I don't have a horse in this race. With that said. Edwards won on substance, bringing up several things in the Bush/Cheney closet. Cheney won, as far as appearing more level headed. Edwards tried hard to get him riled, and Cheney didn't bite for the most part.

Edwards came across too eager, to just score points. Ignoring the rules, of not addressing the opponent dirrectly. Going back to previous topics too many times etc.. Facial expressions durring Cheney's responses didn't help any, but could have been worse.

Cheney came across as an arrogant stiff. He didn't bother to respond to Edwards two or three times. As if Edwards statements, didn't warrant a response. He also snubbed Edwards at the end. Thanking the moderator, and not Edwards. Hollier then thou, was my overall impression of him.

So I think it will be perceived as a draw overall, or very close to it. I also don't think, it will have any effect on the polls. Neither candidate, or the moderator did great. It was like watching, a high school debate club rehersal.

Tom Sawyer

At last check MSNBC poll had Edwards winning 70% to 30%. Fox News had Edwards winning 50% to 49%. Haven't found the CNN or ABC News poll yet.

Originally posted by slank
Bush and Cheney are incompetent to handle the war on terror.
Bremer- Not enough troops on the ground.
Rumsfeld - No solid evidence linking Saddam with 911.
No WMDs.
The FBI not translating tapes:Since Sept. 11, more than 123,000 hours of audio in languages associated with counterterrorism cases have not been reviewed.

(1) Incompetent? Seems the terrorists would like Kerry to win...Wonder Why?
(2) Enough troops, Like Cheney said, more Americans will not help things, the Iraqis must step up. You live in a dream world. But Maybe more on the 1st day would have been good. Maybe we should talk to Turkey instead of having the troops sit in Kuwaitt.
(3) No evidence of a saddam /911 link. Well to me the verdict is still out. Atta in Prague, AlQeda in Iraq PRE invasion....they have not found the smoking gun...but read the 911 report.
(3) Maybe if Clinton hadnt made it illegal to hire "criminals" as informants, we might have more arabic folks to translate them. It is not as easy as you think. And if you knew how we gather information you would know that we do not have enough manpower in Iraq to translate everything - See Rhyolite Satellites (or the newer gen thereof)

Originally posted by slankBush and Cheney are FAILURES on the war on terrorism.
They have NOT gotten Osama Bin Laden.
They are creating more terrorists in Iraq and creating a sanctuary for them there.

(1) Well no they havent, YET. Then again how can you get a dead man? Have you seen him? Well if he is alive he sure as hell isnt vocal about it!
(2) Well they are comming there to fight, rather the battle of the Bulge be fought there then......Funny how the Radical islamic terrorists cant wait to get to Iraq and fight the Infadels. And yes they are comming and they are dying....lots of them...

Originally posted by slankJohn F. Kerry and John Edwards will keep there focus on ACTUAL terrorists and not be sidetracked going after Daddie's leftover problem.

FOCUS??? With Kerry in the same sentence? HAHAHAHAHAHHAAH Thats funny. YOu can see the bass flipping and flopping.....now ...cant you?

Originally posted by slankJohn F. Kerry and John Edwards will round up nuclear materials in the old Soviet Union in FOUR years, NOT THIRTEEN years.

(1) Well why couldnt Clinton do it in 8 YEARS? What you fail to realize is that the Russians ARE STILL MAKING IT! That makes no sense....We have been doing it for years, LONG before BUSH...

Originally posted by slankJohn F. Kerry and John Edwards will not alienate the ENTIRE world against America.

OF that I could give a crap less, sorry but I dont see anyone looking out for Americans but Americans and the few allies not afraid to make a stand. 30 countries are in Iraq now....you make the contribution they make seem trivial.......Oh wait I get it, the "FRENCH" are not on board. WHO CARES? They wouldnt fight for themselves let alone for others.....

Originally posted by slankI will breathe SO MUCH easier when they occupy the whitehouse.
.

Well it seems you will have 4 years of integestion then cause Bush will win and I Dare do say handily I might add. most of America will think twice in the booth when voting for a Mass. Liberal for CIC........

[edit on 5-10-2004 by edsinger]

[edit on 5-10-2004 by edsinger]

Sorry slip of fingers

[edit on 5-10-2004 by edsinger]

Umm, ed, I think the problem is that the Iraqis are fighting for their freedom....

If Fox says Edwards won, it means Edwards won.

QED.

The real score for Fox to report it 50-49 would have to have been 70-29, creative accounting making up the rest. Maybe it's all just a call to action for the unpatriotic (Bush supporters) to come out in droves on the day in an attempt to stop the evicttion.

Originally posted by edsinger

(3) Maybe if Clinton hadnt made it illegal to hire "criminals" as informants, we might have more arabic folks to translate them. It is not as easy as you think
[edit on 5-10-2004 by edsinger]

What I mean by this is that Clinotn made it illegal to hire informants who had a criminal record, stupid rule for the CIA to follow wouldnt you agree?

Originally posted by American Mad Man
UPDATE:

So far it's 9-4 Cheney, with a handfull of undecided/draws.

If you guys change your minds, let me know - I will add it to the tally.

Add the draw numbers....that appears to be the clear winner!

Originally posted by Nerdling

Originally posted by American Mad Man
UPDATE:

So far it's 9-4 Cheney, with a handfull of undecided/draws.

If you guys change your minds, let me know - I will add it to the tally.

Our poll really means nothing in the grand scheme of things. But...

I'll bite though. Edwards. He was calm, composed and answered everything adequately

Oh, and he didnt have a defibrilator on standby in the back just in case. I think you need to take health into account. Cheney is unreliable.

Agreed on the poll, I am just curious thats all

I disagree - but thats what polls are about - to get everyones opinion

If health is such an issue, then Kerry needs to drop out - he has had cancer, and it could come back

Look,
Though I'm a republican, all of my friends are liberal Democrats. Before each debate I have gotten mass emails from several of these people urging folks to vote, online, for the Democratic candidate NO MATTER what happens.

The bottom line: Democratic activists are flooding these online voting booths and voting en masse... repeatedly. The online tallies are completely meaningless. They only indicate that the Democrats have a lot of college kids logging on to the net, logging off, erasing their cookies, and logging back on to vote three, four, five times.

Cheney castrated edwards tonight. the bloated online poll numbers only reflect greater Democratic spin capabilities.

It was pretty close, but I believe Edwards won the debate.

Originally posted by onlyinmydreams

Cheney castrated edwards tonight. the bloated online poll numbers only reflect greater Democratic spin capabilities.

Now that is the most logical thing I ahve heard in awhile! Of course for a few statements during the thumping Edwards took.


SPIN...no wonder the Demo;s hate O'Reilly!

Updated numbers with undecided votes

Add the draw numbers....that appears to be the clear winner!

Your wish is my command


Cheney: 9 votes

Edwards: 6 votes

Undecided/Draw: 4 votes

NOTE: I did not count people that did not explecitly say which of the three ways they were leaning.

Thus, if someone just wrote a post blasting Bush/Cheney or Kerry/Edwards I did not count that as a vote in the opposite direction, as political views differ from who actually won the debate. For example, I am a republican, yet concede that Kerry won the first debate.

I believe Cheney gunned down Edwards in the debate.

I got an image of a big battleship gun firing at someone holding a little peashooter. I especially thought it was a big salvo coming at Edwards when he was described as a gone Senator that missed most votes in the Senate. Cheney even stated that he has met most senators and he is present on most Tuesdays on the Senate floor but tonight was the first time he has actually met Edwards. I believe Edwards home state of NC will most likely vote for Bush and Cheney, they should know Edwards better than most.

Personally, I thought Cheney chewed up Edwards, and spit him out. Cheney deserves props for not making the debate personal... he stuck to the issues whenever possible. He didn't take Edwards' bait to talk about his daughter, and he didn't even take the moderator's bait to talk about Edwards' career as a trial lawyer.

Originally posted by edsinger
I ahd a thread that was deleted DURING the debate, and then waited to post one and now it is closed?

There was a monopoly on debate discussion tonight. It's the first time I have seen thread quashed because the same subject was on ATSNN. There wasn't even an explanation.

I vote for Cheney. Cheney was one smooth operator and debated with the utmost dignity--a trait foreign to the Democrats.

[edit on 04/10/6 by GradyPhilpott]

Originally posted by MaskedAvatar
Maybe it's all just a call to action for the unpatriotic (Bush supporters) to come out in droves on the day in an attempt to stop the evicttion.

No wonder you wear a mask. The Bush supporters are unpatriotic? Has it escaped your attention that the Democratic candidate is a traitor? Please, give us a break. I'm falling out of my chair.

Originally posted by orionthehunter
I believe Cheney gunned down Edwards in the debate.
I believe Edwards home state of NC will most likely vote for Bush and Cheney, they should know Edwards better than most.

Why not Tennessee knew better huh?

Funny when you drive into Tenn, there is a sign that says

"Welcome to Tennessee, home of Al Gore, Home of 11 electoral votes for G.W. Bush!"

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
Has it escaped your attention that the Democratic candidate is a traitor?

Well stated! I often wonder how folks can not recognize this, but then again Clinton was elected as a draft DODGER. Makes you wonder about the general intelligence of the American people doesnt it?