Why New Agers are "Spiritually Dead" and not "Enlightened", page 13

reply to post by wildtimes

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Very well put, Wildtimes.

Your version of "critical thinking" seems to be to criticize everyone around you who doesn't agree with your narrow-minded zeal.

I too have seen this behavior from the OP many times over in here. You are either with him, or his god will send you straight to hell. Try to show him the origins of the words he uses, he gets mad and insults you. Tell him the people he is talking about most likely are aliens, he calls them all demons. Damning everyone who has a different religious outlook as "sinners," is akin to insults. This is called religious intolerance, and in a forum like ATS, there are people from all over the world, and to expect that all of them will immediately become Christians just because one member, or several, tells them they are going to Hell if they don't, well, that dog won't hunt.

Religious tolerance is about civil rights: Others define religious tolerance as a human rights issue. Religious tolerance means that you favor extending religious freedom to people of all faith traditions, even though you probably disagree with their validity of theiir beliefs and/or practices. In turn, religious freedom means that a person can, without oppression or discrimination:

*Believe, worship and witness as they wish;

*Practice freedom from belief, worship and witnessing if they wish;

*Change their beliefs or religious affiliation;

*Within reasonable limits, proselytize others in order to convert others to their belief system, and/or

*Associate with others to express their beliefs.

source

Quotations on religious intolerance:

George H.W. Bush: (R) as Presidential candidate on 1987-AUG-27: "No, I don't know that Atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God."

Pat Robertson, Fundamentalist Christian minister, on The 700 Club episode for 1991-JAN-14: "You say you're supposed to be nice to the Episcopalians and the Presbyterians and the Methodists and this, that, and the other thing. Nonsense. I don't have to be nice to the spirit of the Antichrist. I can love the people who hold false opinions but I don't have to be nice to them."

Andrew Sandlin, writing for the Chalcedon Foundation, calls for Christian believers to pray to God to exterminate those who think differently from themselves: "God extends his grace to his people (and mankind in general) when he destroys the wicked, because in destroying the wicked, he is averting their evil works that so plague God's children and mankind in general. When he maims and kills cultists and theological liberals, he prevents the spread of heretical doctrine that damns souls...God's judgment -- not his favor -- leads the world to righteousness. We should petition God's judgment on the wicked because judgment is a form of grace."

source
America has Freedom of Religion, America has Laws against Hate Crimes, and America is not now, nor was it ever, a Christian Nation, and no amount of preaching will make it that.

reply to post by autowrench

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Interesting quotes by Bush and Robertson. And we look to people like this for leadership? That's downright scary.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

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Moses wrote the Torah, the first 5 "books" of the hebrew bible.

Dig deeper. Moses wrote two more book not included in the biblical texts, mostly because they deal with Jewish Magick, which Moses used successfully in certain stories in the Old Testament Book of Exodus. These books are known as the Sixth and Seventh Books of Moses, or as THE SWORD OF MOSES. This is a Magickal Grimore, and is a very real book. I myself have read an English translation at The Hospital of Enlightenment in Virginia Beach.

Also, there is some evidence that the biblical Moses story was taken from a much earlier story of Sargon of Akkad, a Sumerian Ruler. Both bear a very similar story.
In any case, Sumerian tales are older (or at least were written down first.) These stories, carved on clay tablets, are about 1,500 years older than the Bible. The earliest of the Biblical books was written down about 1500 BC. For myself, I am more inclined to take the first story over the copy.

reply to post by Titen-Sxull

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Well the first thing that drew me here was the use of the words New Age. New Age beliefs are a subject I am interested in precisely because of how much of a hodge-podge of different beliefs they can be. A New Ager can accept Crystals, alien entities, channeling spirits, Jesus and reincarnation and apparently not suffer the slightest cognitive dissonance, that alone is quite interesting. New Age is essentially the "pick-your-own-adventure-book" of religions.

Of course the thread turned out to be just some Christian pretending his death cult is somehow so much more enlightened than New Age beliefs. As a former Christian and someone who knows a decent amount about Christian beliefs and scripture naturally I responded.

Me also. As soon as I read the term "New Age" associated with the author, I knew even before reading a word that is was yet another attempt to criticise and put down any other belief of faith as being wrong, wrong, wrong. That is what brought me to this thread, and what made me fell inclined to reply and post what I think, and what I know. The OP even stated when he first came here that he was a new Christian, but even with that he pretends to know everything there is to know about it. The OP has told me that in his view, the bible is the word of God, and is all literally true, no mistake about it, and any other Ancient text was simply a "myth" designed to tear down modern Christianity. In his opinion, all Ghosts and all Aliens are Demons, and these Demons are posing to fool us, and are after our souls, and so on.
It always strikes me fully that ONLY Christians ever see these Demons, and ONLY the devout ever get possessed. In monotheistic religions, the deities (Gods/Goddesses) of other religions are usually interpreted as demons. The evolution of the Christian Devil/Satan are good examples, as seen by the Christians. There are many thousands of demons in Christian demonology, many of which were added because some Christian theologians concluded that all Pagan Deities were in fact Demons. Alphonso de Spina is said to have asserted that the number of Demons was 133,316,666. With that many Demons running around, why can't everyone see them, and why isn't everyone possessed by them, and why haven't they taken over the word yet?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by apushforenlightment

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There is a strange sense of peace at that moment after a fear imposed amagydala overload since the brain will not be able to feel fear anymore.

What exactly happened at this moment? Can you elaborate some more?

All the preassures of the world and yourself evaporate. You do not care at all about other peoples perception of you at all or anyone else. The mind is exhausted and is silent. You just are and do not care that much about anything all things seem so trivial and laughable. I have read that in the brain the reward/punishment system gets changed to be rebuild again. I understand why people call experiances like this a rebirth.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by apushforenlightment

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Lol. I remeber when I in my mind told god that I would never agree to eternal punishment and would reject god if he was a bully and would not have anything to do with Christianety because of it before I had my moment.

Your statement almost concerns me. From my research, it makes me wonder if "rejecting" God based on our own requirements of him is what could possibly lead to deceptions. Does refusing to accept God for who he is, but who we want him to be open a door wide open for other spirits to enter in? I think this may be a possibility.

Do we have every right to get mad at God? Absolutely. Do we have any right to make demands on him based on our own limited understanding of him? I don't think so. However, like you said, anyone is free to reject him.

This is giving me some new ideas on areas of research. Thanks.

I do not reject god. I reject what I belive is humans false perception on him. I am as I am for a reason. God made sure I became exactly what I am today and is in his own way keeping watch. In me he is not creating a follower. He is creating a person that stands up to even himself to the ideals of service to all by all. For by serving my neighbour and my neighbour serving me equaly we are both serving god.

A quote from Buddha
Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.

God made sure Buddha was sent here to preach gods wisdom. I examine and change all my thought if they do not make sense. If god did not want people who can think for themself and question his motives then why do he keep us around and even teaches some of us to do it? God loves curriosity since it shows the soul is wanting to understand all about god/creation/love and reality.

reply to post by autowrench

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Also, there is some evidence that the biblical Moses story was taken from a much earlier story of Sargon of Akkad, a Sumerian Ruler. Both bear a very similar story. In any case, Sumerian tales are older (or at least were written down first.) These stories, carved on clay tablets, are about 1,500 years older than the Bible. The earliest of the Biblical books was written down about 1500 BC. For myself, I am more inclined to take the first story over the copy.

Boy, all of this research is a time consuming vicious circle!

First, your link on Sargon claims that it really doesn't know the time period in which Sargon of Akkad lived or reigned. The only information they had to go by was a Sumerian King List and incorporating the "Short Chronology Timeline". If you look up the link on the timeline, it says several times that newer research has caused a lack of academic support on anything dated between the 2nd & 3rd millenniums b.c.. Now you throw in the information that no one really knows for sure because there was also an Assyrian king named Sargon and the whole thing becomes a jumbled mess! Whew!

In the meanwhile, the section of Sargon of Akkad being compared to the story of Moses says it all came from a supposed "autobiography" dated in the 7th century b.c. Considering that Moses supposedly lived from 1391 - 1271 b.c., I think it's very likely that the story could have been copied from the story of Moses.

reply to post by autowrench

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This is called religious intolerance, and in a forum like ATS, there are people from all over the world, and to expect that all of them will immediately become Christians just because one member, or several, tells them they are going to Hell if they don't, well, that dog won't hunt.

Spot on, auto. And thanks for the bump!

It does seem to me that there are more and more members who are "coming out" about not toeing the Christian line "du jour" or "a la mode."

When I first joined in, it was amazing how many evangelists were monopolizing the Religion forums. It seems a much more widely diverse group now, with MANY deep thinkers and scholars -- including you and others.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

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Thanks for proving the Jesus taught the truth about reincarnation, using his own soul's journey as an example.

reply to post by Deetermined

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Your funny. So your research led to facts about the existence of Sargon of Akkad, but archaeologists are unsure as to the time period. But, there is no achaeological evidence that Moses even existed, let alone when! You know, the identity of Moses is a hotly debated topic and some scholars identify him as Pharaoh Akennoten, 1379 BC.

reply to post by apushforenlightment

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God made sure Buddha was sent here to preach gods wisdom. I examine and change all my thought if they do not make sense. If god did not want people who can think for themself and question his motives then why do he keep us around and even teaches some of us to do it? God loves curriosity since it shows the soul is wanting to understand all about god/creation/love and reality.

Very well put, push!

I always enjoy your posts. Here's one of my faves.
And here is a quote from the HH the 14th Dalai Lama:

reply to post by windword

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Your funny. So your research led to facts about the existence of Sargon of Akkad, but archaeologists are unsure as to the time period. But, there is no achaeological evidence that Moses even existed, let alone when! You know, the identity of Moses is a hotly debated topic and some scholars identify him as Pharaoh Akennoten, 1379 BC.

The Exodus Discovered! Egypt to Arabia

www.squidoo.com...

reply to post by Deetermined

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This merely proves that nomadic people were present in the area, not that they were Hebrews or that they were led by the legendary "Moses."

There is no evidence of the Hebrew people being held as slaves in Egypt, and no evidence that the people in the myths are the same people of these archaeological sites.

There is evidence of a mass exodus from Egypt after the volcanic eruption on Santorini, that caused plagues in the Egyptian territory of the Nile Delta.

www.greeka.com...

reply to post by windword

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You obviously didn't read the link.

reply to post by Deetermined

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Didn't have to, I've immersed myself in this debate before.

EDIT: There is no evidence that the people who dwelt in those outposts were Hebrews, let alone THE Hebrews.

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by apushforenlightment

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God made sure Buddha was sent here to preach gods wisdom. I examine and change all my thought if they do not make sense. If god did not want people who can think for themself and question his motives then why do he keep us around and even teaches some of us to do it? God loves curriosity since it shows the soul is wanting to understand all about god/creation/love and reality.

Very well put, push!

I always enjoy your posts. Here's one of my faves.
And here is a quote from the HH the 14th Dalai Lama:

I love that one. It is just like searching for wisdom and thruth and higher ideals should be. Egoless and questioning and willing to change without caring that your views where wrong.

Evolution of wisdom is the way wisdom increases. Fractal evolution. The animal evolves from one thing to another. The person evolve thru his life from one thing to another. The spirit evolves and learn and change due to more experiances. Society evolves. The planet changes and evolves. The unvierse changes and evolves. And here is one that some people do not like to hear. Even god changes even if the system that is built up do not. God is very much alive.

Being static the same is an Illusion and I thank god for that. It would be very boring to be totaly static.

(From my point of view what attracts me in these religons)
The Buddist are the logical ones who quantify everything for the mind to become egoless/humble and to achive control. The Christians are the emotional ones that enhances whatever emotion exists within. If you bring ego then you get ego. If you bring hate then you create hate. If you bring love the you get love. The Hindus are ones who control their body thru mediation and Chakra to be able to find peace without emotion or mind at times.

What do you get sometimes when you put these together? New age . The sum of wisdom in the parts is greater than the parts.

reply to post by Deetermined

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While I don't have a thread about the subject, I did write an article about my deconversion on the website hubpages:

From Superstition to Skepticism

If that's a bit long and Klassified does set up a thread I'd be glad to share. The short version is that I was a raised by Fundamentalist parents to believe the Bible was the word of God. I attended a Pentecostal church until around seventeen at which point my parents stopped forcing me to get up on Sunday for church. For a time I was an Old Earth Creationist. After this I attempted to reach my own conclusions rather than being spoon-fed from the pulpit, I set out to read the entire Bible and once I had done that it didn't take long for me to stop being a Christian. I drifted into deism and pantheism before realizing I didn't have a reason to believe those either. I labeled myself agnostic until I realized I fit the definition of an atheist as well and have been an atheist since 2009.

reply to post by autowrench

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Well the thing is that according to the Bible the devil already rules the Earth, sort of. The devil is referred to as the ruler of the Kingdom of the air in Ephesians, suggesting that Earth is his domain, while God on the other hand resides elsewhere waiting for the time when he will eventually punish the devil. In 2nd Corinthians again the devil is identified as the "god of this world".

So God has apparently already given Satan the crown, and is just waiting around to take it back for some reason.

I'm always amazed at how people will pretend to have certitude regarding supernatural and fantastic things, especially when they believe these things to be absolutely real.

reply to post by Titen-Sxull

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I'm not even sure how to respond to your article. It sounds so incredibly frustrating. It sounds like you've been searching in earnestness, yet you haven't had any personal experiences....yet. I'm guessing you're still pretty young (early twenties)?

I find it fascinating that you talk about being able to speak in tongues even though you don't practice religion. Is this something you do or do not have control over? It sounds like it would come over you without your controlling it? You don't seem to think it's anything spiritual or supernatural, so what do you consider it to be? For me personally, I belong to a Pentecostal church, yet I have never spoken in tongues. I believe there are seven gifts of the Spirit and I don't believe that everyone should feel like they have to practice all of them. Just my personal preference.

reply to post by Titen-Sxull

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I am into my first rough draft now, so it'll be a bit, but I'll u2u everyone when I have it posted. I'm not a particularly good story teller, so it will take me a while to hone it down.

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