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Illegal's Get Huge Government IRS Checks - forget the tax REFUND part... Caution: Blood Boiler,

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posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 06:30 PM
reply to post by babybunnies

The 20% sales tax is based upon the assumption that government must continue raising the same amount of revenue they have been for too long. In 1913, when the income tax was imposed, the national debt was hovering around $3 billion dollars. Today, almost one hundred years later, instead of using the new found revenue to pay of the national debt we are currently at an unsustainable $15 trillion national debt and no amount of taxation will ever pay this off without bankrupting us all.

The 20% sales tax proposal is based on the presumption that we must keep expanding government and need the revenue to pay for that continued expansion. There are better options.

posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 06:32 PM

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by frazzle

But with that signature the person is on the hook from then on for potential perjury charges, while without such a signature an employer cannot withhold money from the wages/salary. Correct?

No, you have not signed anything under penalty of perjury and have merely signed a contract allowing your employer to act as a fiat tax collector on your behalf. You are not required to sign any such form, which is why it is called an "allowance certificate" because your signature signifies you are "allowing" the withholding.

The Code of Federal Regulations - which is in pursuance of the law - explains it as such:

The employer is required to request a withholding exemption certificate from each employee, but if the employee fails to furnish such certificate, such employee shall be considered as a single person claiming no withholding exemptions.

The employer is not required to obtain a withholding exemption certificate from each employee, merely required to request one and if you refuse this request, the CFR tells that employer precisely what to do in the event of that refusal and it doesn't instruct them to refuse you employment, nor refuse you pay, simply instructs them to claim you as a single person claiming no withholding exemptions.

If you are not a "taxpayer" subject to this applicable revenue law then it follows you need no exemption from it.

I was getting to that although I wouldn't have explained it as well. I wish you'd do a thread on this subject along with the blood boiling aspect of it.

posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 09:33 PM

Originally posted by The Sword

Because even though some illegals can't speak english, it does not mean that they are stupid or sub-human.

I once saw a caravan of school-buses heading west on I-10. Each one was driven by a Latino, and each one had 2 cars stuffed inside. As I pulled up along the side of them, I looked really hard for welding marks or some kind of clue as to how they pulled it off. I couldn't find anything. Till this day I am baffled. Those guys are freakin geniuses if you ask me.

My point is that people are opportunists by nature. If there's a loophole to be found, it will be.

posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 09:49 PM
Question to those who say not to blame the illegals for what the law allows them to do:

Do you blame this man for what he did?

Ronald Page seemingly had it made when Bank of America unintentionally changed his account status, allowing the 55-year-old man to make unlimited ATM cash overdraft withdrawals.

But ABC News reports that Page, who in reality had only $300 in his checking account, used the accidental loophole to withdraw more than $1.5 million—losing it all on gambling.

And even worse for Page, the U.S. Attorney's Office in Detroit says he is now facing 15 months in prison after pleading guilty to charges of theft of bank funds, $1,543,104 in total between December 1, 2008 and May 31, 2009.

Or is it BOA's fault?

Let's be honest now people......this is not a latino remember.....

posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 10:03 PM
reply to post by HandyDandy

Or is it BOA's fault?

Let's be honest now people......this is not a latino remember.....

Maybe he took his guidance from the man with all the gold in his sachs. How can anybody look at what they do and not realize financial fraud does pay? Guess he just didn't realize the only way he'd get away with it is if he had a bunch of congressmen in his pocket.

posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 10:03 PM
some how if you don't pay taxes and keep all the money you earn, you're unamerican or a socialist.

we have our taxes taken from our work without our consent, and without approving what it will be used for.

there are so many useless things that america pays for that have absolutely no benefit for society as a whole.

on top of that they tell you how much to pay, under threat of prison.

how is that not different than extortion. if you don't pay, you go to prison.

people will fully pay just to keep some dignity. and lie to themselves while thousands of dollars are taken from their hands for only God knows.

posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 10:10 PM
On the note of illegal immigrants getting through US tax loop holes I want to add how universities are giving them a free ride. Who pays for this?

posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 10:19 PM
Nobody, but nobody, is more adept and insidious at discovering, utilizing and abusing the various public services throughout America than immigrants and illegal aliens- along with their off-shore collusion partners. More than a few times I have heard these people tout just how easy it is to scam in America.

posted on Jun, 19 2012 @ 11:47 PM
reply to post by tothetenthpower

So, don't blame people that take advantage of a loop hole even when they know it's wrong?

Sorry, It comes back to personal responsibility to do the right thing. These people obviously have none.

Don't blame the bank robber, blame the guy who fired him from his last job and made him desperate......

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 12:11 AM
I know I’m going to come across as amoral and I guess that would be a right assumption...because I agree it is wrong to lie and steal...

But hypothetically speaking... if I was an illegal immigrant, dirt poor, with starving relatives back home...I’d have no problem taking advantage of that tax code either.

Because imho, I would not be stealing from you or other hard working Americans. I sincerely believe that the money these illegal immigrants are taking would never in a million years be used by the American government to benefit you or any other ‘legal’ American.

The government officials will simply take that extra money and spend it on themselves, funnel it into ‘black’ project or simply waste or lose it. At least if the illegal immigrants are getting the money, we know where it’s going and there’s a greater chance that the money will help those in need.

Like Jean Paul said, the tax system is convoluted and ridiculous and our politician are liars and thieves. I see why people would be annoyed with illegals taking advantage of tax programs. But imho, there’s far more disturbing things going on...for example how much money has ‘disappeared’ from the US budget over the last couple of years?

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 12:35 AM
The majority of the people doing this are not illegals. I would guarantee that many who are on wellfare also do this on a yearly basis. The real question is why is no one doing anything about it when this is blatant fraud.

Every Jan-April is a constant trading of kids SS numbers between people who will gladly pay a percentage of there tax return to the person who "lent" there SS number to them.

Its just like food stamps. Dont need it this month, go sell it on the streets for half the value, which could be anywhere from $100-$300.

There is a very lucrative black market that you all are missing and focusing on a minority of the offenders, either because of this Article or responses in this thread is laughable at best.

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 01:24 AM
reply to post by 1BornPatriot

So is it the loophole that boils your blood, or the immigrants?

I find a lot of this immigrant loophole stuff popping up in the conservative media. Go figure!

Seriously though, whats the real issue here? Loophole or Immigrants?

Does revenue loss from US Corporate loopholes bother you as much?

Did you know US Corporations cost U.S. ~$60-80bil(depending on who ya ask) in lost revenue through tax loopholes? This issues has been known for some time and still has not been fixed. How often do the conservative media like to address this issue? What? They're whining about ~$4 billion when there's $70-80bil going down the drain? Why does this not surprise me?

Also, another issue to consider is how much revenue does Uncle Sam generate from the taxes paid by undocumented immigrants? Well, your answer depends on who you ask. There have been a number of studies. I've read many. Some say the taxes paid by immigrants generate more revenue than they use in social services. The ACLU has with sourced studies sayin more generated in revenue than used. And of course, theres the other side, other studies say they use more in services than they generate in revenue.

But I'll post a little quote from Wikipedia. All sources are cited in the wikipedia article. Look below.
"Most arguments against illegal immigration begin with the premise that the undocumented don't pay income taxes, and that they therefore take more in services than they contribute. However, IRS estimates that about 6 million unauthorized immigrants file individual income tax returns each year.[33] Research reviewed by the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office indicates that between 50 percent and 75 percent of unauthorized immigrants pay federal, state, and local taxes.[33] Illegal immigrants are estimated to pay in about $7 billion per year into Social Security.[34] Most undocumented immigrants pay sales, federal and state income taxes. In addition they also spend millions per year which support US and helps create new jobs. The Texas State Comptroller report in 2006 that the 1.4 million undocumented immigrants in Texas alone added almost $18 billion to the state's budget, and paid $1.2 billion in state services they used.[35]"

And yet another consideration to make; How many undocumented immigrants who use fake greencards actually file tax returns? Answer: Not Many. Most are too afraid to get busted. The IRS cross-references all SSN's with SSA when a tax return is filed. This is in addition to other information such as names, addresses, dependants etc etc. Not too many fakes slip through their system these days. So thats a lot of $$ in payroll taxes not given returns.

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 01:31 AM

Originally posted by be4ne1
Nobody, but nobody, is more adept and insidious at discovering, utilizing and abusing the various public services throughout America than immigrants and illegal aliens- along with their off-shore collusion partners. More than a few times I have heard these people tout just how easy it is to scam in America.

You mean more insidious than Corporate America? hah!

Please refer to my post about US Corporations using tax loopholes to skirt the system to revenue loss of $60-80 billion.

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 02:08 AM
i have a few guys i work with who told me what they do is get a TIN number for someone in there family in Mexico and claim them that way and that is how they get so much back at the end of the year

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 02:11 AM
Illegal bashers, always need a scapegoat. Sorry but I know a lot of people who aren't illegal who will line up at a certain tax ladies business and will wait hours on end because she does taxes, "the best and gets you a lot of money. I don't know what she does but she does something to get you a lot of money." Sorry but illegals and legals are taking advantage.

This country and most of it's citizens are tards who don't give a damn about anyone but themselves. I bet half the people here complaining get their taxes done by some unscrupulous character just to make out with a couple extra hundred or thousand dollars. What about all the corporations who DON'T pay taxes?

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 02:51 AM

If your knowledge expands to the point that you realize you have no clue as to how it was you became a "taxpayer" and have no clue whether you are a "taxpayer" or not, then by signing under penalty of perjury that all of the above is true and correct to the best of your knowledge would be fraudulent since to the best of your knowledge you have no idea whether it is true and correct or not.

As amusing as that is, it really doesn't mean much in reality, does it. What exactly are you suggesting people do? Learn the tax code? By your own admission that's impossible. Refuse to be a part of the vast joke that is income tax? As much as people would like to believe otherwise, taxes are necessary.

Imo the entire system should be scrapped and rewritten. Of course, that won't happen until it finally collapses under it's own bloated weight. Who knows when that will occur.

Regardless, it doesn't negate the issue brought forth by the OP. So in your opinion, if people don't understand the system, they are not allowed to be outraged, angry or confused? They are not allowed to have an opinion or comment? Yes, that's a great idea. If we can't understand all of it, if we can't fix it all, ignore it all.

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 03:10 AM

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by tothetenthpower

Again, blame the IRS, who enable this to occur. They are allowing other people to steal from you.

The entire "income" tax has always been a wealth redistribution scheme. Legal plunder is still theft. As long as wealth redistribution remains a function of the federal government it is pointless to complain that certain people are the beneficiaries of this plunder.

You cannot be in favor of plunder and against it too, anymore than you can eat your cake and have it too.

Everything a government does is wealth redistribution.
Military? Take taxpayer money, redistribute among soldiers
Providing a court? Take taxpayer money, redistribute among judges
Even if they were selling fruitcakes instead of collecting taxes, they would still be redistributing wealth from the fruitcakeeaters to public servants.

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 03:22 AM
We have a saying in Turkish (and I've been seen to say this on these forums a lot recently) and it goes like this:

"When a fish starts to rot, it starts from the head."

Ponder on that for a moment.

No? If you haven't gotten it already, let me just start by saying that if the people at the very top weren't stealing, the ones on the bottom wouldn't be either

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 03:53 AM
I'll just say that I've always found the term "Illegals" so distasteful, it's almost amusing; as if their very existence is an affront to justice. I'll stand by and proudly work alongside any man or woman willing to stand and work alongside me. I don't give a damn where you came from or where you are going, as long as you are good and kind of heart, I'm proud to call you my neighbor and fellow, come sit at my table and let us break bread together.

Borders are just imaginary divisions that keep us from being truly united as One species, I care not for them. This may sound lofty and optimistic to you, and it is. They say you should dress for the job you want, not the job you have, this is the same concept, I am actively creating the reality I speak of for my future paradigm.

posted on Jun, 20 2012 @ 04:10 AM
reply to post by rtyfx

My goodness, this site just gets worse every day with such nonsense.

I feel like I'm looking at a right-wing talking points forum, not ATS.

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