will america be punished for attacking iraq for no reason???

WMD - Concubines and a stargate

Prove to me that it wasn't - stalemate.



Although there is a thread about a mobile lab that could be interesting.

Lets face it would you trust saddam to tell the truth. Since Iran, syria, israel and anyone else in that part of the ME seem to be involved in nuclear tech, iraq prob was too IMO that is.

Originally posted by Munro_DreadGod
ATS is all about IMHO finding the truth not enforcing your own on others.

Exactly. And according the the expertice, the vast prepondrance of evidence have shown there to be nothing to support the notion of Saddam harbouring WMD's. Maybe you have some deeper knowledge in this you'd like to share? Or maybe you're just satisfied with the reasoning you've just displayed?

And it aint a court of law

Freedom of speech and all that.

Sure. You can keep rambling utter b.s. as much as you want .

Originally posted by Munro_DreadGod
WMD - Concubines and a stargate

Prove to me that it wasn't - stalemate.

But where do you draw the line? God forbit that this administration decides to go after China because they BELIEVE that biological additives have been added to imported rice. We can all kiss our asses goodbye then. Same logic wouldn't you say?

Sure. You can keep rambling utter b.s. as much as you want

.

A the thoughts of an educated man.

opps i must be talking b.s. again



Fact - convoy of military trucks takes undisclosed items too syria.

what was in them is hearsay granted but it does not mean that they were filled with teddybears and thankfully you are free too be able to express an opiniuon yourself. Kumbya my friend

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by Munro_DreadGod
WMD - Concubines and a stargate

Prove to me that it wasn't - stalemate.

But where do you draw the line? God forbit that this administration decides to go after China because they BELIEVE that biological additives have been added to imported rice. We can all kiss our asses goodbye then. Same logic wouldn't you say?

Yip but if you give the enemy a inch he will take the mile. NK, Iran others what do you do sit back and watch. The rhetoric coming from these places say we will attack the US surely can't blame the US for being as aggressive.


Its a worry all the same.

Originally posted by Munro_DreadGod
what was in them is hearsay granted but it does not mean that they were filled with teddybears

That's your argument? You're satisfied with hearsay? Didn't you just a moment ago say this:

ATS is all about IMHO finding the truth

And hearsay is good enough for you? Gimme a break .

you are naive?

If you don't at least think about what could be in them hearsay or not then you are. Guess you must know more than me if your not then - care to share these facts, that you know for definite.

What makes you more right than me? At least i say IMO.

Originally posted by Munro_DreadGod
you are naive?

If you don't at least think about what could be in them hearsay or not then you are. Guess you must know more than me if your not then - care to share these facts, that you know for definite.

What makes you more right than me? At least i say IMO.

Well what make him right is that proof should be there not just "because we think." That thinking leads here:

What makes you more right than me? At least i say IMO.

The evidence at hand. But hey, stick to your opinion all you want. Ignorance is bliss, huh?

Originally posted by Durden

What makes you more right than me? At least i say IMO.

The evidence at hand. But hey, stick to your opinion all you want. Ignorance is bliss, huh?

My opinion is at least as good as yours, for you black is black, white is white what about the grey areas? Don't forward an opinion on them or as you would say 'ignorance is bliss' you sound like a zombie with no free thought watch fox news for the truth eh! You cant prove me wrong I can't prove myself right but you need two sides for an argument

For you the glass is half empty i think.

Originally posted by Munro_DreadGod
For you the glass is half empty i think.

What about my arguement as to where this is leading us?
How's my glass?

Originally posted by Munro_DreadGod
My opinion is at least as good as yours, for you black is black, white is white what about the grey areas?

Let me ask you this: is an opinion based on hearsay and grey areas, as opposed to actual evidence what you consider a credible argument here?

Originally posted by Durden

What makes you more right than me? At least i say IMO.

The evidence at hand. But hey, stick to your opinion all you want. Ignorance is bliss, huh?

what evidence? did you find those trucks yourself take pictures of teddybears? the fact of the matter is you have people just like YOURSELF expressing their own OPINIONS that they dont believe saddam had any weapons days before the attacks. well no duh do you think this insane guy is going to lay them out?

for crying out loud he used children as protection, he slaughtered familys for running to take cover from a fire fight.

you expected us to go in there and find weapons laying on dinning room tables or something. Right now my house is a terrosists favorite place. All my cleaning materials i use to clean my house can make nitroglycerin. That is what we are dealing with, NORMAL PEOPLE using weapons dug into the back yard and under trees so at night or every week they could use them against their own people then put them back. A person can walk into my house see it is normal and go hey this guy is ok, when at night he mixes and terroizes....yea real clear between who is the enemy and what weapons we are looking for.

i live in a community of 350 houses each 1/2 a acre....now out of this community there is 1000 people +-, now with this say 100 soldier army how long do you think its going to take to search every inch of ground 3feet deep to find these weapons small or large chemical or not???? now times that by a whole country. we have maybe dug up .0000001% of the country and you expect to find his MOST SECRET WEAPONS???? now that is ignorance

if it wasnt for public records of our nuclear sights, some of which are still classified, how long do you think it would take say turkey to find our weapons? especially if they have NO KNOWLEDGE OF WHERE THEY LAY TO BEGIN WITH. oh yea they have to do it with 100,000 troops have a supply line where troops are taken from that 100k figure and troops to protect, training others, and building, and still fighting...now what are you left with to "search for weapons".

before i get off my soap box tell me this
1) how many times before 9/11 were we attacked?
2) out of those times how many died?
3) why are their lives so worthless and 9/11's so great?
4) why did no one stand up before and say enough?
5) why is it when we do stand we get our balls cut off because its election season
6) How many years after our OWN DECLARATION OF INDEPENDECE did it take for us to become a country?
7) how many men died still fighting during that time of independence?
8) last but not least how many troops did the previous president have in dangerous situations and did nothing about? ie the downing of a f-16 in a no fly zone

hmmm seems to me that this president is the only one with balls to enforce anything and because its election he gets the hammer, typical liberals.

[edit on 7-10-2004 by elitewolverine]

It was written
IRAQ - VERY INTERESTING - DID YOU KNOW?

1. The garden of Eden was in Iraq.

2. Mesopotamia, which is now Iraq, was the cradle of civilization!

3. Noah built the ark in Iraq.

4. The Tower of Babel was in Iraq.

5. Abraham was from Ur, which is in Southern Iraq!

6. Isaac's wife Rebekah is from Nahor, which is i n Iraq.

7. Jacob met Rachel in Iraq.

8. Jonah preached in Nineveh - which is in Iraq.

9. Assyria, which is in Iraq, conquered the ten tribes of Israel.

10. Amos cried out in Iraq!

11. Babylon, which is in Iraq, destroyed Jerusalem.

12. Daniel was in the lion's den in Iraq!

13. The three Hebrew children were in the fire in Iraq (Jesus had been in Iraq also as the fourth person in the fiery furnace!)

14. Belshazzar, the King of Babylon saw the "writing on the wall" in Iraq.

15. Nebuchadnezzar, King of Babylon, carried the Jews captive into Iraq.

16. Ezekiel preached in Iraq.

17. The wise men were from Iraq.

18. Peter preached in Iraq.

19. The "Empire of Man" described in Revelation is called Babylon,which was a city in Iraq!

And you have probably seen this one. Israel is the nation most often mentioned in the Bible. But do you know which nation is second? It is Iraq! However, that is not the name that is used in the Bible. The names used in the Bible are Babylon, Land of

Indeed Iraq is a country with deep roots and is a very significant country in the Bible.

No other nation, except Israel, has more history and prophecy associated it than Iraq.

And also... This is something to think about! Since America is typically represented by an eagle. Saddam should have read up on his Muslim passages...

The following verse is from the Koran, (the Islamic Bible)

Koran (9:11) - For it is written that a son of Arabia would awaken a fearsome Eagle. The wrath of the Eagle would be felt throughout the lands of Allah and lo, while some of the people trembled in despair still more rejoiced; for the wrath of the Eagle cleansed the lands of Allah; and there was peace.

(Note the verse number!) Hmmmmmmm?! God Bless you all Amen !

Originally posted by elitewolverine
what evidence? did you find those trucks yourself take pictures of teddybears? the fact of the matter is you have people just like YOURSELF expressing their own OPINIONS that they dont believe saddam had any weapons days before the attacks. well no duh do you think this insane guy is going to lay them out?

U.S. Report Finds No Evidence of Iraq WMD

Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction programs had deteriorated into only hopes and dreams by the time of the U.S.-led invasion last year, a decline wrought by the first Gulf War and years of international sanctions, the chief U.S. weapons hunter found.

And what ambitions Saddam harbored for such weapons were secondary to his goal of evading those sanctions, and he wanted them primarily not to attack the United States or to provide them to terrorists, but to oppose his older enemies, Iran and Israel.

The report of weapons hunter Charles Duelfer was presented Wednesday to senators and the public in the midst of a fierce presidential election campaign in which Iraq and the war of terror have become the overriding issues. The Associated Press Oct 7

[edit on 7-10-2004 by Durden]

Originally posted by Durden

Originally posted by elitewolverine
what evidence? did you find those trucks yourself take pictures of teddybears? the fact of the matter is you have people just like YOURSELF expressing their own OPINIONS that they dont believe saddam had any weapons days before the attacks. well no duh do you think this insane guy is going to lay them out?

Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction programs had deteriorated into only hopes and dreams by the time of the U.S.-led invasion last year, a decline wrought by the first Gulf War and years of international sanctions, the chief U.S. weapons hunter found.

And what ambitions Saddam harbored for such weapons were secondary to his goal of evading those sanctions, and he wanted them primarily not to attack the United States or to provide them to terrorists, but to oppose his older enemies, Iran and Israel.

The report of weapons hunter Charles Duelfer was presented Wednesday to senators and the public in the midst of a fierce presidential election campaign in which Iraq and the war of terror have become the overriding issues. The Associated Press Oct 7

still no answer to my questions and still no answer to the fact that a buried weapon in iraq is like a needle in a haystack, without hearsay from the locals we might NEVER FIND THEM. WE ARE STILL FINDING MINES FROM WWII era. THAT WAR HAS BEEN OVER FOR HOW MANY YEARS? hell just look to my sig for the deaths and attacks before 9/11 you dont even have to search.

it might have been deteriating, but the fact that he denied our weapon inspectors THAT FREAKIN TOLD HIM WHERE THEY WERE GOING TO BE WEEKS IN ADVANCE doenst mean squat that we didnt find nothing. hmmm here you go america your attacking when? where? what building? sure do so in three weeks then bring your inspectors....lol it was a joke what we put up with.


[edit on 7-10-2004 by elitewolverine]

Originally posted by elitewolverine
still no answer to my questions and still no answer to the fact that a buried weapon in iraq is like a needle in a haystack, without hearsay from the locals we might NEVER FIND THEM. WE ARE STILL FINDING MINES FROM WWII era. THAT WAR HAS BEEN OVER FOR HOW MANY YEARS? hell just look to my sig for the deaths and attacks before 9/11 you dont even have to search.

Are you suggesting that hearsay all of a sudden is reason enough to attack another nation with military force? Priceless .

Originally posted by Durden

Originally posted by elitewolverine
still no answer to my questions and still no answer to the fact that a buried weapon in iraq is like a needle in a haystack, without hearsay from the locals we might NEVER FIND THEM. WE ARE STILL FINDING MINES FROM WWII era. THAT WAR HAS BEEN OVER FOR HOW MANY YEARS? hell just look to my sig for the deaths and attacks before 9/11 you dont even have to search.

Are you suggesting that hearsay all of a sudden is reason enough to attack another nation with military force? Priceless

.

hearsay? isnt that what your providing as proof? the people who make statements that there were no weapons in iraq are the same people stating OPINIONS. so we can dismiss all that and go on facts. How big in square miles is Iraq? how many ACTUAL TROOPS ARE LOOKING FOR WEAPONS?

fact one sadam had weapons, inspectors got a run around and were denied to places, if no weapons why such fear of us taking a peak inside a harmless warehouse? guess it was the drug smuggling lol

fact two, he was a tyrant that supported terrorists even though i dont believe to me as a reason going to war yet there are plusses and negatives to his ties in any bombings

fact three he wanted to use his weapons not against us but against other countries, well shoot me dead, isnt that why we went to the first gulf war for? and he still didnt learn his lesson?

fact four he used chemicals on his own innocent people, what makes you think he had no way of doing so now? i can make mustard gas out of my kitchen chems, which by the way is a chemical no longer able to be used in war, and many other chemical weapons....it doesnt take a billion dollar lab to do chemical, maybe in the USA it does but not for a true terrorists. but hey i already stated that. chemical technology there and available, even if primative. primative is the worse enemy, for the smart take no second thought to them as a threat.

[edit on 7-10-2004 by elitewolverine]

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne

Again, you as well as everyone else know Iraq had chemical and biological weapons and was working on nuclear (actual WMD's) weapons. Again, the question that needs to be asked is WHERE are the weapons and materials at this time. Thanks to our "alies", Hussein had months to smuggle everything out.

Denial, Thomas. It's not longer just a river in Egypt:

"WASHINGTON -- Iraq had destroyed its illicit weapons stockpiles within months after the Persian Gulf War of 1991, and its capacity to produce such weapons had significantly eroded by the time of the American invasion in 2003, the top American inspector in Iraq said in a report made public yesterday.

The report said Iraq, while under pressure from the United Nations, had "essentially destroyed" its illicit weapons ability by the end of 1991, with its last secret factory, a biological weapons facility, eliminated in 1996. The report by the inspector, Charles Duelfer, is intended to offer a near-final judgment about Iraq and its weapons."

seattlepi.nwsource.com...

Originally posted by elitewolverine
hearsay? isnt that what your providing as proof? the people who make statements that there were no weapons in iraq are the same people stating OPINIONS.

Statements based on - and supported by - the vast preponderance of evidence at hand.

fact one sadam had weapons, inspectors got a run around and were denied to places, if no weapons why such fear of us taking a peak inside a harmless warehouse?

Oh sure he had weapons, as do pretty much every country in the world. What's your next suggestion; attack every other nation as well? Is the fact that the iraqis were hesitant to let inspectors in, enough evidence of them harboring WMD's? You don't need much, do you?

fact two, he was a tyrant that supported terrorists even though i dont believe to me as a reason going to war yet there are plusses and negatives to his ties in any bombings

Actual evidence shows there to be little to no connection between Iraq and Al-Qaida.

fact three he wanted to use his weapons not against us but against other countries, well shoot me dead, isnt that why we went to the first gulf war for? and he still didnt learn his lesson?

Oh, he wanted to use his weapons? That's what you call fact? Well then I suppose it's fair to say you'd be more than happy to see a few other nations being attacked as well?

fact four he used chemicals on his own innocent people, what makes you think he had no way of doing so now? i can make mustard gas out of my kitchen chems, which by the way is a chemical no longer able to be used in war, and many other chemical weapons....it doesnt take a billion dollar lab to do chemical, maybe in the USA it does but not for a true terrorists. but hey i already stated that. chemical technology there and available, even if primative. primative is the worse enemy, for the smart take no second thought to them as a threat.

The question was whether Saddam harbored WMD's at the time of the attack. Again; the vast preponderance of evidence doesn't support the notion that he did.

Fact is; the reasons initially presented by the Bush Aministration for invading Iraq, simply aren't supported by the actual evidence. But that doesn't really matter to you, now does it? Truly troubling

[edit on 7-10-2004 by Durden]