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US gun owners get the shaft

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posted on May, 30 2003 @ 07:25 AM
I hate to say it but I think the answer to your delima lies on the other end of this issue; namely stricter punishment for criminals. While I know that this falls in the realm of personal responsibilty for their own actions and not blaming an inanimate object as the popular liberal theory supports, I think most arguments and evidence presented here so far supports that avenue rather than banning the very instrument we have to combat such travesties against innocents. While I have guns ( an old H&R single shot 12 guage and a Marlin .22 semi-auto) I do not keep them loaded and at the ready for fear the possibility my 5 year old could get hold of one. For protection, I rely on local law enforcement coupled with a 9 iron in the corner of my bedroom , that is if the intruder gets through the 75 pound German Shepherd who roams around all night long.

After an "almost" break in year before last by a migrant worker, I have though seriously about getting a hand gun but considering the guy was only after something to keep him warm, if he'd knocked and asked, I would have given it to him but still it scared the misses. I don't think he'd made it in if my son hadn't had our Siberian inside playing with her at the time. I chased after the guy but considering I was nursing a freshly broken foot at the time, I really could do nothing more then yell and swear at him while hobbling along. I'm thinking of instead of a handgun, a compromise and just hanging the .22 up over the door inside our bedroom bathroom.

Back to the gun control issue, I think the answer has always been holding people personally responsible for their actions involving their use and proper storage which includes safely keeping them from minors without supervision of an adult. Its so easy to blame the gun when we always look for something else to blame rather than the deviate behavior it takes to use one illegally.

posted on May, 30 2003 @ 11:10 AM
"In Florida and Texas, where it was feared that the enactment of concealed carry of handguns would lead to wild west style shootouts on the street, the crime rates (especially rape, as the majority of CHL holders are female) has plummeted."

Yep, you have to be a real idiot to commit armed robbery in Texas, hehe...

Banning weapons is not the way. Gangbangers don't exactly buy their guns at the local gun shop....but more out of the back of Tony's van...(and Tony doesn't require a waiting period or background check)....

I will agree though, that nobody needs a fully auto assault rifle for home defense....

posted on May, 30 2003 @ 11:32 AM

Originally posted by Byrd

Frankly, I don't think the public needs to have them (you'll notice that the ones in Iraq with them couldn't do that much against our armies, so "defending the country" is a poor rationale.)

Wait a minute....Peoples in Irak were NOT ready to die for Saddam and they were NOT fighting for themselves. They were living under a dictatorship and they knew the coalition troops were there to kick Saddam a$$, not to enslaved them.

The USA are ( still ? ) a democracy. If foreigns troops, or even US troops, were trying to enslaved them, it would be another story. I'm damn sure the real US citizens would fight them. But if they don't have any guns... How do you want to control a nation of 280 million peoples, well armed, well trained and ready to fight for their freedom ? You would have to have a 10 million robocops-hight-tech-super soldiers to achieve your goal.

But if the citizens are not armed ( or not well armed ), it will be very easy.

I wrote it before. In 1941,in Belgium, the nazis had " only " 12000 soldiers to keep my country under control.

12000 soldiers for a 10 million nation. Why so less ?

Well, they overruned us with an heavy army, they took the control in my country, they ordered to the population to bring back to the " Kommendatur " all their weapons ( even the knives ), and then, they had a 10 million disarmed sheeps. They didn't have to have a 200k army to keep us their control anymore.

Well armed citizens = freedom.

Unarmed citizens = dictatorship.

posted on May, 30 2003 @ 03:09 PM
I am not saying ban them, I am asking why would a database of guns be such a horrible thing? If you are responsible with your gun, you need not worry. However, if you are one who likes to play "bang bang" and kill people, the gun used for the crime is easily tracked down...

posted on May, 31 2003 @ 12:09 AM
I live in a "shall issue" CCW state, and when the CCW was instituted, our crime rates dropped dramatically. Massad Ayoob, a famous firearms instructor and writer coined the saying "An armed society is a polite society". He is quite correct.

As far as private ownership of assault rifles, well, that is the primary reason that the US still has some vestiges of freedom left. For those who seem to believe "if you arent a criminal, what do you need to worry about getting your guns registered" are extremely short sighted... Just ask the legal gun owners in the UK, Canada and Australia who believed the same thing, and a couple years later the cops came knocking on doors confiscating weapons.

"If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. Thats ridiculous. If I have a gun, what in the hell do I have to be paranoid about?"
Clint Smith, Director, Thunder Ranch

posted on May, 31 2003 @ 12:00 PM
First of all, in Florida where you can carry handguns, people from out of state who can't are getting their a$$es kicked because the criminals know the people from out of state don't have guns.

Second, I have metioned numerous(while wrong country, sorry) that a place where over 18 have to own a gun if male, and option if female, lowest crime rate in the world!!!!! Most guns, lowest crime rate!!!!!

Besides, if you ban guns, there will be other ways to kill. Posion, sharp pointy objects, thrown down a staircase, thrown off a tall building, hammer to head, drill to heart(literally screwed to the wall, lol) run them over with a car, drop a bowling ball on them from a tall building, throw a baseball really fast at their head, attack dogs, bow and arrow,throwing a bag of pennies off of the Empire State Building,setting someone on fire, drowning them, electricuting them, cutting major artery by paper cut, stabing with a pencil or pen, scissors, hitting in head with car battery numerous times, hitting them with baseball bat, beating them to death with fists, beating them to death with artificial body part(like a leg an amputee would wear) locking them in a portapotty them picking it up with a crane and dropping it, running them over with steam roller, nail gun to eyes, playing music so loud ears bleed and bleed till loss of blood kills them, smashing them with a skateboard numerous times, hit them in head with radio, shoving a lava lamp down their throats choking them, millions of ways to kill people. Should all those items above be banned? They kill people, unlike guns. Bullets kill people, not guns.

Anyways, last time I checked, if you have a shotgun, the guy who broke in isn't going to mess with you. Should one ban stairs so you can't throw people down them? Or pennies so you can't throw them off the Empire State Building? Lava Lamps so you can't choke the person? paper so you can't give a paper cut to people's major arteries???????

Where will it stop. Besides, unloaded guns kill more people than loaded ones.

"Don't worry, it's not loaded!" Last words said before they are shot or someone else is. Kind of like "Watch this!" or "Look at what I can do!"

posted on May, 31 2003 @ 03:24 PM
I agree with dragonrider and James the Lesser.

But James, you forgot something. Martial Art. With just a hand we can kill someone.Sp what, Martial Art have to be banned too ?

" Your hands are weapons.We have to register them, and may be later, you'll have to give us your hands cuz you can kill with your hands "

Anti-guns laws are borning ONLY in tyranical brains who want to control the honnest populations.

anti-guns laws = nazis/communists laws

posted on May, 31 2003 @ 04:41 PM
First of all, in Florida where you can carry handguns, people from out of state who can't are getting their a$$es kicked because the criminals know the people from out of state don't have guns. Posted by James the Lesser

Actually many states, at least the "shall issue" states, offer "reciprocity" where you can carry legally with a state issued CCW in other states that issue CCWs.

Check out

Gives complete list of state gun laws, which states issue CCWs, which states reciprocate, ect. There are also NUMEROUS articles of how guns are used to save innocent lives. A VERY good page.

anti-guns laws = nazis/communists laws
Posted by Ultra Phoenix

Absolutely correct

"This year will go down in history! For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration! Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!"
Adolf Hitler

posted on Jun, 1 2003 @ 05:38 AM

Originally posted by dragonrider

anti-guns laws = nazis/communists laws
Posted by Ultra Phoenix

Absolutely correct

"This year will go down in history! For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration! Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!"
Adolf Hitler

It would be interesting to read what an anti-gun laws fan ( democrat or not ), has to say about what Hitler wrote and said on that matter.

It's very strange that the so-called ultra-right are pro-guns and the so-called " democratics peoples " are against the guns and are bending to an Hitler position.

Each time I saw a " democratic political program ", the program was anti-guns. Each time I saw a so-called far-right political program, the program was pro-guns.

Where are the real democrats and the real nazis ?

I.e, the EU.

- Hitler wanted a united europe, now we have it.

- Hitler wanted an european currency, now we have it.

-Hitler wanted to ban all the guns, now we're on the way to ban all the guns.

- Hitler wanted a one world gov, now we're on the way to have it.

- Before WW2, in Europe, we didn't have ID cards. Hitler *brought* us the ID card gift, and after our liberation, the europeans governments who were in exile in London kept the ID card system for their own purpose.

-Also, they didn't reject everything brought by the nazis.There is many nazis stuffs that *we* kept.

If we don't wake up, in some years, we'll all live in a nazi-like regime.And that time, it will be too late.

posted on Jun, 1 2003 @ 10:53 AM
Ultra_Phoenix, you're right, but you must give examples. And the single European currency was not Hitler's idea, but it was a Nazi one.

And Hitler originally used ID cards for the oppressed Jews (read IBM and the Holocaust). The gun control advocates say getting guns out of the hands of civilians prevents murders, but what happens when they can't defend themselves from criminals/soldiers? Well they're no longer murders, they're simply massacres, which causes UN or other NWO organization involvement and strengthens the New World Order, i.e. Kosovo, Ireland, or Palestine.

posted on Jun, 12 2003 @ 06:00 PM
Capitol Hill ( - Federal legislation introduced Tuesday would subject firearms to heightened scrutiny, similar to consumer safety standards for products like teddy bears, nightlights and pancake makers.

Gun control advocates hailed the announcement, vowing to strike back at pro-gun lawmakers who supported legislation passed by the U.S. House of Representatives in April granting firearms manufacturers' immunity from nuisance lawsuits.

The Firearms Safety and Consumer Protection Act, introduced by Sen. Jon S. Corzine (D-N.J.) and Rep. Patrick Kennedy (D-R.I.), would give the Department of Justice authority to regulate the design, manufacture and distribution of guns.

Gun rights groups dismissed the effort. The National Rifle Association noted that firearms are already subject to many regulations. Even some states, such as California, have established their own guidelines.

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