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The Coming Collapse of Canadian Banks and the Canadian Economy

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posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 11:40 PM
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reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 


u know ,,we knew that G20 didn't really cost 33 Billion,,
but it sure makes for a lot of Reciepts.





posted on Jun, 15 2012 @ 01:42 PM
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Originally posted by starwarsisreal
reply to post by lordvader
 


so in addition to illegal Mexicans we Americans should expect illegal Canadians?


What makes you think we would jump out of one sinking ship into a bigger equally sinking ship?



posted on Jun, 15 2012 @ 02:15 PM
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Originally posted by CrikeyMagnet

Originally posted by starwarsisreal
reply to post by lordvader
 


so in addition to illegal Mexicans we Americans should expect illegal Canadians?


What makes you think we would jump out of one sinking ship into a bigger equally sinking ship?


Exactly. Lol.
When canadians get pissed at the banks and government we will forcefully remove them.

Also, Canada is one of the only countries in the world that can fully sustain itself without imports



posted on Jun, 15 2012 @ 03:35 PM
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reply to post by eNaR
 


Whatever EnaR:
I am glad you "worked" at CMHC, you would be the only one of thousands that really did.
Oh, and you still need to get a clue, because if you understood the program undertaken by the feds, you would KNOW that they do not own the debt!
Idiot.



posted on Jun, 15 2012 @ 04:31 PM
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reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 

I have to say Bobby that information piece is the best I have read in a long time,Stephen [Tony Soprano]Harper and Jimmy [Johnny Sac ]Flaherty would be not be impressed with this,but it couldn't have been said any better,as for me with this economic crash coming Im trying to get the contract to build Laureen [Carmela Soprano] Harpers spec house.
cheers from Toronto [little New Jersey]Ontario



posted on Jun, 15 2012 @ 06:29 PM
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Originally posted by Cynic
reply to post by lordvader
 


Complete rubbish.
I have been in the industry for decades and you haven't got a clue what you are talking about.
Debt levels are high, yes. But mortgages are not approved the same way they were in the States.
The Canadian banking system is the envy of the world due to its tightly regulated practices.
You're spouting complete drivel.


Agreed, the OP has no clue what he is on about.



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 01:36 AM
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Originally posted by QUEEQUEG
reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 

I have to say Bobby that information piece is the best I have read in a long time,Stephen [Tony Soprano]Harper and Jimmy [Johnny Sac ]Flaherty would be not be impressed with this,but it couldn't have been said any better,as for me with this economic crash coming Im trying to get the contract to build Laureen [Carmela Soprano] Harpers spec house.
cheers from Toronto [little New Jersey]Ontario


Cheers buddy! I have the misfortune of knowing a few of these MP scumbags and a good friend of mine is Jim Flaherty's cousin, if I could only repeat some of those stories from Flaherty's Whitby days when he had his office on Dundas street LOL. Another friend was one of the videographers for the HRSDC "closed door" scandal hearings. He had some good stuff too, MP's walking around looking under chairs, on the bottoms of their shoes and in folders saying crap like, "hmmm, it's not in here" on video tape, joking around about our corrupt government and their malfeasance of about a billion dollars of taxpayer money. I begged him to give me a copy of the tape, but he said it was too easily traced back to him. I could tell you about the government/bank/university/brokerage 150 million tax and public funds fraud in 1997, oh wait, no I can't, the government put me under a superior court gag order so they wouldn't get caught, oh well, one day maybe.

In this stupid socialist country of Kanadakastan, they know like anywhere else, it's not their money and if it disappears it's irrelevant to them. This is what we get when we accept elective group or area (mis)representation in the government. It's easy to control a few hundred greedy scumbag meat puppets in parliament (or the senate or congress in the US), oops we have a stupid@ss senate here too, it's even easier to control Harper, the zombie on top. If it costs Demarais or the IMF or goldman sucks a 100 million a year to make the @ssclowns in government play their tune, they are still making a billion or more on top of that and they're laughing, because they get to write off the 100 million in, hmmm, lobbying costs? Yeah, we'll call it lobbying costs even though we all know better. The whole e'fing thing disgusts me.

I've been waiting for the banks to fold here but the government props them up, kind of the opposite of JP Morgan artificially holding silver prices down (traditionally silver is 1/14th the gold price). The government bald faced lied to the citizens in Canada on live TV, said that we didn't need a bailout, that our finances were rock solid and in perfect order while at the same time slipping our banks the 75 billion through CHMC (plus there's that other 40 billion they sent them, total was 114 billion I think). They didn't mention that almost 100% of all federal income tax collected goes to servicing the international ponzi scheme debt, through the bloody banks.

It will happen again, this time though when it goes down, it ain't getting back up again. Apparently for a while now, if you're an immigrant you can get mortgage and other loans from banks without income verification, they did this to artificially inflate real estate values, so that bubble is gonna blow. I am predicting infrastructure, utilities and banks will collapse inside of 6 months. It's going to be a cold winter, stock up and invest in rope. Like always say, if a government backs people into a corner and there's no way to go around them, people end going through them. I've been on the CSIS list for years, so I really don't give a sh***t what I say anymore.

Cheers - Dave
edit on 6/16.2012 by bobs_uruncle because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 04:09 AM
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reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 


In this stupid socialist country of Kanadakastan, they know like anywhere else, it's not their money and if it disappears it's irrelevant to them. This is what we get when we accept elective group or area (mis)representation in the government. It's easy to control a few hundred greedy scumbag meat puppets in parliament (or the senate or congress in the US), oops we have a stupid@ss senate here too, it's even easier to control Harper, the zombie on top. If it costs Demarais or the IMF or goldman sucks a 100 million a year to make the @ssclowns in government play their tune, they are still making a billion or more on top of that and they're laughing, because they get to write off the 100 million in, hmmm, lobbying costs? Yeah, we'll call it lobbying costs even though we all know better. The whole e'fing thing disgusts me.

The beauty of living in Canada is the freedom we all have to do and say whatever we want.
Including the one you have to move to Cuba or whatever socialist Eden you choose.
Feel free to pack, I can drive you to the bus anytime you like.



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 04:34 AM
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Canada is having a problem but not as bad as United States and UK.

Take a look at these stats:
Current account balance
External Debt
Public debt

China, Saudi Arabia, Germany, Japan and Russia are the top 5 in current account balance. This is the reason why Japan still has not collapse despite having high debt.

Notably, United States is the worst based on current account balance.



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 04:35 AM
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I am concerned people are still so blind to the global problem...it has been purposely generated....WOW....all over the world and it will be the same in Canada....It is all about debt....they want to completely OWN you It is not about home ownership...it is about owning the people...they own you and this is what they want...once your owned you will have no rights....(like you do now).



George has never been more correct...George used to be the best comic out there.....then he decided i am old enough they can't F87k me now So time to speak out.
edit on 043030p://f36Saturday by plube because: (no reason given)

edit on 043030p://f37Saturday by plube because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 11:59 AM
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Originally posted by Cynic
reply to post by bobs_uruncle
 


In this stupid socialist country of Kanadakastan, they know like anywhere else, it's not their money and if it disappears it's irrelevant to them. This is what we get when we accept elective group or area (mis)representation in the government. It's easy to control a few hundred greedy scumbag meat puppets in parliament (or the senate or congress in the US), oops we have a stupid@ss senate here too, it's even easier to control Harper, the zombie on top. If it costs Demarais or the IMF or goldman sucks a 100 million a year to make the @ssclowns in government play their tune, they are still making a billion or more on top of that and they're laughing, because they get to write off the 100 million in, hmmm, lobbying costs? Yeah, we'll call it lobbying costs even though we all know better. The whole e'fing thing disgusts me.



The beauty of living in Canada is the freedom we all have to do and say whatever we want.
Including the one you have to move to Cuba or whatever socialist Eden you choose.
Feel free to pack, I can drive you to the bus anytime you like.


You know, I've lived, worked and visted all over, europe, the carribean, africa, the US, etc., in republics, communist, marxist, alleged "democracies," dictatorships, etc. and one thing is very consistent; every politicial system is screwed up and every country that I have been to has a central bank controlled by the IMF. Now, Kanadakastan (Canada) is not a country, it's a colony, our laws are based on "british" law and maritime law, since the government and the banks are controlled out of the city of london and can be subverted very easily, we have this problem, bought politicians tow the party line. Not the citizens line, the party line.

One nice thing about Kanadakastan, the pine cone colony of the north, is that it's easy to disappear when SHTF. Lots of land to the north, lots of water and plenty of food if you know what you are doing. That is the only advantage. It's a lot easier to get hunted down on a beach ;-)

I don't want to move if I can help it, I would rather see positive change in this colony and have it turn into a real country, one that cannot be easily annexed by the US or China with a stroke of a pen by an inbred dysfunctional welfare family across the pond. I would rather, unlike you with your head in the sand, to be part of the solution, rather than part of the problem. When the banks fail and US/Chinese/UN troops come in to keep the peace and drones are circling like flies overhead, you tell me how good it is then, when the internet is locked down and there is no such thing as free speech anymore. Read some of the recent "Bills" passed in parliament and tell me how much the government is doing things in our (citizens) interest. Do the research, the future is rather bleak, but not just in Kanadakastan, everywhere.

But cheer up eh, the worst is yet to come.

Cheers - Dave
edit on 6/16.2012 by bobs_uruncle because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:04 PM
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Originally posted by Cynic
reply to post by eNaR
 


Whatever EnaR:
I am glad you "worked" at CMHC, you would be the only one of thousands that really did.
Oh, and you still need to get a clue, because if you understood the program undertaken by the feds, you would KNOW that they do not own the debt!
Idiot.


Yes I "worked" at CMHC as do the approximately 1,500 current employees that REALLY "do work"! Sounds as though you're a bit jealous, but I digress....


....getting perturbed (definition: agitated confusion) there Cynic..... because you don't understand the MBS program and how the transactions went down ?


Let me explain, but read slowly. Pretend I'm standing in front of you talking to you r e a l s l o w l y....

I’m making use of two documents. The first document is entitled Canada's 75 Billion Dollar Bank Bailout - The $64 Billion Federal Budget Deficit is intended to Finance Canada's Chartered Banks, By Michel Chossudovsky and resides at www.globalresearch.ca...

The second document is a CMHC document namely NHA Mortgage Backed Securities Guide 2006 (get it here www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca... )



How the Program works

Issuers (banks) participate in the NHA MBS Program by issuing securities backed by residential mortgage loans insured against borrower default.

The Issuer assembles and administers the pool itself or uses a Servicer to service the mortgages in the pool on its behalf. The Issuer issues the securities for the pool. The Central Payment and Transfer Agent (CPTA] issues and registers the certificates of the Investors in accordance with the instructions of the Issuer and CMHC, and later on with the instructions of successive owners of the certificates. The certificate holder may instruct that the certificate be assigned to the Canadian Depository for Securities Limited (CDS) in which case subsequent sales may be transacted on the record of the depository.

CMHC provides the guarantee under the NHA MBS Program where the issuer fits within certain criteria, as must the securities. A specific commitment will be provided by CMHC to guarantee timely payment of amounts due on securities.

Issuer eligibility requirements and the procedure to follow in applying for approval to become an Issuer are described in Chapter 3. Chapter 6 gives the procedures for Issuers to follow in submitting a CMHC Guarantee Approval.

With the Guarantee Approval in hand, if it has not already done so, the Issuer begins originating or acquiring mortgage loans, and assembles a pool of eligible mortgages.

The Issuer arranges for a Custodian. The Custodian must be acceptable to CMHC. The Custodian maintains possession of the required documents. Arrangements must also be made for Custodial / Trust Accounts at a financial institution. One Custodial / Trust Account is for P&I funds and the other is for tax deposits. The Issuer assigns all rights, title and interest in the mortgage pool and pooled mortgages to CM[IC as trustee on behalf of Investors. The procedures for marketing securities are set forth in Chapter 9.

Chapter 7 includes a description of the nature of the mortgage assignment process.
Chapter 8 sets forth the procedures relating to the custodial relationship, and
Chapter 10 provides the requirements for establishing the Custodial/Trust Accounts.

Under the NHA MBS Program, CMHC reviews the mortgage pool documentation and allows the delivery of the Security Certificates within five full business days of receipt by CMHC of a complete document package.

After CMHC has approved the mortgage pool documentation, and after the Custodian has reviewed the documentation, the CPTA prepares and delivers the Security Certificates in accordance with instructions provided by the Issuer and CMHC with the timely delivery of the certificates assured, the Issuer can then plan to sell the securities to Investors. Chapter 9 describes the preparation, delivery and registration of securities certificates.

continued



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:09 PM
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Are we as in bad of shape as most of the world?

No, but don't make it seem like we are sitting high on the hog. I know plenty of people with a mortgage who will not be able to afford it if interest rates go up even remotely.

Except for a few areas in Canada, most of us are seeing a huge reduction in the economy. Things are not getting better at all - and just a personal note - am I the only one who is seeing an increase in aggression in people.



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:11 PM
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Originally posted by Cynic
reply to post by eNaR
 


Whatever EnaR:
I am glad you "worked" at CMHC, you would be the only one of thousands that really did.
Oh, and you still need to get a clue, because if you understood the program undertaken by the feds, you would KNOW that they do not own the debt!
Idiot.


continued...



Once certificates are issued, the Issuer no longer owns the mortgages in the pool. All mortgage loans and related security in the Pool have now been assigned by the Issuer to CMHC as trustee on behalf of Investors. CMHC, as agent for Her Majesty in right of Canada, by the guarantee set out on the face of the Certificate, guarantees to the Investor that the amounts due on the Certificate will be remitted to the Investor on their due dates even if the corresponding amounts have not been paid and collected in respect of the Pool. The Issuer is responsible for servicing the mortgages and depositing the amounts collected into a P & I Custodial/Trust Account for payment to the Investors by the CPTA. The Issuer is also responsible for periodic reporting to the CPTA and CMHC (as required). The CPTA in turn, reports to CMHC in accordance with the procedures set forth in Chapter 10.


So, the bank assembles a pool of mortgages and administers those loans forming that pool. It then performs a number of steps required for (a) CMHC to provide guarantees under the NHA MBS Program (b) CMHC reviews the mortgage pool documentation which allows the delivery of the Security Certificates to the Issuer (the bank) which finally can (c) sell the securities to Investors.

---Once certificates are issued, the Insurer no longer owns the mortgages in the pool. All mortgage loans and related security in the Pool have now been assigned by the Issuer to CMHC as trustee on behalf of Investors.---

So to get this straight….

° Issuers are the banks
° Once the certificates are issued (to the investors) the Issuer no longer owns the mortgages in the pool. All mortgage loan and related security in the Pool have now been assigned by the Issuer to CMHC as trustee on behalf of Investors.

Now, following is the portion of Canada's 75 Billion Dollar Bank Bailout that you should read….




Canada's Bank Bailout

The 64 billion dollar budget deficit should come as no surprise.

It is directly related to a 75 billion dollar bank bailout program for Canada's chartered banks, announced, virtually unnoticed, four days before the October Federal election.

The bank bailout received close to no media coverage; its budgetary implications were not analyzed.

In a statement by Prime Minister Harper on October 10, the bank bailout was casually presented as a commitment by the Federal government to purchase an initial $25 billion in "secure" bank mortgages from the Canadian chartered banks. The transaction would be implemented through Canada Mortgage and Housing Corp:

"Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) will purchase up to $25 billion in insured mortgage pools as part of the Government of Canada’s plan, announced today, to maintain the availability of longer-term credit in Canada." (Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation Supports Canadian Credit Markets, CHMC Press Release, 10 October 2009 - www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca...


The decision implies a money transfer into the coffers of Canada's financial institutions. The money is "fungible" and can be used by the banks as they see fit:

"The federal government's [initial] $25-billion takeover of bank-held mortgages to ease a growing credit crunch faced by the country's financial institutions is not a bailout similar to recent moves made in the United States and other Western countries, Conservative Leader Stephen Harper said Friday.

"This is not a bailout; this is a market transaction that will cost the government nothing," he told reporters at a campaign rally in Brantford, Ont., ahead of Tuesday's federal election.

"We are not going in and buying bad assets. What we're doing is simply exchanging assets that we already hold the insurance on and the reason we're doing this is to get out in front. The issue here is not protecting the banks." (CBC News October 10, 2008, emphasis added)

The 25 billion dollar allocation was announced four days prior to the elections. Two days following the federal elections, the first mortgage purchase took place leading to an initial cash injection of 5 billion into the coffers of the chartered banks.


continued.....



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:15 PM
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Originally posted by Cynic
reply to post by eNaR
 


Whatever EnaR:
I am glad you "worked" at CMHC, you would be the only one of thousands that really did.
Oh, and you still need to get a clue, because if you understood the program undertaken by the feds, you would KNOW that they do not own the debt!
Idiot.


continued..... and finally


Barely a month following the federal election, on November 12 2008, another $50 billion allocation was announced.

It received no news coverage. Moreover, opposition party leaders did not analyze the official statement of the Ministry of Finance.

The likely consequences of the Canada bank bailout on the federal fiscal structure were not the object of discussion or political debate.

The text of the official statement reads as follows:

"The Honourable Jim Flaherty, Minister of Finance, today announced the Government will purchase up to an additional $50 billion of insured mortgage pools by the end of the fiscal year as part of its ongoing efforts to maintain the availability of longer-term credit in Canada.

This action will increase to $75 billion the maximum value of securities purchased through Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) under this program.

"At a time of considerable uncertainty in global financial markets, this action will provide Canada's financial institutions with significant and stable access to longer-term funding," said Minister Flaherty.(The Main Wire, November 12, 2008, emphasis added).

At the height of the election campaign, Prime Minister Harper stated emphatically that: "this is not a bailout... it will cost the government nothing." (CBC News, October 10, 2008).
According to Finance Minister Jim Flaherty: "This program is an efficient, cost-effective and safe way to support lending in Canada that comes at no fiscal cost to taxpayers."(Ibid)

Under the proposal, Ottawa plans to sell a combination of government bonds and other public debt instruments to raise the $25 billion.



So….

(a) "Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) will purchase up to $25 billion in insured mortgage pools as part of the Government of Canada’s plan, announced today, to maintain the availability of longer-term credit in Canada." (Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation Supports Canadian Credit Markets, CHMC Press Release, 10 October 2009 - www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca...

(b) "The Honourable Jim Flaherty, Minister of Finance, today announced the Government will purchase up to an additional $50 billion of insured mortgage pools by the end of the fiscal year as part of its ongoing efforts to maintain the availability of longer-term credit in Canada. This action will increase to $75 billion the maximum value of securities purchased through Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) under this program.

The Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation purchased $25 billion in insured mortgage pools and the Government purchased an additional %50 billion in insured mortgage pools. That makes CMHC and the Government of Canada the Investors (the purchasers of the Mortgage Backed Securities (MBS) however….

° Issuers are the banks
° Once the certificates are issued (to the investors) the Issuer no longer owns the mortgages in the pool. All mortgage loan and related security in the Pool have now been assigned by the Issuer to CMHC as trustee on behalf of Investors.
° CMHC and the Government are the owners of the debt.

Now tell me how you see it working….. explain just who "owns the debt"?



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:19 PM
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Originally posted by BobAthome
unfortunatly,,

Caveat Emptor

but if a Portfolio of Mortgates,,is actually maggot infested,,

well same rule applies.



maggot infested,,

Caveat Emptor



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:26 PM
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Originally posted by Cynic
reply to post by lordvader
 


Complete rubbish.
I have been in the industry for decades and you haven't got a clue what you are talking about.
Debt levels are high, yes. But mortgages are not approved the same way they were in the States.
The Canadian banking system is the envy of the world due to its tightly regulated practices.
You're spouting complete drivel.


I was wondering the exact same thing. Even the IMF has said that Canada should be upheld as a shining example of why we need banking regulations. I wouldn't say that we have tightly regulated prices, certainly with regards to how it was say in the 1960's, but it's still quite a lot more stringent than say in the USA or United Kingdom.



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:42 PM
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Originally posted by misfitofscience
Sorry

Being a Certified Financial Planner, I have to totally disagree with you. Canada has never been stronger, has never made smarter decisions, was hardly impacted by the meltdown in 2008. Our banks are leading the way around the world. Mark Carney has done the right job as minister. He even predicted that Jamie Dimon would loose out! Our insurance companies are making headlines internationally, without using the negative concepts of US insurance companies, The Real Estate sector has been strong, not overly, just well in place. Our government while not the best has done an incredible job throughout the whole fiscal crisis.


I unloaded MFC ( biggest Insurance corp in NA ) at its three double top peaks
I can tell you re your comment about insurance stocks on the TSX you are wrong

mfc hedged iteslf down to half the price pre hedge Price
www.theglobeandmail.com...
as I said TOP TWENTY TARP RECIPIENTS
edit on 16-6-2012 by Danbones because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:50 PM
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Originally posted by starwarsisreal
reply to post by lordvader
 


so in addition to illegal Mexicans we Americans should expect illegal Canadians?


Why would you say that? Do you have jobs there that we don't know about? At any rate, with the pipeline business expanding I'm sure the government will step in and throw money at it.
edit on 16-6-2012 by InTheLight because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2012 @ 09:55 PM
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Originally posted by starwarsisreal
reply to post by lordvader
 


so in addition to illegal Mexicans we Americans should expect illegal Canadians?


well we allready have your yellow bellied draft dodgers


i dont even know what yellow bellied means lol

on topic, im trying to convince my mother to pull out her savings....and invest in life sustaining land in the Philippines.
edit on 16-6-2012 by The Great Day because: (no reason given)




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