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Jesus Christ keeps us saved forever

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posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 06:44 PM
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reply to post by JesuitGarlic
 



For me personally, when I am thinking about sinning or have sinned I feel the Holy Spirit promoting me against what I am thinking of doing or promoting me to repent afterwards if I go along and do it anyway. At that point I either follow the Holy Spirit to not sin or I follow the Holy Spirit who is promoting me to repent. I know from past experiences when I have continually ignored the promptings of the Holy Spirit His voice grows fainter and fainter to the point where I don't feel lead by God or the Holy Spirit is not in me at all. People can go through these highs and lows in their spiritual life all the time, life circumstances can distract you from what is important and people can readily turn away from God even though at an earlier point in their lives they decided to 'believe' in Him. At that point when I have felt cut off from the branch I never felt that I was still 'saved'.


Anyone that is really saved, if they continue to do what they know is wrong will hurt the Holy Spirit and he will grow silent if you continue to not listen to him. It doesn't mean he is not there anymore. You can turn away from him, but he will never turn away from you. I know because i did it for 14 years, and looking back over the course of my life he was always there even went i went agnostic, messed with evil things, witch boards and demon magic and i could still hear his call but i willfully ignored it. When i started coming under demonic attacks and things started happening, objects flying off the counters at me, footsteps running across my kitchen and livingroom that my cat could see but i could not, something turning my bedroom light on at 4 am and yelling "get up" and i was the only one there. I could still hear him telling me to call his name, he was calling mine but it wasn't until i had enough of the hell that i was ready to be done doing things my way, i got the the point i was ready to blow my brains out to end my misery.




When people go through these various tough periods in their spiritual lives and I think it is the totally wrong message to say basically 'continue along in your wrong path, it doesn't matter now if you ever pray to God anymore or seek to give your life and time to Him ect ect because you are ALWAYS 'saved' now and can do no wrong in His eyes'. I really don't think there is much exaggeration here. To me it is a pointless message to basically say to people be content in your capitulation to the world cos you are already home free, just cruise along, no need to live boldly for God's services.


We never tell anyone that they can continue to live in sin once they have been saved, but sometimes people get saved who are not ready for it and they don't understand the commitment involved, nor do they understand that if they keep doing the things they do they disrepsect Yeshua and his gift "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do", and him saying that applies even to this day, many do not know what they do which is why without his grace and mercy no one will ever see his kingdom, we are totally relying on him because that's what grace and mercy is. Yeshua's spirit becomes our guide, and our conscience, the light in the darkness but we have to heed his voice and obey his commands.



The only people that have been attracted to this thread (would be the target audience) are jmdewey60 and I, both Adventist and both of whom if we were to die today would consider yourself would be in the Resurrection of the faithful. It is a pointless thread. It is a pointless thread for us and it is a dangerous thread for other Christians who don't know any better.


When it comes to talking about Yeshua and how he is and what he is like there is no such thing as a pointless thread, because people will google and see and questions they may have had may be answered, and people reading who do not know but were worried that their salvation could ever be taken away, their fears will be laid to rest in the confidence of his love, grace and mercy. His covenant was a blood covenant written and sealed in his own blood, and that is binding for eternity, once he has you, there is no escape.
edit on 4-7-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 09:36 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


agreed....but heaps of people think here that if it is not explicitly mentioned then it doesn't apply, particularly the 4th commandment so you have 98-99% of Christianity not following this commandment



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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reply to post by JesuitGarlic
 


that seems like a rather large assumption...

Do you keep the 4th?

Hope you don't mind if i assume here, but i would assume you don't... at least not according to the OT...

Ask yourself this...

What day isn't "Gods day"?




posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 10:11 PM
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Originally posted by JesuitGarlic
reply to post by Akragon
 


agreed....but heaps of people think here that if it is not explicitly mentioned then it doesn't apply, particularly the 4th commandment so you have 98-99% of Christianity not following this commandment

The Ten Commandments do not now apply as a covenant...
...although they are still 'holy, just and good'.

The words of the Old Covenant were the Ten Commandments...

Exodus 34:28 "And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments."

...but they are not the terms of the New Covenant...
...the New Covenant is 'in His blood' and mediated by the Holy Spirit.

The New Covenant is not defined by law and commandments.



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 10:13 PM
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reply to post by troubleshooter
 


Funny... i thought there were at least 2 commandments...




posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 10:22 PM
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reply to post by lonewolf19792000
 


You have to understand my perspective on this....I am on this forum basically just to say the proclamation of the 3 angels (3 messages from Revelation 14:6-11 given by humans as the end approaches). The third angels message from verses 9-11 makes it abundantly clear that ALL those who receive the beast's mark will be erased from existence(both body and soul) and will not go to Heaven. Do you see how this message is incompatible with 'once saved always saved'?

I am here trying to inform people of this great test, to tell them to spend this time now strengthen their relationship with God so they will not capitulate to the world when they are threatened with not being able to buy food, clothing or have any shelter....The message of OSAS is, 'it doesn't matter if you receive the beast's mark, you are going to heaven anyway'. The two views are completely at odds with each other. This final test (we are told from E. White writings) separates out those of lukewarm faith (maybe you would advocate that they were never 'saved' to begin with, maybe, maybe not, who knows) and those who's character's aren't compatible with the Heavenly kingdom.

If this is how the test will be to separate people into two camps then would not Jesus be deciding this all through history as well (not just the last days test). God can only Judge people by the amount of light/understanding they have received, so if people in the past were initially 'saved' by God already and some time along the way they receive more understanding/light of what God expects of them as Christians but they reject this because they are all so comfortable already then what do you think God's Judgment on them will be as this is a mirror of the beast's mark test.

People are expected to grow as Christians to spiritual maturity and we grow in understanding and light along the way. If we get to the point where we start rejecting the Word that we have been given in new understanding then it makes perfect sense that He too would reject them.

If I see anyone saying (or effectively saying) to others in the last days, 'don't worry, you are already Christian, it is fine to receive the beast's mark and reject God's mark because once you are saved you are always saved'. If I hear that from anyone then they are going to experience some fury from me because the truth is not in them.


Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 10:25 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by troubleshooter
 


Funny... i thought there were at least 2 commandments...


Notice I said 'covenant'...

There are two commandments...

1 John 3:23 "And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment."

...and these are a work of the Spirit in all who believe...
...they grow out of the covenant but they are not the New Covenant.



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 10:27 PM
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Originally posted by JesuitGarlic
reply to post by lonewolf19792000
 


You have to understand my perspective on this....I am on this forum basically just to say the proclamation of the 3 angels (3 messages from Revelation 14:6-11 given by humans as the end approaches). The third angels message from verses 9-11 makes it abundantly clear that ALL those who receive the beast's mark will be erased from existence(both body and soul) and will not go to Heaven. Do you see how this message is incompatible with 'once saved always saved'?

I am here trying to inform people of this great test, to tell them to spend this time now strengthen their relationship with God so they will not capitulate to the world when they are threatened with not being able to buy food, clothing or have any shelter....The message of OSAS is, 'it doesn't matter if you receive the beast's mark, you are going to heaven anyway'. The two views are completely at odds with each other. This final test (we are told from E. White writings) separates out those of lukewarm faith (maybe you would advocate that they were never 'saved' to begin with, maybe, maybe not, who knows) and those who's character's aren't compatible with the Heavenly kingdom.

If this is how the test will be to separate people into two camps then would not Jesus be deciding this all through history as well (not just the last days test). God can only Judge people by the amount of light/understanding they have received, so if people in the past were initially 'saved' by God already and some time along the way they receive more understanding/light of what God expects of them as Christians but they reject this because they are all so comfortable already then what do you think God's Judgment on them will be as this is a mirror of the beast's mark test.

People are expected to grow as Christians to spiritual maturity and we grow in understanding and light along the way. If we get to the point where we start rejecting the Word that we have been given in new understanding then it makes perfect sense that He too would reject them.

If I see anyone saying (or effectively saying) to others in the last days, 'don't worry, you are already Christian, it is fine to receive the beast's mark and reject God's mark because once you are saved you are always saved'. If I hear that from anyone then they are going to experience some fury from me because the truth is not in them.


Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them

Can you give me clear scripture for this 'test' JG?



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 10:42 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 



Do you keep the 4th?
Hope you don't mind if i assume here, but i would assume you don't... at least not according to the OT...


Actually I do keep the 4th commandment according to the Old Testament according to the intent behind it before Satan instilled on the hearts of the Pharisees all the onerous and ridiculous rules and regulations that came about later on, after the old covenant was already broken.

Here is the background of of how the Sabbath command was transformed from a 'delight' to a pain in the neck for most people and how Jesus tried to set it back on its rightful footing again.


As the Jews departed from God, and failed to make the righteousness of Christ their own by faith, the Sabbath lost its significance to them. Satan was seeking to exalt himself and to draw men away from Christ, and he worked to pervert the Sabbath, because it is a sign of the power of Christ. The Jewish leaders accomplished the will of Satan by surrounding God's rest day with burdensome requirements. In the days of Christ the Sabbath had become so perverted that its observance reflected the character of selfish and arbitrary men rather than the character of the loving heavenly Father. The rabbis virtually represented God as giving laws which it was impossible for men to obey. They led the people to look upon God as a tyrant, and to think that the observance of the Sabbath, as He required it, made men hard hearted and cruel. It was the work of Christ to clear away these misconceptions. Although the rabbis followed Him with merciless hostility, He did not even appear to conform to their requirements, but went straight forward, keeping the Sabbath according to the law of God.

When accused of Sabbathbreaking at Bethesda, Jesus defended Himself by affirming His Sonship to God, and declaring that He worked in harmony with the Father. Now that the disciples are attacked, He cites His accusers to examples from the Old Testament, acts performed on the Sabbath by those who were in the service of God.

The Jewish teachers prided themselves on their knowledge of the Scriptures, and in the Saviour's answer there was an implied rebuke for their ignorance of the Sacred Writings. "Have ye not read so much as this," He said, "what David did, when himself was an hungered, and they which were with him; how he went into the house of God, and did take and eat the shewbread, . . . which it is not lawful to eat but for the priests alone?" "And He said unto them, The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." "Have ye not read in the law, how that on the Sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the Sabbath, and are blameless? But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple." "The Son of man is Lord also of the Sabbath." Luke 6:3, 4; Mark 2:27, 28; Matt. 12:5, 6.

If it was right for David to satisfy his hunger by eating of the bread that had been set apart to a holy use, then it was right for the disciples to supply their need by plucking the grain upon the sacred hours of the Sabbath. Again, the priests in the temple performed greater labor on the Sabbath than upon other days. The same labor in secular business would be sinful; but the work of the priests was in the service of God. They were performing those rites that pointed to the redeeming power of Christ, and their labor was in harmony with the object of the Sabbath. But now Christ Himself had come. The disciples, in doing the work of Christ, were engaged in God's service, and that which was necessary for the accomplishment of this work it was right to do on the Sabbath day.

Christ would teach His disciples and His enemies that the service of God is first of all. The object of God's work in this world is the redemption of man; therefore that which is necessary to be done on the Sabbath in the accomplishment of this work is in accord with the Sabbath law. Jesus then crowned His argument by declaring Himself the "Lord of the Sabbath,"--One above all question and above all law. This infinite Judge acquits the disciples of blame, appealing to the very statutes they are accused of violating.

Jesus did not let the matter pass with administering a rebuke to His enemies. He declared that in their blindness they had mistaken the object of the Sabbath. He said, "If ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless." Matt. 12:7. Their many heartless rites could not supply the lack of that truthful integrity and tender love which will ever characterize the true worshiper of God.

Again Christ reiterated the truth that the sacrifices were in themselves of no value. They were a means, and not an end. Their object was to direct men to the Saviour, and thus to bring them into harmony with God. It is the service of love that God values. When this is lacking, the mere round of ceremony is an offense to Him. So with the Sabbath. It was designed to bring men into communion with God; but when the mind was absorbed with wearisome rites, the object of the Sabbath was thwarted. Its mere outward observance was a mockery.
Desire of Ages, Chp 29 p. 283 - 286




What day isn't "Gods day"?



Matthew 12:28 For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath
...we know what day the Lord's Day is, specifically setting aside the whole day
edit on 5-7-2012 by JesuitGarlic because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 10:49 PM
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reply to post by JesuitGarlic
 



Actually I do keep the 4th commandment according to the Old Testament according to the intend behind it before Satan instilled on the hearts of the Pharisees all the onerous and ridiculous rules and regulations that came about later on, after the old covenant was already broken.


So thats a no then?

You either do it the way its written or you don't...

Perhaps you keep the sabbath in your own little way, or according to whatever your church tells you to do?


we know what day the Lord's Day is, specifically setting aside the whole day


Saturday, or Sunday? Or Friday?

Theres plenty of different beliefs on the matter... only one holds true according to scripture...

And either way, you didn't answer my quesiton... What day isn't the lords day... The answer is Every day is... not just one out of the week...



edit on 4-7-2012 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 10:57 PM
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reply to post by troubleshooter
 


Incorrect, the object of both covenants are the 10 commandments....the terms of salvation, what is given along the way to help strengthen us (to keep the 10 commandments) and the way forgiveness/repentance is conducted is different.

SAME DIVINE LAW...DIFFERENT TERMS

Why do you think the weekly Sabbath will still take place in Heaven and on the New Earth (after the second coming)?


Isaiah 66:22-23 For as the new heaven and the new earth which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
(23) and it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

edit on 4-7-2012 by JesuitGarlic because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 11:12 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 



So thats a no then?
You either do it the way its written or you don't...


Show me where all the onerous rules and regulations are written down in the Bible that we must keep...show me where 'the way it is written'



Saturday, or Sunday? Or Friday?

Theres plenty of different beliefs on the matter... only one holds true according to scripture...

The weekly Sabbath as reference in the 4th commandment, the 7th day of the week, has always ever been Friday sunset to Saturday sunset.


What day isn't the lords day... The answer is Every day is... not just one out of the week

Everyday we can/should seek to worship God and get to know Him better ect but not everyday of the week does one refrain from going to work, switching off secular music and TV and dedicate the whole time to just as God intended on His day He sanctified as Holy.



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 11:13 PM
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reply to post by JesuitGarlic
 

We are not under law...

Romans 6:14 "... ye are not under the law, but under grace."


edit on 4/7/12 by troubleshooter because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 11:25 PM
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Originally posted by JesuitGarlic
reply to post by Akragon
 


The weekly Sabbath as reference in the 4th commandment, the 7th day of the week, has always ever been Friday sunset to Saturday sunset.

Under Israel the weekly Sabbath fell on day 8, 15, 22, 29 of each lunar month.

The Saturday/Sabbath you think you are keeping is an invention of Julius Caesar about 48 BC...
...who changed times and the law. (Dan 7:25)



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 11:32 PM
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reply to post by JesuitGarlic
 



Show me where all the onerous rules and regulations are written down in the Bible that we must keep...show me where 'the way it is written'


This really depends on how "in depth" you choose to take the sabbath...

No work, you or others in your home... Lev. 23:3, Ex 20:8-10, Ex 23:12

No cooking or food preperation.. Ex 16:21-30

No lighting fires... which techinically would include ovens, toasters, microwaves, TV, Radio... anything electronic... Exodus 35:3

No Carrying of anything... Jer. 17: 21

No trading Amos 8:5

No marketing Neh. 10:31; 13:15,19

heres a decent list of prohibited activities...

Carrying
Burning
Extinguishing
Finishing
Writing
Erasing
Cooking
Washing
Sewing
Tearing
Knotting
Untying
Shaping
Plowing
Planting
Reaping
Harvesting
Threshing
Winnowing
Selecting
Sifting
Grinding
Kneading
Combing
Spinning
Dyeing
Chain-stitching
Warping
Weaving
Unraveling
Building
Demolishing
Trapping
Shearing
Slaughtering
Skinning
Tanning
Smoothing
Marking

Im sure theres more as well... if i can remember all the rules...

No traveling outside of your home is one... i can't remember the reference though....

Edit: found it Ex. 16:29



edit on 4-7-2012 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 11:35 PM
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reply to post by JesuitGarlic
 





ALL those who receive the beast's mark will be erased from existence(both body and soul) and will not go to Heaven. Do you see how this message is incompatible with 'once saved always saved'?


You can't take the mark if you have YHWH's seal on you, those sealed to him would die first. It's incompatable with once saved always saved because believers will not take the mark and people will still be getting saved in the trib/great trib. That time period will be Jacob's Trouble, that YHWH uses to redeem Israel, the physical decendants of Jacob.

Unless ofcourse you're trying to advocate that sunday worship is the mark of the beast, which is a fallacy for many reasons.



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 11:40 PM
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Originally posted by JesuitGarlic
reply to post by troubleshooter
 


Incorrect, the object of both covenants are the 10 commandments....the terms of salvation, what is given along the way to help strengthen us (to keep the 10 commandments) and the way forgiveness/repentance is conducted is different.

You make the most outrageous statements mate that I know you have no biblical support for.

The Old Covenant is not the New Covenant.

The Ten Commandments were the Old Covenant...
Exodus 34:28 "And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments."

...and the writer of Hebrews says this Covenant has been supersided...
...by a better covenant.

Hebrews 8:13 - 9:1 "In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away."

The Ten Commandments were delivered to Israel the first Pentecost post-Exodus...
...and the Holy Spirit was given the first Pentecost post-Gospel.

A covenant of law/commandments has given way to the superior relationship with the Spirit.

Galatians 5:18 "...if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law."



posted on Jul, 4 2012 @ 11:44 PM
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Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by JesuitGarlic
reply to post by Akragon
 


The weekly Sabbath as reference in the 4th commandment, the 7th day of the week, has always ever been Friday sunset to Saturday sunset.

Under Israel the weekly Sabbath fell on day 8, 15, 22, 29 of each lunar month.

The Saturday/Sabbath you think you are keeping is an invention of Julius Caesar about 48 BC...
...who changed times and the law. (Dan 7:25)


He is correct actually...

would you mind givng some references to your claim?

Sunday worship is a creation of the romans... Sun worship...

And Friday at Sunset to Saturday at sunset falls in line with the gospels...




posted on Jul, 5 2012 @ 12:06 AM
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Originally posted by Akragon

Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by JesuitGarlic
reply to post by Akragon
 


The weekly Sabbath as reference in the 4th commandment, the 7th day of the week, has always ever been Friday sunset to Saturday sunset.

Under Israel the weekly Sabbath fell on day 8, 15, 22, 29 of each lunar month.

The Saturday/Sabbath you think you are keeping is an invention of Julius Caesar about 48 BC...
...who changed times and the law. (Dan 7:25)


He is correct actually...

would you mind givng some references to your claim?

Sunday worship is a creation of the romans... Sun worship...

And Friday at Sunset to Saturday at sunset falls in line with the gospels...


There is loads of support for the luni-solar determination of Sabbath days in Israel...
...here are a couple of quotes from Jewish sources....

“Sabbath and New Moon (Rosh Hodesh), both periodically recurring in the course of the year. The New Moon is still, and the Sabbath originally was, dependent upon the lunar cycle” (Universal Jewish Encylopedia, 410.)

“The Israelites . . . made the Sabbath the feasts of a living and holy God. The work of man became symbolic of the work of God, and human rest of divine rest, so that the Sabbaths became preeminently days of rest. Since, moreover, the lunar month had 29 or 30 days, the normal lapse of time between Sabbaths was six days, although sometimes seven or eight; and six working days were accordingly assigned to the creation, which was to furnish a prototype for human life. The connection of the Sabbath with lunar phases, however, was [later] discarded by the Israelites . . . .” (The New Schaff-Herzog Religious Encyclopedia, 135-136.)



posted on Jul, 5 2012 @ 12:08 AM
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reply to post by troubleshooter
 



Can you give me clear scripture for this 'test' JG?


You have to way up what is clear and what isn't and the intent behind the test....but the following texts make the test clear enough and of no issue for those who fully know and love God.

We know from this passage the test involves the question of worship, who you give your allegiance to

Revelation 13:15-17

15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.


God tells us who to worship....He is saying don't worship anyone but the Creator, don't give your ultimate allegiance to anyone but the Creator who is the only one worthy of our worship and the only one through whom salvation is given

Revelation 14:7 Worship Him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water.


We are told what happens to those who don't pass the 'test' and their allegiance is shown to be with someone other than the Creator

Revelation 14:9-11

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.


We are given descriptions of those who pass the test to get an idea of how to pass it

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city


Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus


We also have the beast telling us what it's mark is (outside of scripture but directly outside of the their own mouth...


“Sunday is our mark...the church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact.” — Catholic Record of London, Ontario, September 1, 1923.

“Of course the Catholic Church claims that the change (Saturday Sabbath to Sunday) was her act...And the act is a mark of her ecclesiastical authority in religious things.” — H.F. Thomas, Chancellor of Cardinal Gibbons.


The beast also tells us how following their 'mark' means we are worshiping the image of the beast, that we are giving our allegiance to him.

“Protestants...accept Sunday rather than Saturday as the day for public worship after the Catholic Church made the change...But the Protestant mind does not seem to realize that...In observing the Sunday, they are accepting the authority of the spokesman for the church, the Pope.” — Our Sunday Visitor, February 15, 1950.

“It was the Catholic church which...has transferred this rest to Sunday in remembrance of the resurrection of our Lord. Therefore the observance of Sunday by the Protestants is an homage they pay, in spite of themselves, to the authority of the (Catholic) church.” — Monsignor Louis Segur, Plain Talk About the Protestantism of Today, p. 213.


We have the Beast laying down the gauntlet to all those who say they follow the Bible as their sole authority, telling exactly what they should do and what it all means by creating a huge write up about it all called Rome's Challenge

“Protestants...accept Sunday rather than Saturday as the day for public worship after the Catholic Church made the change...But the Protestant mind does not seem to realize that...In observing the Sunday, they are accepting the authority of the spokesman for the church, the Pope.” — Our Sunday Visitor, February 15, 1950.

“It was the Catholic church which...has transferred this rest to Sunday in remembrance of the resurrection of our Lord. Therefore the observance of Sunday by the Protestants is an homage they pay, in spite of themselves, to the authority of the (Catholic) church.” — Monsignor Louis Segur, Plain Talk About the Protestantism of Today, p. 213.
Romes Challenge


We have God also telling us in scripture what His 'mark' is (Ezekiel 20:12, 20 and Exodus 31:17...strongs #0226 word 'SIGN': Hebrew: 'owth', meaning - sign, token, ensign, mark, a distinguishing mark, signal, banner, remembrance), and how in similar circumstances of plagues coming down upon the people outside of God we know how the test will be administered

Revelation 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that you be not partakers of her sins, and that you receive not of her plagues.



Pharaoh says, "You make them rest from their labor(Exodus 5:5 KJV)".
The word Pharaoh used for rest is 'shabbat' (Strong's #7673) the word which is also found used in Genesis 2:2. Therefore the Hebrews were endeavoring to keep the commands of God by keeping the Sabbath day holy. The reason that the plagues came upon the Egyptians was because Pharaoh instituted a new civil law to double the labors of the Hebrews that would prevent them from being able to keep the Sabbath as God had intended for his people, a civil law that was against the Divine law of God.

There is the test...civil legislation that will come into effect that will be against one commandment of the Divine Law, the 4th commandment that signifies that we specifically follow the Creator.

The 4th Commandment

Remember the Sabbath day to keep it Holy...The 7th day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God...For in six days the Lord made the heavens, the earth, the sea and all that is in them, and rest on the seventh-day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it. (Exodus 20:8, 10, and 11)

----------
Is the test outlined straight forward enough...it should be abundantly clear
edit on 5-7-2012 by JesuitGarlic because: (no reason given)




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