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found it - here you go - what if 20 million illegals left the USA

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posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 08:34 PM
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Originally posted by syrinx high priest
more asians are immigrating to the US than any other group right now

please adjust your racism, stereo-typing and hatred accordingly

thank you


Immigrating, or illegally immigrating?

There's a huge difference, which is the main point of the debate. It has nothing to do with race.
edit on 25-6-2012 by Morgenstern89 because: (no reason given)




posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 08:40 PM
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So glad that you posted the fact based response. About time that people looked at the real cost of illegals in this country. What is it about the term" illegal" that so many libs don't understand??? Close the borders.



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 08:41 PM
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Originally posted by syrinx high priest
more asians are immigrating to the US than any other group right now

please adjust your racism, stereo-typing and hatred accordingly

thank you


Racism? I don't care who is immigrating to the United States right now, as long as they are doing it legally, and don't end up needing government support to survive here. That is racist? From what I gathered traveling to Europe a few years ago, and chatting with Germans, Italians, and Greeks that lived there, their expectations of immigration are exactly what I said, they don't want people coming from other countries living off of their government. Exactly what is wrong with that, given our current expenditure for illegal immigrants?



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 08:47 PM
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Originally posted by 1BornPatriot
I have mixed feeling on the subject - if an illegal wants to become American - wants to work hard and raise a family and make my country better - I'm for that -- now if you want to sneek in and take advantage of a loop hole and bascially dont want to be American - Get the hell out. we got enough people to take care of. and we dont need your help in making it harder for the rest of us ...

source
Somebody really did their homework on this one.

I, Tina Griego, A journalist for the Denver Rocky Mountain News wrote a column titled ,
"Mexican Visitor's Lament"- 10/25/07.


I interviewed Mexican journalist Evangelina Hernandez while visiting Denver last week. Hernandez said, "illegal aliens pay rent, buy groceries, buy clothes. What Happens to your country's economy if 20 million people go away?" Hmmm, I thought, what would happen? So I did my due diligence, buried my nose as a reporter into the FACTS I found below .



It's a good question it deserves an honest answer. Over 80% of Americans demand secured borders and illegal migration stopped. But what would happen if all 20 million or more vacated America ? The answers I found may surprise you! In California , if 3.5 million illegal aliens moved back to Mexico , it would leave an extra $10.2 billion to spend on overloaded school systems, bankrupt hospitals and overrun prisons. It would leave highways cleaner, safer and less congested. Everyone could understand one another as English became the dominant language again. In Colorado , 500,000 illegal migrants, plus their 300,000 kids and grandchilds would move back 'home', mostly to Mexico . That would save Colorado an estimated $2 billion (other experts say $7 billion) annually in taxes that pay for schooling, medical, social-services and incarceration costs. It means 12,000 gang members would vanish out of Denver alone.


Total cost a whopping $538 . 3 BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR! .

edit on 25-6-2012 by 1BornPatriot because: (no reason given)

edit on 25-6-2012 by Asktheanimals because: Excessive quoting of source material removed


But their "kids and grandchilds," even if you use awful grammar, are mostly American citizens, not illegals, and therefore don't need to go anywhere. Or are we now talking about deporting people just because they're brown?



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 08:58 PM
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reply to post by vexati0n
 


once again i see no connection with the color of your skin and the fact that that you willing break the laws.I want to see all illegal immigrants ran out but I could care less about color



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 08:59 PM
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Originally posted by syrinx high priest
more asians are immigrating to the US than any other group right now

please adjust your racism, stereo-typing and hatred accordingly

thank you


haha,

spot on.

jump on the next bandwagon.


Originally posted by Helious

Originally posted by RealSpoke
There aren't 20 million illegals in the USA, there are 11 million according to the census. This thread is dis-info


According to the census...... ROFLMFAO. Yeah, cause all illegals let the census guy into there house and tell them how many people actually live there....... Worst troll I have seen THIS YEAR.


Not really a troll.. while the initial comment may be incorrect, it raises an important point: There is no way anyone could come up with an accurate figure of illegal immigrants in the US, it's an oxymoron... You can't count something that is hiding and refuses to cooperate with census counters. Until every single person within the borders is accounted for the figures in the OP are inaccurate and cannot be taken without question.
edit on 25-6-2012 by knightwhosaysnih because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:01 PM
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Originally posted by Lostmymarbles
Questions:

For all those illegal aliens using fake ids to get jobs that pay taxes, which they cannot claim during income tax time to get back a tax refund. Flawed. They can get it back using the same SSN and name they used on their W2.

How much money would the US lose out on?

Let's just say out of the 20 million, half are paying taxes that they won't ever get back. Sounds like a lot of money the US is going to lose out on. Flawed. If they are paying in, then they are using a SSN and an address, therefore they can use that same info to get it back.

What about all those illegals from Europe that came over due to wars and economic problems in Europe? Are they to be sent back as well? What about all those that come from Asia, Africa, and the rest of the world? Are they to be sent back as well? Quote sources. I don't know of any illegal "Europeans". Most came through Ellis Island, AKA, the front door.

At which point do you draw the line? How many years do you and your family have to live here to be considered legal? 5 years? 10 years? 30? 50? 100? 200? 300? If you do it legally, you don't have to worry about that in the first place. Don't know of many 100 or 200 year-old illegals. Are you serious or seriously that dumb? Not trying to demean you, serious question.

What makes those who's families were once illegals better then the current illegals? Amnesty? Like, under Reagan? Naturalization? Ever heard of that one?

Why is one group allowed to stay and another forced to leave? Show me a bunch of illegal Pol's, Frenchmen or whatever. I frankly don't know of any. If they are here illegally, then they should be rounded up and deported as well. Before you start with your theoretical sophistries, bring some proof to the game.

Who has the right to tell the person who came years after him that he's an illegal and not allowed in? It's called the rule of law. We are a nation of laws.

Is limiting our county to just one language a good thing? Europeans are surrounded by many languages and most of them know at least 2 or more languages. And the EU is collapsing. Next question.

How much money do cities and states lose out on for fining illegals? Fining them for what? Littering? How much do they save by sparing the school system, welfare system and healthcare system? If we're gonna count apples, let's count oranges too.

Who is going to replace all the workers in agriculture? Those that work for barely minimal wage? Who cares? The law is the law and big Ag shouldn't be breaking the law by taking advantage of illegals.

Did you take into account that if others replaced the agriculture workers that they would demand better wages, which would require produce and food prices to skyrocket to make up for the cost of paying employees? Did you take into account if these illegals were given amnesty or green cards, they would then go "on the books" and would no longer be able to work for those wages. The benefits of hiring illegals effectively goes away.

What if a law passed that said if your family hasn't lived in this country for at least 200 years, your an ILLEGAL, would you still be okay with kicking out the illegals? Sorry, pal. Already got my long form birth certificate so it ain't gonna happen. Are you on drugs? Under what conditions would they possible pass a law like that?

My family has been here for nearly 400 years, how long has your family been here?
edit on 25-6-2012 by Lostmymarbles because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:03 PM
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I lean to the left politically, but within reason, and I have to agree with those of you who appose illegal immigration. If someone does it legally, awesome, welcome to America, but doing it illegally just spits in the face of everyone who went through the proper channels. And I think this modern "we should let them stay" mentality comes more from a place of sympathy than logic. I understand their country is a wreck, people are having a rough time, have hard lives, but why is that our fault, and why is it our job to help them? We don't have our act together enough to help the needy that already live here, nor the resources to find and cut off those who have been thoroughly abusing the system for generations. Do I think that rounding up every illegal immigrant and sending them back will solve our problems? Absolutely not. But we're going down the tubes fast, and we need to take every step we can towards turning things around. And to make any part of this debate about race is dishonest and intellectually lazy.



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:04 PM
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LOL

Notice what the left have to say in this thread so far? Your a racist or Native Indians would be the only ones left if all the illegals left. Geeze guys, get some new material.

How dare some of us think that people should come into the country legally, pay taxes and assimilate to the American culture? How dare we! Oh, I also forgot, all illegals are hard working, fine law abiding people.....got some farmland in Atlantis to sell me?
edit on 25-6-2012 by MidnightTide because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:04 PM
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This might be the TX comptroller link

Undocumented Immigrants in Texas - Window on State Government

Texas doesn't pay that great of wages anyway so I wonder if that play into the 'facts'.



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:19 PM
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Originally posted by Daedalus24
reply to post by havok
 


And how exactly did your grandparents get here? The immigration process is quite different than it was two generations ago when people had to pass through Ellis or Angel Island and had to pass a simple health check and not wait 10-20 years for a visa or work permit...


Let's not bring mi familia into this. K?
I will say they came on a boat, from a country, and into New York.


The immigration process is what allows people to gain citizenship. Old or new.
The whole, "It takes 30 years to become a legal citizen" argument is played out.
I don't know where you are from, but I've talked to many people about getting work visa's in 4-6 weeks.
Green cards too.

Look, if we have to live in these defined borders sold to us by our masters...
We might as well ALL do our part to make it better for everyone.
Why should we support free-loaders!?






posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:22 PM
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Originally posted by havok

Originally posted by Daedalus24
reply to post by havok
 


And how exactly did your grandparents get here? The immigration process is quite different than it was two generations ago when people had to pass through Ellis or Angel Island and had to pass a simple health check and not wait 10-20 years for a visa or work permit...


Let's not bring mi familia into this. K?
I will say they came on a boat, from a country, and into New York.


The immigration process is what allows people to gain citizenship. Old or new.
The whole, "It takes 30 years to become a legal citizen" argument is played out.
I don't know where you are from, but I've talked to many people about getting work visa's in 4-6 weeks.
Green cards too.

Look, if we have to live in these defined borders sold to us by our masters...
We might as well ALL do our part to make it better for everyone.
Why should we support free-loaders!?





You know, I've never heard of it taking that long either. Where are those time frames coming from? One of my relatives got a green card in a few months, it was a relatively smooth process.



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:31 PM
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Originally posted by Atom12
So glad that you posted the fact based response. About time that people looked at the real cost of illegals in this country. What is it about the term" illegal" that so many libs don't understand??? Close the borders.


Anyone paying attention knows they are closing them.
To people wanting out.



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:34 PM
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if an illegal wants to become American - wants to work hard and raise a family and make my country better - I'm for that -- now if you want to sneek in and take advantage of a loop hole and bascially dont want to be American - Get the hell out. we got enough people to take care of. and we dont need your help in making it harder for the rest of us


Im sure the native amaricans feel the same about the white man who have raped thier country.



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:34 PM
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If 20 million illegals were deported tomorrow, we could cut most government subsidies (welfare and more) and put Americans to work. Sure, people won't be doing their dream jobs, but they'd have jobs.

Additionally, ALL corporations would finally be adhering to the confines of federal law, which they should be doing now but they know they get a slap on the wrist because corporate lobbyists make sure there's no real penalty for big businesses to engage in SLAVE LABOR.

Plus, we would put an end to human trafficking (and then continual extortion) by the drug cartels that smuggle most of the illegal entries to the USA. Not only are ILLEGAL aliens knowingly BREAKING FEDERAL LAW the instance they cross the border, they're paying money to help fund organized crime in the process. Many unsuspecting women are raped in that process. The very allowance of illegal immigration should be a federal crime because it harms all.

Not only do the drug cartels bring these somewhat naive people in this country (ILLEGALLY) to perform Slave Labor Like conditions, some of the smuggled are SOLD as SLAVES into prostitution rings and as small restaurant slaves (literally), domestic household slaves (literally), and a hundred other types of literal slaves.

If you dislike slavery, you MUST be against illegal immigration. We can STOP modern day SLAVERY now. (At least we can within with latinos and latinas within our borders. We can also stop modern day slavery by refusing to buy goods made in China where businesses succeed because their workers are nearly slaves and some of them are actual bought and paid for slaves. We support this with the dollars we spend on the cheap products we want.)

Additionally, there is a purpose for controlled immigration, which allows a proportional growth of psycho-demographics and allows the most FAIR growth patterns. Currently, anyone from any other country has the hardest time getting to immigrate. The illegal immigration is a crime against all these other individuals from other countries who want to come to America. That's not even mentioning the unfairness illegal immigration causes to Mexicans who go through all the time, effort, and money to cross that border legally and become naturalized citizens.

Not everyone wants to live in the USA or become American citizens, but there are scores across the world who want it and who want to do so by RESPECTING the LAWS of the USA from the get-go.

Beyond issues of providing a fair ratio of immigration to all, abetting illegal immigration in any way is a crime against humanity because of what these people go through as a result of initially and continually breaking sovereign laws because they deem themselves above it... or exempt from it (from some Marxist teachings popularized in Mexico).

We can end this type of slavery now. We can force corporations in America to pay minimum wage (or more) now. And we can stop allowing women to get raped along the border, along with funding the cartels and other organized crime. We can also finally allow preference and fairness to a global mix of immigrants who WANT to enter our borders legally.

The argument that the world would stop if the illegal aliens were deported today or tomorrow is just a bunch of baloney, especially now since a real number of 25% of the population is either unemployed, on welfare, or otherwise checked out of the workforce.
edit on 25-6-2012 by twoandthree because: added tidbit on slaves in China. Our dollar makes the vote. We can make modern day slavery less profitable now.



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:42 PM
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Originally posted by roadgravel
This might be the TX comptroller link

Undocumented Immigrants in Texas - Window on State Government

Texas doesn't pay that great of wages anyway so I wonder if that play into the 'facts'.


I skimmed this briefly, I don't have time to read it in depth, but I will go over it later a little more closely. From what I understood, there were two other reports that conflicted with this Texas report. One of the differences that the report cited, was that the other tests included the other "legal children" of the illegal immigrants, which they did not include in the report. Really? The only reason why there are other "legal children" children born to illegal immigrants is because they were born to illegal immigrants while in the United States. You absolutely have to count those children, they were still born to parents here illegaly, and still cost America the same amount. People talk about the "anchor baby" myth, but here it is in a government report. The real numbers don't lie, and should include all children born to illegal aliens while illegal.

By the way, one of the reasons why Texas does not pay "great wages", is because we have an extremely low cost of living. It also depends very much on who you work for.



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:43 PM
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reply to post by 1BornPatriot
 


"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."

I like the part where you talk about deporting children and grandchildren of illegal immigrants who would actually be birthright citizens of the United States. If you truly believe in the US Constitution, you might consider actually reading the 14th Amendment.

The highways being less congested and safer is laughable.

Illegal immigrants are not eligible for welfare, medicare or medicaid. So, how would not having illegal immigrants reduce the burden on welfare?
edit on 25-6-2012 by andrewh7 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:46 PM
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Originally posted by PhoenixOD
Im sure the native amaricans feel the same about the white man who have raped thier country.


Can we say this about Europe too?
Because someone had to "steal" the land from someone right?
Or else, there would never be wars for land, anywhere.
Ever.

All across this globe humans have fought over land and resources.
It doesn't make it right, but you can't blame a particular group of people for human nature.

The Native Americans fought and "raped" other Natives for land centuries before "white man" did.
It was always war between tribes over who owned what.


That argument is a moot point.






posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:48 PM
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Originally posted by 1BornPatriot
the funny thing was I also, judged if they used drugs or not by their attire - hair style and accessories they were wearing


That is pretty funny. Considering you can't realistically judge whether or not some one does drugs, by the clothes they choose to wear, their hair style and other such accessories.

Please, tell me you were not seriously trying to do that.

And how could you tell if they were using food stamps anyway? They aren't stamps anymore...They look just like debit cards... Did you grab the card out of their hand and look...Or... what?

All I can say is, if you are really that stuck on appearances, you are missing out on a lot of great people.


I wonder if you think you can tell an illegal alien just by looking, too. Tell me, which one is the illegal alien?



Don't judge a book by it's cover, friend.


Vote Truth_2012



posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 09:50 PM
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reply to post by MidnightTide
 


The reality is that the victors of war get to call the shots. The early American forefathers and Congresses kindly and dutifully signed legally-binding TREATISES, most often with a monetary sum exchanged for the land, such as the Gabsden Purchase. These are LEGAL agreements between countries to determine borders. So, NO, Arizona does not belong to Mexico in any shape, way, or form, but I know for a fact that the communist funded Mehta group and their underlings push that (and other) propaganda all throughout the Mexican AND AMERICAN (in special Latino cultural clubs) school systems.

Ultimately, the Native American Indians (as wonderful as they are and I revere them most highly), were not the first people on this land but they won out. Before them, another form of humanoid ruled supreme. All these "we were here first" arguments are worthless. In this reality in which we live in, the United States of America is a sovereign nation and its rules deserve to be upheld.
edit on 25-6-2012 by twoandthree because: added Mehta



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