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Spain's debt hits record as euro zone crisis worsens

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posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:10 AM
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Spain's debt hits record as euro zone crisis worsens


news.yahoo.com

LONDON (Reuters) - Spain's 10-year bond yields hit a euro-era record of 7 percent on Wednesday as investors fled to safe-haven assets on fears the storm surrounding Europe's two-year long debt crisis was worsening, sending European shares and the euro lower.
"The underlying problem of deteriorating confidence in sovereign debt in Europe is continuing to intensify," said Lee Hardman, currency economist at Bank of Tokyo-Mitsubishi.
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:10 AM
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We are already looking at a possible Grexit here very soon, now Spain needs a second bailout after just receiving 125 billion euros. Italy looks like it is next as their borrowing rate just jumped up. They loudly insist that they do not need a bailout though. However, the numbers don't lie. Italy and all of the PIIGS are in serious trouble. What isn't as clearly visible though is just how weak Germany's balance sheet is. Add that to the fact that France just elected a socialist government and you have a recipe for a major financial disaster. Hold on to your hats people.

news.yahoo.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:23 AM
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reply to post by DarthMuerte
 


Germany will come out of this fine. It's really another case of the Weimar Republic whereby Germany is effectively using it's currency as the European reserve, only this time, it's the EURO.

Greece is gone, Spain will go and Italy will follow. Expect complete meltdown in the next 24 months as countries scramble to default and return to their currencies prior to the EU Merger - what a catastrophic f*** up. All of this proves what was said a long time ago, which is you cannot have fiscal union without policy centralisation.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:27 AM
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reply to post by 0010110011101
 

I agree, and policy centralization just makes another "Soviet Union". The populations are too disparate for a centralized policy to effectively manage such wide differences. I mean be serious. Germans and Greeks under the exact same financial policies? Can you say "absurd"?



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:30 AM
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reply to post by DarthMuerte
 


I can and I do say absurd. There are too many social and demographic nuances to ever make something on the scale of the EURO work. It you took the top 10 grossing courties by GDP and put them fiscally and governmentally into one, it may work. When you start including the smaller states who do not have the same manfacturing, services and corporations, it's no wonder the poor bastards cant keep up.

A complete shambles and another fine case of "if it aint broke............"



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:48 AM
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Originally posted by 0010110011101

A complete shambles and another fine case of "if it aint broke............"
If it ain't broke, send in a socialist. They will muck it up quickly.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:50 AM
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The post Euro zone collapse party will be in the Mens room at the bus station, bring yer own party favors and sanitary napkins.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:57 AM
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Originally posted by GrandHeretic
The post Euro zone collapse party will be in the Mens room at the bus station, bring yer own party favors and sanitary napkins.
Hopefully the bankers will do their celebrations without parachutes.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 06:58 AM
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reply to post by DarthMuerte
 


This had nothing to do with socialism. To the contrary, the minds behind the EuroZone initiative were focused solely on concentrating political and financial power. This was always a power-elite move. It was of no benefit to the pawns (although, as usual, it was sold that way). Everything was hunky-dory when the global economy was booming but they never considered what would happen if the econoy faltered. So when the same players pooched the economy everything came undone. And here we are. So now, the same power-elite are jockying to minimize THEIR losses before the people lose it.

Repeat after me, 'it's them against us, it's them against us'



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 07:15 AM
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reply to post by jtma508
 

Nothing to do with socialism? Have you examined Greek spending? What do you think they spent all of their money on? It wasn't defense, the American taxpayer has been paying for Europe's defense since the end of WWII. Socialism had a lot to do with it. Corrupt politicians, bankers and corporatists helped out, but their major problem is social spending. It is unsustainable, and bammy wants to take us there next.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 07:19 AM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte
reply to post by jtma508
 

the American taxpayer has been paying for Europe's defense since the end of WWII.


I think that's slightly unfair. UK, France, Germany and Italy are all in the top 10 of global military spend. I'm not saying that America dosen't contribute, becuase they spend more than the rest of the world put together, but to say that the American taxpayer has born the whole cost is not true.....

en.wikipedia.org...
edit on 14/6/2012 by 0010110011101 because: Abhorrent spelling and grammar!



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 07:26 AM
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Yeah the IMF basically gave the Euro 3 months to save itself. A large part of that is here in Spain. We have not fallen under yet....but when we do....it will all be almost irrecoverable. IMO it is irrecoverable, but I am no expert....


I don't know. Things are getting pretty crazy here in the north of Spain. The miners are on strike again. The funds that were set aside to replace the Asturian mining with other industries has been spent up and the miners are owed allot of dough. Most people here are just waiting for the first stick of dynamite to close a highway(they blow crap up in protest usually when they don't get what they want....yeah). Then there will be blood.

Everybody is going on sporadic strikes every month. I saw for the first time in my life here a march for the old republic( pre-civil war)

I think there will be ALLOT of bloodshed here in the future. We are a passionate people. Fire will burst from our hearts and spill onto the streets. Spaniards don't really respect their law enforcement. There is allot of resentment from civil guard abuses during and after the war. People would not hesitate to shoot at them should basic services be rendered null.

I remember last week during the transit workers union strike, this guy was just asking for the civil guard patrol jeep passing in front of my cafe to stop and fight him. He kept inching toward them as they moved to not run him over. He then smashed his fists on their hood and of course they got out and detained him. He wasn't drunk or a homeless crazy. He was a trucker. He would have killed people. He was that desperate and pissed. There were other instances of people going ape.


That same day they stoned a trucker for trying to work as a scab. He almost went into a coma and died. I think they stoned someone else too (banker?) I don't remember.


Makes you respect the situation. I can agree with the OP. Spain is in a closed lid bowl of it.

edit on 14-6-2012 by BIHOTZ because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 07:36 AM
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Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by GrandHeretic
The post Euro zone collapse party will be in the Mens room at the bus station, bring yer own party favors and sanitary napkins.
Hopefully the bankers will do their celebrations without parachutes.


i just hope that the building is high enough...wouldnt want one of em to live or anything...think of the years he'd spend comfortably as a living victim of the economy.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 10:34 AM
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reply to post by BIHOTZ
 


Wow! Thanks for that insight. Be careful if it does boil over. Do you guys have gun rights there? Sounds like you might need them.
I am on the fence as to whether the euro is being set up to fail or if it is just plain old incompetence and not playing well with others.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 10:55 AM
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Originally posted by 0010110011101

Originally posted by DarthMuerte
reply to post by jtma508
 

the American taxpayer has been paying for Europe's defense since the end of WWII.


I think that's slightly unfair. UK, France, Germany and Italy are all in the top 10 of global military spend. I'm not saying that America dosen't contribute, becuase they spend more than the rest of the world put together, but to say that the American taxpayer has born the whole cost is not true.....

en.wikipedia.org...
I agree that we don't pay the whole cost now, but we did in the 50s-80s, especially for NATO members. Even now we spend way too much.


America's contribution to NATO's military budget - provided through the Department of the Army's Operations and Maintenance account - is under 23 percent. The U.S. contributed $408.051 million and $430.381 million, respectively, in FY2009 and FY2010, according to the Congressional Budget Service.

After the U.S., the largest contributors to NATO's military budget are Germany (16.6 percent); France (12.4 percent); United Kingdom (12 percent); Italy (7.8 percent); Canada (5 percent); Spain (4.2 percent); Netherlands (3.3 percent); Belgium (2.6 percent); Poland (2.3 percent); Turkey (1.8 percent); Denmark (1.7 percent); and Norway (1.6 percent). Fifteen countries make up the remaining 5.8 percent.






posted on Jun, 28 2012 @ 07:35 AM
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No way to resolve the policy corruption problem in Spain. Spain is gone



posted on Jun, 28 2012 @ 08:06 AM
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reply to post by DarthMuerte
 


So am I blind or does Europe (if you count the Euro country's as 1 sum) pays way more then the US in your link?



posted on Jun, 28 2012 @ 08:06 AM
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I saw where the just made a huge payment to the banks at the expense of the people.

And the banks are getting hacked and money siphoned off.

This crap isn't right. It's not right.



posted on Jun, 28 2012 @ 08:22 AM
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I just can't believe how first EU banks got in problems since they bought up AAA rated (by US rating angency's) junk products from US banks, then the EU had to save EU banks, so then those some US agency's downgraded some EU country's (&Goldman S made a sneaky deal to make things look better in Greece).
And because of that the interest on the debt got higher, so another downgrade! The rest of the story you know...

They even grade all EU company's! I don't know how many company's there are in the EU but you know, its just silly that those US rating agency's can/have so much influence..

(Before the crisis&on a side note > Europe handing over all EU citizen bank accounts information in the name of terrorism to the US, which also raised my eye brows!).

At least the good thing of all of this for the US, is that investors (as usually) are like chickens & very nervous, so they think that the US is more safer.. (chickens ain't the smartest /coolest birds), so now the US can make more cheap new debt & print more dollars (at least on the short term, it's not that this can last for a long time of course + when Europe goes bad, the US will take a hit sooner or later as well).

But yea our political figures are really also so glad helping the US, whatever she says to them... clueless ass kissers.

Of course I can be wrong, just my own gut feeling I have..



posted on Jul, 12 2012 @ 03:07 PM
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I usually stock up a 6 pack (beer) into my fridge when it gets low.

One night after work, I remembered my fridge was empty of beers. So I headed to the store to get my 6 pack, but then realized I had only enough cash in my wallet either for a 6 pack or for a cab ride home.

I figured the beer was more important, and walking home a good many blocks away is a good excercise even though tiring excercise, so I paid up for the beers.

Halfway through lugging that 6 pack, I realized that IF I had just bought a couple of cans, I would have enough to take a cab ride home instead, and buy more the next day after withdrawing more cash. I thought long term, but didn't realize I could have solve my immediate problems satisfying needs more easier. Stupid of me, isn't it???

Similarly, what the EU heads are doing are stupidly similar to what I had done.

Austerity is often good, BUT ONLY for the long run. One have to solve the IMMEDIATE issues first, and that's GROWTH.

WIth growth, the long term will be taken care of as money circulates, responsibly and not corruptively as in the past where politicians and bankers/corporations were in collusion for personal greed. It builds up confidences in the markets if leaders show perseverance and dedication to growth.

Dedication to Austerity will only lead to capital flight NOT ONLY from investors but depositors as well, dooming the nation, even rich Germany within months.

They are looking for long term solutions, when more immediate, clear and present solutions are needed. Saving banks are well and good, but only for the long term. With many out of jobs and soon to be starved, those issues best be settled first, not for long term solutions while the nation gets shafted, and may not even get to see the 'long term' benefits, which are more of fantazies than realities that the spanish ministers are calling for.


edit on 12-7-2012 by SeekerofTruth101 because: (no reason given)



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