EU unveils its vision for the future of monetary union

EU unveils its vision for the future of monetary union

www.bbc.co.uk

European authorities have unveiled their vision for the future, which gives them much greater powers.

It includes the creation of a European treasury, which would have powers over national budgets.

European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso said it was "a defining moment for European integration".

(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
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www.bloomberg.com

To me the statement that the European Treasury would have power over national budgets is the key phrase. If you ever wanted proof that a globalist order is coming this is it. Some might say it is a good thing, and I am sure many will say it is not. To me it will mean a little bit more sovereignty is slipping away. I do also feel that this is only the beginning and we will be seeing more of this come as time goes by.

www.bbc.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

Originally posted by RedGolem


To me the statement that the European Treasury would have power over national budgets is the key phrase. If you ever wanted proof that a globalist order is coming this is it. Some might say it is a good thing, and I am sure many will say it is not. To me it will mean a little bit more sovereignty is slipping away. I do also feel that this is only the beginning and we will be seeing more of this come as time goes by.

www.bbc.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

I'm not sure about globalist, this was the whole point of the Eurozone before it was even called that. Personally I don't agree with it, but then if I lived in Greece, Spain, Italy or Cyprus, maybe I would if it meant the debt was shared. The closest I can come up with an example of this is in modern times is the old Soviet Union, that worked well didn't it.

reply to post by something wicked


Wicked
thanks for posting. I am not sure if I could really say the soviate union would be a good example. Not that I can come up with a better one. I will just personally stand by it would be better to keep your sovereignty, at this point. If this goes through I just see each country loosing control of the treasury to the banks. That is why I think it would be best for Greece to just tear up there debt and tell the banks to stick it where the sun don't shine. I am looking at this as tyranny is tyranny no matter what form it is in or where it comes from.

Yaaaaay! Just what we need, another unelected body holding power over us all and beholden to crooked central banks.

I mean, why wouldn't we trust them to create this bankers wet dream and enslave us all to even more debt in the process? After all, they've done such a sterling job so far...... haven't they?

It's all just a money-go-round, where member states borrow money (at interest) to contribute to a bail out of big bondholders (banks) whose investments went tits-up. The capital loan and interest repayment is then passed onto the public by means of extra taxation and "austerity" measures. Following month it's that nations turn to apply for a bailout... repeat process with the other member states borrowing to pay for the bailout. Repeat ad infinitum, while the bondholders and central banks keep piling on the interest and bailouts become ever larger.

reply to post by Britguy


Brit
thanks for posting, and yes I do think you got it right. I just hope this will all be able to be stopped before it gets to far out of hand.

Originally posted by RedGolem
reply to post by something wicked

 

Wicked
thanks for posting. I am not sure if I could really say the soviate union would be a good example. Not that I can come up with a better one. I will just personally stand by it would be better to keep your sovereignty, at this point. If this goes through I just see each country loosing control of the treasury to the banks. That is why I think it would be best for Greece to just tear up there debt and tell the banks to stick it where the sun don't shine. I am looking at this as tyranny is tyranny no matter what form it is in or where it comes from.

Fair points, all of them. I only suggested the Soviet Union as an example where there was a level of central management of several countries, rather than where today the EU doesn't have the same level of power - a lot, yes, too much - probably.

For Greece to tear up their debt, I can appreciate the sentiment, but remember that debt is actually held in other countries, they would then suffer and if Greece ever needed credit in the future, I'm fairly sure it would be hard to find or would come at a very high cost.

the only way this will happen is if germany is in control of the EU monetary union. hitlers dream without even firing a shot

Well, Eurozone nations should be described as naive if they had not expected this from the start.

The crisis with the Eurozone has merely underlined the importance that nations who use the same currency have to coalesce in terms of their monetary policy. Following close behind proper financial union will be political union.

There are negative sides to this, mainly revolving around a loss of sovereignty, but there are also positives, such as a common economic block being created, much like the United States. Democracy could also be strengthened if it was done properly, but it is worrisome that at the start political union would sit with the big population centres, notably Germany.

This is only a step too far if you value nationality. If you consider yourself as “European” then this is truly orgasmic.

Personally, I am rather glad the UK kept out of the Euro, but as new generations come forth, I can see Europe working, so long as they speak English.

Regards

reply to post by something wicked


Wicked
yes it would come at a high cost, I just think if they were to take what they are paying for the debt they could pay all of there obligations and have enough left over to fund some civil projects. Point being when the loans were made those making were likely full aware they would not be able to be paid back. So just another way to execute some for of tyranny.

Originally posted by Britguy
Yaaaaay! Just what we need, another unelected body holding power over us all and beholden to crooked central banks.

I mean, why wouldn't we trust them to create this bankers wet dream and enslave us all to even more debt in the process? After all, they've done such a sterling job so far...... haven't they?

It's all just a money-go-round, where member states borrow money (at interest) to contribute to a bail out of big bondholders (banks) whose investments went tits-up. The capital loan and interest repayment is then passed onto the public by means of extra taxation and "austerity" measures. Following month it's that nations turn to apply for a bailout... repeat process with the other member states borrowing to pay for the bailout. Repeat ad infinitum, while the bondholders and central banks keep piling on the interest and bailouts become ever larger.

Just to clarify one thing...

They are not unelected at all. In all other European Member States, citizens get to vote for their Euro-MP, in exactly the same manner that they vote for their governmental leaders.

It is only in the case of the UK, where the UK government chose to deny the general population the right to vote for their Euro-MP's on the basis that the general population did not understand European issues.Instead the government chose to appoint our Euro-MP's on our behalf.

If they seem unelected, blame our own government not Europe.

Personally, I'm all for a European Union as a European version of the US, and idea of globalism and a one-world government. I think that ultimately we may benefit from it in the form of world peace, better economy, and extreme leaps when it comes to advances in technology - just a few of the things that we could gain and benefit from the globalist system.

However, I strongly feel that the EU is pushing it too fast in a way that is not really healthy, and puts this new governing form that is growing, on the very fine line between totalitarian and democratic state. If the EU would become a single state today, it would be ruled by bureaucrats not elected by the people, and not the politicians that are elected by the people. I'm not saying it's necessarily a bad thing, or that it would necessarily be a bad system despite being non-democratic - but in this case, it is definitely not good, and there is corruption going on, which is not the kind of foundation we want for a European state.

I wouldn't mind if my country, Sweden, surrendered it's economic sovereignty to the EU - but I do mind it surrendering it to the EU we have today.

The Euro was conceived as a 'cart before the horse' way of securing political union. And yes it has all gone pear shaped but rather conveniently it looks like disaster will achieve what the last few years didn't.
Whether by accident or design I don't know
I think the Euro will survive and the Eurozone will end up ruled by Brussels. Tony Blair still wants UK in the Euro - imagine that! But even if we manage to stay out we will be sucked into the EU - make no mistake. You can see the writing on the wall already. And IMO it is part of the globalist agenda. You have to amalgamate groups of countries before unifying the whole and that's what's happening.
As for the pros and cons, the advantages of countries coming together are outweighed by the danger of having just a few controlling powers (or even just one). It's nothing to do with nationalism. At least now if you dissent with your current regime, you have choices - other places to go. Heaven help us if we end up with one controlling power.

Originally posted by RedGolem

EU unveils its vision for the future of monetary union

www.bbc.co.uk

European authorities have unveiled their vision for the future, which gives them much greater powers.

It includes the creation of a European treasury, which would have powers over national budgets.

European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso said it was "a defining moment for European integration".

(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
www.bbc.co.uk
www.bloomberg.com

Well I don't think the people of Britain will have anything to do with this. Such a momentous change in sovereignty would require a referendum and I'm confident the outcome will be a resounding NO!

It would probably signal our exit from Europe but I for one would rather we stood on our own than hand our souls to the shysters in Brussels, however hard it may get.

reply to post by starchild10


I think the Euro and the Euro-zone will survive also. If for no other reason just because the globalists want it to. On another note this form of government has been coming for a long time. Although I would not have wanted the banks to be the ones pulling the strings.

Originally posted by Grifter81
Such a momentous change in sovereignty would require a referendum and I'm confident the outcome will be a resounding NO!

It would probably signal our exit from Europe but I for one would rather we stood on our own than hand our souls to the shysters in Brussels, however hard it may get.

We should bookmark this thread then you can come back at me in a year or so (or sooner) if I am wrong.
There has already been talk of a future referendum. If one was held now, the outcome would indeed be a resounding no. Which is exactly why there hasn't been one these last few years even though our power has been slipping away. But the time is not yet right. Don't underestimate the power of fear - when things are a whole lot worse than they are now - health services crumbling, more people going hungry, the threat of war on the continent, country going broke .... The panacea to all of this will be further integration into the EU. Don't underestimate the power of the PR machine. We will be given the 'got to be in it to win it' speech. And there will be weasel words about protection of sovereignty.
Why do you think our armed forces are being run down? There will be a common European army. Did you take note of the creeping integration of our recent Census with the rest of Europe? It's coming.

Something is unclear here...

Does this affect Eurozone countries only, or the entire EU, including the UK.

If the former, couldn't care less, do what they want. If the latter, I bloody well hope we get that referendum as that is a massive transfer of Sovereignty

reply to post by starchild10


That's a fair point you have there! I hope you are wrong but sadly I fear there is at least a chance you are right. I just hope that when the time comes there is enough spirit left in the people of this country to say no.

I wouldn't be too bothered except I just know once were integrated then Britain will be shafted for every penny she's got, with nothing in return.

reply to post by Grifter81


If we got out of the EU and went the way of Norway, we could ave £4 billion a year from our contributions..

God forbid we ever lose our rebate though, as our contributions would rocket too £9 billion, making us the single largest contributor to the (badly run) EU budget.

Originally posted by stumason
Something is unclear here...

Does this affect Eurozone countries only, or the entire EU, including the UK.

The proposed greater fiscal and political union will initially just apply to the Eurozone. But it will be argued that we will be left at a disadvantage, on the outside edge looking in (such opinions are already being voiced). And it will be argued that not being involved (ie not having a say in decisions) will harm British interests (also being voiced now). That's when we will be suckered in.
And that's when the whole propaganda machine will start rolling. At that point the state of our country may well be a whole lot worse than it is now. So don't underestimate the fear factor.
Sadly I think the majority of Brits will have neither the understanding nor the backbone to say 'no'.
Nick Clegg is already calling Eurosceptics traitors. As they say in the States, go figure.