliban have done to women in Afghanistan is reprehensible, no one would claim otherwise. The question is, is the Taliban the norm of Islam, or the exception?

If the norm in Islam is for women to wear burqa, then why do we not see more women in burqa?

As for Afghanistan, I don't know the solution. The only thing that can be done, I suspect, is for the men and women who are against such extremes to make their voices heard. Hard to do when the ones in control have machine guns, I recognize that.

Things in Afghanistan used to be very different
It looks as though time is moving backwards in Afghanistan
Along with it, women’s rights



Afghanistan was soo much developed socially and economically in those time. We may not get to there even after three decades

Category:
Education

reply to post by TheFogHorn


In comparison to the relationships, behavior and overall judgement of 1.57 Billion people, yes, VERY isolated.

Sorry but even though what happened to you was terrible, it doesn't make you special, or more in tune with the rest of the world.

Playing the victim card as a means to judge others is not a good way to about resolving your own personal issues. I think you are projecting whatever emotions you still have pent up and using them as justification to put down a 6th of the world's population.

Does that make much sense to you?

~Tenth

reply to post by tothetenthpower

Dear tothetenthpower,

Nice talking to you again, and thanks for the point about not judging everybody by some. That's a sometimes needed reminder, but it's got it's limits.

As an example so extreme it's silly, suppose 99% of red haired people are confirmed, pathological liars. No one would take the word of the next redhead they met. What if it was 51%? Odds are still against them and you probaably wouldn't take their word for anything. The point is that at some level of probability everyone makes a judgment on a person they don't know. The more important the judgment is, the less risk you're likely to take. Assume you knew that someone from group "A" was .001% likely to kill you at random, and a person from group "B" was 1% likely to do so. You may not be statistically justified in judging everyone from group "B," but you will certainly act differently around them.

So what per centages do we have? Sketchy, at best. let me show you what little I've found.

Recent (2009) Polls show a disparity of views regarding terrorism, with between 15% and 30% of respondents in most Muslim countries surveyed holding a positive view on various related issues. An average of 30% of respondents in Indonesia, Egypt, Pakistan and Morocco held positive views of groups that launch attacks against Americans, while similar numbers held a negative view or a neutral view. With regards specifically to al-Qaeda, in Egypt, 21% of respondents supported their attacks on Americans, while 33% opposed attacks on Americans but supported al-Qaeda's goals and 28% opposed both al-Qaeda's attacks and goals; the remainder held no strong opinion. These numbers were 9%, 19%, and 22% respectively in Indonesia; 16%, 15%, and 22% in Pakistan; and 9%, 31%, and 26% in Morocco.

en.wikipedia.org...
Between 15% and 30% hold a positive view on terrorism and related issues? Those are worse odds than Russian Roulette, and I'm not going to play that game either.

But leaving aside, for a moment, per centages, what are the numbers? You mentioned 1.57 Billion. If the 15% to 30% figures are correct, that means between 235,000,000 and 470,000,000 Muslims are quite pleased with the idea of terrorism. That's roughly the same or greater than the entire population of the US.

I was hoping that living in the West would moderate some views, and maybe it does in some cases, but there is also this

:A 2007 survey of British muslims showed that 61 % believe homosexuality should be illegal, with up to 71 % of young British muslims holding this belief. 43% of polled muslims believed muslim woman should not be allowed to marry without the consent of her guardian, and 31% believed apostasy should be forbidden and punishable by death

en.wikipedia.org...

Tothetenthpower, I think I'm a little more worried about this than you are. And from the very little digging I've done, I think I'm more correct. But I know I have a lot to learn, and I'm willing to do it.

With respect,
Charles1952

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by TheFogHorn

 

In comparison to the relationships, behavior and overall judgement of 1.57 Billion people, yes, VERY isolated.

Sorry but even though what happened to you was terrible, it doesn't make you special, or more in tune with the rest of the world.

Playing the victim card as a means to judge others is not a good way to about resolving your own personal issues. I think you are projecting whatever emotions you still have pent up and using them as justification to put down a 6th of the world's population.

Does that make much sense to you?

~Tenth

I asked you are you blind, meaning not only are you blind to what's going on in the world but also are you blind to all the things I and others have posted on this and other threads. I put it to you that it is in fact YOU who are seeing things through your own myopic viewpoint due to you living 'on the fringe' and therefore siding with the underdog, as is so often the case. This coupling up explains the unlikely alliance between the Islamists and the leftists, the latter being first for the chop once they've helped their friends gain ascendence. I am yet to find a gay man who either agrees with me or is able to listen to my story without shrinking off. Minorities stick together.....the enemy of my enemy is my friend. Well how strong that bond is and how ironic your allegiances are given gay men are strung up and hanged in muslim countries?

www.youtube.com...

Not all minorities deserve or need your sympathy and support. One day the Islamic minority of your country will become a large enough minority to ensure all gay people are dealt with....their way. And who will help you then? Women like me? Forget it.....I'll be long gone.

Your bed fellows' tune will change and you will not be dancing in the streets about it.

Ask a woman that lived in Syria for thirty years
She can tell you about the Muslim Brotherhood
She is a registered psychiatrist
From 2007

Wafa Sultan at David Horowitz's Restoration Weekend, Palm Beach, Florida 2007

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Quote: 'Some Norwegian women have reported started to dye their hair black and only travel in groups'

WATCH VIDEO HERE IF NOT APPEARING BELOW...www.youtube.com...



I can't believe that my years of work could potentially help people like you when you can't find it in yourself to consider the possibility women are suffering. Do you think my bad experiences started and ended with my extended period of sexual abuse as a teenager? It's never ended and it extends like tentacles throughout my friends and family network. A friend having to have facial reconstruction due to being attacked, a family member being unfairly sued for a million, a friend of a friend being taken to Pakistan and never heard from again, a friend being used for sex, a landlord not returning a large bond, a neighbour who never smiled, repeated religious cleansing in yet another area, several pets disappearing,....and to this day dirty looks from the women and looks of both lust and disdain from muslim men. I would say more to you but I would get banned.

QUOTE: 75% of women in Pakistani prisons are behind bars for the 'crime' of having been raped.

''

Video here if not above...www.youtube.com...

How sad that this thread has only received six flags. Are most of the many Christians around here more concerned with whether or not they got the saved or not saved rules right than being a real Christian who fights for fairness and justice in the world regardless of what people think of them? There are hardly any Christians around here....a few but most are just concerned about their own future, i.e. self serving frauds.

reply to post by TheFogHorn


Yes when a woman is raped, she needs four men to testify they saw it
Because her testimony dose not have the same legal power as a man
four men never testify
The man then says she tempted him and she is guilty of adultery
Sharia law in action

Lara Logan, the journalist who was repeatedly sexually assaulted by a crowd in Egypt........is this an isolated incident that we should totally dismiss or does this give us an insight into the male muslim mentality? Is she a racist for speaking out about the sexual harassment 'epidemic' in Egypt? Should her voice be silenced to avoid upsetting muslims?

www.youtube.com...

And another 'racist' who should be ashamed of herself should she dare suggest muslim men are more likely to be sexually depraved...

www.youtube.com...

and another one of those horrid women who offends our sense of correctness and forces us to think about horrid things. She should just put up and shut up and certainly not make an issue out of it. Besides, it was probably her own faught. She should have worn a headscarf and kept her head down, silly woman....

www.youtube.com...

and another....

www.youtube.com...

These women should all just shut up because if they make a big deal of their little mishaps we will all be forced to do something we would rather not have to do.........surrender our narcissistic supply of self serving satisfaction at always being very very nice and never ever questioning the integrity of a bunch of people whose symbolism includes a huge machete. We would have to be just ordinary and that's unthinkable.

QUOTE: 'The number of rapes in Malmo, Sweden, has trippled in the last twenty years.'

www.youtube.com...

There are nubers of issues with Islam other than the treatment of women
There are other countries with slave trade and not necessarily Islamic
However, this woman defines and supports the argument of Islam being the problem anywhere sharia law is instated


In Islam Women Are Dumb Animals & Slaves - In Christianity Women Are Not

Uploaded by Awakened2Truth on Jul 17, 2011

Nothing like hearing the truth from the women themselves of the truth of ISLAM and it's true purpose.

I love my sisters in humanity who are of the Islam Religion, but please sisters, realize it's not muslim you want to be with your aspirations of being good women of God, it's a Christian woman you want to be, do not be deceived by Islam.

Not all minorities deserve or need your sympathy and support. One day the Islamic minority of your country will become a large enough minority to ensure all gay people are dealt with....their way. And who will help you then? Women like me? Forget it.....I'll be long gone. reply to post by TheFogHorn


There are major issues with woman’s rights
The proof is in Europe and they are serious problems
and getting worse

The article below demonstrates the cunning of Islamism. Facts are tweaked to suit the situation in order to further the Islamification process. In most instances, the wearing of the headscarf is a religious obligation and to deny it would be an enfringement on freedom of religion. In others, however, it is 'just part of the uniform'.

www.dailymail.co.uk...

reply to post by TheFogHorn


It's actually quite telling that you would attack me for being gay and then make a wild assumption that I am a "leftist" as apparently Muslim "apologists" and leftists go hand it hand.

Spare me again the victim card. I in no way stated that women were not suffering all around the world, clearly there are places where they suffering. If you however, expect me to believe that 1/7th of the population are these evil heathens and that ALL muslim men treat their woment this way, then you are the blind one.

I'm sorry but I am not so jaded as to think that 1.57 billion people, which is HARDLY a minority in the religious sense, are all a bunch of evil patriarchs.

You may continue to believe this, just remember that you have the right to your own opinions, not your own facts.

I never stated that Muslim immigration to other countries wasn't a problem, but it's those countries whose immigration policies and handling of these immigrants was poor and has caused these issues.

You don't allow immigrants to come to your country and change your culture or your laws, if that was the case, why did they immigrate from those nations to begin with?

There is so much fear and propaganda in today's media regarding Muslims and Islam in general and people are just waiting to gobble it up. After all, everybody needs an enemy to hate right? Need a justification for wars right?

In any case, your personal experiences, however terrible they were, cannot, and I refuse to let them be used to judge an entire group of people. 1.57 billion people to be exact at last count. If you think that you have the moral authority to do so based on a few people that treated you poorly in your past, then you really need to re-evaluate your arguments and ask yourself if emotions cloud your reasoning.

~Tenth

reply to post by tothetenthpower


I never said they were ALL sexual predators nor ALL bad people and the only reason why you are now saying this is due to your need to justify your attack of me, a woman determined to do her best to warn people. It's pretty low isn't it to attack a victim of sexual abuse for speaking out and saying there is a problem and we need to do something about it? Isn't that the Christian thing to do....to alert people to potential danger?

QUOTE: 'None of the 500 British Muslims interviewed believed that homosexual acts were morally acceptable.Incredible, isn't it? Gallup did a random poll of British muslims and couldn't find even ONE single muslim to stand up for gay rights. So next time someone tells you that most British muslims are moderate, nice people, be sure to correct them. Scientific polling shows that virtually all British muslims are homophobic bigots.'

4freedoms.ning.com...

Is that a warning you find acceptable? ALL muslims in the survey enough for you?

Even if only 10% of muslim men in a muslim ghetto are a danger to Westernised women, that is an unacceptably high risk in a supposedly liberal country. No Westernised women should have to live in fear and have to wear a shroud every time she leaves the house.

reply to post by TheFogHorn

Originally posted by TheFogHorn
QUOTE: 'None of the 500 British Muslims interviewed believed that homosexual acts were morally acceptable.Incredible, isn't it? Gallup did a random poll of British muslims and couldn't find even ONE single muslim to stand up for gay rights. So next time someone tells you that most British muslims are moderate, nice people, be sure to correct them. Scientific polling shows that virtually all British muslims are homophobic bigots.'

Scientific polling
Did the polling show how many christians believed homosexual acts were morally reprehensible? Jews? Hindus? Sikhs? No, it focused on muslims, and didn't even mention any percentage for others. It didn't even differentiate between different levels of adherence to the faith.

Since you love statistics so much, another survey found that 100% of women polled in Indianapolis reported having been sexually harassed (similar stuff to what you mentioned...leering, following, blocking the path, sexual/sexist comments, sexual touching, grabbing, vulgar gestures, etc.). I didn't know Indianapolis had such a huge muslims population!
Same with the California Bay area. 100% of women polled said they had been harassed. I suppose California is a hub of muslims! Chicago faired better, with only 86% of the women polled being harassed- I suppose the Mafia have moved away now, and it is all muslamic rape gangs there . The entirety of Canada is also under attack! 80% of the women polled said they had been harassed. Must already be a muslim majority country...The list goes on...NYC 63%, Tel Aviv 83%, Delhi 95%, Tokyo 64%, Beijing 70%, etc. Muslims seem to have really gotten around!

Yeah, if you were looking at the numbers (and had decided to act insane), you'd be "warning" about the entire male portion of the human race. Heck, from half to 90% of those polled mentioned that public transport (buses, subways, trains, etc.) had it the worst. WE SHOULD OUTLAW PUBLIC TRANSPORT!

Now of course, some muslim-majority countries polled high as well (Pakistan, for example). But looking at the data in context, you can understand that this isn't a case for the "utter vileness of Pakistanis" or muslims or whatever. It seems to be something endemic with people, and needs to be addressed as such. Scare-mongering about, or scapegoating one group won't help anything.

reply to post by TheFogHorn


I never attacked anybody and you never stated that you did not think that all Muslim men were this way.

All of your posts on this subject paint a very wide brush about Islam and Muslims in general.

If you didn't mean to generalize, than you should have specified.

~Tenth

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by TheFogHorn

 

I never attacked anybody and you never stated that you did not think that all Muslim men were this way.

All of your posts on this subject paint a very wide brush about Islam and Muslims in general.

If you didn't mean to generalize, than you should have specified.

~Tenth

edit on 7/5/2012 by tothetenthpower because: (no reason given)

Don't be so ridiculous. I shouldn't need to make footnotes.