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Freemasonry renounced by hundreds of (Christian) Barbadians

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posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:31 AM
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reply to post by JoshNorton
 


No but you argue with faceless, anonymous internet forum posters? You guys are so quick to dismiss that which would be difficult to argue with, it's laughable.




posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:31 AM
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Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
reply to post by JoshNorton
 



I've had dinner with the top of the pyramid and am quite comfortable with them carrying on as they have been.

I never said anything about their beliefs being "evil" or "wrong"... in fact I believe the Luciferian (not Satanic) perspective is much closer to the truth than the typical Christian indoctrination garbage.
That's fine, but if you're looking for ACTUAL luciferianism, you'd be disappointed looking for it in Freemasonry.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:32 AM
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Originally posted by protocolsoflove
reply to post by JoshNorton
 


No but you argue with faceless, anonymous internet forum posters? You guys are so quick to dismiss that which would be difficult to argue with, it's laughable.
I'm a man of letters. Any jackass with a $500 computer and a cell phone can post a YouTube video. That doesn't make it research.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:36 AM
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Originally posted by JoshNorton
reply to post by protocolsoflove
 


Well, I'll say one thing, that Ronnie Seale is a smart guy wearing a bow-tie when he slurps his soup. Those of us with proper cravats were spilling things left and right.


Haha now you're name dropping with affable nicknames. Like those hollywood types with stars in their eyes. May I also point out, that according to proclaimed masons on this site, your avatar is NOT a masonic sign.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:38 AM
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reply to post by JoshNorton
 



But unfortunately, the philosopher forgets all the laws of equilibrium, and seeks to absorb the Light in a splendor without shadow, and movement in an absolute repose that would be the cessation of life. So long as there shall be a visible light, there will be a shadow proportional to this Light, and whatever is illuminated will cast its cone of shadow.

And that would mesh perfectly with te supposed quote from De La Rive's book:


Yes, Lucifer is God, and unfortunately Adonay is also God. For the eternal law is that there is no light without shade, no beauty without ugliness, no white without black.

Clearly he accepts the nature of duality... but that does not mean he does not prefer one side over the other, because he clearly does as the following except from Morals and Dogma proves... unless you wish to live in denial and dismiss the meaning of these words:


LUCIFER, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning!

Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish Souls? Doubt it not!



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:41 AM
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reply to post by seabag
 

So what? Their opinion means what?

Grand Order of United Scottish Mechanics of the Universe Incorporated? Sounds like an irregular body.

House of Freedom? How sickeningly ironic that a seemingly un-libertarian body would use the name "Freedom" in their name.

Actually the Scottish Rite, is composed of 4 bodies, and the 31st through the 33rd is not referred to as a "Lodge". And if the 31st through the 33rd is considered the upper echelon, then I guess I'm upper echelon. Plus the Scottish Rite only has authority over the Scottish Rite, not any other body to include the Blue Lodge.

I could care less about the skepticism of the Barbadians. That is their opinion.

reply to post by Numbers33four
 

What did they shine on? The article proved nothing so...

reply to post by seabag
 

Which ritual is that?

reply to post by Numbers33four
 

Meh, I'm not really into Lady Gaga.

reply to post by protocolsoflove
 

Well, actually I went on a 10-km walk with my roommate, her friend, and our dog. Most of the day I've been studying as I have a York Rite College meeting here soon, and also running errands.


Originally posted by seabag
Which God?

Depends on the individual person. For me it is the God of the Bible, of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.


Originally posted by seabag
If it isn't the father of Jesus Christ then it would be a false idol....no?

Unless of course you're not Christian then this opinion would mean very little.


Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
And Pike never wrote an edict for the “23 Supreme Councils of the world” hmmm?

No, he didn't. This quote is taken from the Taxil Hoax. It's historically proven.

reply to post by seabag
 

We require our members to have a faith, but we don't define that faith. I am Christian so when I pray or said my oaths it was to our Blessed Redeemer. My Lodge is composed of deists, Christians (of all denominations), Buddhists, Daoists, Jews, Muslims, and Hindus. When we pray, we each pray to the god of our individual faith.

Freemasonry isn't about shoving any beliefs down someone's throat.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder
 

Where in any of those quotes does it say we worship Lucifer? Or that Lucifer is god? In fact, it doesn't. Nowhere does Pike ever say we worship Satan. It's quite a pathetic, childish attempt anti-Masons play.

reply to post by seabag
 

We do not name any specific god because we are supposed to be equal in the Lodge and keep harmony. How can we say we are equal in the Lodge, but then elevate on ideology above another?

I hate pretentious, self-serving "born again's". I find it particularly repugnant that he sits there in Masonic regalia bad mouthing the very institution. Where in Masonry do we speak of being "born again"? Actually we don't say that the works of Freemasonry alone will lead to our salvation. Nowhere in Freemasonry do we preach any salvation. We say that it is hoped that you would enter by being a pious follower of your faith, a virtuous education, and most importantly the blessing of your God. If I live according to my Christian faith, I gain a great deal of knowledge through education/research, and God grants me leave to enter His Kingdom through my very faith is against Christian teachings then we have two different views. How is receiving the blessing of God contrary to Christianity? So as long as I spout off a few "Hallelujahs", "Amen Preacher", "Praise Jesus" and so forth I will enter Heaven, but I won't if it is by the blessing of God? How the # does that work? IMO, the zealot, self-serving "christian" is nothing more than a drone, a mouth piece, who spews out hollow words. How are the lessons of our degrees contrary to Christianity? Blah blah blah, more things taken of out context or fabricated...blah blah blah. I'm a Master ritualist in my Grand Lodge, and I find nothing wrong.

If anything, someone like these two arrogant, self-righteous zealots, would only cement my membership in the Masonic fraternity and further strengthen my resolve that I have been right in all of my decisions.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:42 AM
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reply to post by JoshNorton
 



That's fine, but if you're looking for ACTUAL luciferianism, you'd be disappointed looking for it in Freemasonry.

No... I don't expect to find it in the general body of Freemasonry, I expect to find it at "the top of the pyramid"... the peak which verges into the realm of the Illuminati... and honestly I'm not going to argue this point with you, because I know you're just going to repeat the same old nonsense over and over again about the Weishaupt Illuminati and that it no longer exists, etc etc.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:45 AM
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reply to post by KSigMason
 


"I hate pretentious, self-serving "born again's"."

Sweet, another hate filled freemason whose knowledge, wisdom and power surpasses that of any low life christian! AREN'T FREEMASONS THE REAL "BORN AGAINS"? WEREN'T YOU DEAD AND RAISED?!



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:48 AM
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reply to post by protocolsoflove
 

I'm Christian too my friend.


AREN'T FREEMASONS THE REAL "BORN AGAINS"? WEREN'T YOU DEAD AND RAISED?!

No.

We're not "born again" though. We're not resurrected or brought to life.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:49 AM
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Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
Clearly he accepts the nature of duality... but that does not mean he does not prefer one side over the other, because he clearly does as the following except from Morals and Dogma proves... unless you wish to live in denial and dismiss the meaning of these words:


LUCIFER, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning!

Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish Souls? Doubt it not!
Didn't I just explain it to you? "Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness!" He's laughing at the people who believe that Lucifer has anything to do with Satan.

He continues, at the end of that same chapter, with

It is by His uttered Word that God reveals Himself to us; not alone in the visible and invisible but intellectual creation, but also in our convictions, consciousness, and instincts. Hence it is that certain beliefs are universal. The conviction of all men that God is good led to a belief in a Devil, the fallen Lucifer or Light-bearer, Shaitan the Adversary, Ahriman and Tupho_n, as an attempt to explain the existence of Evil, and make it consistent with the Infinite Power, Wisdom, and Benevolence of God.


And in Chapter 3 he writes

The true name of Satan, the Kabalists say, is that of Yahveh reversed; for Satan is not a black god, but the negation of God. The Devil is the personification of Atheism or Idolatry.

For the Initiates, this is not a Person, but a Force, created for good, but which may serve for evil. It is the instrument of Liberty or Free Will. They represent this Force, which presides over the physical generation, under the mythologic and horned form of the God PAN; thence came the he-goat of the Sabbat, brother of the Ancient Serpent, and the Light-bearer or Phosphor, of which the poets have made the false Lucifer of the legend.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 12:55 AM
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reply to post by KSigMason
 


neither are christians who oppose your occult, twisted views yet you refer to them as born again. why?



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 01:00 AM
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reply to post by seabag

 





What say you? Are the Christians in Barbados (and other parts of the world) justified in their skepticism of masonry?



I have just recently looked into joining a lodge and found that it was not my cup of tea. You are required to believe in some sort of deity and I do not do believing. As far as I know christians do, so they can join.

You can't go wrong being skeptic, though. So yes, they are right.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 01:03 AM
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Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
I expect to find it at "the top of the pyramid"... the peak which verges into the realm of the Illuminati... and honestly I'm not going to argue this point with you, because I know you're just going to repeat the same old nonsense over and over again about the Weishaupt Illuminati and that it no longer exists, etc etc.
Well, you've learned something


The thing most people don't understand is, there's isn't one pyramid, so there isn't one top. The Grand Master of the Grand Lodge of New York doesn't answer to anyone above him. He serves his one year in his elected office, then steps down for the next guy who's elected next year.

Each state has its own grand lodge, and they're all independent of each other. There's no governing body over all of them.

The Scottish Rite doesn't have any power over Blue Lodges. And the head of the Scottish Rite Southern Jurisdiction doesn't have any power over the Scottish Rite Northern Jurisdiction, or any other Scottish Rite body elsewhere in the world.

People imagine there are puppetmasters. There can't be. It doesn't work like that.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 01:11 AM
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reply to post by JoshNorton
 


The same can be said about our 3 branches of government yet evil terrible crap still happens all the time.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 01:56 AM
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wrong thread im an idiot
edit on 24-6-2012 by luvhet because: wrong thread too many tabs open



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 03:57 AM
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Originally posted by KSigMason

 For me it is the God of the Bible, of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

We require our members to have a faith, but we don't define that faith.  I am Christian so when I pray or said my oaths it was to our Blessed Redeemer.  My Lodge is composed of deists, Christians (of all denominations), Buddhists, Daoists, Jews, Muslims, and Hindus.  When we pray, we each pray to the god of our individual faith.


"Consider the people of Israel: Do not those who eat the sacrifices participate in the altar? Do I mean then that a sacrifice offered to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything? No, but the sacrifices of pagans are offered to demons, not to God, and I do not want you to be participants with demons. You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons too; you cannot have a part in both the Lord’s table and the table of demons. Are we trying to arouse the Lord’s jealousy? Are we stronger than he?" 1Corinthians 10:18-22

There are no other 'gods', therefore those other beliefs are doctrines of demons. You know that they not only pray in vain to demons, yet by your very actions and words you acknowledge them as praying to a 'god'. Ye hypocrite!


Freemasonry isn't about shoving any beliefs down someone's throat.


Quite right, and therefore you do absolutely nothing to preach the gospel message to your Freemasonry brethren - you are content that they worship false idols and you have no concern if they ever seek salvation from the ONE who offers it. This very attitude has spoiled the true gospel message as thousands of Freemasons serve as preachers yet preach what they themselves don't believe in.



We do not name any specific god because we are supposed to be equal in the Lodge and keep harmony.  How can we say we are equal in the Lodge, but then elevate on ideology above another?


"You shall have no other Gods" ring a bell? Your statement above clearly demonstrates that you ignore every bit of scripture that the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob commands you to be set-apart. You deny in your very words that the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is the only God of Heaven and Earth. Your very act of acceptance of Freemasonry mocks Our God and every word that He commands you. 


Where in Masonry do we speak of being "born again"?  Actually we don't say that the works of Freemasonry alone will lead to our salvation.  Nowhere in Freemasonry do we preach any salvation.  We say that it is hoped that you would enter by being a pious follower of your faith, a virtuous education, and most importantly the blessing of your God.


"Salvation is found in no one else, for THERE IS NO OTHER NAME UNDER HEAVEN GIVEN TO MEN BY WHICH WE MUST BE SAVED."  Acts 4:12

As a supposed Christian, what part of those words, or any words in scripture, do you use to justify your belief that one "would enter by being a pious follower of your faith, a virtuous education, and most importantly the blessing of your God."? There are no other "gods", therefore you subscribe to Freemasonry dogma that has convinced you to deny the very Saviour in favour of it's own religious beliefs. You are content to believe their words and doctrines over what your God tells you. You are content to let them perish by not telling them the truth that there is only One God of Heaven and Earth, and that He is your redeemer through Christ Jesus who is THE way, THE truth and THE life - NOT one of many paths.



I live according to my Christian faith, I gain a great deal of knowledge through education/research, and God grants me leave to enter His Kingdom through my very faith is against Christian teachings then we have two different views.


You've already proven by your very words above that you are not Faithful - how can you consider yourself Fathful if you deny the very words of scripture? Revelation states that those who obey God's commands and who remain faithful to Jesus are the ones who persevere. Where does the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob ever tell you to believe that there are other 'gods' or that there are other paths to salvation? He doesn't, but Freemasonry does. So who are you obeying?


So as long as I spout off a few "Hallelujahs", "Amen Preacher", "Praise Jesus" and so forth I will enter Heaven, but I won't if it is by the blessing of God?  How the # does that work?  IMO, the zealot, self-serving "christian" is nothing more than a drone, a mouth piece, who spews out hollow words.


So a Christian who chooses to obey God and remain faithful to Jesus is now a 'zealot'? You truly have no love for your brothers and sisters in Christ, and therefore prove that you do not have the love of Christ or the Father within you. Your words also prove that Freemasonry speaks blasphemous words against the Most High and makes converts twice the child of Hell.

Speaking to His disciples, His BRETHREN, Jesus said "As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love. If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father’s commands and remain in his love. 1 have told you this so that my joy may be in you and that your joy may be complete. My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends. You are my friends if you do what I command. " John 15:9-14



If anything, someone like these two arrogant, self-righteous zealots, would only cement my membership in the Masonic fraternity and further strengthen my resolve that I have been right in all of my decisions.


And by your very words here, you demonstrate just who you serve - the 'god' of Freemasonry - NOT THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, ISAAC AND JACOB. It is as usual, your choice. You have succumbed to the doctrines of demons and you are clearly comfortable eating at their table. You sir have no love for any person who professes a belief in Jesus unless that person disavows the very One who saved them. You are not willing to be persecuted for the very one you profess to hold faith in, but you are willing to be the persecutor.



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 04:08 AM
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edit on 24-6-2012 by Pinocchio because: pIC WONT POST



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 04:12 AM
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edit on 24-6-2012 by Pinocchio because: Pic Wont Post



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 04:27 AM
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Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
reply to post by JoshNorton
 



I've had dinner with the top of the pyramid and am quite comfortable with them carrying on as they have been.

I never said anything about their beliefs being "evil" or "wrong"... in fact I believe the Luciferian (not Satanic) perspective is much closer to the truth than the typical Christian indoctrination garbage.
That's fine, but if you're looking for ACTUAL luciferianism, you'd be disappointed looking for it in Freemasonry.


In Pike's book he states that...Lucifer is the real God and the bearer of the light whilst the real creator Adonay held Adam and Eve captive in the garden of Eden. He states that Lucifer was good and Adonay was Evil?



posted on Jun, 24 2012 @ 04:36 AM
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Originally posted by KSigMason
reply to post by protocolsoflove
 

I'm Christian too my friend.


AREN'T FREEMASONS THE REAL "BORN AGAINS"? WEREN'T YOU DEAD AND RAISED?!

No.

We're not "born again" though. We're not resurrected or brought to life.


Yes you are with your initiation, thus the use of a noose and a coffin in some lodges. As for the belief in a supreme being it could be anything from Baal,Jesus, Allah, Adonay, or even Lucifer.






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