No more worship of the troops

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posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 07:57 AM
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reply to post by ValentineWiggin
 


Sounds like the guy was being a douche. I'm a veteran of 8 years and two foreign conflicts so I would say the exact same thing to him you did if I were in your shoes.

And to all you people who are acting like Military service is something to be ashamed of, keep in mind that its a job that nobody WANTS to do, but somebody HAS to do. Every single civilization in histoy has had to have someone that stands on the walls so to speak. "Speak softly and carry a big stick" is one of the wisest quotes from Roosevelt I've ever heard. I just wish the U.S. government would speak softer, but it would be really bad to do away with the big stick.




posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:01 AM
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reply to post by petrus4
 


Look, there is nothing wrong with honoring people who believe they are doing the right thing. Just like I honor the religion of my mother (Christianity) even though i disagree with it.

If people want to take your disagreement with them as an attack, then that is a psychological issue that they have to work through. Disagreement is not hate.

Maybe not understanding THAT point is what causes so much war?



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:04 AM
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Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by petrus4
 


Maybe not understanding THAT point is what causes so much war?


You seem to have an unusually strong desire for unity among people. That is a positive thing.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:05 AM
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reply to post by petrus4
 


Because disunity is an illusion thrust on us by greedy and sociopathic people.

All truly is one. And I don't mean in some mystical, hokey sort of way.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:06 AM
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Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
So you tried to STOP war by WAGING war?
If firemen used that same philosophy, every house on the block would be ashes by now.

World War II ... the Hitler take over was stopped when people waged war against him. And as for the firemen .... ever hear of a fire-break or a back fire? Go look it up.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:08 AM
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reply to post by michaelbrux
 


Anyone who joins a national army is either a moron, desperate or a psychopath. I do not "support the troops" they made the decision to join the army, their job is to kill people and be killed, deal with it.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:08 AM
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reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan
 

The house wouldn't burn if prevention had been effectively pursued but the fire fighter is necessary once it starts,especially if an arsonist has hit that house.I can do circular arguments with the best of them.
In the world corruption is now being exposed for what it is but the new kids are going after the most obvious targets oblivious to the cause.You now, as we speak, stand side by side with a person who wants you and I PUNISHED for the sins of our leadership.They are acting with fascist glee against us AND the world and all you can see is me and my uniform.All you can do is call ME the monster.You'd better pray this monster is still around if ANY of the myriad of conspiracies we read about on this board come true as apparently you are defenseless and evidently as well you will receive zero support from friends like this boy from Australia.
This constant blatant BS is inconsistant with our traditions and values anyway,which are also under attack,We'll be seeing the swing back to these soon.And we can lose the central banking system,I'll shed no tears for it. Only then will we succeed.Otherwise you'll bicker us on down the road to oblivion by obstruction and division and hand victory to these a##hats that want everything include you under thumb.I'll have none of that.
We also have learned more than you about dogmatic separation of faith and god.When a bullet whizzes by you that can happen.Need I remind you they want to destroy Homosexuality in general unless you are stupid enough to think AIDs isn't artificial?They refuse to let them marry,I haven't got a problem with that.They blatantly have blamed ALL of islam for the acts of a precious few.True hard core Christianity forbids such judgement. Americans are learning to live with each other in whole new ways.But not the leadership,not the banks.There are the "Arsonists" I spoke of.It's YOUR job to fix it, now get busy or we will all fail.
edit on 24-6-2012 by cavtrooper7 because: mispell
edit on 24-6-2012 by cavtrooper7 because: Finished my point



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:18 AM
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Originally posted by Peruvianmonk
reply to post by michaelbrux
 


Anyone who joins a national army is either a moron, desperate or a psychopath.


Niiiice. I'll take, "What is a patronising prig" for 200 Alex.



I do not "support the troops" they made the decision to join the army, their job is to kill people and be killed, deal with it.


Okay. You don't have to.

Though I find it amusing that I see countless "hate the troops" threads and very few "Worship me, I am a soldier" threads.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:23 AM
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reply to post by beezzer
 


I don't hate the troops, but i'm not going to act like I owe them anything, because I don't.

I agree it is not the troops in the whole pushing this "support the troops" bid but those in and around them and the politicians and celebrities who jump on board for publicity's sake. An example in the UK is Help for Heroes. Fair enough they are raising money for troops injured etc, good for them. However they don't seem to spare any thoughts (or money) for those on the receiving end of these troops.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:25 AM
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Originally posted by cavtrooper7
as apparently you are defenseless and evidently as well you will receive zero support from friends like this boy from Australia.


You know...it might honestly help the cause of some of you, if you weren't such complete living, breathing, walking stereotypes. Calling me, "boy." Who are you...Colonel Quaritch?

Seriously. I can only shake my head in disbelief. This sort of thing makes me wonder which came first; the war movie cliches, or the soldiers themselves.
edit on 24-6-2012 by petrus4 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:32 AM
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I did mean what I said earlier, however, about feeling genuinely ashamed of responding to people who are apparently rhetorically and psychologically incapable of defending themselves.

As a result, I will now withdraw.
edit on 24-6-2012 by petrus4 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:39 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


Wildfires are not fought in neighborhoods. You are messing up my metaphor.


The Nazi's were funded by the globalist bankers. The same ones who fund us. It is like we had a slap fight with our right hand versus our left.

Regardless, I am not saying that war isn't sometimes a necessary evil. But since WWII how many soldiers have died? And how many of THOSE wars are justifiable?

Just because you find a nearly century old example of a benefit of war (and even that is disputed) does not mean that war is a good thing.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:41 AM
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reply to post by petrus4
 


Excellent thread, and needed to be said.


Some observations, but first a caveat: I cannot watch videos, so am not commenting on any content in any video in this thread.

I find it interesting to note how quickly this turned into an argument about dis-respecting military personnel, when in fact the title and apparent point is about not worshiping military personnel. And those are two very different things.

Since at least the Vietnam era, the US military has not been used so much to "keep us safe", as the propaganda wants to be the case, but rather as an enforcement arm of the various multinational corps., so as to secure access to "our oil" that happens to be under someone else's country, and so on. Oil is by no means the only example.

Consider that the US military is in a state of constantly being trained to the n-th degree, and able to launch into combat operations pretty much anywhere in the world at a moment's notice. That means the troops are in combat-ready posture all the time.

And you cannot keep troops trained to that level just sitting around doing training exercises... if they aren't used for their primary purpose - waging war - then they tend to go nuts and unit cohesion and discipline starts to degrade. So such troops must be used, and that means a constant or near-constant state of low-level war is necessary. Examine the pattern of use of the US military just since the Vietnam era to see this in action.

Military personnel are in a very tough position at this stage of history... for a soldier (using the generic term "soldier" to cover all branches) to defy an order, it must be pretty clear that said order is illegal. And the legal system in the military has been corrupted to the same degree as civilian law such that it is very difficult to determine at any given instant whether any given order is illegal or not.

Which brings me to the next point: Based on observation, it is apparent that military personnel, both current active and former, believe they have some unique perspective on politics and reality and what is going on in the world, simply due to having been in the military. That is not true. Military personnel that have been in combat have a unique perspective on mortal danger and dealing with that, but that perspective does not grant any unique knowledge about anything else external to each person. So the claims by military personnel that they "know better" about politics and such on a global scale, simply by the fact of being military personnel are not correct.

And in fact, military personnel are likely to have an extremely skewed view of reality when it comes to their job and world politics; working from the "need to know" model. For example, consider the large number of Iraq veterans who believe or believed Saddam had something to do with 9/11. So we as a culture need to let go of this myth that military service provides somebody with a unique ability to know "the truth".

Next point - the trend to refer to anybody that joins the military (or fire or police or EMT for that matter) as a "hero" has cheapened heroism. It is the same as the trend towards giving out "participation medals" for T-ball or something. It reduces the impact of the real heros, of which there are plenty. Just the mere fact of being a soldier, fire-fighter, cop or EMT does not a hero make.

Next point - There is a disturbing trend, I don't pretend to know how large or significant but I've personally seen multiple examples, of military personnel, both current and former, believing they should not be held to the same laws and rules as everybody else, because they have "served the country". Serving the country is fine, and an admirable thing to do. But that loses its luster when people start wanting laws to not apply to them "because I was a Marine" (insert branch of choice... no jab at Marines intended). I often want to ask these folks - "So, you went and risked your life and health to defend our way of life and now you want to throw away our way of life?". VallentineWiggin's story is a case in point (
on how you handled that, btw).

Final point: To join the US military at this particular stage in history means a person is more likely to be used, misused and abused for the profit of multinational corps. You stand a very small chance of actually being used to actually defend our freedom, you are more likely to be used to further restrict it. So if you choose to join the military at this point, do so with your eyes open.

Final final point: It is no surprise or coincidence that the economy is kept such that military service is the best choice available to the not-1% part of the population. That ensures a steady supply of bodies, even if they know the score. Still gotta eat.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:46 AM
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Originally posted by Peruvianmonk
I don't hate the troops, but i'm not going to act like I owe them anything, because I don't.

Says the guy who has freedom to sit on his computer and chat as he wishes - because someone fought for him to be able to have that freedom. Ungrateful much?

reply to post by petrus4
 

.... says the guy who pushes the racist and hate filled Protocols of the Elders of Zion HOAX. :shk:



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:46 AM
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reply to post by cavtrooper7
 


I don't call you or any other person a monster without specific details warranting such a label (there are some soldiers who have disgraced our nation and humanity with their actions, like the Haditha killer). I see soldiers as, on the whole, poor and misguided brainwashed individuals. I don't hate or dislike the soldier. Instead, i appreciate their desire to defend me. However, I don't need your defense. When I do need a defense, I will be part of that defense, not some spectator. When my home is threatened, or the home of my neighbor, I will act. Note that I do not plan to act when our bankers and government are attacked. They are not me, they do not represent me.

The whole discussion about the military is full of emotional attachment (both by people who have served, or those with families serving) and zero sum thinking. Just because I disagree with what you do does not mean i hate you. I have already said that in this very thread.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:47 AM
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I dont want your worship. That's stupid. I do what I believe is right for me and the country. Your opinion of that belief is inconsequential to me as well. I dont need approval, adoration, or "worship". Just ignore me. I wear camo to not be seen anyway.
edit on 24-6-2012 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:48 AM
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Originally posted by michaelbrux
Some of you military bashers need to put your heads on straight.

Fact: Politicians and Lawmakers and by extension the people that elected them are responsible for the wars.

the soldiers that fight in them do what is asked of them and are not capable starting a war;



There is no black and white. There are some wars that need to be fought, and many that don't.

The last war that had any moral basis for being fought was probably the Korean War, and many would argue it was WWII.

The military has to wake up and realize they are not fighting for the American people, but they are just a tool of the globalists, as should have been made evident to everyone by Gulf War II, aka Operation Oil Grab/Operation enrich Haliburton/Operation train up our own fascist brown-shirt army - contractors.

That fact is, the US military is one of the most manipulated and brainwashed organizations on the planet. Their true humanitarian missions are worthy, but if the focus was just this they would have to reduce the size of the military by about 90%.

The US Constitution is set up to have an army of reservists to defend from external and and INTERNAL threats. Anything beyond this is designed to enrich and empower the military-industrial-congressional complex and help the globalists keep humanity in their debt enslavement.

You can say you were young and naive didn't understand all this and when you joined you had honorable intentions - fine. But once you become aware of all the negative issues surrounding the US military - and still remain a part of it - you have no excuse.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:48 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


When? Specific examples? I mean, i will give you WWII (although, like i said, i dispute it). So when since 1945 has someone "died for my freedom"?

And how come i don't feel very free?



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:48 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


Eh? We harking back to World War II when the "troops" had little choice but to fight or go to jail? Don't be a fool.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 08:49 AM
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Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
Just because you find a nearly century old example of a benefit of war (and even that is disputed) does not mean that war is a good thing.

I didn't say it was a good thing. But sometimes, it is necessary.

People who say that war is never needed or that we don't have to be strong, they are just plain wrong. If a thug sees a really big fella on the street ... all beefcake ... he won't pick a fight with him to take his wallet. However, if the thug sees a whimpy dude sniffing daisys and sipping an apple martini, oblivious to what is going on around him , well then that lil' fella is going to get nailed.

Stay pumped up ... you won't get hassled. Common sense.





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