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Originally posted by FractalChaos13242017
Ahhh I love this link! lol sorry... may just be me.
The Number 12 Looks Just Like You, Numerology?
Ahhh 12 fold...edit on 16-6-2012 by FractalChaos13242017 because: additional comment
Originally posted by yourmaker
The universe always has, and always will exist. forever. always eternal, in existance.
The lifeforms, and inorganic matter will always continue to evolve and eventually dissolve.
Originally posted by stirling
What is the universe expanding INTO?
There must be space outside of the universe which it expands into....
Originally posted by stirling
....or does the universe keep creating even more space as it keeps exploding outwards from the big bang
The expansion is an expansion of space itself. It doesnt expand into anything, it itself is expanding.
Thats basically it, yes.
Like if you glue a bunch of pennies to a balloon and blow up the balloon. The pennies don't get any bigger. Only the balloon does. Gravity is also what holds the planet itself together.
Some calculations show the solar system has moved a super small amount away from the Sun due to the expansion but it's not really measurable yet.
However, some believe that eventually the expansion could speed up enough that it would overtake the force of "large" gravity causing the solar system to move away from the Sun. Except it wouldn't really be moving. It's in the same spot.
The space between the Earth and the Sun would just be expanding faster than gravity can cancel it out. This would be like if the pennies actually starting getting bigger until they fell apart.
Now to the thermodynamics question and adding energy to the Earth? Wouldn't this violate the laws of thermodynamics? Actually no, because the Earth wouldn't actually be moving. It'd be stuck in the same exact spot.
It's the space between the Earth and the Sun that would actually be growing larger. And since space has no mass, the energy required could be explain by something like a quantum foam or zero point energy or whatever. Take your pick here.
Then long long after even that the expansion could become so fast that the space between atoms and sub-atomic particles expands enough that even they can't hold together anymore. And all matter would just fall apart and you'd just have empty space really.
The better explanation I've seen is to draw a bunch of dots on a balloon with a marker. The dots grow at the same ratio as the rest of the balloon. Which is more in line with the theory.
So... where do the calculations come from if this can't be measured?
So, if they aren't really moving... aren't really getting farther apart... then why would gravity or subatomic forces behave any differently?
What does quantum foam or zero point energy have to do with space expanding between two objects (without really expanding?)
How do subatomic particles get driven apart?
How does space arbitrarily expand without a force or force carrier?
Or... perhaps more importantly.... what the hell is space?
Some computer model that might be complete BS. You can measure the expansion between two galaxies. They move away from each other faster than planets move away from their suns. They're far enough away from each other that the expansion can be measured.
Because they are getting farther apart. They just aren't moving, but yet they still end up farther apart. Strange.
Anyway the space between them expands and literally grows larger.
Both objects are in the same space, but now there's more space between the two objects.
The more space between you and another object the less effect gravity has on you. So there should be less potential energy between them. Losing energy wouldn't violate thermodynamics.
Nobody knows where the energy to make space expands come from. They call it dark energy, which really means, we have no idea.
The point is that since space has no mass it takes far less energy to make it expand then it would say a planet.
But where that energy comes from, no one knows. I was just saying until they figure it out, everyone gets to make their own guess I guess
What happens to an individual particle I have no idea. But the idea is that each particle gets farther and farther away from other particles (somehow without moving).
They claim there is a force. They just don't know what the force is. They refer to it as dark energy. But nobody claims that it happens with no energy or force behind it.
I don't know, it's just empty space.
According to the people that came up with this theory. There is nothing beyond the universe. The universe is infinite. Goes on and on forever and you never get to an edge. There is no edge.
When it expands it expands into itself. Every place in space is expanding.
Some people thought the galaxies were moving away from each other, but that doesn't appear to be the case. Imagine if I'm moving away from something in front of me. That means I would be moving towards what's behind me. But that's not what you see with galaxies.
When they look at the galaxies they see the middle galaxy getting farther away from the one in front of it AND the one behind it. There's just some how more space between the two. Somehow a galaxy in the center of a whole bunch of galaxies can somehow move away from all of them at the same time without getting closer to other ones. It just looks like there's more space.
In quantum mechanics, the wavelengths of emission or absorption lines in spectral series are proportional to the inverse fourth power of the unit electrical charge If electrical charge in a given region of space is different than locally then we should expect to see all of the spectral elements from that region to be shifted in a systematic manner. (The fine-structure constant, which is proportional to the fourth power of the unit electrical charge, may also come into play here. This is because the internal spacing of individual lines within spectral multiplets is proportional to the fine structure constant.) An observed set of redshifted lines thus becomes an indirect measure of the ambient ... matter density in the source's region of space. [The word local was replaced by ambient on 14 Apr 2007.] (See the redshift derivation in Figure 4.)
And like I said nobody said it didn't take energy. It does take energy.
As for the dark energy thing, and dark matter as well. That's scientists for you. I guess they get to get away with things religious people don't. I guess it's okay when they do it right?
Then what's beyond the hazy depths of the edge of the visible universe? From their position... what is beyond the edge of their visible universe (along the same vector)?
Unless what is behind you is moving.
According to the theory - we're still debris in an explosion of epic proportions. Why is the observation of many galaxies moving away from each other shocking?
Of course - one must wonder what the collision with Andromeda in something like 4 billion years says about the idea that everything is so universally moving away from everything else.
No. Because it's not science at that point.
According to modern day thinking? More space that's also expanding lol.
That's what I said. Andromeda is blue shifted meaning it's getting closer.
But they say that Andromeda is close enough for gravity to cancel the expansion.
That's not what you would see from a universal explosion. After all, the big bang had no center point. The entire infinite universe banged all over at the same time.
The reason they claim this is because they need space to be expanding to explain some things.
How things appear to have moved faster than the speed of light.
Why they're speeding up. Particles from an explosion in space either slow down due to gravity, or stay the same speed due to inertia.
But the galaxies that are moving away from us are getting faster.
They also need this to explain why the gravity of all the matter hasn't contracted back to a single point.
If that's not true you better get on em lol.