Obamacare amounts to slavery...

Originally posted by ldyserenity

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
I have government provided healthcare.

I'm not "forced" to purchase it or go to jail, it's simply provided. I just pay a slightly larger tax rate and there you go, Bob's your uncle.

I don't understand this problem that people have with Universal Healthcare. Sure, there are flaws in the system, Canada isn't perfect.

But would you rather wait 10 hours in an emergency room to get your broken arm looked at, or pay 5 thousand dollars in hospital bills to get through faster?

I'll take the first one thank you.

As for Obamacare, it's total crap, should be abolished ASAP. And does ammount to slavery.

~Tenth

edit on 7/2/2012 by tothetenthpower because: (no reason given)

This is not universal healthcare, they still get to pick and choose who they want to give the public plan to (Which will be the ghetto trash) and those that can't get the public plan are forced by threat of fine to get their own through a health insurance company. With no exceptions. And beleive me the medicaid is an epic fail, you literally gotta be ghetto trash drug addict alcoholic or be a baby factory to get it. It's effing disgusting, mostly everybody that works will be turned down for the public plan.

Absolutely untrue. I lost my $100-150k/year job of 10 years when W pushed through his legislation giving the biggest banks most of the student loan consolidation business. 2 weeks later, we found out my wife was pregnant. 3 months later, we had Medicaid insurance which carried us through his birth. Shortly after, my insurance through my new job kicked in. I never applied for unemployment, and I don't feel bad about using the Medicaid for a time, because I had paid in far more in taxes by age 35 than most people do by the time they retire.

It was easy to get with no income at the time. We're both highly educated and live in a nice area in a nice home which we rehabbed beautifully. When we drink, we drink a few microbrews, not a 30-pack of Bud Light, our home and yard are both well-kept, we don't smoke crack or meth, and I don't beat my wife. Since there's plenty of racist overtones in this thread, if you need more to show that we're not ghetto trash, we're also Caucasian - that should allay the counter-argument of the Limbaughians here. (I think race is ,eaningless for this argument, but I know many of you are opposed to healthcare for the poor AND the dark-skinned.).

So again, wild assumptions making for another meaningless, useless post. Falsehoods contribute nothing to the discussion. Unless I am automatically trash fir using Medicaid, despite having paid in over $30,000 annually in federal taxes for years now. I really think anyone who has paid less than me can make any such argument - if they did, I would respond by calling them trash for netting the treasury less than I have because of their lack of earnings ability.

Healthcare should be universal right just as access to water,and education,not money making business.I don't understand why Americans are busting their balls over this.In Europe it's non issue,you contribute part of your income to health and medical care. This has made it possible for the health service to be free and accessible to every citizen.It might not always be great,but if we leave people dying just because they are in a situation when they don't have any money we are barbarians.Anybody can find themselves broke and ill.

reply to post by dogstar23


For someone who claims that race is meaningless in this argument you did a pretty good job of inserting it in your post.
I'm just saying...Baby factories can come in all colors, so can crackheads. I don't think anyone was claiming otherwise.

reply to post by Masterjaden
Around 1060BC King Solomon wrote "A feast is made for laughter, and wine makes life merry, but money is the answer for everything". Since then the "Money Changers" have learned many things and one of them is if you own slaves, you have to feed, house and take care of them, put if you can entrap a man in the chains of Debt, he will not only be your willing slave but he will enslave his own children, your children and future generations.

Our world only appears to be one of free men, we only "think" we own anything, including our lives but it is an illusion the real owners of our world have nurtured, developed and perpetuated into a very complex web of enslavement. You and I don't really own anything, we possess things for only a time and if we intend to pass it on to our children, think again, because what you will be passing onto them is your enslavement. How is this so? Try not paying your taxes; try not paying the fines and fees put upon you and what is yours.

I have no solution of this, although what was done during the French Revolution (Tale Of Two Cities) would reshuffle the deck but it would not be long before other men would maneuver us all back into servitude.

What Obamacare does is what George Bush Jr. began (not really, the Federalist/Globalists have been at work since this country was born) but more to my point; what George Bush Jr did was turned our country into a nation of producers, into a nation of consumers and creditor nation with a surplus into a nation of debtors (at this moment we owe about 16 Trillion Dollars) but he and those with and behind him pulling the strings did not yet have a way to 1)Identify every man woman and child or the means to track us...not yet anyway.

Obama is just like Romney, just like Bush, just like Clinton, just like Bush Sr. and most of the Presidents since 1923 or there about with maybe the exception of JFK. Behind them are men (devils) whose goal is to identify, track, control and tax everyone.

Obamacare is going to be the means of making their dream of nationwide enslavement possible. They are going to use Healthcare as their Trojan Horse.

I am not going to spell it all out, there is no point because the solution is not something I would dare put into writing.

Watch as Americans just pay the fine instead of getting Health Insurance. Then when they get sick they will get health insurance and after they get well they will drop it again. Why would someone do this? Because you can't be denied insurance anymore and since the fine is so small, people will figure this out and not pay for it. They will only pay when they get sick. This will crush the insurance companies profit margins and they will be forced to raise rates.

Look at all of the health insurance stocks, tumbling. Because analysts have figured this out. Its going to kill the insurance companies.

Health...Care... HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! HealthCare my ass. Why aren't vitamins and minerals covered by OBAMNEYCare, why aren't gym memberships and Herbal remedies in this bill? Why aren't GMO's, Aspartame, Fluoride, Pink Slime etc etc etc banned in this bill. Why is the new bill still based on Cures cures cures, why not PREVENTION! Why the HELL would anyone want a force to control your life (via health/ DEATH PANELS) from birth till death VIA TAX!? WHERE THE HELL IS THE FUNDING FOR THIS COMING FROM?

Of course this is slavery! I want to scream so damn loud right now.

Why are corporations (over 1,400 so far) being given waivers? Why can't I opt out and help friends and family with the money I would save by NOT being a part of this SLAVERY? If I want to live on an island and be self sufficient (including Preventive healthcare AND emergency care) via my wife, what, now I cant. Why? Because I will be fined for not participating in your ILLEGAL EXPERIMENT. Is this not just an admission from the corrupt government that everything else they have tried in the past to insure the poor HAS FAILED! How is this (TAX) any damn better? Have you not read the Grace Commission? That was 30 years ago...You really think money will go anywhere else besides THE BANKS!?

The report said that one-third of all income taxes is consumed by waste and inefficiency in the federal government, and another one-third escapes collection owing to the underground economy. “With two thirds of everyone’s personal income taxes wasted or not collected, 100 percent of what is collected is absorbed solely by interest on the federal debt and by federal government contributions to transfer payments. In other words, all individual income tax revenues are gone before one nickel is spent on the services [that] taxpayers expect from their government."

HAHAHAHA! And you want them to be in charge of DeathCare. YOU DESERVE whats coming, keep begging!

What happens when I DO NOT pay my fines......GUNS! GUNS! GUNS! Raiding my home via IRS assholes to FORCE me to pay for something I never wanted. Of course this is SLAVERY. No I am not in some field picking cotton and getting whipped but I am being FORCED by someone else to BUY something. Come on people, this is NOT the answer we need. Do we need help? Of course, we are sinking, but come on, this was written by the Ins. Companies. NOT 1800'S SLAVERY THIS IS THE NEW CORPORATE SLAVERY!

DENY IGNORANCE! Are these not the people we have been bitching about on ATS for years? Going along with ANYTHING the corporate media/government has said is good has gone how? GEEEZ!

Originally posted by Masterjaden

Originally posted by Seraph Sephiroth
Topics like this make people here in the UK laugh. There's nothing wrong with helping people America!

You're absolutely right, there is nothing wrong with helping people, when it is a CHOICE...

When you are forced to at the point of a gun, it is no longer helping people... it is forced servitude.

And it IS at the point of a gun. Anything that a government forces you to do is at the point of a gun.

Jaden

You don't have to jump into the ObamaCare Pit.

Medical tourism is a choice.

You can say "No thanks." and fly to Mexico for medical care.

The only thing 'ObamaCare' does is force you to pay insurance companies just the same as you would for a vehicle. Anyone that says different either (A) is to brain-dead to look past propaganda or (2) is lining their pockets by this abomination to our constitutional rights.

I'm on Social Security Disabilty and Mediacare
from my point of veiw it's not a bad deal for someone like me, since I'm not able to afford much.
from what I read on this it's for the people that are without any health Ins. now will be covered.
Slavery ? how are you a slave ? no one said you had to work for the medical field you choose it.
you choose to work, you choose to pay for things you want , like a car , it's not a right
Every American should have health care plain an simple, if you don't like the system change it or move out of the country.
this seems to be a way to provide health care for everyone.

it like a drivers lic. it's not a right to have it.

you all think of the worse when it comes to these types of things.
you fear that someone is liveing off of your hard work , geuss what you been a slave to someone your whole life.
all be it your mom/dad whomever.

People have been liveing off your work from day 1 , get over it. move on.

you young people think this is a new issue it's been something that's been going on since before Bill Clinton took office.

For real OP? "Obamacare is tantamount to slavers"? Ok let me break this down for you.


1) Its not even a tax. Its a penalty enacted by being uninsured. It also only applies to 2% of the US population, and is capped off at $700-2% of income.

2) Healthcare is not a luxry, it is a neccessity. EVERYONE needs healthcare. PERIOD. Show me a man who in uninsured and believes he doesn't need health insurance. I will in turn, show you a damned fool.

3) If you think this is tantamount to slavery because it "...puts a gun to your head...", then public schools are slavery. Police stations and fire fighters are SLAVERY! Your local PARKS DEPARTMENT is slavery! In this fashion, ANYTHING YOU DONT AGREE WITH IS SLAVERY.

4) The Hippocratic Oath obliges a doctor to heal whomever is sick, regardless of money/country/creed. It doesnt say "I shall heal whomever pays me".

With but the tiniest critical thinking skills, one can see that Obamacare leads to more people being able to afford healthcare, while the rest of us enjoy a 30-40% drop in price. Your argument that "Obamacare is tantamount to slavery" is an argument purely based in ignorance, willful or not.

Originally posted by ConspiracyBuff
The only thing 'ObamaCare' does is force you to pay insurance companies just the same as you would for a vehicle. Anyone that says different either (A) is to brain-dead to look past propaganda or (2) is lining their pockets by this abomination to our constitutional rights.

ObamaCare will be - repealed & replaced -.

The economy is in bad shape. The last thing we need is a huge ObamaTax 2012.

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Small businesses will sit on their hands until November 6, 2012.

If you don't pay for running water, your house becomes condemned. If you don't have car insurance and are caught on the roads, you get in trouble.

Do these not sound similar? Why don't we really rebel and start making them pay US! That doesn't sound right.

Those aren't "rights", but for some reason most of you still subscribe to them. But no, insurance is bad, I get it.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012

Originally posted by ConspiracyBuff
The only thing 'ObamaCare' does is force you to pay insurance companies just the same as you would for a vehicle. Anyone that says different either (A) is to brain-dead to look past propaganda or (2) is lining their pockets by this abomination to our constitutional rights.

ObamaCare will be - repealed & replaced -.

The economy is in bad shape. The last thing we need is a huge ObamaTax 2012.

---------
Small businesses will sit on their hands until November 6, 2012.

Repealed and replaced? Oh you mean Mitt Romney's plan! The one he never goes into detail about ever. Did you forget to mention it was originally RomneyCare though? Hes such a humble person he would never admit it.

Its not a tax, its a penalty. What the guy you quoted doesnt mention is it only applies to about 2% of the population. The economy is bad, yes. All the more reason to fight for the poor.

reply to post by Eurisko2012


www.alternet.org...

Unless you are an anarcho-capitalist, your point is moot. Whats the difference between taxation to pay for police or fire services, and taxation to pay for health services?

I don't understand how ANYONE can claim that a service provided by another is a right... That would infer that you have the right to force someone to work for you. That is THE definition of slavery.

Police protection is not a right?

Originally posted by TheJaberwocky

Originally posted by Eurisko2012

Originally posted by ConspiracyBuff
The only thing 'ObamaCare' does is force you to pay insurance companies just the same as you would for a vehicle. Anyone that says different either (A) is to brain-dead to look past propaganda or (2) is lining their pockets by this abomination to our constitutional rights.

ObamaCare will be - repealed & replaced -.

The economy is in bad shape. The last thing we need is a huge ObamaTax 2012.

---------
Small businesses will sit on their hands until November 6, 2012.

Repealed and replaced? Oh you mean Mitt Romney's plan! The one he never goes into detail about ever. Did you forget to mention it was originally RomneyCare though? Hes such a humble person he would never admit it.

Its not a tax, its a penalty. What the guy you quoted doesnt mention is it only applies to about 2% of the population. The economy is bad, yes. All the more reason to fight for the poor.

We have a - new - plan.

It includes something called - tort reform -.

Obama left that out because he is in bed with the trial lawyers. - Texas got it right. -
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Now would be bad time for the IRS to - terrorize - the American people with the

iron fist of ObamaCare.

ObamaCare solves nothing. It just grows the size of government.

Don't worry Masterjaden, all you need to do to save America from this "slavery" is to vote Mitt Romney for President. Mitt will Repeal Obamacare. Check out the video for his promises to repeal Obamacare and kill it dead!

reply to post by Anonymous404


By the time November 6, 2012 gets here the American people are going

to be throwing up after learning about the ObamaCare - Death Panels -.

If the death panel does not smile at you, then you will go home with a

pain pill. - rationed heathcare -.
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When you fall into the ObamaCare Pit - Take a number !

The doctor will see you in 3 months.....maybe.

It all sounds so wonderful !
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More GOP / Tea Party members will be added to the House and the US Senate.

60 Senators will do the trick.

It is sickening to me to read or hear people express disdain for universal healthcare. Why is helping people so abhorrent to you? Most of the civilized world has universal healthcare. We are one of the last holdouts. We shouldn't be. We are one of the wealthiest countries in the world. Its time to start acting like it. If you can afford healthcare, good for you. Here is a cookie. This is huge for people who can't afford it. It will give them the opportunity to have a healthy life. I read on this site everyday about the elite this and the elite that and how horrible "they" are. Your actions detail you as one of them. By attempting to deny your fellow human beings the chance at proper care your are setting yourself apart. Is that really your goal?

Originally posted by Peruvianmonk


What the hell are you on about? What is wrong with you?

The whole point of healthcare should be that it is not a commodity dished out to those who can afford it. Anyone going in to healthcares primary aim should be a duty of care, any financial incentives should be secondary to this.

It the US instituted some kind of universal healthcare there would still exist a private healthcare industry where many could continue to work. Those who chose the public sphere would still be rewarded financially.

So, you get to define people's motives for doing what they should be able to freely choose?

The Govt forces people to purchase health insurance. That is slavery. FORCE.
If you choose not to buy, then you are taxed. That is slavery as well. FORCE.

I still don't know where derive this mentality that you, or anyone else, gets to define the priorities and rewards that people get. How very elitist.