Gene Kranz's Remarkable Self Incriminating Gaffe, The Storied Ship, " Fraudulent Apollo 13 "

THE PUNCHLINE

Take a listen to the "Houston We Have A Problem" video at 6:55 in. This is where Kranz incriminates himself with his now infamous lines. Kranz says,

" Ok now let's everybody keep cool, we got the LM still attached, the LM spacecraft's good, so if we need to get back home we've got a LM to do a good portion of it with. OK let's make sure we don't do anything that's going to blow our CSM electrical power with the batteries, or that will cause us to lose the main, or the fuel cell number two. OK, we want to keep the O2 and that kind of stuff working, we'd like to have RCS, but we got the command module system, so we're in good shape if we need to get home. Let's solve the problem, but let's not make it any worse by guessing"

"





If you go back to the EECOM tape posted by the OP you will find that Kranz delivers these lines about 15 minutes from the time of the alleged explosion. This is one minute after Lovell's venting comment. Keep in mind Lovell does not say they were venting oxygen. He said they were venting "something", " gaseous substance". He did not say how much, it could have been next to nothing for all anybody knew at the time.

Carefully listen to the EECOM tape, plus.google.com...

You will hear in th background Kranz begin to deliever these lines at a time 15 minutes from the the moment of the alleged explosion. The OP is correct . Kranz has no business saying this. He does not know there is a major problem with the ship now. He does not know what is venting. He does not know if the LM is or is not in good shape. The LM may have been damaged for all he knows. I'll stop there. People should listen to this incriminating recording for themselves. I would argue that the OP here is far too kind. This is enough to indict Kranz right here. He should be brought up on criminal charges. Anything less would be be an injustice. This has gone on quite long enough and I for one won't stand for it.

The OP's points is are excellent. Kranz evidences foreknowledge by making this statement .

The SayonaraJupiter poster made another excellent point that these film makers are probably perpetrators themselves. That would have to be the case. That is the case. The editing of this film is done in such a way as to imply Kranz's comments were time line appropriate. This is true of many books in which this comment of Kranz's is referenced and editied to imply that the statment was made in temporal context. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Yes most certainly, welcome back decisive! You should have waited a bit longer to register though. Its painfully obvious dude. Isn't this one of your aliases from another site? I seem to remember this name for some reason.

While you are here though, mind telling us what it was that finally got you banned? I am very curious.

reply to post by SayonaraJupiter


An important point was missed by the OP SJ. All of these men would have been tested for rubella as a matter of course. As military personnel they would have been tested for rubella outside the context of their astronaut status. The story about needing to test all of the remaining 5 astronauts for rubella the week before the launch ( Lovell, Haise, Mattingly, Young, Swigert) cannot be true. This is the case because as military personnel Lovell, Haise, Young, Swigert would have already been tested. Having already been tested, they would be known to be IgG antibody positive(previously exposed). The official story about the rubella testing cannot be true simply based on the fact that we know all military personnel at that time were routinely tested for rubella. Once positive, always positive. The vast majority of Americans including Lovell , Haise, Swigert, Young became positive as youths and their routine military testing would have reflected that. There would be no need to test them again. The official last minute antibody testing story must be made up. It cannot be true.

NICE CONFIRMATION OF THE OP's POINT ABOUT KRANZ's PREMATURE COMMENTS ABOUT THE LM





View this entire video. Pay very careful attention beginning 43 minutes in. Kranz repeats his point made historically on his part that the key element in understanding the nature of the Apollo 13 problem was when Lovell made the "ventilang something" comment. Here in this video Kranz says it occurred 11 minutes 30 seconds after the alleged explosion. It was closer to 14 minutes after, but that is not a concern here. Kranz states that after the Lovell venting comment, he knew there was a serious problem and time for the LM to be used as a lifeboat. Listen to the EECOM tape again. You will note that clearly this is not true. One minute after Lovell's venting statement Kranz begins with the LM as lifeboat comment. Kranz's statement as quoted above was made by the flight director entirely out of context temporally. Listen and decide for yourself about this critical point.

Listen to Lovell 47 minutes into this video talk about the possiblility of a meteor strike. They decided that this possibility was unlikely but that does not change the point that the LM could have been the source of the problem to begin with. The LM may have been damaged as a result of the Apollo 13 problem whatever it was. The Kranz comment is premature and self incriminating.

52 minutes and 50 seconds into this video Kranz names key players who orchestrated this Apollo 13 theater. Criminals named are Arnie Aldrich, John Aaron and Bill Peters. All of these men were involved as inside players in this criminal activity and should be charged in federal court as appropriate. I have not nearly the patience, nor the sympathy for these criminals as does the OP. The American public deserves justice here. Serious crimes were commited, Kranz, Mattingly, Lovell, Haise, Aldrich, Aaron, Peters should be tried and assuming convicted, spend the rest of their lives in federal prison. Any other punishment would be inappropriately lenient.

Originally posted by Capablanca
Kranz states that after the Lovell venting comment, he knew there was a serious problem and time for the LM to be used as a lifeboat. Listen to the EECOM tape again. You will note that clearly this is not true. One minute after Lovell's venting statement Kranz begins with the LM as lifeboat comment. Kranz's statement as quoted above was made by the flight director entirely out of context temporally. Listen and decide for yourself about this critical point.

It sounds to me like it is exactly true - after Lovell made the comment about venting Krantz started talking about the LM as a lifeboat.

You are evidently confused about what "after" means!

Listen to Lovell 47 minutes into this video talk about the possiblility of a meteor strike. They decided that this possibility was unlikely but that does not change the point that the LM could have been the source of the problem to begin with. The LM may have been damaged as a result of the Apollo 13 problem whatever it was. The Kranz comment is premature and self incriminating.

Bollocks - they had no reason to think the LM was damaged, and plenty of reason to know the SM was damaged - what is incriminating about it at all??

Are you "Decisively" posting under a different name?? 'cos this is just the same nonsense

reply to post by Capablanca


Oh there's no doubt who this is posting. Couldn't even wait a day?



And again: Kranz was reacting in a proper way.

Venting = bad

Thinking of using the LM as a life boat right away was quick thinking on his part. Assume and prepare for the worst, hope for the best. If it had turned out that there was no reason to use the LM as a lifeboat, then no harm done.

reply to post by Capablanca

The official story about the rubella testing cannot be true simply based on the fact that we know all military personnel at that time were routinely tested for rubella.

Wrong:

During the Revolutionary War and the Civil War, measles was one of the principal causes of death among troops. Measles and secondary pneumonias in 1917 led to 48,000 hospitalizations and 1 million lost work days and represented 30 percent of all Army deaths, including combat deaths (44, 137, 138). During 1917 and early 1918, measles and mumps were leading causes of hospitalization and days lost from active service by members of the American Expeditionary Force in Europe (17, 44, 137, 139). During World War II, measles, mumps, rubella, and varicella accounted for over 300,000 hospital admissions or restrictions to quarters (140, 141). Even into the 1970s, measles and rubella caused a substantial number of hospitalizations and lost training time at basic training centers (90).

In 1961, Paul Parkman and his colleagues at WRAIR were codiscoverers of the rubella virus, isolating the virus among trainees at Fort Dix (4, 141). Vaccines to prevent measles, mumps, and rubella were licensed in the United States between 1963 and 1969. The AFEB helped to fund development of an attenuated measles vaccine (142). Indeed, the AFEB represented a major national source of grant funding for military and civilian biomedical researchers from the 1940s to the 1970s (10, 11, 53).

For military trainees, rubella vaccine was adopted first, in 1972, with measles vaccine added in 1980 to immunize those who evaded infection as children (10, 143, 144). Mumps outbreaks were less common than were the other two diseases, so mumps immunization was not uniformly adopted until 1991 (11, 145). A varicella policy of screening and as-needed immunization was also adopted in 1991 (11). The Food and Drug Administration licensed varicella vaccine in 1995. Now that a large proportion of basic trainees enter military service immune to these infections because of childhood immunization, the Services are increasingly testing for antibody and exempting those already immune (11, 146–152).

epirev.oxfordjournals.org...

See also:

www.dtic.mil...

It is a gross oversight on Dr. Berry's part. He should have known the rubella profile of every astronaut well in advance. The "confirmation testing" done 3 days before the launch date is the mark of a pure amateur. It looks to me like a CIA cover story to justify the switcher-oo from Mattingly to Swigert.

Originally posted by SayonaraJupiter
It is a gross oversight on Dr. Berry's part. He should have known the rubella profile of every astronaut well in advance.

Why? Waht was the standard he was required to test to?

I can't find any reference to him being deceased - so perhaps you should lodge a complaint with an appropriate medical authority for incompetence or similar?

The "confirmation testing" done 3 days before the launch date is the mark of a pure amateur. It looks to me like a CIA cover story to justify the switcher-oo from Mattingly to Swigert.

Of course it looks liek that to you!!

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


What about the CIA switcher-oo with CIA Swigert?

John Leonard "Jack" Swigert, Jr., (August 30, 1931 – December 27, 1982)

Before joining NASA, Swigert was a test pilot. After leaving NASA, he was elected to the United States House of Representatives, but died before being sworn in.

In 1982, during his political campaign, Swigert developed a malignant tumor in his right nasal passage. He underwent surgery, but the cancer spread to his bone marrow and lungs. He was hospitalized at Georgetown University Hospital on 19 December, and died of respiratory failure on December 27, eight days before the beginning of his Congressional term.

reply to post by SayonaraJupiter


you mean they switched mattingly to swigert because CIA?

or should i say in your speak "CIA you CIA mean CIA they CIA switched CIA matCIAtingCIAly to swiCIAgert because CIA CIA"

reply to post by Capablanca


An important and illuminating remark made by Edgar Mitchell himself. This can be found in the Edgar Mitchell book "The Way of the Explorer".

The brilliant telemetry on the monitor before me showed all systems working in lovely harmony. Then one of the astronauts reported a strange, muffled "boom" coming from the service module. At the very same instant I saw the system parameters lilt simultaneously before me on the monitor. Then the dials silently fell to minimum levels. Fuel, power, battery, oxygen-all seemed to have fluttered into the vacuum of space. Then came Jack Swigert's voice, saying with stoic control, "Houston, we have a problem." When I looked about the control room everyone seemed to be checking first their wits, then the telemetry. No one had any idea what had happened. Perhaps nothing at all but a loss of telemetry. After checking and double checking the data, however, we all knew it was for real. A grisly tension floated across the room. This wasn't erroneous information flickering through the maze of electronics. No, the data was accurate, and something had gone terribly wrong. Within a few minutes we had identified the problem as an explosion of some sort in the service module. We all knew just how serious this was. Jim Lovell, Jack Swigert, and Fred Haise might not make it back alive. This was a very real possibility. Originally, they were headed for a rugged region of the moon called Fra Mauro, but a lunar landing was now a lost dream. The most we could hope for was getting them home before they depleted something they couldn't live without.

Dr. Edgar Mitchell. The Way of the Explorer, Revised Edition (pp. 49-50).

Those that have read the Apollo 13 voice transcript know this account of Mitchell's cannot possibly be true. The underlying cause of the Apollo 13 problems was not identified as an explosion for quite some time. We also know by way of the accounts given by all of the flight crew present including Eugene Kranz himself that after the Apollo 13 TV show everyone but the flight officers left the mission control center. Edgar Mitchell was not present at the time of the call from Apollo 13 that there was a problem. Edgar Mitchell is lying. This supports the point already made that an effort was made after the Apollo 13 flight to give the impression the nature of the crew's difficulty was understood very shortly after the crew reported they had a problem.

reply to post by DigItLosseJam

Edgar Mitchell was not present at the time of the call from Apollo 13 that there was a problem. Edgar Mitchell is lying.

If you are to last more than another v24 hours, you should re-read the pertinent parts of the thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by DigItLosseJam

Might this be the new alias?

from decisively
to Capablanca
then to DigItLosseJam?

reply to post by Gibborium


Looks pretty much like it doesn't it

Originally posted by choos
reply to post by SayonaraJupiter

 

you mean they switched mattingly to swigert because CIA?

or should i say in your speak "CIA you CIA mean CIA they CIA switched CIA matCIAtingCIAly to swiCIAgert because CIA CIA"

Good. Now you are beginning to understand the real legacy of the Apollo CIA Mythology... it is the productive output of 1960's anti-communist paranoia in the American establishment.

Originally posted by SayonaraJupiter

Good. Now you are beginning to understand the real legacy of the Apollo CIA Mythology... it is the productive output of 1960's anti-communist paranoia in the American establishment.

the CIA organisation will not mean that the technology they had could not get man to the moon. you have yet to find that connection.. how can the CIA automatically make it immediately impossible for man to land on the moon? are they really that incompetent?? im guessing the entire space program is a hoax now because the CIA is involved?? maybe the sun and moon are holograms too since there have been loose CIA connections to NASA??

reply to post by DJW001




My post was more than pertinent. Young and Mitchell both tell the same lie. Do you believe Mitchell was in mission control when the call came that there was a problem? Of course he was not there. Does that mean Apollo 13 was scammed? In all likelihood YES!

reply to post by DigItLosseJam


When, exactly, did "everyone except the flight officers" leave mission control?

reply to post by DigItLosseJam

My post was more than pertinent. Young and Mitchell both tell the same lie. Do you believe Mitchell was in mission control when the call came that there was a problem?

I cannot confirm or falsify Mitchell's memory; I was not there.

Of course he was not there.

Were you there? All we have are conflicting recollections. Even the photographs may have been taken in such a way that some people who were indeed present happened not to be in the shot.

Does that mean Apollo 13 was scammed? In all likelihood YES!

Please explain this Olympian leap to a conclusion. If you have followed this thread, you would know that human memory is highly unreliable. Mitchell was no doubt following the mission very closely, and was aware of every little development as it happened. His memory may have re-written events to make him more centrally involved. That does not mean that the events themselves did not happen, only that his memory of them is not as objective as he honestly believes. He may even be consciously lying in order to sell his book; even if that were the case, it does not mean that the underlying events did not happen.