Humanity escapes the solar system: Voyager 1 signals that it has reached the edge of interstellar sp, page 11

reply to post by Zcustosmorum

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This can hardly be considered an achievement at all. It's more like an interesting phenomena, like the northern lights. It's cool that it is happening, but there is no significance of it happening other than being able to say that it happened.

reply to post by SolidGoal

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My point is as follows. SCHOOLS OUT and the children have decended upon ATS..... Billions of tax dollars, you two need to keep re-peating that over & over Billions of dollars wasted in space and space related things. Either of you two, show me and all THE MEANINGFULL DISCOVERIES our space program has brought.

NOTHING< NATHAN> NADA. And that is a fact. If you don't think it is. Prove me wrong and list them all out here. Allmost 1/2 of the STS MIssions were for the Pentagon and secret. That $$$$$$ my friends is'nt put into the budget of NASA for all to see. So I wait, with baited breath for the list of earthshattering discoveries our space agency has brought about pissing my tax dollars away in space. 790 billion dollars, pissed away in space. That is alot of cheddar. sure could fix a few bridges, or roads, or hospitals, or retirement homes or schools. hell you want me to keep going with this? It also could knock a chunk out of that national debt we have.

790 billion with nothing to show for it. Hell that's another bailout right there. When they retired the shuttle program, NASA was asked what has the shuttle program brought us? The answer was" Not much really" Go to CNN archives and watch it for yourself.

Originally posted by openyourmind1262
reply to post by Tsurugi

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So i guess six billion is ok to piss away in space, with zero to show for it. You did a good job of showing where the $$$$ went, what about all the earth shattering "breakthroughs" in anything space related. Yea I have a problem with NASA, just as I have a problem with any "con-man" or con agency in this case.

NASA is a waste of our tax dollars. It was when it was created, it still is now. A $$$$ funnel. Millions of tax dollars hurling thru space, hell yea that makes sense. In the mean time here on earth, veterans sleeping under bridges, homeless people everywhere, Fukashima melting down and contaminateing the world, violence in the middles east., Infrastructure crumbleing at our feet, I could go on & on & on. But let's piss the $$$$ away in space and on space programs. Sure as hell makes perfect sense to YOU.

Erm. Did you even read my post?

• I did not defend NASA. In fact, I said that it is a government agency and governments have long proven to be good only at two things: getting bigger and screwing things up. I also mentioned that I would welcome private industry endeavors into space as opposed to NASA.
  
• I did not imply that I was going to give a run-down of "where all the money went," so your sarcasm about how I did a "good job" on that is quite entertaining.
  
• I did not imply that I was going to enumerate any "earth shattering breakthroughs" from NASA either.
  
• I did not say 6 billion or any other amount is "ok to piss away in space."
  

What I actually said in my post was that you were flinging around this "trillions and trillions" BS about NASA's expenditures, when the actual amount is 790 billion since it's founding in 1958.

So again, I wasn't defending NASA. I was deconstructing your disinformation.

I do find it interesting that your reply used "billions" and "millions" instead of the previous "trillions," which seems like a tacit agreement with my original point, and yet you spend the whole post snarking about things I didn't say. U mad bro?

PS: The sentence about veterans under bridges and homeless gave me the sniffles.

reply to post by intrptr

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Ok, I'll try this once again.

Yes, Voyager's power source is radioactive. It radiates both heavy and light particles. But space, especially interstellar space, is full of radiated heavy and light particles from sources much more energetic than a plutonium isotope. Any alien not dying from those will not die from Voyager--i.e. they will have shielding, or they will be immune.

Furthermore, anyone(human or alien) that came across an unknown and possibly derelict spacecraft would not just "bring it into their ship" without finding out everything they could about it first from a distance using whatever instruments they had. Spacecraft are expected to have power plants of some kind, and any type of respectable power source is basically a controlled channeling of something very dangerous. A derelict craft would be checked over very carefully by anyone with any sense before they even got close to it, much less brought it into their ship.

An advanced race might snicker at the low tech of Voyager's systems and it's ball of plutonium, but I doubt they would shriek in horror at how unbelievably "toxic" it is, seeing as how the stuff sleeting all around their ship all the time in interstellar space is much, much more potent. Also because most likely whatever is powering their ship would be a zillion times more dangerous(and thus a better source of power).

And finally, any alien that takes a bite of the plutonium deserves what he gets.

Originally posted by openyourmind1262
Either of you two, show me and all THE MEANINGFULL DISCOVERIES our space program has brought.

"Meaningfull" is relative. What might be meaningful to you might not be to some one else, but here are some sources on NASA spinoffs.

spinoff.nasa.gov...
Top 20 new NASA spinoff technologies
10 NASA Inventions You Might Use Every Day
How we have benefited from NASA's 50 years
NASA Spin-off technologies wiki

Allmost 1/2 of the STS MIssions were for the Pentagon and secret.

No they were not. Their was a total of 10 STS missions done by the DoD. 7 of those were classified, 1 partly classified and 2 unclassified. Their were a total of 135 STS flights. That's no where near half.

That $$$$$$ my friends is'nt put into the budget of NASA for all to see.

Nothing in NASA's budget is classified. They are a public agency and their full budget is made available to the public. The DoD, however, has their own space program that has its own budget which is not fully disclosed to the public.

790 billion dollars, pissed away in space. That is alot of cheddar. sure could fix a few bridges, or roads, or hospitals, or retirement homes or schools. hell you want me to keep going with this? It also could knock a chunk out of that national debt we have.

$790 billion over 54 years. Meanwhile the US spends about $700 billion on defense annually. During the height of the Iraq war. The US Military was spending the equivalent of NASA's annual budget every two weeks!

reply to post by Tsurugi

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Actually young man it's way more tha 790 billion. All STS MIssions that were for the Pentagon And Department of defence, were classified, therefore the cost is'nt in the budget, and If you go to NASA's little site and reserach the STS missions, about a third to half were classified. So the over all $$$$$$ is way more than 790 billion. And you act is if it's wrong for someone ( me) to dislike the fact my & your tax dollars are being wasted on space related crap.

Nasa comes out and say's Voyager 1 is leaving heading into interstellar space. WOW, how does it benefeit mankind? It don't. At all. Nothing. Zilch. And for the record, humanity aint escaped anything, a extremley expensive spacecraft has. Even if you beleive that, which I don't. As I have allready stated.

Homeless folks at all time high, infrastrucrure crumbleing, schools at the bottom all over the nation, wars, occupations, un-employment at all time high, Most Americans can't afford insurance, Yea, sure wished we had used that 790+ billion to handle a few of these, (terra firma problems) No, we have space to conquer.

Young man, they want you looking up. It keeps your mind off all the things in the above paragraph. And it does it all to well.

reply to post by jra

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Spin off technology. So we really did'nt need to go into space for these tech's . Did we? Now where's the state of NASA at the present time? I beleive you could go take a tour of Kennedy Space center, because that's all they got to show for all that $$$$$ wasted. A Shuttle museum, and a tour. All for the rock bottom price of 790+ billion. and yea, they gonna makke you pay for the tour. God Speed Space Cadet's. Im out. Sarcasm, it really does work.

reply to post by Tsurugi

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But ATS is purportedly about denying ignorance(that is the site motto, isn't it?) and you are engaging in an emotionally charged campaign of propagating ignorance in the form of misinformation.

I'll try again too.

But space, especially interstellar space, is full of radiated heavy and light particles from sources much more energetic than a plutonium isotope.

Yah, a long ways away sources, Plutonium contamination is like swallowing an X-ray machine.

There is a big difference between a sun and radioactive contamination. The latter is a source. Whereas a radioactive element or particle of radioactive contamination sits inside your body bombarding nearby cells again and again with ionizing radiation. Its like swallowing an X-ray machine that cannot be turned off. Way more dangerous. Once ingested, it only takes a millionth of a gram to give you cancer. You see the difference now? Between far off sources (like a sun) and internal sources (like some decay dust from a rotting freaking nuclear battery?)

My experience with technology don't mean I understand word one about alien technology. They aren't Gods. They are people just like us (with neater toys). Look at it like this. Fighter Pilots in their cockpit may not know everything about the metallurgy in the aircraft or the design engineering in their onboard computers, etc. They are trained to use these things but don't know all the details of how they work inside. They don't have to. Pilots are specialized.

Interstellar ACME garbage men or archeologists know even less. Did Egyptologists check for radioactivity before opening tombs? Aliens know even less about our stuff is my guess. And what symbol would you put on the craft to warn them? There are hieroglyphs and a Laser disk about us, but what about them?

Useless argument anyway. All our outward bound space probe envoys are radioactive. Some have blown up on launch, some litter the moon and mars. Good start for exploration. Poor example.

But you are probably right. They already know how hypocritical, dangerous and toxic we are. I bet that is why they avoid us. On the front of their earth manuals it probably says, keep your distance from the locals, they carry guns and will dissect you.

reply to post by openyourmind1262

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My point is as follows. SCHOOLS OUT and the children have decended upon ATS.

Really ? You think I am a children that is still in school ? How cute of you.

Sorry friend, but you are the one who sound like a children. Billions, trillions (can't even get your figures straight), ad hominem fallacy's, insults, aggressiveness, etc...Bravo, really showing your true colors.

Billions of tax dollars, you two need to keep re-peating that over & over Billions of dollars wasted in space and space related things.

Hum... what did I repeated over and over ?
Can you quote me ? Of course not.
You are obviously mistaking me with another user.

If you are pissed that your govt is spending all your tax $$$, why don't you take it on the banks bailout and the defense budget for starters ? (Rhetorical question BTW as it would be considered off-topic here)
You need some serious perspective. Otherwise your agenda is too obvious.

No hard feelings...

reply to post by SolidGoal

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No , I'm simply saying you are acting like a child. And to be a grammar nazi. It's child not children. And now I understand your not American, how sweet. Your country have a space program? Probally not, so. Let me type this correct for you. 790 billion dollars is alot of cash that could be used for a much better purpose. IMHO. I am out of you guys thread, as in it does no good to try and get the point across to someone who is obviously enamered with NASA. God Speed Space Cadets. 790 billion, 790billion, keep saying it, if you say it enough it lowers the amount. Pun Intended.

reply to post by openyourmind1262

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I wouldn't know if you consider it meaningful, but micro-sized porcelain bubbles, when added to paint, acts like 7 inches of insulation, in 1 coat. That's retro-engineering from the shuttle's tiles. A good half of the higher-tech portable water filtration is tied in. The complexity of modern cars is rooted in shuttle technology.

but then, Wiki has many I can't think of off the top of my head:
Here.

reply to post by shadowland8

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My guess would be using sophisticated technology, that is able to view the Milky Way in multiple wavelengths. Peering through the galactic dust and giving us a better understanding of the structure.

reply to post by knightwhosaysnih

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I love your post - mobile phones drop out and people are calling each other over a short distance. You are awesome and have made me very happy by giving my intellect a boost of energy!! Thank you.

Much Peace...

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