DOJ will NOT prosecute Holder for contempt...

Did people honestly not know this was going to happen???

This is why everyone has been calling this vote political theater and a huge waste of time.

They have no authority to force an investigation because he committed no crime.


I mean...even Fox News has been saying this for the past two weeks...come on people.

And...Everyone is shocked by this? Why would they give themselves up so Congress can dismantle them in the public. They will eventually find out...years upon years later. Then no one will care.

Originally posted by redrose123
reply to post by bjax9er

 

You can't criminally prosecute anyone in civil court.

Technically correct however if the judge in a civil case determines the DOJ has to turn over documents it means the executive privilege invocation is invalid, re-opening the door for criminal prosecution since they are no longer protected.

Originally posted by Maxmars
reply to post by Novaroc

 

Associated Press? (I always like to note the source.)

The Department of Justice cannot simply overrule a Congressional Committee. Whether they (meaning Holder's subordinate administration) refused to prosecute is irrelevant.

"Special Prosecutor" candidates are standing in line on this political show... it will make their career.

Or am I wrong?

The legal issue comes in with the way the Congressional contempt criteria reads. It states the USADA for the D.C. area must convene a grand jury. The problem is Congress can't tell a prosecutor they have to file charges since one branch of government cannot order an agency of a different branch to act.

Thats one of the reason Congress held 2 contempt votes - 1 criminal and 1 civil. They were fully expecting the DOJ to refuse to move on the criminal charges. If it goes to civil, a judge gets to decide if the documents being requested as well as the invocation of executive privilege are valid.

If the judge determines privilege does not apply, Holder will lose his immunity from criminal prosecution. Worst case scenario if the DOJ still refuses to act would be a special prosecutor. I see Holder resigning long before it gets to that level.

The info placed into the record by Issa about the wiretap and the detailed info contained wil most likely be the document that brings this to a close.

Originally posted by michaelbrux
I'm really learning a lot about how the American system works.

Political Partisanship is a neutered beast in this land.

I suppose the republican party can declare war upon the U.S. Department of Justice next if they want to show us they mean business.

edit on 29-6-2012 by michaelbrux because: (no reason given)

The term you are looking for is called Separation of Powers.

Originally posted by cavtrooper7
The POTUS has executed executive privilege.If they want those docs they have to impeach the man.Holder is covered.

Executive Privilege is not designed to be used for communications / documents that occur outside of the White House. Executive Privilege also cannot be used to cover up criminal activity, and the Supreme Court ruling in Nixon stated as much.

Impeaching Holder will not resolve the document issue. Several people involved who were going to be called as witnesses for the congressional hearing have declined to appear and invoked their 5th amendment right against self incrimination.

Right now there are 2 ways to gain access to those documents -
Voluntarily by the DOJ
Finding Holder in civil contempt, taking it before a judge and having the judge subpoena the documents in question.

Option 2 is where we are at.

reply to post by Xcathdra


that's what I'll call it for now on, Separation of Powers.

it's still hilarious to watch the looks on people faces when they realize no one gives a crap what they think.

that's priceless.

how does it feel is the question that i'd ask a random person.

reply to post by michaelbrux


Partisan politics, as much as I hate it, is what allows the minority opinion to be heard.

In this case the Legislative (Congress) is exercising their oversight and the DOJ (Executive) is exercising their authority.

Hence the civil contempt and taking the argument to the judicial to settle the issue.

There are 2 things you dont let the public see made -
Laws and sausage.

The simple fact the government is able to argue with itself in such a manner they take it to court, as dysfunctional and irritating as it is, serves as a reminder that the government is capable of working correctly.

reply to post by Xcathdra


i didn't see it made, but sausage tastes great.

i hope everyone enjoys the outcome of this situation as much as many people enjoy sausage.

from what i've been reading, the republican house members still have the option of a civil case.

i don't see a federal judge finding that the President of the United States will have to release the documents they desire.

but i'm sure they will have no problem making the American people watch them try over the next 2 years, instead of actually doing something that will make our lives better.

Romney has already stated he will spend his entire first term overturning Obamacare...so its obvious that wasting everyone's time with partisan politics is not beneath any of them.

i suppose what makes politics so gross is that MEN make the most out of what they get. Women complain until they get what they want.

When politicians complain without end...it just weird and unattractive; considering most of them allege they possess male genitalia.

Is it going to be a fire at the DOJ where they loose all that paperwork ,without digital records, that would mean a......terrorist attack.
I mean they can't kill that many people quietly they have to blame it on someone.
If the information is that heavy well they've shown their cards by redacting the papers so heavily.Arrogance protected by secrecy.Well if they want it secret bad enough how far will they go?

reply to post by Novaroc


Someone will prosecute, without law we are lawless, then anything goes.
In my opinion if guilty, the man and all involved must swing.

I am sure President Obama allready has the Pardon on paper with a signature. Does not matter what they do

I can't believe Republicans actually thought congress had the power to force the executive branch to prosecute him.

Ignorance isn't bliss, it's damn annoying.

Well, if we go along with the used argument of increased monitoring and snooping etc. Patriot act, wire taps, etc.

And everyone says "If your not doing anything wrong, why hide and seek privacy?".

So if this is turned around and applied to these guys..

What are they hiding that Mr. Obama has to invoke "Executive Priviledge", and the DOJ is refusing all sorts of things. WHAT are they all HIDING?

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher

They have no authority to force an investigation because he committed no crime.

hahahahah this is cognitive dissonance at it's best

if there was no crime there would NO reason to withhold the documents in the first place

your just lucky the people your backing are so frikin corrupt they can get away with things like this

There is no need to prosecute him
He is a political corpse.

reply to post by Diisenchanted


It was a joke (paraphrased line from casablanca movie).

reply to post by Xcathdra


Thank you Xcathdra. You answered most of the questions I had on this subject. It is hard to get to the core of what the meaning and/or outcome in these verdicts actually mean and where they end up going. Also thanks to you all for your input and views. I always learn more from researching another persons take on things than just reading what is offered from the usual channels of the web. Stars for all.